Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2012 July 20



Category:Pennsylvania Turnpike

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Rename. Timrollpickering (talk) 15:01, 27 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Pennsylvania Turnpike to Category:Pennsylvania Turnpike Commission
 * Nominator's rationale: The proposed name would both better fit the parent category Category:Toll road authorities of the United States and the content of the category, which is roads operated by the PTC, not just the Pennsylvania Turnpike proper (the Mon–Fayette Expressway, Pennsylvania Route 66, etc.). It's possible that the PTC might just be known as "Pennsylvania Turnpike" per WP:COMMONNAME, though, so that needs to be discussed. The Bushranger One ping only 23:03, 20 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Support this, per reasoning above. Tinton5 (talk) 00:09, 21 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Support - This category covers all roads maintained by the PTC rather than just the mainline Pennsylvania Turnpike.  Dough 48  72  00:52, 21 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Rename to Category:Pennsylvania turnpike roads -- Most of the content seems to be roads, bridges and tunnels of the Pennsylvania Turnpike Commission. In other words it is about highways, not the commission.  A head note should explain that the contnet includes bridges and tunnels used by the roads.  Pennsylvania Turnpike Commission would become the main article.  Peterkingiron (talk) 15:08, 22 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Except "Pennsylvania turnpike roads" is both improperly capitalised (would be "Turnpike") and would not fit under "Toll road authorities of the United States", and is not consistent with the similar Category:New York State Thruway Authority‎. - The Bushranger One ping only 00:46, 23 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I think naming the category after the PTC is the best idea because not only does it contain articles about roads the commission maintains, but it also has articles about bridges and tunnels along with the commission itself.  Dough 48  72  00:17, 24 July 2012 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: withdrawn. The Bushranger One ping only 19:10, 24 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo to Category:California Polytechnic State University (San Luis Obispo)
 * Propose renaming Category:California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo alumni to Category:California Polytechnic State University (San Luis Obispo) alumni
 * Nominator's rationale: Contested speedy. All the other by-campus subcategories of Category:California State University rightfully use the "Cal State, City" format, as that is the name of the universities in question and, thus, their main articles. The main article here, however, is California Polytechnic State University - neither the university itself, or the article thereon, use any further wording. However, Category:California Polytechnic State University would be ambiguous, due to the existiance of California Polytechnic State University, Pomona. Therefore, this category should use the (disambiguator) format that is the standard, not the ", City" format which is not included in the name of this branch of the college.


 * Category:California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo to Category:California Polytechnic State University (San Luis Obispo) – C2B: Proper form of disambiguation. The Bushranger One ping only 05:41, 20 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Oppose - this rename would be inconsistent with all of the 22 other CSUs. I am pretty sure they would prefer their proper titles be used.Greg Bard (talk) 05:58, 20 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Except that there is no such thing as California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo. The "proper title" of this university is only California Polytechnic State University - but using that as a category name would be ambiguous thanks to Cal Poly Pomona. - The Bushranger One ping only 18:39, 20 July 2012 (UTC)
 * The form of the titles of all of the California State Universities are the same. It's "California State University, Name of Location." They use commas appropriately, and would not appreciate the parenthetical title. If this is moved, I will contact the public affairs office of the university and have them correct you directly. The current title as is, is the correct one.Greg Bard (talk) 19:50, 20 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Please see the article names. All the article names are at "California State University, Name of Location"...except this one. Becaue it's the acutal name of the university. - The Bushranger One ping only 20:13, 20 July 2012 (UTC)

The Bushranger One ping only 20:18, 20 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Please only title the category with the name the university calls itself. There are no instances of any parenthetical titles for the university. They universally use commas appropriately. The current title is consistent with the Pomona title, and I would oppose moving that one also. Stop attempting to insert parenthetical titles where they are not necessary.Greg Bard (talk) 4:42 pm, Today (UTC−4)
 * Except it is necessary. The name the university calls itself by is California Polytechnic State University - no parens, commas, or distrusted semicolons. But that cannot be used for a category title as it is ambiguous with California Polytechnic State University, Pomona. Wikipedia's standard in cases where disambiguation is necessary is to use the Ambiguous name (disambiguation) title format. Using the "Ambiguous name, disambiguation" format implies that that is the actual name of the school - when it is not. Which is the entire point of this exercise: to have the title match that which the school actually calls itself by. The (parens) are not part of the name, nor are they claimed to be, unlike the, Comma format which does. - The Bushranger One ping only 20:53, 20 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Keep as is. Sure, it's not the school-sponsored name of the university, but take a look at California State University system's take on the matter. There are two California Polytechnics by adding the city name to "Category:California Polytechnic State University" will avoid confusion to end-users not familiar with the subject.-- Marco Guzman, Jr Talk  16:37, 21 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Keep as is -- Dropping a disambiguator would be ambiguous. Using the place as a disambiguator, with a comma is common for places (the second item being a county, state, or country).  I see no reason why this format should not be retaiuned here.  Californis State Univ has two Poly campuses.  This one is older, but not quite as large as Pomona.  This one has the priority, and thus uses the name without a handle, but sometimes WP needs a handle to avoid ambiguity.   Peterkingiron (talk) 15:18, 22 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Because the ", dab" format is used for places - geographical locations. A college is not such a place. That would be like using Bacardi Building, Miami instead of Bacardi Building (Miami). - The Bushranger One ping only 00:47, 23 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Keep as is -- I stated my opposition at the speedy. Again, please respect the university's own practices. Greg Bard (talk) 04:28, 23 July 2012 (UTC)
 * 'Respecting their own practices' would mean making it Category:California Polytechnic State University. Which the article on the university is already at. - The Bushranger One ping only 04:36, 23 July 2012 (UTC)
 * No, please let me correct you. It depends on context. I am certain that I have seen more lists naming the CSUs than you have. The comma is part of the name universally. Greg Bard (talk) 04:51, 23 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Then you should file a WP:RM for the article. - The Bushranger One ping only 04:55, 23 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Excuse me, NO I shouldn't. Leave this article category exactly where it is please. You know, the respectful thing to do is to always call a person or group of people the name that they themselves want to be called. This nonsense about parenthetical titles is SOLELY a Wikipedia phenomenon and it has gotten out of hand. No, it is NOT necessary, and you have ignored my repeatedly pointing out that the comma is universally used in the names of CSU (and also the UCs). I was on the University Affairs Committee of the CSSA. I have been to almost all of the 23 campuses, and I have certainly seen the names of these institutions spelled and formed correctly enough times to know what I am talking about. Please consult a style guide of one or more of the campus newspapers, and/or contact the public affairs office. You are the only one on this crusade, and if it is moved, it will have to be moved back. Please save us all the time and trouble.Greg Bard (talk) 16:52, 23 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Greg Bard just made an excellent argument. The parenthetical thing is truly absurd and, in this case, it borderlines academic boosterism. -- Marco Guzman, Jr Talk  22:02, 23 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Er...I beg your pardon? Please see WP:NCDAB. There is no "boosterism" here. Parenthetical titles are how Wikipeida disambiguates. The (dab phrase in parenthesis) is not part of the title or name; the title is exactly what the place or person is called/called themselves, just with the (dab) being used, not as part of the name, but as a disambiguator. However, as the article is, apparently, about to be moved to the ",comma dab format", if it is moved I'll withdraw this CfD. (Also, the assertion that we should always call people/entities by the name they wish to be called by is contraindicated here). - The Bushranger One ping only 22:21, 23 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your understanding. Both the article and the category should be at "California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo" and in the case of Pomona, the title should be "California State Polytechnic University, Pomona." (This is consistent with their seal) The parenthetical titles in general have gotten out of hand. Editors are robotically moving category names with the idea that the main article and category should be the same. However, there has not been a lot of good judgment as to whether the category or the article should move, or in some cases both names are not adequate, and the resulting move make the whole situation worse. I think the whole business should be stopped and proper English phrases should be used, not parentheses. It causes real problems. Be well,
 * I agree, both the category and the main article should be named California Polytechnic State University, San Luis Obispo. The geographical reference truly helps to disambiguate itself from California State Polytechnic University, Pomona, and will be helpful to both Wikipedia users familiar and unfamiliar with this unique naming convention in the California State University system. -- Marco Guzman, Jr Talk  19:00, 24 July 2012 (UTC)
 * My opinion was that since the geographical reference didn't appear to be part of the university name, and wasn't in the article name, the (MOS format for a dab) should be used. As the page has now been moved and it appears the actual name does include the ", city" in it, and the page has been moved to that title, I hereby withdraw this and, as there is unanimity for keep, will close. - The Bushranger One ping only 19:09, 24 July 2012 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Transport ministers of France

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Reverse merge. Timrollpickering (talk) 14:53, 27 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Transport ministers of France to Category:French Ministers of Transportation
 * Nominator's rationale: Main article is Minister of Transport (France). I don't know what the best name for the category is. —Justin ( koavf ) ❤T☮C☺M☯ 16:34, 12 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Mmm Category:Transport ministers by country I would go the other way and merge Category:French Ministers of Transportation into Transport ministers of France for consistency's sake.♦ Dr. Blofeld  16:40, 12 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Reverse merge -- I cannot find the French title of the present holder but his predecessor was "secrétaire d'État chargé des Transports" -- literally "Secretary of State charged with Transports". In English, "Transport" is a collective noun and thus does not take the plural, hence Category:Transport ministers of France is appropriate.  Transportation appears to follow an American tendency to use a longer word where a shorter one will do.  Peterkingiron (talk) 10:55, 14 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Rename to Ministers of Transport (France). - Darwinek (talk) 11:35, 14 July 2012 (UTC)
 * That matches no naming format. See Category:Transport ministers by country. - The Bushranger One ping only 20:10, 17 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Reverse merge per Peterkingiron. - The Bushranger One ping only 20:10, 17 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Relisting comment: Category:French Ministers of Transportation was not tagged. It is tagged now.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, -- Black Falcon (talk) 18:40, 20 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Reverse merge This isn't about Transport ministers who speak French. And in certain countries, that becomes political (vis Belgium, Canada) -- 76.65.131.160 (talk) 07:47, 21 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Reverse merge actually though, nothing in the form ever implied what language the people spoke. The proposed end form though would allow for any French national who served as a transport minister.  This is meant to be a by office form, thus Transport minister of France, not a by nationality form.John Pack Lambert (talk) 18:56, 21 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Reverse merge per Peterkingiron to match the siblings of this category for non-American English. Hmains (talk) 21:06, 21 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Reverse merge per several. Johnbod (talk) 11:30, 22 July 2012 (UTC)
 * egreM per Peterkingiron. -- Brown HairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 19:48, 24 July 2012 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Northern American portals

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Upmerge to Category:North American portals. Timrollpickering (talk) 15:00, 27 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Propose deletion Category:Northern American portals
 * Nominator's rationale: The associated portal on this topic has been deleted Portal:Northern America, and the category is redundant to Category:North American portals and Category:Northern America. Rreagan007 (talk) 17:12, 20 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Upmerge to Category:North American portals, as the contents of this category are not otherwise categorised. - The Bushranger One ping only 00:11, 27 July 2012 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Railway stations in Hokkaidō Prefecture

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Rename. Timrollpickering (talk) 14:54, 27 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Railway stations in Hokkaidō Prefecture to Category:Railway stations in Hokkaido Prefecture
 * Nominator's rationale: The prefecture name Hokkaido is common enough not to be written with a macron in normal English usage (see article Hokkaido and Category:Hokkaido). While the initial speedy move proposal was contested, the existence of other categories still using the textbook Hokkaidō spelling with a macron does not in itself constitute a valid argument against moving to the more common English spelling (as per WP:OTHERSTUFF). In fact it may also be appropriate to move those categories in the future. --DAJF (talk) 13:22, 20 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Support – Hokkaidō was moved to Hokkaido in 2010 via process, its category Category:Hokkaidō was moved (speedy) in 2011, and all its subcats should follow the same convention. Oculi (talk) 14:05, 20 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Speedy rename this and all the other subcats that still use the whatsit. - The Bushranger One ping only 18:36, 20 July 2012 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Pacific Union College films

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Merge. Timrollpickering (talk) 14:56, 27 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Pacific Union College films to Category:Pacific Union College
 * Nominator's rationale: WP:SMALLCAT. The Bushranger One ping only 05:43, 20 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Support: the creator, BelloWello, is indeffed, and he won't be registering any objections. Recommend that you be WP:BOLD.– Lionel (talk) 05:49, 20 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Upmerge we have no scheme for creating categories of films associated with in some way given colleges. Thus this is not part of a general scheme.  There is no reason for a single-entry category in this case.John Pack Lambert (talk) 18:57, 21 July 2012 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Cal Poly Pomona College

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Merge. Timrollpickering (talk) 14:58, 27 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Cal Poly Pomona College to Category:California State Polytechnic University, Pomona
 * Nominator's rationale: This appears to be a case of categorisation by shared name; there is no Cal Poly Pomona College, just subunits of California State Polytechnic University, Pomona, and these should be categorised directly under its cat. The Bushranger One ping only 05:40, 20 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Merge per nom.John Pack Lambert (talk) 18:58, 21 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Merge to expand the abbreviation. Peterkingiron (talk) 15:21, 22 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Merge -- this is the name that the University and the CSU uses.


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.