Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2020 August 29



Category:Climate change in fiction

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: reverse merge. MER-C 19:06, 25 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Climate change in fiction to Category:Climate fiction
 * Nominator's rationale: merge, this category does not clearly distinguish itself from its parent category. Both have the same main articles. Marcocapelle (talk) 13:29, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Support we shouldn't be using categories to describe passing elements in works, but only the central themes. Sadads (talk) 15:10, 30 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Prefer reverse merge -- Climate change in fiction (or Climate change fiction) would be about projections of what might happen of global warming continues unabated. The target might cover speculations that are wholly improbable, or do they count as Sci-fi?  Peterkingiron (talk) 14:03, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Based on the current text of Climate fiction I do not expect that this should be a particular worry. Marcocapelle (talk) 09:59, 11 September 2020 (UTC)


 * Support reverse merge, oppose move as proposed. Johnbod (talk) 20:14, 15 September 2020 (UTC)
 * (as nom) I do not oppose the reverse merge alternative. Marcocapelle (talk) 09:41, 10 October 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Climate activists

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: reverse merge. MER-C 19:07, 25 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Climate activists to Category:Climate change environmentalists
 * Nominator's rationale: merge, this category does not clearly distinguish itself from its parent category. Marcocapelle (talk) 13:24, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
 * I would do it the other way around: the main category should be "climate activists" -- that is the overwhelming common concept being applied by the youth movement and others which are at the front of the work. Moreover, climate activism need not be environmentalism --- which is has its own schools of thought, priority, and needs -- they frequently overlap but don't need to. Sadads (talk) 15:09, 30 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Reverse merge is alright too. Marcocapelle (talk) 16:18, 30 August 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Plants by climate
Relisted, see Categories for discussion/Log/2020 September 6%23Plants by climate

Category:Köppen climate classifications
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2020 September 6%23Category:Köppen climate classifications

Category:Fictional heroes

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: do not merge. MER-C 18:59, 25 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Fictional heroes to Category:Heroes
 * Nominator's rationale: merge, redundant category layer with only two subcategories. Marcocapelle (talk) 16:43, 7 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Strong keep. Category:Heroes has 2 subcats, "fictional" and "in myth & legend".  It seems sensible and useful to keep these segregated. Johnbod (talk) 16:46, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * When merged, there will be 3 subcats, "lists", "superheroes" and "in myth & legend". Why wouldn't that be an equally valid segregation? Marcocapelle (talk) 16:51, 7 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Comment See also Category:Fictional villains, which has the same WP:OVERLAPCAT problem, but also has no corresponding mythology category. –LaundryPizza03 ( d c̄ ) 17:05, 10 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Comment. Where should Ash Williams, Ellen Ripley and Hiro Protagonist be categorized? They're fictional heroes, but not super heroes. pburka (talk) 17:24, 10 August 2020 (UTC)
 * I would expect that tens of thousands of protagonists in fiction are a kind of hero, thus categorizing them would create a rather useless category. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:02, 11 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Comment "real life heroes" can also be objectively identified by say, having been awarded with the Hero of the Soviet Union award; a Victoria Cross, Congressional Medal of Freedom, Medal of Honor, Pour le Merite. -- 65.94.169.16 (talk) 02:25, 14 August 2020 (UTC)
 * We already have a tree Category:Recipients of orders, decorations, and medals for that. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:59, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Comment it seems that "heroes" fall into (a) fictional or (b) mythological - all the "superheroes" are fictional. To have superheroes at the same level as mythological is dissecting the fictional category too finely. Carlossuarez46 (talk) 00:25, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MER-C 09:45, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep -- Whether a real individual is a hero is probably a POV issue, so that we might decline to populate Category:Heroes with people, but there is already some useful content in topical articles. It is best not to amalgamate fact (history) with fiction (invention) or myth (which may or may not have a basis in fact).  Peterkingiron (talk) 14:28, 29 August 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:World of Darkness novels

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: no real consensus here on what to do. As noted, the non-novels could simply be moved to, so I have done that. Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:25, 6 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:World of Darkness novels to Category:World of Darkness literature
 * Nominator's rationale: This should be pretty uncontroversial, but it didn't fit with any of the Speedy criteria, so going through this venue: Not all the articles in this category are about novels, ie Vampire: The Masquerade (Vault Comics publication) is about a comic book and Revelations of the Dark Mother is about a poem. They are closely related, as written works based on World of Darkness, and so belong together, but there is only one comic article and one poem article, so it does not currently make sense to create further sub-categories for separate types of works. AlexandraIDV 15:21, 7 August 2020 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * It does seem reasonable to move to a more general category; I'm not sure if literature is the best word, but definitely some version of "adapted works". I have no particular opinion on what it should be changed to, but hopefully discussion will provide an answer. BOZ (talk) 22:39, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * I am fine with "written works based on World of Darkness", too - it is more about how the current name doesn't reflect the contents.--AlexandraIDV 07:35, 9 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Question, is the word "franchise" appropriate here? We have a large category tree of franchises. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:14, 10 August 2020 (UTC)
 * There already is Category:World of Darkness for the larger media franchise (which is focused on tabletop games), which is big enough that it's been split up into sub-categories including this one and one for video games.--AlexandraIDV 18:26, 10 August 2020 (UTC)
 * I see what you mean. But then, why wouldn't we simply merge Category:World of Darkness novels to Category:World of Darkness instead of creating a new type of category that does not fit in any tree? Marcocapelle (talk) 18:38, 10 August 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MER-C 09:45, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Voting merge per stale discussion above. Or else keep the category and move the non-novel articles to the parent category. Marcocapelle (talk) 10:35, 29 August 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Films with screenplays by Akiko Nogi

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: no consensus to delete, so rename to Category:Works by Akiko Nogi. – Fayenatic  L ondon 22:04, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Films with screenplays by Akiko Nogi to Category:Works by Akiko Nogi
 * Nominator's rationale: Contains more than films (manga, film, television shows) –xeno<sup style="color:#000">talk 12:48, 7 August 2020 (UTC)

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 * It is hard to tell what Nogi's exact involvement is in all of these, because the articles often cover multiple media formats, and the only article where Nogi actually is mentioned outside of categories is in the TV infobox on Nigeru wa Haji da ga Yaku ni Tatsu. Some clarification would be good - did Nogi work on any of these manga, or only on TV and film adaptations of them? Basically, I am considering whether it would make sense to name it "Television series and films with screenplays by Akiko Nogi".--AlexandraIDV 12:32, 8 August 2020 (UTC)
 * we could have separate categories for both Film screenplays and Television shows but combined would mess up the trees. –<b style="font-family:verdana;color:#000">xeno</b><sup style="color:#000">talk 00:55, 10 August 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MER-C 09:45, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete per WP:NONDEF, loosely per Alexandra IDV's comment. Note that there is also not an article about Akiko Nogi. Marcocapelle (talk) 09:38, 10 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Comment: For the record, Akiko Nogi is now also named as the writer of Unnatural (TV series), for which s/he won International Drama Festival in Tokyo Best Screenplay in 2018, and of the TV series Bōkyaku Tantei. – Fayenatic  L ondon 09:16, 1 November 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Files for cleanup
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Image files for cleanup. MER-C 18:26, 24 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Files for cleanup to Category:Files for content cleanup
 * Nominator's rationale: Category could be confused with Category:Wikipedia file cleanup. The subcategories of Category:Files for cleanup are all about cleaning up the file content. I.e. visual changes for images, for example. —⁠andrybak (talk) 18:33, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

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 * Suggestion – As this category is all about images, I propose Category:Image files for cleanup. <span style="font-family:Futura,serif;font-size:88%;border-bottom:2px solid #09DB67;text-decoration:none;">Senator2029 “Talk” 10:40, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MER-C 09:45, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
 * , sounds good to me. I support rename to Category:Image files for cleanup. —⁠andrybak (talk) 22:39, 7 October 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Back to the Future
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename. – Fayenatic  L ondon 18:30, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Back to the Future to Category:Back to the Future (franchise)
 * Propose renaming Category:Back to the Future franchise mass media to Category:Back to the Future (franchise) mass media (added 18 August)
 * Propose renaming Category:Music from the Back to the Future (franchise) to Category:Music from Back to the Future (franchise) (added 18 August)
 * Nominator's rationale: This should be a regular WP:C2D speedy, but it was opposed. As long as the article is at Back to the Future (franchise) and this is the category for the entire franchise, there is no reason for the category to not match the franchise. We even had a related RfC on this sort of disambiguation which validated the usage of disambiguation matching. Gonnym (talk) 20:27, 14 August 2020 (UTC)

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 * Comment, the rename was also opposed in full discussion quite some time ago. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:03, 14 August 2020 (UTC)
 * True, but the only comment which had any weight (as one was based on it, and another on an essay) by Fayenatic London did not get support at the RfC I mentioned. So that discussion from 2012 does not really have any relevance here. --Gonnym (talk) 08:01, 15 August 2020 (UTC)
 * For the record, the RfC discussion mentioned above is at WT:CFD. After 7 weeks it has not yet been closed, but it clearly failed to gain consensus support. – Fayenatic  L ondon 14:22, 18 August 2020 (UTC)
 * I added a couple of subcats which already have the word "franchise" but miss the goal of consistency.
 * I do not relish the thought of renaming the other, short-form, subcats, but will not oppose them any more. Nevertheless I think it would be better to add them all to this nomination, so that at least there would be a recorded consensus for the final long-winded result. – Fayenatic  L ondon 14:57, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MER-C 09:45, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
 * can this be closed? --Gonnym (talk) 11:56, 31 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Could be. Would have been neater to relist it with all the sub-cats. – Fayenatic  L ondon 12:05, 31 October 2020 (UTC)
 * It was already relisted with the two you added. Any else can be speedy as we always do with follow up cleanup. --Gonnym (talk) 12:58, 31 October 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Viacom Media Networks people
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge the remaining 1 article and 2 sub-cats into Category:ViacomCBS people. Thank you Marcocapelle for sub-catting the rest. – Fayenatic  L ondon 09:01, 1 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Viacom Media Networks people to Category:ViacomCBS Domestic Media Networks people
 * Nominator's rationale: To reflect with the new division name. Ridwan97 (talk) 04:23, 18 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Comment, I checked a few articles and the name ViacomCBS did not pop up often. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:32, 18 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete per WP:NONDEF, with the exception of David Nevins (television producer) none of these articles refers to ViacomCBS. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:40, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

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Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MER-C 09:45, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
 * should that article and the sub-cats, be moved up to  as a partial merge? – Fayenatic  L ondon 13:46, 31 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Also, some of the others appear to belong in MTV people or .– Fayenatic  L ondon 13:50, 31 October 2020 (UTC)
 * you are right, I moved most articles to Category:MTV people. As you said, the remainder can be merged to . Marcocapelle (talk) 08:16, 1 November 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

National University of Science and Technology MISiS
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename. MER-C 18:12, 12 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Moscow Institute of Steel and Alloys to Category:National University of Science and Technology MISiS
 * Propose renaming Category:Moscow Institute of Steel and Alloys alumni to Category:National University of Science and Technology MISiS alumni
 * Propose renaming Category:Moscow Institute of Steel and Alloys faculty to Category:National University of Science and Technology MISiS faculty
 * Nominator's rationale: I recently moved National University of Science and Technology MISiS (Russia) to National University of Science and Technology MISiS because no disambiguation is necessary and "(Russia)" is not part of the name of the institution. I propose that the categories be renamed to match. (This is not speediable because it is based on a recent article move.) Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:38, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

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 * Comment.  If moved, please retain category redirects from the old titles. --  Brown HairedGirl  (talk) • (contribs) 21:12, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MER-C 09:45, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Support per nom. St3095   (?)  17:45, 8 September 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

OCN
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Rename Timrollpickering (talk) 19:18, 24 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Orion Cinema Network original programming to Category:OCN original programming
 * Nominator's rationale: C2D, the article on the channel is OCN. St3095   (?)  08:22, 29 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Category:Orion Cinema Network original programming to Category:OCN original programming
 * Category:Orion Cinema Network television dramas to Category:OCN television dramas


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:2003 pinball machines
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: keep, no actual support, except for 2014 which is empty. I also note that the nomination addresses small categories in recent years but not small categories in early years. – Fayenatic  L ondon 17:53, 9 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:2003 pinball machines to Category:21st-century pinball machines
 * Propose merging Category:2015 pinball machines to Category:21st-century pinball machines
 * Propose merging Category:2014 pinball machines to Category:21st-century pinball machines
 * Propose merging Category:2013 pinball machines to Category:21st-century pinball machines
 * Propose merging Category:2007 pinball machines to Category:21st-century pinball machines
 * Nominator's rationale: There's only one article and a redirect in here. Since most pinball machines are NN per several AFDs, this is unlikely to expand in size, so merge per WP:SMALLCAT. Hog Farm Bacon 03:55, 29 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Comment and alternative suggestion. By-decade categories might be more appropriate. Grutness... wha?   04:38, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Comment, I took the liberty to merge the five nominations into one. The four other categories contain only one article. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:21, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
 * If merged, then dual merge, also to e.g. Category:2003 works. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:25, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Make decade categories If we are going to change this, there should also be mergers for earlier decades. Annual categories would be sufficiently populated (or nearly so) 1979 to 1990s, but not before that.  I accept that the two 21st century decades will still be under-populated.  If merged, dual merge.  Peterkingiron (talk) 14:35, 29 August 2020 (UTC)
 * - Category:2014 pinball machines is now empty, and has been for three days after the AFD for the last article in that category. It's looking like that one should be deleted now. Hog Farm Bacon 17:52, 8 September 2020 (UTC)
 * That is obvious. Marcocapelle (talk) 18:28, 8 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Yup. Grutness... wha?   03:50, 9 September 2020 (UTC)


 * Oppose. Century categories are too broad.  If editors want to do this, the targets should be decade cats "YYY0s pinball machines" + "YYYY works".
 * Plus, a merge nomination should include the 20th-century categories. No reason is given for their omission.
 * But I think that any merge is a bad idea. This will dump a lot of articles into the "YYYY works" categories. --  Brown HairedGirl  (talk) • (contribs) 17:46, 8 October 2020 (UTC)
 * The reason for merging them to a 21st-century category is that there are hardly any articles about pinball machines after the year 2000. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:22, 22 October 2020 (UTC)


 * is "works" an incorrect parent/target for this series? Perhaps rather, Category:Products introduced in 2003 etc? – Fayenatic  L ondon 14:08, 31 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Perhaps ? Grutness... wha?   16:19, 31 October 2020 (UTC)
 * That sounds even better. – Fayenatic  L ondon 16:32, 31 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Agree with that too (instead of works). Marcocapelle (talk) 18:33, 31 October 2020 (UTC)

.Part of the problem here is that the category titles use the shorthand form "Works", rather than the less ambiguous term used in the head article: creative works. This is another example of the wider problem that those who specialise in a topic tend to use a jargon which involves short forms, which are unambiguous within their field. Unfortunately, attempts to remove the ambiguity risk creating a storm of fury from those immersed in the jargon of topic, as happened for example at CFD 2020 March 24#Musical_compositions. -- Brown HairedGirl  (talk) • (contribs) 16:59, 31 October 2020 (UTC)
 * @Fayenatic, I agree that pinball machines are a poor fit, but the "works" categories generally seem very broad. They include buildings, bridges, towers, airports, TV shows, treaties and  nearly every type of human creation.


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.