Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2020 March 15



Category:Trochilidae

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Merge Timrollpickering (Talk) 23:23, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Trochilidae to Category:Hummingbirds
 * Nominator's rationale: They seem to duplicate each other. AS  sa 22:46, 15 March 2020 (UTC)


 * Merge per nom, or perhaps reverse merge. I personally prefer a word I can understand. Oculi (talk) 08:13, 16 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Merge -- leaving a cat-redirect. Prefer not to reverse merge.  Peterkingiron (talk) 16:30, 17 March 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Tudeh Party of Iran politicians

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Not renamed Timrollpickering (Talk) 23:24, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Tudeh Party of Iran politicians to Category:Tudeh Party of Iran members
 * Nominator's rationale: The term 'member' is more convenient and includes all, even those who were not 'politician' in the traditional sense: Ebrahim Golestan, Ahmad Shamlou, etc. Pahlevun (talk) 19:05, 15 March 2020 (UTC)


 * Oppose, this is part of a category tree by occupation. Politician is an occupation (and a defining characteristic), party membership is not. Marcocapelle (talk) 15:50, 16 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose -- A businessman notable for other reasons should not be in a category, just because he had joined the party. mere membership casts the net too wide.  Peterkingiron (talk) 16:32, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose per Marcocapelle & Peterkingiron who correctly note that mere membership in the organization isn't what's defining nor what the tree contains. Carlossuarez46 (talk) 23:40, 17 March 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Biomedical engineers

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: withdrawn (non-admin closure) Marcocapelle (talk) 06:08, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Biomedical engineers to Category:Bioengineers
 * Nominator's rationale: They seem to be substantially the same. Not sure which way round would be the better merge. Rathfelder (talk) 15:00, 15 March 2020 (UTC)


 * Keep - all Biomedical engineers are bioengineers; not all bioengineers are Biomedical engineers (eg Adrian Thomas (zoologist)). Accordingly Category:Biomedical engineers is correctly a proper subcat of Category:Bioengineers. A merge if thought necessary should be of the child to the parent (upmerge). Oculi (talk) 15:19, 15 March 2020 (UTC)
 * OK I see. I withdraw this. Rathfelder (talk) 12:09, 16 March 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:History of clothing (Europe)

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. There is some support for a medieval sub-cat, so after merging I will rename the page and move relevant content. – Fayenatic  L ondon 08:57, 15 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:History of clothing (Europe) to Category:History of European clothing
 * Nominator's rationale: Smoother flow and consistency with other similar categories (Category:History of European colonialism, Category:History of European art music, etc). Brandmeistertalk  14:51, 15 March 2020 (UTC)


 * Comment - what exactly is the category's scope - would be a better target? Grutness...  wha?   04:13, 16 March 2020 (UTC)
 * The category contains History of Western fashion as its main article, but is categorized both in Category:History of clothing and Category:History of fashion. Brandmeistertalk  07:39, 16 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Prefer Category:History of Western fashion per WP:C2D and I can't see how European clothing is different from clothing in other continents in certain periods of history. Marcocapelle (talk) 16:21, 16 March 2020 (UTC)
 * That would work for me. Grutness... wha?   03:09, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
 * there is already Category:History of clothing (Western fashion). – Fayenatic  L ondon 11:26, 14 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Yes, in that case I would suggest merging under new name, Category:History of European clothing or Category:History of European fashion. Brandmeistertalk  11:30, 14 April 2020 (UTC)
 * May I offer the suggestion of repurposing this longstanding category as Category:Medieval European clothing, as that is its stated purpose, and a new category with such a name would otherwise be required/very helpful? – Fayenatic  L ondon 11:37, 14 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Category:History of clothing (Europe) contains non-medieval items as well. Same goes for Category:History of clothing (Western fashion) with subcategories up to 1940s fashion‎. Brandmeistertalk  12:32, 14 April 2020 (UTC)
 * support merge with Category:History of clothing (Western fashion). - PKM (talk) 19:42, 14 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Yes merging makes perfect sense. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:11, 14 April 2020 (UTC)
 * I also support merging, and suggest that 's suggestion of a specific mediaeval category could (should?) be added as a subcat. Grutness... wha?   03:25, 15 April 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Spelling reform

 * Propose merging Category:Spelling reform to Category:Orthography reform
 * Nominator's rationale: Both of the category is about orthography reform. Soumyabrata (talk • subpages) 13:22, 15 March 2020 (UTC)


 * Keep - "Spelling is one of the elements of orthography", hence Category:Spelling is a subcat of Category:Orthography and Category:Spelling reform is a subcat of Category:Orthography reform. If a merge is required, it should be a reverse merge, of the subcat into the parent. Oculi (talk) 15:05, 15 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep  Oculi is right. If you want to reduce the number of categories, keep the inclusive one, and then its categorization will remain accurate, meaning that articles about broader orthographic reforms won’t be mischaracterized as “spelling.” —Michael Z. 2020-03-15 16:14 z 
 * Suggestion merge both to Category:Orthography and spelling reform, since there appears to be a big overlap (spelling reform is often a major part of orthography reform). Marcocapelle (talk) 16:24, 16 March 2020 (UTC)

Category:Track and field athletes by club

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Not renamed Timrollpickering (Talk) 23:32, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Track and field athletes by club to Category:Competitors in athletics by club
 * Nominator's rationale: The contents of this tree include competitors in all forms of the sport of athletics, not just track and field. The naming convention of the child categories is mixed and ambiguous: "athletes" and "athletics competitors". We need to make it clear that these categories are specifically about the sport of athletics, and not sport in general.


 * This is particularly problematic as the parent clubs are often multi-sport ones with child categories for other types of athlete (e.g. Category:Fenerbahçe S.K.). It also does not help that some similarly named "X CLUB athletes" categories relate to all sports rather than specifically athletics (I will raise this in a separate nomination). I suggest we standardise the athletics club member tree to match the logical parent Category:Competitors in athletics. SFB 11:39, 15 March 2020 (UTC)


 * Child nominations
 * Category:Beşiktaş J.K. athletes → Category:Beşiktaş J.K. competitors in athletics
 * Category:Enkaspor athletes → Category:Enkaspor competitors in athletics
 * Category:Fenerbahçe athletes → Category:Fenerbahçe competitors in athletics
 * Category:Athletes in Germany by club → Category:Competitors in athletics in Germany by club
 * Category:TSV 1860 München athletes → Category:TSV 1860 München competitors in athletics
 * Category:TG Aachen athletes‎ → Category:TG Aachen competitors in athletics
 * Category:DJK Agon 08 Düsseldorf athletes‎ → Category:DJK Agon 08 Düsseldorf competitors in athletics
 * Category:LG Ahlen-Hamm athletes‎ → Category:LG Ahlen-Hamm competitors in athletics
 * Category:ASV Köln athletes → Category:ASV Köln competitors in athletics
 * Category:LG Bayer Leverkusen athletes‎ → Category:LG Bayer Leverkusen competitors in athletics
 * Category:Bayer 05 Uerdingen athletes‎ → Category:Bayer 05 Uerdingen competitors in athletics
 * Category:OSC Berlin athletes‎ → Category:OSC Berlin competitors in athletics
 * Category:Eintracht Braunschweig athletes‎ → Category:Eintracht Braunschweig competitors in athletics
 * Category:LG Braunschweig athletes‎ → Category:LG Braunschweig competitors in athletics
 * Category:SC DHfK Leipzig athletes‎ → Category:SC DHfK Leipzig competitors in athletics
 * Category:LAV Dortmund athletes‎ → Category:LAV Dortmund competitors in athletics
 * Category:Eintracht Frankfurt athletes‎ → Category:Eintracht Frankfurt competitors in athletics
 * Category:SC Eintracht Hamm athletes‎ → Category:SC Eintracht Hamm competitors in athletics
 * Category:SC Empor Rostock athletes‎ → Category:SC Empor Rostock competitors in athletics
 * Category:SpVgg Feuerbach athletes‎ → Category:SpVgg Feuerbach competitors in athletics
 * Category:LG Frankfurt athletes‎ → Category:LG Frankfurt competitors in athletics
 * Category:SC Leipzig athletes‎ → Category:SC Leipzig competitors in athletics
 * Category:SC Magdeburg athletes‎ → Category:SC Magdeburg competitors in athletics
 * Category:USC Mainz athletes‎ → Category:USC Mainz competitors in athletics
 * Category:MTG Mannheim athletes‎ → Category:MTG Mannheim competitors in athletics
 * Category:LG Neckar-Odenwald athletes‎ → Category:LG Neckar-Odenwald competitors in athletics
 * Category:LG Olympia Dortmund athletes‎ → Category:LG Olympia Dortmund competitors in athletics
 * Category:LAC Quelle Fürth athletes‎ → Category:LAC Quelle Fürth competitors in athletics
 * Category:SV Salamander Kornwestheim athletes → Category:SV Salamander Kornwestheim competitors in athletics
 * Category:LG Sieg athletes‎ → Category:LG Sieg competitors in athletics
 * Category:VfL Sindelfingen athletes‎ → Category:VfL Sindelfingen competitors in athletics
 * Category:VfB Stuttgart athletes‎ → Category:VfB Stuttgart competitors in athletics
 * Category:SC Traktor Schwerin athletes → Category:SC Traktor Schwerin competitors in athletics
 * Category:TV Wattenscheid athletes → Category:TV Wattenscheid competitors in athletics
 * Category:VfL Wolfsburg athletes‎ → Category:VfL Wolfsburg competitors in athletics
 * Category:Athletics competitors of Italian military sports bodies → Category:Competitors in athletics for Italian military sports bodies
 * Category:Athletics competitors of Centro Sportivo Aeronautica Militare‎ → Category:Centro Sportivo Aeronautica Militare competitors in athletics
 * Category:Athletics competitors of Centro Sportivo Carabinieri → Category:Centro Sportivo Carabinieri competitors in athletics
 * Category:Athletics competitors of Fiamme Azzurre‎ → Category:Fiamme Azzurre competitors in athletics
 * Category:Athletics competitors of Fiamme Oro‎ → Category:Fiamme Oro competitors in athletics
 * Category:Athletics competitors of Gruppo Sportivo Esercito‎ → Category:Gruppo Sportivo Esercito competitors in athletics
 * Category:Athletics competitors of Gruppo Sportivo Forestale → Category:Gruppo Sportivo Forestale competitors in athletics
 * Category:Athletes in Norway by club → Category:Competitors in athletics in Norway by club
 * Category:Ullensaker/Kisa IL athletes → Category:Ullensaker/Kisa IL competitors in athletics
 * Category:Athletes in Poland by club → Category:Competitors in athletics in Poland by club
 * Category:Jagiellonia Białystok athletes‎ → Category:Jagiellonia Białystok competitors in athletics
 * Category:Lechia Gdańsk athletes → Category:Lechia Gdańsk competitors in athletics
 * Category:Legia Warsaw athletes‎ → Category:Legia Warsaw competitors in athletics
 * Category:Podlasie Białystok athletes‎ → Category:Podlasie Białystok competitors in athletics
 * Category:Skra Warszawa athletes → Category:Skra Warszawa competitors in athletics
 * Category:Śląsk Wrocław athletes → Category:Śląsk Wrocław competitors in athletics
 * Category:Zawisza Bydgoszcz athletes‎ → Category:Zawisza Bydgoszcz competitors in athletics
 * Category:S.L. Benfica athletes → Category:S.L. Benfica competitors in athletics
 * Category:Athletes in Sweden by club → Category:Competitors in athletics in Sweden by club
 * Category:Hammarby IF Friidrott athletes‎ → Category:Hammarby IF Friidrott competitors in athletics
 * Category:Malmö AI athletes‎ → Category:Malmö AI competitors in athletics
 * Category:Örgryte IS Friidrott athletes‎ → Category:Örgryte IS Friidrott competitors in athletics
 * Oppose - the bizarrely named Category:Competitors in athletics is a creation of SFB rather than the result of any consensus. This nom creates a large anomaly throughout (the listed categories are subcats of  etc). Oculi (talk) 13:13, 15 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose because is "athletics competitors" and not "competitors in athletics". --Kasper2006 (talk) 17:31, 15 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose -- It should be Category:Athletes by club. There is an ENGVAR issue here.  "Track and field" is an Americanism and might be appropriate as an ultimate parent if any of the children were Americans, but as far as I can see this is wholly or mainly a European category, where British English is more appropriate.  Peterkingiron (talk) 19:12, 15 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose athletes do not always compete in athletics (sensu stricto). A quick google search for "great athletes" pulls up the likes of Michael Jordan, Muhammad Ali, Michael Phelps, Roger Federer, and Pele. Great athletes to be sure, but they notably compete(d) in basketball, boxing, swimming, tennis, and soccer/association football and not "athletics" of the track & field variety. Carlossuarez46 (talk) 23:46, 17 March 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Public Health Emergency of International Concern

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: no consensus. – Fayenatic  L ondon 11:42, 14 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Public Health Emergency of International Concern to Category:Public Health Emergencies of International Concern
 * Nominator's rationale: This appears to be a set category rather than topic category. Only Polio eradication is somewhat out. Brandmeistertalk  11:08, 15 March 2020 (UTC)


 * Keep - it isn't a set category as it contains 2 topic subcats. Oculi (talk) 11:30, 15 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Having topic subcats doesn't make it a topic category automatically. Five out of six disease articles inside the category have been classified as Public Health Emergency of International Concern. Brandmeistertalk  11:47, 15 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Of course it does. Any subcat of a set category is necessarily a set category (assuming the correct laws of logic have been followed, which sadly is very far from the case in Wikipedia). Oculi (talk) 11:54, 15 March 2020 (UTC)
 * No. An example mentioned in WP:SETCAT, Category:Cities in France contains many topical subcats, e.g. Category:Strasbourg. Likewise, this category overwhelmingly contains diseases classified as Public Health Emergency of International Concern (PHEIC). Polio is also classified as such, so except parent article and Template:PHEIC all articles inside are PHEICs. Brandmeistertalk   12:52, 15 March 2020 (UTC)


 * REname per nom. It is covering multiple emergencies, as declared by WHO.  Plural is correct.  Peterkingiron (talk) 19:07, 15 March 2020 (UTC)
 * ALT It's not the emergencies that are plural but the declarations by the WHO that are plural. Each PHEIC in itself is singular; collectively they are plural. So it should be something like Category:WHO declarations of a Public Health Emergency of International Concern. Laurel Lodged (talk) 15:46, 21 March 2020 (UTC)
 * The parent article is at Public Health Emergency of International Concern, so the category follows suit per WP:C2D. Brandmeistertalk  16:50, 21 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep (=do not rename), or delete, Oculi and Laurel Lodged are both right. Besides the declaration is a borderline defining characteristic of an emergency, so the category might be deleted as well. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:20, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Rename to using short names (WHO, PHEIC). 94.178.234.44 (talk) 12:24, 6 April 2020 (UTC)
 * No, the category does not contain declarations, it contains epidemics. Apart from that, abbreviating PHEIC does not make any sense. Marcocapelle (talk) 16:45, 6 April 2020 (UTC)

Category:19th-century kings of Germany

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Delete Timrollpickering (Talk) 23:34, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting 19th-century kings of germany


 * Nominator's rationale: delete per WP:NONDEF, "king of Germany" is not a defining characteristic of Napoleon II. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:25, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

I've removed him from that category because I don't see how it's appropriate. DrKay (talk) 09:19, 15 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Comments I had added him to a category as the last King of the Romans. The category was merged to the Kings of Germany category, and then deleted. Dimadick (talk) 08:25, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Comment there were kings in Germany (e.g., the King of Bavaria) but not of Germany; there was an emperor of Germany. Carlossuarez46 (talk) 23:48, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Support per nom. By the 19th century the title, if it ever really meant anything, had ceased beyond doubt to have any meaning. It could only conceivably be said to have had meaning for 2 years. Laurel Lodged (talk) 15:42, 21 March 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Kings of Germany

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Rename Timrollpickering (Talk) 23:36, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:11th-century kings of Germany to Category:11th-century Kings of the Romans
 * Propose renaming Category:12th-century kings of Germany to Category:12th-century Kings of the Romans
 * Propose renaming Category:13th-century kings of Germany to Category:13th-century Kings of the Romans
 * Propose renaming Category:14th-century kings of Germany to Category:14th-century Kings of the Romans
 * Propose renaming Category:15th-century kings of Germany to Category:15th-century Kings of the Romans
 * Propose renaming Category:16th-century kings of Germany to Category:16th-century Kings of the Romans
 * Propose renaming Category:17th-century kings of Germany to Category:17th-century Kings of the Romans
 * Propose renaming Category:18th-century kings of Germany to Category:18th-century Kings of the Romans
 * Nominator's rationale: rename, C2D per King of the Romans and C2C per Category:Kings of the Romans. This was opposed at CFDS.


 * pinging contributor of speedy discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:14, 15 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Comments I had created the Kings of Romans categories, and they were all deleted in August 2019. Isn't there a rule against recreating deleted categories? Dimadick (talk) 08:28, 17 March 2020 (UTC)
 * The general rule is to not be disruptive. In this case I had nominated the categories as "merge or reverse merge", the discussion was closed as "merge" but in hindsight "reverse merge" would have been better. This nomination is meant to implement the latter after all. That is not disruptive. Marcocapelle (talk) 18:36, 17 March 2020 (UTC)


 * Support per nom. 19th-century probably not needed. Laurel Lodged (talk) 15:39, 21 March 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:10th-century kings of Germany

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Rename Timrollpickering (Talk) 23:36, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:10th-century kings of Germany to Category:10th century kings of East Francia
 * Nominator's rationale: rename, anachronistic title, rename to match Category:9th-century kings of East Francia. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:07, 15 March 2020 (UTC)


 * Support per nom. Laurel Lodged (talk) 15:34, 21 March 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Carolingian Roman emperors

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Merge Timrollpickering (Talk) 23:37, 24 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Carolingian Roman emperors to Category:Rulers of the Carolingian Empire
 * Nominator's rationale: I created this category in 2015, but after the creation of Category:9th-century Holy Roman Emperors in 2018 this category lost its purpose. No need to merge to the other parent, all content is already in the tree of Category:Holy Roman Emperors. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:03, 15 March 2020 (UTC)


 * Support per nom. Laurel Lodged (talk) 15:34, 21 March 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.