Wikipedia:Bots/Requests for approval/IrcamBot


 * The following discussion is an archived debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. The result of the discussion was Symbol delete vote.svg Denied.

IrcamBot
Operator: LeMiklos

Automatic or Manually assisted: Automatic (supervised)

Programming language(s): PHP, w/ botclasses

Source code available: soon on the bot's userpage

Function overview: adding templates on pages of contemporary classical music composers, linking to bios and music contents on several databases held by Ircam, French Research Institute in acoustics and music.

Edit period(s): once every few months.

Estimated number of pages affected: Between 200 and 800.

Exclusion compliant (Y/N): N

Already has a bot flag (Y/N): N

Function details: Harvests links (composers' pages) from category pages (only few of them, we manually decide which) and compares them to the list of resources on our databases (mainly Brahms and ContemporaryMusic). When needed, it adds a template (Template:CMOnline and Template:BrahmsOnline) to the External Links section - in the appropriate subsection (Listening, Recordings, etc.) if it exists. If the section does not exist, it is created.

Not exclusion-compliant : don't think it's a necessary feature, but I can implement it if needed. This is professional work from Ircam, guaranteed. I started adding templates (Template:ContemporaryMusicOnline) one by one, but we've got several hundreds of them. It's the kind of task that suits perfectly to a very simple bot. It has already been tested on our internal wiki.

As an example, I've applied it to a very small category : Spectral music. And it added two external links to Claude Vivier's and Hugues Dufourt's pages.

Discussion
Okay, this may seem like a stupid point to bring up, but have you tried using the BasicBot framework? When I tried it, it didn't work. - Jarry1250 [ humourous – discuss ] 10:42, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

Haha you're right man ;) I tried to make it work for hours, but that stuff's just awful! Actually, sorry I didn't update that, but a few days ago I switched to the botclasses. Do you want me to put my source code on the botpage? bye --LeMiklos (talk) 11:51, 9 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Okay onto the more serious concerns. First oof, the text of at least one of the templates is not ideal. "(in French) Get a complete biography and more information about Claude Vivier on Ircam's Brahms contemporary music database." is too promotional for example, but that's kind of a sideshow to the main attraction here: experience. I'm sure you know your stuff, LeMiklos, but you're likely to come across difficult scenarios which require an intimate knowledge of how Wikipedia works. Bot trials, for example, should be handed out, rather than presented as faits accomplis, for example. The minutia involved will bring you down I fear. Possible solutions: semi-automate, possibly using AWB; wait, gain experience for a few weeks and come back; hand over the code to a more experienced bot operator and let them fine tune the details. It's tough, I know, but really it's in everyone's best interests. - Jarry1250 [ humourous – discuss ] 13:16, 9 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Sorry, but I had been asked to try it out on small categories on French and Spanish wikis, so as I wasn't getting replies here I assumed it was because I hadn' shown anything. Also, I've just changed the text in the template. --LeMiklos (talk) 15:16, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

Okay, this task has been pending for some time. So let me see where we are. I believe you've addressed Jarry1250's concern above concerning the wording of the templates. You are also advised that it's imperative that you test bots in their own userspaces. You can't add "some stuff" at the end of an encyclopedia article, supervised or no. Also, the External links section header is supposed to be capitalized that way; you should not change its capitalization. What's your opinion of the possible alternatives that Jarry1250 mentioned above? I'm afraid I am likewise concerned with your experience as a contributor and as a bot operator. &mdash; madman bum and angel 21:10, 2 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Also, since the wikipedia class has a method nobots ($page, $user), you really do need to use it since it's just that easy to be exclusion compliant. &mdash; madman bum and angel 21:12, 2 August 2009 (UTC)

– I'm not at all sure that this bot task is either noncontroversial or useful. Spreading external links is something that should be done only after a good amount of community discussion, which the operator has not, to date, attempted to instigate. Furthermore, the fact that a trial, run without approval, on the Main namespace, resulted uniformly in errors and in violations of the Manual of Style does not inspire confidence in the operator. &mdash; madman bum and angel 20:41, 4 August 2009 (UTC)