Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2020 November 20



Category:Lists of farms

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete, sole article added to Category:Agriculture-related lists. Good Ol’factory (talk) 02:07, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting lists of farms


 * Nominator's rationale: Unnecessary category. Down to 1 article after several others were deleted. Geschichte (talk) 22:56, 20 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Comment The nom for this category also proposed to delete all three of the farm-related articles. Only List of farms in Cornwall remains while |List of farms in Gausdal was deleted by just a single "delete" vote while |List of farms in Gjøvik was deleted by many votes.  Yoshiman6464 ♫🥚 23:35, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Merge to Category:Agriculture-related lists per WP:SMALLCAT. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:08, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete -- Even if there were more lists in this category (and it might not be difficult to create them), I do not think such lists would be worth having. There must be 1000s of farms in each county and most are wholly NN.  Peterkingiron (talk) 15:35, 28 November 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Czech politicians of Japanese descent

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge to Category:Czech politicians. (non-admin closure) Asmodea Oaktree (talk) 20:33, 28 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Czech politicians of Japanese descent to Category:Czech politicians
 * Propose merging Category:Czech politicians of Korean descent to Category:Czech politicians
 * Nominator's rationale: Only 1 - in the two categories. Doesnt seem very defining. Rathfelder (talk) 22:05, 20 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Merge as a trivial intersection. Descent and occupation are entirely unrelated. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:10, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Merge also to Category:Czech people of Japanese descent. The Korean descent category may be unnecessary: he apparently has a Korean grandparent but never lived there.  Peterkingiron (talk) 17:34, 22 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Merge. Grandparent is quintessential to the "descent" categories, though. Geschichte (talk) 13:18, 23 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Merge, trivial cat per WP:OCEGRS. Neither Japanese nor Korean created a significicant subculture or practice of Czech politics. Place Clichy (talk) 16:44, 25 November 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Destroyed landmarks in New Zealand

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. MER-C 13:17, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting destroyed landmarks in new zealand


 * Nominator's rationale: As per other deletion noms, "destroyed" and "landmarks" are subjective - of the three subjects in the category, one is a redirect, the other two are already safely in Category:Buildings and structures demolished as a result of the 2011 Christchurch earthquake, a proper cat for an event which caused the destruction of a solid handful of buildings. SportingFlyer  T · C  19:27, 20 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Support. FWIW, the redirect is already in the equivalent buildings and structures category. Grutness... wha?   02:49, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:11, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. Place Clichy (talk) 16:44, 25 November 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Destroyed landmarks in Denmark

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. MER-C 13:18, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting destroyed landmarks in denmark


 * Nominator's rationale: As per other discussions, "destroyed" and "landmark" are both subjective, and we have other places for things. Only two buildings in this category, both of which are already properly in country-specific demolished or destroyed cats. SportingFlyer  T · C  19:22, 20 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Merge to Category:Demolished buildings and structures in Denmark, one of the two articles is not yet in there. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:15, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Change vote to delete per discussion below. Marcocapelle (talk) 14:37, 22 November 2020 (UTC)
 * I disagree with that merge - the one that isn't is already properly in Category:Buildings and structures in Denmark destroyed during World War II. SportingFlyer  T · C  11:59, 22 November 2020 (UTC)
 * You are right, I overlooked this. Marcocapelle (talk) 14:37, 22 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete per nom. Place Clichy (talk) 16:44, 25 November 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Need for Speed games
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2020 November 28%23Category:Need for Speed games

Category:Crazy Taxi video games

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: no consensus. Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:38, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Crazy Taxi video games to Category:Crazy Taxi
 * Nominator's rationale: Pointless subcategory, almost nothing in parent category. ZXCVBNM (TALK) 15:02, 20 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Support per nom. Geschichte (talk) 22:57, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose, it is the parent category that should be nominated. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:20, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose, it is useful for a clean classification: this category only contains games, while the parent category contains several subcategories (games and medias), the main article (the series / franchise) and other related pages. Even if it means choosing, this category is more important than the parent one, but I think both should be kept: Category:Crazy Taxi video games is included in Category:Racing video games by series and Category:Sega video games, wherease Category:Crazy Taxi is included in Category:Sega Games franchises and Category:Works about taxicabs, so they are radically different. --- ʂɤɲ ✉ 23:19, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep and reverse merge per Marcocapelle. Place Clichy (talk) 16:44, 25 November 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Midnight Club games

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: do not merge; the target category was not nominated. Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:40, 9 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Midnight Club games to Category:Midnight Club
 * Nominator's rationale: Pointless subcategory, there is nothing in the parent category. ZXCVBNM (TALK) 15:00, 20 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Oppose, it is the parent category that should be nominated. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:21, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep and reverse merge per Marcocapelle. Place Clichy (talk) 16:44, 25 November 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:MacOS massively multiplayer online role-playing games
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2020 November 28%23Category:MacOS massively multiplayer online role-playing games

Category:Mon Wikipedia

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 02:16, 28 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting mon wikipedia


 * Nominator's rationale: I'm not seeing why we need a separate category for this. Even if the Mon Wikipedia article is kept, there's nothing so special about it as to warrant an entire subcategory. Wikipedias in much more major languages don't have their own (sub)categories; why should this? Adam9007 (talk) 05:20, 20 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Hello Admin Wikipedia this category I noticed is important for Mon Wikipedia this category can I use it or not don't misunderstand me, I am only trying to help Wikipedia, I would mostly like to help Mon Wikipedia, most are Mon people read too little books, because Mon people doesn't have a government school Most of them go to learn Mon language, they have to go to Monk temple, Burmese government school, he only teaches in Burmese language, Mon's technology has not yet grown, I would like to ask for help Admin Wikipedia, thanks my name is 咽頭べさ (talk) 07:10, 20 November 2020 (UTC) all that I have said, I am not lying,
 * No one here will question your good intentions per WP:GOODFAITH. The purpose of this board is to discuss whether categories are WP:DEFINING and help readers navigate between articles. (Note that I reformatted the above comment and interpret it as "oppose".) - RevelationDirect (talk) 10:09, 20 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete Per WP:SMALLCAT since I can't imagine the category getting up to 5 articles and only 1 should be there now. The current contents are all under Category:Mon language so no merge is needed. - RevelationDirect (talk) 10:09, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete, the main article belongs in Category:Wikipedias by language, is there already and that is sufficient for categorization. Marcocapelle (talk) 15:51, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete Mon Wikipedia has been turned into a redirect and this category is now emptied. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 01:35, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. Ninja ✮ Strikers  «☎» 13:27, 21 November 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Fictional magic school students
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. MER-C 13:18, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Fictional magic school students to Category:Fictional students of magic
 * Nominator's rationale: Move to a title that is less of a grammatical pretzel. ZXCVBNM (TALK) 08:09, 19 October 2020 (UTC)

<div class="xfd_relist" style="border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 25px;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Rename per nom. –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d c̄ ) 09:42, 19 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Rename per nom. The current names suggests that the school students are magic, not that they study magic. Dimadick (talk) 16:00, 22 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete -- The whole category seems to relate only to Harry Potter characters, which will best be covered by having the characters in a tree relating to that. Peterkingiron (talk) 16:32, 25 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete per Peterkingiron, well observed. Marcocapelle (talk) 18:00, 25 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete per Peterkingiron. I can think of only one other. Deb (talk) 18:19, 7 November 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Good Ol’factory (talk) 02:11, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete per Peterkingiron. Carlossuarez46 (talk) 19:05, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete per Peterkingiron. Place Clichy (talk) 16:44, 25 November 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Lordship of Botrun
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge as WP:SOFTDELETE. German Wikipedia has six articles on individual Lords of Botrun, so there is a possibility of recreating the category in future. See https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q8972926.  – Fayenatic  L ondon 23:40, 17 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Lordship of Botrun to Category:County of Tripoli
 * Nominator's rationale: upmerge per WP:SMALLCAT, currently only two articles. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:25, 25 September 2020 (UTC)


 * Oppose. There were more than one lords of Botrun, so the category can easily be expanded. Borsoka (talk) 02:03, 26 September 2020 (UTC)
 * We can create Category:Lords of Botrun when every lord has his own article. But I can't imagine many more topic articles to come. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:51, 26 September 2020 (UTC)


 * REname and repurpose as Category:Lords of Botrun, with Lordship of Botrun as its main article. Peterkingiron (talk) 14:13, 27 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Why do not preserve the status quo? Borsoka (talk) 05:27, 28 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Because the two articles can and do already directly link to each other. Categories start to become useful in case the number of direct links would become too large. Marcocapelle (talk) 15:08, 3 October 2020 (UTC)

<div class="xfd_relist" style="border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 25px;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MER-C 09:25, 25 October 2020 (UTC) <div class="xfd_relist" style="border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 25px;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:47, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Support This won't help whoever has to close this as a no consensus close, but this is a WP:SMALLCAT and upmerging is proper. I have no issues if this category is repurposed as long as WP:SMALLCAT isn't violated. SportingFlyer  T · C  15:42, 13 December 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Bleach episode lists
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename. Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:33, 14 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Bleach episode lists to Category:Bleach (TV series) seasons
 * Nominator's rationale: rename per article title Bleach (TV series) and per actual content about seasons. This was earlier opposed for speedy renaming. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:24, 1 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Category:Bleach episode lists to Category:Bleach (TV series) seasons – C2D: and C2C. Gonnym (talk) 22:04, 14 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose speedily changing “episode lists” to “seasons”, as that would go against the convention in . Armbrust The Homunculus 05:11, 15 October 2020 (UTC)
 * what about speedily renaming this to Category:Bleach (TV series) episode lists? Marcocapelle (talk) 18:43, 19 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Nope. They are season articles. --Gonnym (talk) 18:53, 19 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Well, after you removed List of Bleach episodes from the category... Armbrust The Homunculus 10:36, 24 October 2020 (UTC)


 * pinging contributors to speedy discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:24, 1 November 2020 (UTC)

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 * is consistently using the current format, so oppose changing just one of them. Armbrust The Homunculus 15:08, 1 November 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:11, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose. I don't really see an improvement here as Bleach doesn't need to be defined here when it comes to episodes. - Knowledgekid87 (talk) 04:23, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * the bigger question is whether you support "seasons" instead of "episode lists". Marcocapelle (talk) 14:03, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * I support "episode lists" here as essentially that is what these are. We can always have a separate discussion regarding WP:COMMONNAME elsewhere. - Knowledgekid87 (talk) 18:53, 21 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Comment – Did anyone actually look at the articles?! It's Bleach (season 1) etc. Cats should clearly state in the name what they are. Each article is more than simply an "episode list". And why am I not surprised that this is all wrong in Category:Lists of anime episodes – I'd bet that nearly every one of those is actually made up of "season" articles. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 07:27, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I take that as a support of the nomination. Marcocapelle (talk) 14:03, 21 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Support. We have lists of episodes and we have seasons (which indeed have episode summaries but also plot, cast, home-media releases, etc.) Actually there are lots of categories on "episode lists" which should better be renamed as "seasons". Dragon Ball has two separated, well defined categories: Category:Dragon Ball episode lists and Category:Dragon Ball seasons; we should follow this pattern. -- LoЯd  ۞pεth  23:21, 7 December 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:American people of Iraqi-Arab descent
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. There is a rough consensus that the nominated category should not exist. The issue of whether to merge or to delete outright did not reach a consensus, so I'm defaulting to merge to retain the information. Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:31, 14 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:American people of Iraqi-Arab descent to Category:American people of Iraqi descent
 * Nominator's rationale: Arabs are the majority group on Iraq. We do not usually have subcategories for majority groups, per WP:OCEGRS. There is no other Iraqi-Arab descent category. It is most likely that many or most of the 67 individuals in the target category (and the 73 in ) also have Arab descent, so there is little rationale to single out the 11 articles in this category. This illustrates how unpractical and hard to maintain such a category is. Also note that Iraqi Arabs redirects to Iraqis. Place Clichy (talk) 16:41, 21 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Comment: a dual merge to could in theory be feasible for articles for which it is defining, but in practice this category is a container for so-called 'Arab countries', regardless of the ethnicity, and  is already a subcategory. Place Clichy (talk) 16:41, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

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 * Merge per nom. We might have ethnic descent categories for minority groups like Kurds, but certainly not for majority groups. Marcocapelle (talk) 17:01, 21 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose -- There are several sibling categories for other ethnicities, including Jewish and Assyrian. People in this category will be Arabic speaking and probably Muslim.  The others probably speak Arabic as an everyday language, but have other languages for worship, etc.  This is a well-established distinction throughout the Middle East, resulting from the former Ottoman milet system, where religious leaders were responsible for the behaviour of their (endogamous) communities.  Peterkingiron (talk) 17:34, 22 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete unnecessary descent category suffering the usual problems. How much descent is sufficient; how recent must it be; and how is it documented/verified? Carlossuarez46 (talk) 21:41, 26 August 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:22, 2 November 2020 (UTC) <div class="xfd_relist" style="border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 25px;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Delete per Carlos or merge. DexDor(talk) 07:24, 3 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose I agree with Peterkingiron, that the category reflects longstanding distinctions in Iraqi culture. That it is poorly maintained is not a reason for deletion. Dimadick (talk) 18:34, 4 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Question - what about category:American people of Iraqi-Jewish descent and category:American people of Iraqi-Assyrian descent? Iraq had been a multi-ethnic country in early 20th century, but ethnocide and genocide policies by various rules made it into mostly Arab with Kurdish enclave in the north, while numerous ethnicities dispersed across Middle East and the world (Iraqi Jews, Assyrians, Mandaeans, Yezidis, Shabaki, Turkmen, etc).GreyShark (dibra) 14:08, 5 November 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:52, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * With respect to the question raised by User:Greyshark09, minority ethnic descent might be a different discussion, but this is about descent of a majority ethnicity in a country. Marcocapelle (talk) 14:47, 22 November 2020 (UTC)
 * That is my point - Arabs were not the majority of Iraqis by the early 20th century. They were one of the two largest ethnic groups (about 30-35% of Iraqis), but not the majority (>>50%) of all Iraqi population, while substantial other ethnic groups co-existed including most notably Kurds (nearly 30-35% at the time), Turkmen (10-15%), Assyro-Chaldeans (~15%), Persians (~5%), Iraqi Jews (~3%), Yezidis (~2%) and other smaller minorities (~2%). Today, Arabs are more than 75% of Iraqis, but applying this current majority on the past is anachronistic. We should avoid anachronistic thinking in my humble opinion. Viewing Iraq as an Arab (or Arab-majority) country is a very recent phenomenon, which came into being due to aggressive Arabization during the 20th century, which turned Arabs from large group into majority, while driving other ethnic groups to become minorities in Iraqi diaspora and even closing to extinction.GreyShark (dibra) 07:47, 25 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Precisely, while Jewish, Assyrian etc. ethnicities have a decent category structure, this cannot be said at all for Arab categories which contain every national category of countries in the Arab League are are not understood as ethnicity categories. This may indeed be a result of what you call agressive Arabization, or let's just say for short that in the Middle East everybody who natively speaks Arabic is an Arab, especially seen from outside the region. It says a lot that we have an Iraqi-Arab category for people in the United States, but not for people in Iraq, and not Iraqi Arabs article but just a redirect to Iraqis. Looking quickly at the articles in the nominated category, nothing is said e.g. in Mahmoud Saeed or Alise Alousi or any other that they would self-identify with the Iraqi-Arab compound (in the sense of the majority ethnic group of Iraq excluding minorites), or that their Iraqi ascendancy comes from this group. The word Arab is instead used either because their language is Arabic, their work is in Arabic, or they are identified as Arab American just because they are from the Middle East and are perceived as such in a generic fashion, or are active in Middle-East related causes. The scheme you seem to suggest, based on a stricter reading of what defines the Arab ethnicity, could work, only if we remove national subcategories for every Arab category and use them strictly for individuals that reliable sources define as ethnic Arabs (rather than just from an "Arab" country). I do recognize that it would have a certain logic, however it would be a huge work, and seen how ethnic categories are currently applied with a shovel by good-faith editors merely because they exist, I do not think this could be maintained in the long run. Place Clichy (talk) 16:44, 25 November 2020 (UTC)


 * (as nom) Delete result would also be fine for me, ethnic Iraqi-Arab ascendancy does not seem to be defining or supported by reliable sources for any of the articles in this category. Place Clichy (talk) 16:44, 25 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Support We do not categorize people by the main dominant group in an area. Thus we do not create Category:White Americans the way we do for African-Americans. The same applies here, Arab Iraqis are the majority, we do not categorize by that.John Pack Lambert (talk) 19:25, 10 December 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Recipients of the Dostlug Order
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. MER-C 13:18, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose Deleting/Listifying Category:Recipients of the Dostlug Order
 * Nominator's rationale: WP:NONDEFINING (WP:PERFCAT and WP:OCAWARD)
 * When Soviet, Russian and other foreign leaders or performers visit Azerbaijan, the Dostlug Order is given out as souvenir to commemorate the visit. In the category, 4 of the article mention the award in passing and 15 don't even mention the award so it's clearly not defining. There wasn't a list so I created one here in the main article. - RevelationDirect (talk) 00:36, 20 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Background In the past, we've deleted similar categories for high ranking visitors here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here and here. - RevelationDirect (talk) 00:36, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete, obvious case of WP:OCAWARD. Marcocapelle (talk) 04:36, 20 November 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Honorary degree recipients from Kerala
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. MER-C 13:19, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose Deleting Category:Honorary degree recipients from Kerala
 * Nominator's rationale: Per WP:OCAWARD and WP:OCLOCATION
 * This category groups people from the Indian state of Kerala who have received an honorary degree from any university or college. In the articles, this is not treated as defining and the "degrees" (it is often plural) are listed with other honors. There is a subset of articles here that do mention the award in the intro, which usually suggests it's defining, but all the ones I checked are recent edits from the creator of this category (for instance here and here). The earlier honory degree categories we deleted were all by awarding institution and I'm also not clear on why we would group them by a geographic area. - RevelationDirect (talk) 00:36, 20 November 2020 (UTC)


 * Background We previously deleted all the other categories for honorary degree recipients here. - RevelationDirect (talk) 00:36, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete, an award by location other than as a container category by nationality does not make any sense. Marcocapelle (talk) 04:39, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete -- Honorary degrees fail WP:OCAWARD. The parent is Category:Lists of honorary degree recipients.  All the other content is lists of degrees awarded by individual universities, not by state or ethnicity.  If the awards are in fact for one university, I would be voting to listify.  Peterkingiron (talk) 17:41, 22 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete. We generally do not have categories for honorary degrees. Place Clichy (talk) 16:44, 25 November 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Harvest Moon games
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Story of Seasons games, which is well-reasoned as the better option. The Bushranger One ping only 06:32, 18 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Harvest Moon games to Category:Story of Seasons
 * Nominator's rationale: The current main article of this category appears to be Story of Seasons (aka the series formerly known as Harvest Moon). A name change seems to be in order, although due to the tricky nature of this series I thought I'd gather consensus on what it should be called. ZXCVBNM (TALK) 04:22, 6 November 2020 (UTC)

<div class="xfd_relist" style="border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 25px;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:07, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Alt rename to Category:Story of Seasons games, there is no obvious reason to drop "games" from the category name. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:27, 21 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Yes there is, it's WP:C2D with the main article for the series, Story of Seasons.ZXCVBNM (TALK) 21:12, 25 November 2020 (UTC)
 * It is a set category, so WP:C2D only applies insofar "Harvest Moon" is replaced by "Story of Seasons". (By analogy, we do not have Category:Video game because the main article is Video game.) Marcocapelle (talk) 07:47, 26 November 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Murder by year and country
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: keep. 2 opposes versus 1 support. (non-admin closure) Train of Knowledge (Talk) 23:39, 20 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming:
 * REDIRECT Category:Murder by year and country to Category:Murders by year and country
 * REDIRECT Category:Murder by decade and country to Category:Murders by decade and country
 * Nominator's rationale: It was agreed at the Speedy page that it would be worth holding a full discussion on a mass nomination to rename all "crimes" categories to "crime", as they are mostly mixed set and topic categories. However, that would require a lot of work, and this nomination is not it. In the meantime, these intermediate categories should be renamed to be consistent with siblings in Category:Murder by year/Category:Murder by decade. – Fayenatic  L ondon 16:51, 6 November 2020 (UTC)

This is part of a wider problem with the crime category tree, which mostly consists of "Foo by year" containing "YYYY Foos". This mismatch is fairly regular. I agree that the contaner and its subcats should be consistent, but I am unsure which direction to go. A decision needs to be made whether we want these to be set categories named "crimes", or broader topic categories named "crime". My thought so far is that the broader topic categories would be more useful, but I'd be interested in other views. -- Brown HairedGirl  (talk) • (contribs) 14:32, 13 October 2020 (UTC) But if there some indication of a convergence of support for a particular format, I would do it. @Oculi and @Fayenatic, @Marcocapelle: would you three agree that the format for set categories should be "Crime in CountryName in YYYY" etc? I think that a prelim discussion at WT:CATP would help. -- Brown HairedGirl  (talk) • (contribs) 21:10, 21 October 2020 (UTC)
 * REDIRECT Category:Murder by decade and country to Category:Murders by decade and country – C2C with sub-cats and with siblings in Category:Murder by decade. – Fayenatic  L ondon 13:54, 13 October 2020 (UTC)
 * REDIRECT Category:Murder by year and country to Category:Murders by year and country
 * Oppose speedy. Thanks for the ping, @Fayenatic.
 * Picking Category:1978 murders in the United Kingdom, this is a topic category misnamed as a set category. Eg Fred West was not a murder. I would favour renaming the subcats. Oculi (talk) 17:53, 13 October 2020 (UTC)
 * That category is a convincing example. Presumably it would become "Murder in the United Kingdom in 1978" within "Crime in the United Kingdom in 1978". The sibling Category:Terrorist incidents in the United Kingdom in 1978 could likewise be renamed to "Terrorism in the United Kingdom in 1978", as some cats in that series contain articles on persons (perpetrators, victims, people who thwarted attacks), locations etc rather than only events. This could require a big nomination. – Fayenatic  L ondon 18:54, 13 October 2020 (UTC)
 * has one of you intentions to compose a bigger nomination? Marcocapelle (talk) 18:34, 21 October 2020 (UTC)
 * @Marcocapelle, I hadn't planned to do so, because it's a monster nomination. So out of laziness, I was inclined to look the other way.
 * I am not sure, it seems that - while Category:Crimes exists - a tree with crimes by country and year makes (at least equally) sense. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:41, 21 October 2020 (UTC)
 * @Marcocapelle, I see your point, at least in theory ... but the reality of Category:Crimes is that despite being named as a set category and having appropriate header text, in practice it has a large set of topic categories as subcats. -- Brown HairedGirl  (talk) • (contribs) 23:07, 21 October 2020 (UTC)
 * IMHO that's a valid analysis, and I would therefore support the proposal. – Fayenatic  L ondon 08:05, 26 October 2020 (UTC)
 * I won't oppose when it goes to CfD as renaming to "crime", but the required effort is huge and the gain is (imho) small at best. Marcocapelle (talk) 17:26, 26 October 2020 (UTC)
 * I admit that I'm not prepared to make the effort myself. if you don't anticipate doing so yourself in the near future, I'd be grateful if you would withdraw your Oppose on these intermediate categories. – Fayenatic  L ondon 08:28, 27 October 2020 (UTC)


 * }
 * Support, they are container categories only holding murders subcategories. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:07, 7 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose - as I pointed out in the speedy, the subcats are set categories only in name, and should all be renamed to 'Murder in XXXX'. This would indeed be a lot of work but so would removing all the non-murders from 'Murders in XXXX'. Oculi (talk) 01:24, 8 November 2020 (UTC)
 * I would oppose purging irrespective of the naming convention. Nearly every article is about a murder, or a countable number of murders, not on the general topic of murder. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:30, 8 November 2020 (UTC)

<div class="xfd_relist" style="border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 25px;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:05, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose Murder as a word is countable and non-countable, and the plural of the non-countable is murder. I believe these container categories are non-countable, so I oppose the rename. SportingFlyer  T · C  15:45, 13 December 2020 (UTC)
 * I also just unhatted the hat - given what's in these categories (Fred West), the subcats aren't countable either, so the rename should occur but in reverse. SportingFlyer  T · C  15:47, 13 December 2020 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.