Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2019 May 7



Essays

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename using "about".     – Fayenatic  L ondon 07:09, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

The following subcategories of Category:Wikipedia essays use either "Wikipedia essays on XYZ" or "Wikipedia essays about XYZ". They should be standardized to use a common naming structure, either "on" or "about". I am currently tagging them. I have tagged them all. Thanks, --DannyS712 (talk) 23:59, 7 May 2019 (UTC)


 * Category:Wikipedia essays on administration
 * Category:Wikipedia essays on BLP
 * Category:Wikipedia essays on building the encyclopedia


 * Category:Wikipedia essays on consensus
 * Category:Wikipedia essays on experts and expertise
 * Category:Wikipedia essays on navigation
 * Category:Wikipedia essays on notability
 * Category:Wikipedia essays on original research
 * Category:Wikipedia essays on reliable sources
 * Category:Wikipedia essays on style
 * Category:Wikipedia essays on templates
 * Category:Wikipedia essays on arbitration


 * Category:Wikipedia essays about article formatting
 * Category:Wikipedia essays about categorization
 * Category:Wikipedia essays about editing


 * Category:Wikipedia essays about gender
 * Category:Wikipedia essays about German
 * Category:Wikipedia essays about infoboxes
 * Category:Wikipedia essays about lists
 * Category:Wikipedia essays about redirecting
 * Category:Wikipedia essays about stubs
 * Category:Wikipedia essays about verification
 * Category:Wikipedia essays about accessibility


 * About Seems like the more precise pronoun. RevelationDirect (talk) 02:24, 8 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Standardize with a weak preference for "about". Marcocapelle (talk) 05:50, 16 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Well, is this creating an actual problem? People write the same thing in different ways, is all; English is not a programming language. I actually don't care either way. If you want to standardize, and you're willing to do the work to implement this, fine. As to "about" vs "on", I don't care. Whichever gets the most votes. If I had to vote, I guess "about", since "on" could be misunderstood by ELS people with indifferent English skills. Herostratus (talk) 02:29, 17 May 2019 (UTC)
 * About. More precise. deisenbe (talk) 01:44, 30 June 2019 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Correspondents

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge to Category:Reporters and correspondents. MER-C 17:08, 23 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Correspondents to Category:Foreign correspondents
 * Nominator's rationale: Name is misleading. Its intended for journalists, not people who write letters. I've removed Voltaire and Boswell. Rathfelder (talk) 21:49, 7 May 2019 (UTC)


 * Rename to something as Correspondent (disambiguation) is ambiguous. Correspondent is wider than Foreign correspondent however (eg Mary Edna Hill Gray Dow). Oculi (talk) 22:01, 7 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep or Upmerge  per WP:VENUE. Not all are "foreign" and the main article, Correspondent, should either be blindly followed or nominated for a requested move. RevelationDirect (talk) 02:28, 8 May 2019 (UTC)
 * No objection to the upmerge being discussed below. RevelationDirect (talk) 02:11, 13 May 2019 (UTC)


 * Merge into the parent category as needed - The reason we have a problem here is because somebody came along 5 years ago and created a new category that wasn't needed and never should have been created. It's no accident that the parent cat -- which has done the job very nicely since 2004! -- is called Category:Reporters and correspondents. Precisely because there is no clear-cut, agreed upon distinction between the two. In short, there's no more reason to have a separate category for Correspondents than there is to have a separate category for Reporters. I think that pretty much covers it. Anomalous+0 (talk) 07:06, 8 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Btw, we do have Category:War correspondents, and probably should have Category:Foreign correspondents as well. But that doesn't need approval from CFD. Anomalous+0 (talk) 07:10, 8 May 2019 (UTC)


 * Merge to Category:Reporters and correspondents. There might be a valid basis for a new foreign correspondents category, but just renaming this one doesn't fill that niche — not everybody who's been filed here was actually a foreign correspondent at all, so not everybody would belong in that new category. We already have, and in a journalism context it's very difficult to tease out a meaningful or defining distinction between those two terms — there is one in theory, in that technically a "correspondent" is a specialist in a specific subject while a "reporter" is a generalist who can be assigned to any story that doesn't fall under a correspondent's domain, but it's not widely observed in actual daily practice or even necessarily always possible to determine which side of that line any given journalist actually falls on, with the result that the vast majority of journalists would just get filed in both categories simultaneously. So this is just an unhelpful reduplication of another category that already existed, and the proposed renaming doesn't fix the problem since not everybody filed here would actually belong there. The question of whether we can justify a dedicated category or not should be divorced from this, and considered and/or implemented separately from the conclusion here. Bearcat (talk) 14:01, 8 May 2019 (UTC)
 * I am quite happy with a Merge to Category:Reporters and correspondents.Rathfelder (talk) 14:39, 8 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Merge to Category:Reporters and correspondents by lack of a clear difference between of the two. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:41, 8 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete, and therefore move contents to the parent category Category:Reporters and correspondents. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Srleffler (talk • contribs) 03:08, May 12, 2019 (UTC)
 * Merge to Category:Reporters and correspondents. Jayjg (talk) 19:10, 22 May 2019 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Educational organizations

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename all. Per lack of objection / C2C (non-admin closure) DannyS712 (talk) 00:18, 19 May 2019 (UTC)


 * 1) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Afghanistan to Category:Educational organisations based in Afghanistan
 * 2) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Argentina to Category:Educational organisations based in Argentina


 * 1) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Australia to Category:Educational organisations based in Australia
 * 2) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Austria to Category:Educational organisations based in Austria
 * 3) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Bahrain to Category:Educational organisations based in Bahrain
 * 4) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Belgium to Category:Educational organisations based in Belgium
 * 5) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Bermuda to Category:Educational organisations based in Bermuda
 * 6) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Brazil to Category:Educational organisations based in Brazil
 * 7) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Cambodia to Category:Educational organisations based in Cambodia
 * 8) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Chile to Category:Educational organisations based in Chile
 * 9) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Dubai to Category:Educational organisations based in Dubai
 * 10) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Ethiopia to Category:Educational organisations based in Ethiopia
 * 11) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Fiji to Category:Educational organisations based in Fiji
 * 12) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Finland to Category:Educational organisations based in Finland
 * 13) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Georgia (country) to Category:Educational organisations based in Georgia (country)
 * 14) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Germany to Category:Educational organisations based in Germany
 * 15) Rename Category:Educational organisations in India to Category:Educational organisations based in India
 * 16) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Iran to Category:Educational organisations based in Iran
 * 17) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Jordan to Category:Educational organisations based in Jordan
 * 18) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Kenya to Category:Educational organisations based in Kenya
 * 19) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Latvia to Category:Educational organisations based in Latvia
 * 20) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Lebanon to Category:Educational organisations based in Lebanon
 * 21) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Libya to Category:Educational organisations based in Libya
 * 22) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Luxembourg to Category:Educational organisations based in Luxembourg
 * 23) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Malawi to Category:Educational organisations based in Malawi
 * 24) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Malaysia to Category:Educational organisations based in Malaysia
 * 25) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Malta to Category:Educational organisations based in Malta
 * 26) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Nepal to Category:Educational organisations based in Nepal
 * 27) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Norway to Category:Educational organisations based in Norway
 * 28) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Pakistan to Category:Educational organisations based in Pakistan
 * 29) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Paraguay to Category:Educational organisations based in Paraguay
 * 30) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Poland to Category:Educational organisations based in Poland
 * 31) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Portugal to Category:Educational organisations based in Portugal
 * 32) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Qatar to Category:Educational organisations based in Qatar
 * 33) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Singapore to Category:Educational organisations based in Singapore
 * 34) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Slovakia to Category:Educational organisations based in Slovakia
 * 35) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Somalia to Category:Educational organisations based in Somalia
 * 36) Rename Category:Educational organisations in South Africa to Category:Educational organisations based in South Africa
 * 37) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Spain to Category:Educational organisations based in Spain
 * 38) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Sri Lanka to Category:Educational organisations based in Sri Lanka
 * 39) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Sudan to Category:Educational organisations based in Sudan
 * 40) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Switzerland to Category:Educational organisations based in Switzerland
 * 41) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Tanzania to Category:Educational organisations based in Tanzania
 * 42) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Tonga to Category:Educational organisations based in Tonga
 * 43) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Uganda to Category:Educational organisations based in Uganda
 * 44) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Ukraine to Category:Educational organisations based in Ukraine
 * 45) Rename Category:Educational organisations in Zimbabwe to Category:Educational organisations based in Zimbabwe
 * 46) Rename Category:Educational organisations in the Netherlands to Category:Educational organisations based in the Netherlands
 * 47) Rename Category:Educational organisations in the Republic of Ireland to Category:Educational organisations based in the Republic of Ireland
 * 48) Rename Category:Educational organisations in the United Arab Emirates to Category:Educational organisations based in the United Arab Emirates
 * 49) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Azerbaijan to Category:Educational organizations based in Azerbaijan
 * 50) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Bosnia and Herzegovina to Category:Educational organizations based in Bosnia and Herzegovina
 * 51) Rename Category:Educational organizations in China to Category:Educational organizations based in China
 * 52) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Croatia to Category:Educational organizations based in Croatia
 * 53) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Cuba to Category:Educational organizations based in Cuba
 * 54) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Denmark to Category:Educational organizations based in Denmark
 * 55) Rename Category:Educational organizations in El Salvador to Category:Educational organizations based in El Salvador
 * 56) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Estonia to Category:Educational organizations based in Estonia
 * 57) Rename Category:Educational organizations in France to Category:Educational organizations based in France
 * 58) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Greece to Category:Educational organizations based in Greece
 * 59) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Haiti to Category:Educational organizations based in Haiti
 * 60) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Honduras to Category:Educational organizations based in Honduras
 * 61) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Indonesia to Category:Educational organizations based in Indonesia
 * 62) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Italy to Category:Educational organizations based in Italy
 * 63) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Japan to Category:Educational organizations based in Japan
 * 64) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Lithuania to Category:Educational organizations based in Lithuania
 * 65) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Mexico to Category:Educational organizations based in Mexico
 * 66) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Mongolia to Category:Educational organizations based in Mongolia
 * 67) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Nicaragua to Category:Educational organizations based in Nicaragua
 * 68) Rename Category:Educational organizations in North Macedonia to Category:Educational organizations based in North Macedonia
 * 69) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Slovenia to Category:Educational organizations based in Slovenia
 * 70) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Sweden to Category:Educational organizations based in Sweden
 * 71) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Syria to Category:Educational organizations based in Syria
 * 72) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Thailand to Category:Educational organizations based in Thailand
 * 73) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Turkey to Category:Educational organizations based in Turkey
 * 74) Rename Category:Educational organizations in Venezuela to Category:Educational organizations based in Venezuela
 * 75) Rename Category:Educational organizations in the Philippines to Category:Educational organizations based in the Philippines


 * Consistency is important in these large category trees, especially as we have the intractable organisation/organization problem. Of the 200 or so country categories in Category:Educational organizations by country, about 80 use 'in'. Moreover the parent tree Category:Organizations by country was renamed to use 'based in' at cfd in 2006. Similar cfds favouring 'based in' were: Women's organizations in 2017; Disability organizations in 2017; Music organizations in 2018; Transport organizations in 2019. Finally Category:International educational organizations is substantial, indicating that there will be many educational organizations which operate 'in' Foo but are not 'based in' Foo. Oculi (talk) 21:16, 7 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Note This is probably speediable under C2C and Applying speedy criteria in full discussions. Oculi (talk) 11:34, 9 May 2019 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Puerto Rican political analysts

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename. MER-C 09:57, 15 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Puerto Rican political analysts to Category:Puerto Rican political journalists
 * Nominator's rationale: Not connected to any other subject category. Articles are all about journalists Rathfelder (talk) 20:04, 7 May 2019 (UTC)


 * Support, these are all journalists indeed. This is apparently a follow-up on this earlier broader nomination which is still open for discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:51, 7 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Support per nom. Oculi (talk) 21:34, 7 May 2019 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Duplass Brothers Television

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename (non-admin closure) . Marcocapelle (talk) 05:52, 16 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Duplass Brothers Television to Category:Television series by Duplass Brothers Productions
 * Nominator's rationale: The production company itself isn't called "Duplass Brothers Television", but "Duplass Brothers Productions". The new name is also in line with other entries within Category:American television series by studio. Gabbe (talk) 16:25, 7 May 2019 (UTC)


 * Speedy per WP:C2C and WP:C2D. RevelationDirect (talk) 02:29, 8 May 2019 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Cultural depictions of men

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: purge and define scope.   – Fayenatic  L ondon 07:30, 12 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Propose rescoping cultural depictions of men


 * Propose rescoping cultural depictions of women


 * Nominator's rationale: Note that this is a purge nomination and not a deletion listing. These categories are meant for articles and categories that have "cultural depictions of..." (or similar wording) in their names, and have usage notes that explicitly clarify that they're not meant to be used for every individual creative work that happens to have men or women in it, but they both have a tendency to keep attracting exactly the films and TV shows and video games and songs they're not meant for. Since every film or TV show has men and/or women in it, and so do a large proportion of video games and songs, this isn't a useful point of categorization for individual creative works. I'm not proposing that the categories be deleted outright, because they do have other legitimate content that belongs, but the articles about individual works of film, TV, video gaming or music need to be purged. Bearcat (talk) 14:33, 7 May 2019 (UTC)


 * Purge per nom, possibly add a template. Marcocapelle (talk) 16:16, 7 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Rename Both to clarify & restrict. ' and ' should do the job. Anomalous+0 (talk) 21:25, 7 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Rename Both Per above to match the intended use. I think the overpopulation is an honest mistake based on a vague name. RevelationDirect (talk) 02:31, 8 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Doesn't "individual men" fail to capture multiples e.g. Abbot and Costello, Cain and Abel? – Fayenatic  L ondon 22:34, 8 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Hah, I did see those, but I don't see a real issue there, since both articles are articles about male individuals. I think we can tolerate a teeny bit of imperfection here. Anomalous+0 (talk) 02:38, 9 May 2019 (UTC)


 * I am not sure how adding "individual" in the category name would have avoided the current pollution. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:30, 9 May 2019 (UTC)
 * No guarantees, but it should cause many editors to wonder about the presence of that word, especially if they've ever come across such articles and/or categories previously. After the categories are purged it should be readily apparent from what remains that they're intended for articles that are largely or entirely about cultural depictions of specified individuals -- as contrasted with articles about men or women in general or articles where somebody gets a passing mention. Anomalous+0 (talk) 02:40, 10 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Purge per nom. Jayjg (talk) 19:09, 22 May 2019 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:People in Midrashim

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete/selective upmerge (non-admin closure) . Marcocapelle (talk) 19:29, 16 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting people in midrashim


 * Nominator's rationale: Only two entries, not likely to get more. Suggest upmerge to Category:Midrashim. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 09:54, 7 May 2019 (UTC)


 * Delete/Selective Upmerge Of the 2 articles, only Abba Yossi mentions this and should be upmerged to Category:Midrashim. No conceptual objection to the category but 1 article isn't a good basis for navigation. RevelationDirect (talk) 02:34, 8 May 2019 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

People of medieval Finland
Relisted, see Categories for discussion/Log/2019 May 21%23People of medieval Finland

Category:Buck Clarke

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. MER-C 09:58, 15 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting buck clarke


 * Nominator's rationale: With the only two related articles already in the subcat Category:Buck Clarke albums, this parent is redundant and unnecessary per WP:OCEPON. Star cheers peaks news lost wars Talk to me 05:02, 7 May 2019 (UTC)


 * Support - true. Oculi (talk) 08:51, 7 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete per nominator....William, is the complaint department really on the roof? 12:32, 7 May 2019 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:MTR stations named from roads

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. MER-C 09:59, 15 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Propose Deleting Category:MTR stations named from roads
 * Propose Deleting Category:MTR stations named from housing estates - added later
 * Propose Deleting Category:MTR stations named from temples - added later
 * Nominator's rationale: Per WP:SHAREDNAME
 * This category groups Mass Transit Railway (MTR) stations in Hong Kong basded on whether the station was named after a nearby road. Stations not named after roads are still next to roads and those named after roads are next to other things so this doesn't seem defining. The naming rabbit hole goes further: Prince Edward station is named for the Prince Edward, Hong Kong neighborhood which is named for Prince Edward Road which was named for, well you know, King Edward VIII when he was a Prince. All of these train stations are also categorized elsewhere in the Category:MTR stations tree so no upmerge is needed. - RevelationDirect (talk) 00:57, 7 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep: Are the editors very free recently to deal with deletion suggestions? Category:MTR stations is a summarized category while this one is a detailed one. It also tallies with its Chinese version. Prince Edward, Hong Kong is NOT place name which is a part of Mongkok. Not only you are confused about the source of the naming, so this is the reason why this category shall be reserved. Ckh3111 (talk)


 * Comment, I took the liberty to add two sibling categories to the nomination. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:26, 7 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Thanks! RevelationDirect (talk) 22:58, 7 May 2019 (UTC)


 * Delete, textbook example of WP:SHAREDNAME. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:26, 7 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete - clear case of WP:SHAREDNAME. Oculi (talk) 08:54, 7 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete. The question of whether a station was named for a road, a housing estate or a temple is not a defining characteristic of the stations for the purposes of categorizing them. Nominator is entirely correct: stations named for buildings are still located on roads, and stations named for roads are still next to other buildings, so subcategorizing them by how they got the name they were given is not navigationally useful to the reader. Bearcat (talk) 14:39, 7 May 2019 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Festivals named after magazines

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename. (non-admin closure) DannyS712 (talk) 00:19, 19 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Propose Renaming Category:Festivals named after magazines to Category:Magazine festivals or similar
 * Nominator's rationale: Per WP:CATNAME and avoiding the appearance of WP:SHAREDNAME
 * This category groups together festivals that are run by magazines: CMJ, Essence Music Festival, The New Yorker Festival, & Pitchfork Music Festival. (I was worried that they were just sponsored or licensed by a magazine but that is not the case.) But their "name" is not what's defining. - RevelationDirect (talk) 00:57, 7 May 2019 (UTC)


 * Support per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:31, 16 May 2019 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.