Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2020 August 6



Category:Mexican public domain images
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2020 August 15%23Category:Mexican public domain images

Category:Films featured on Mystery Science Theater 3000

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete.  bibliomaniac  1  5  02:41, 15 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting films featured on mystery science theater 3000


 * Nominator's rationale: Recreation at a new name of a category that has been deleted by CFD at least three times before, at Categories for discussion/Log/2010 September 3 in 2010, at Categories for discussion/Log/2012 October 12 in 2012 and at Categories for discussion/Log/2018 October 6 in 2018. Films, as always, are not defined by having been featured in an anthology series once, and this would lead to extreme category bloat if we allowed it for every umbrella title that movies have ever aired on TV under. List of Mystery Science Theater 3000 episodes already exists, and is entirely sufficient for this purpose, so a category is not needed or warranted here. Bearcat (talk) 20:23, 6 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete as non-defining and in the spirit of WP:PERFCAT. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:04, 7 August 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Films with screenplays by Mindy Kaling

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. MER-C 09:05, 16 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Films with screenplays by Mindy Kaling to Category:Works by Mindy Kaling
 * Nominator's rationale: only 1 remaining member –xenotalk 18:45, 6 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Merge per nom.  bibliomaniac 1  5  02:42, 15 August 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Films with screenplays by Noriko Gotô

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. MER-C 10:31, 15 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting films with screenplays by noriko gotô


 * Nominator's rationale: Delete as WP:NONDEF or rename to "Works by..." as contains 1 film, 1 manga, and 1 television show (equal preference). –xenotalk 18:26, 6 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete, especially since there is no article for Noriko Gotô.  bibliomaniac 1  5  02:48, 15 August 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:People from Gramsh

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: speedy renamed.  bibliomaniac  1  5  02:44, 15 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:People from Gramsh to Category:People from Gramsh, Elbasan
 * Nominator's rationale: Per the article Gramsh, Elbasan: There are other locations named Gramsh. 1234qwer1234qwer4 (talk) 18:23, 6 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Rename per nom. Note that the parent Category:Gramsh can be listed at WP:CFDS. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:11, 6 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Meanwhile I have listed Category:Gramsh at WP:CFDS. Marcocapelle (talk) 11:12, 8 August 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Highlander (franchise) episodes
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2020 August 15%23Category:Highlander (franchise) episodes

Category:Van Helsing

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Van Helsing (Universal Pictures franchise). MER-C 09:02, 16 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Van Helsing to Category:Van Helsing (film)
 * Nominator's rationale: or something else, maybe Category:Van Helsing (Universal Pictures franchise). The name "Van Helsing" is ambiguous with the name of Abraham Van Helsing, the character which the film is based on. Gonnym (talk) 13:10, 6 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Rename to the alt target, Category:Van Helsing (Universal Pictures franchise), to be inclusive of the other works.  bibliomaniac 1  5  02:45, 15 August 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Scream films

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge.  bibliomaniac  1  5  02:49, 15 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Scream films to Category:Scream (film series)
 * Nominator's rationale: This seems like a redundant category level. Gonnym (talk) 13:04, 6 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Merge per nominator. Neither the nominated cat nor the target cat are big enough to justify a split. -- Brown HairedGirl  (talk) • (contribs) 14:05, 7 August 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Wesleyan on stage and camera

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete.  bibliomaniac  1  5  02:40, 15 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting wesleyan on stage and camera


 * Nominator's rationale: "This category directs the user to Wikipedia articles about people, artifacts, and institutions connected with Wesleyan University that have had some impact on theater, film, television, video, &c.

Individuals may have been actors, producers, writers, directors, critics, or held similar roles; their connection to Wesleyan is generally as students or faculty. A few people are also catalogued whose relationship is inadvertent (writers whose books have been turned into plays, scientists interviewed on TV for their expert opinion, some listed individuals have their papers in Wesleyan's Ogden and Mary Louise Reid Cinema Archives. Products and creations (eg: films/shows) that reference Wesleyan in their setting or as a specified part of a character's background get recorded. "

If the criterion for inclusion is "somebody who was interviewed on TV once", I think we can agree that this category may have been created in good faith but far from WP:DEFINING. The creator might want to have a read of WP:CATEGORIZATION and look around the category hierarchy to get more of a feel for how it works since this is their first foray into categorisation. Le Deluge (talk) 09:23, 6 August 2020 (UTC) Le Deluge (talk) 09:23, 6 August 2020 (UTC)
 * I launched this category after reading several articles (many not in Wikipedia) about Professor Basinger (who I've never met nor previously noted) to film. Intending to divine the scope of her impact on the industry as well as the university; I used the various tools described in WP:CATEGORIZATION and elsewhere to compile my list, then decided to "publish" the content.  This initial foray into category-creation may have issues, but I feel generally meets extant standards.  "No worse than..." is not an argument I generally proffer, but WP:CATEGORIZATION is a "how-to", while nothing I read in WP:DEFINING militates against creating intersectional categories.  Indeed, Category:Writers from Los Angeles and Category:African-American Jews demonstrate that such are common and frequent across Wikipedia.  Collating Michael Bay, Akiva Goldsman, and Thomas Kail with Barton MacLane and Stuart Byron is of no less utility than Category:Spokespersons or Category:STX Entertainment.  And making such linkages clearly adds structural and content value to the Wikipedia endeavor.
 * So, I do NOT agree with the proposed action, but may be assured that I will entertain challenges to individuals on the list (indeed some - like Darius Brubeck, who worked for NFBC I'd likely remove myself).  Perhaps  would offer a more cogent and transparent reason for removal than that he/she disagrees with including of an unspecified article. Thank you for the notification. Ethnic laundry (talk) 15:24, 6 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete for two reasons. 'Some impact' is a way too vague inclusion criterion, and it concerns a trivial intersection (Wesleyan University does not educate students to have some impact on theater, film, television, video, &c.). Marcocapelle (talk) 20:27, 6 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Actually,, Wesleyan does award degrees with majors in both Theater and Film Studies , so is purposefully educating students to enter careers in these (and related) disciplines. In fact, the Wesleyan Film Studies program is consistently ranked in numerous surveys as one of the very best.    And "some" impact is useful to collectively gather the inter-related effort and product of actors, directors, screenwriters, producers, critics, (with many individuals fulfilling several of these roles in their careers). Ethnic laundry (talk) 05:49, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Then Category:Wesleyan Film Studies alumni may be a better option, provided it is defining for the individual people. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:57, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Please read my answer to on that issue, below.  Thanks!   Ethnic laundry (talk) 13:29, 7 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete per WP:OCTRIVIA and WP:OCASSOC. The intersection of an alma mater with an occupation is not in and of itself a WP:DEFINING characteristic of a person, especially if you're permitting the inclusion of people "whose relationship is inadvertent". Bearcat (talk) 20:29, 6 August 2020 (UTC)
 * , not certain why advertancy is important here - Category:Kindertransport refugees‎ lists many who were inadvertant. There are a lot of categories which intersect national/ethnic heritage and occupation, and which are much less defining than school+career (just ask a doctor or lawyer).  Particularly less defining when a subject is included under more than two or three heritage groups.  And I'd think a person is nearly always an inadvertant product of any heritage when they grew up in a different culture without significant measures taken to acquire the traditions.  Ethnic laundry (talk) 05:49, 7 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete - this is a subcat of ; I am assuming an upmerge is not required. I am not aware of any other subcatting of alumni categories by occupation, and I think it would be an exceedingly bad idea. As Marcocapelle observes, Category:Wesleyan Film Studies alumni would be a better idea. Oculi (talk) 12:50, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * must be unaware of Category:Hasty Pudding alumni. More to the point, a Film Studies alumni category would [a] properly exclude all Theater, English, History, &c. alums (eg: Jeffrey Richards); [b] not include those who graduated prior to that department's founding, like Philip Casnoff, Stephen Talbot, and the aforementioned MacLane and Byron; [c] omit important non-alumni with major contributions to the university and the "performing arts" such as Prof. Basinger, or those who have their papers collected in the school's archives to assist students and other scholars.  Ethnic laundry (talk) 13:21, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Perfectly happy with those exclusions, since the only defining characteristic they share is Wesleyan University alumni. Marcocapelle (talk) 14:20, 7 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete per WP:NONDEF, WP:OCTRIVIA and WP:OCASSOC ... and per the rationales of the nominator, Oculi, Marcocapelle, and Bearcat. A vague criterion ("some impact") intersected with an irrelevant attribute fails WP:CAT in so many ways that it's a clear delete.
 * The category creator would be better advised to spend some time reading categorisation guidelines and CFD archives, rather than digging themselves in deeper. The contents of this category might make the basis of an article in some alumni publication, but they are not a viable wn.wp category. -- Brown HairedGirl  (talk) • (contribs) 14:02, 7 August 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:1991 Soviet coup d'état attempt

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: keep.  bibliomaniac  1  5  02:35, 15 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:1991 Soviet coup d'état attempt to Category:1991 August Coup


 * Category:People of the 1991 Soviet coup d'état attempt to Category:People of the 1991 August Coup
 * Nominator's rationale: I propose matching the category names to the article name, 1991 August Coup. This was proposed at speedy renames but was opposed on the grounds that the article had only recently been moved (without discussion) to the current name. Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:18, 6 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Category:1991 Soviet coup d'état attempt to Category:1991 August Coup – C2D per 1991 August Coup Good Ol’factory (talk) 02:37, 28 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Category:People of the 1991 Soviet coup d'état attempt to Category:People of the 1991 August Coup
 * Oppose both Article was only moved in May, without RM discussion. UnitedStatesian (talk) 02:42, 28 July 2020 (UTC)


 * Comment, there had been an earlier RM with no consensus. It sounds puzzling to refer to this coup without a mention of the Soviet Union. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:19, 6 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose - at least until there's been a clear RM in favour of renaming the article. FWIW this may be the common name in Russian but it feels like that a global English encyclopedia should mention the country involved, this is not a case like the October Revolution which is so well known amongst English speakers that you don't need the country.Le Deluge (talk) 09:37, 6 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose - the failed RM was in fact to August Coup which seems an astonishingly brief suggestion. (The great majority of articles in Category:1990s coups d'état and coup attempts give both the year and the country.) I recall the coup (Yeltsin got onto a tank and berated the soldiers involved) but not that it was in August or indeed 1991. There are times when the article name is unsatisfactory for the related category name. Oculi (talk) 09:56, 6 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose - seems the earlier title is more appropriate. Grutness... wha?   03:51, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose. The proposed new title fails to adequately identify the topic. -- Brown HairedGirl  (talk) • (contribs) 11:50, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Comment, I have started a new RM, see Talk:1991_August_Coup. Marcocapelle (talk) 16:05, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose per opposers - another attempted speedy reinforcing the damage of an undiscussed move. Johnbod (talk) 16:51, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * @Johnbod, the speedy nomination was clearly made in good faith. Yes, it missed the undiscussed article move ... but it has all been beneficial, because it has drawn attention to a bad move which may now be reverted. The system is working. --  Brown HairedGirl  (talk) • (contribs) 03:03, 9 August 2020 (UTC)
 * There are far' too many dodgy speedies, most of which get through. Every time I look there .... Johnbod (talk) 03:16, 9 August 2020 (UTC)
 * No dodginess or underhandedness was intended by the speedy nomination, User:Johnbod. I'm sorry if you have felt that it was done in bad faith. Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:19, 12 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Ok, but this is happening far too often. Look at this pile-up. Johnbod (talk) 00:31, 12 August 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.