Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2021 February 14



Sects in the Latter Day Saint movement

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename. Merger proposals may be presented separately. – Fayenatic  L ondon 09:29, 21 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Monotheistic sects in the Latter Day Saint movement to Category:Monotheistic denominations in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Propose renaming Category:Trinitarian sects in the Latter Day Saint movement to Category:Trinitarian denominations in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Propose renaming Category:Hedrickite sects in the Latter Day Saint movement to Category:Hedrickite denominations in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Propose renaming Category:Josephite sects in the Latter Day Saint movement to Category:Josephite denominations in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Propose renaming Category:Strangite sects in the Latter Day Saint movement to Category:Strangite denominations in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Propose renaming Category:Prairie Saints sects in the Latter Day Saint movement to Category:Prairie Saints denominations in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Propose renaming Category:Cutlerite sects in the Latter Day Saint movement to Category:Cutlerite denominations in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Propose renaming Category:Rigdonite–Bickertonite sects in the Latter Day Saint movement to Category:Rigdonite–Bickertonite denominations in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Propose renaming Category:Pre-succession crisis sects in the Latter Day Saint movement to Category:Pre-succession crisis denominations in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Propose renaming Category:Rocky Mountain Saints sects in the Latter Day Saint movement to Category:Rocky Mountain Saints denominations in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Propose renaming Category:Liberal Mormon sects in the Latter Day Saint movement to Category:Liberal Mormon denominations in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Propose renaming Category:New restoration sects in the Latter Day Saint movement to Category:New restoration denominations in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Propose renaming Category:Self-originated sects in the Latter Day Saint movement to Category:Self-originated denominations in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Propose renaming Category:Mormon fundamentalist sects to Category:Mormon fundamentalist denominations
 * Nominator's rationale: "Sect" can carry with it a slightly negative or POV connotation that the group is somehow heretical. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church) is the dominant church in the Latter Day Saint movement (claiming 98% of Latter Day Saints), and it would likely use the "sect" terminology to describe these various branches (because it regards all but itself as illegitimate), but Wikipedia should not. If renamed these will match the parent category and the lead article List of denominations in the Latter Day Saint movement.  Good Ol’factory (talk) 21:58, 14 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Support I don't know if I see "sect" as negative, definitely not like "cult", but the proposed renames better match most of the religion category tree. - RevelationDirect (talk) 01:40, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * In Christianity, apparently "sect" used to be more pejorative than it is today. From Sect: "While the historical usage of the term 'sect' in Christendom has had pejorative connotations, referring to a group or movement with heretical beliefs or practices that deviate from those of groups considered orthodox, its primary meaning is to indicate a community which has separated itself from the larger body from which its members came." These groups certainly are sects under the latter definition. Good Ol’factory (talk) 05:17, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the additional background; perhaps my experince with the word "sect" is atypical or incomplete. All the more reason to rename them. - RevelationDirect (talk) 13:13, 15 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Rename per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:49, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Rename in many places "sect" is just as negative a word as "cult". We clearly should not use it if we want to be a global publication that avoids needlessly expressing points of view on issues at hand.John Pack Lambert (talk) 13:11, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment I have serious doubts that having all these sub-categories is really justified. I am less than convinced we really need to sub-divide Category:Latter Day Saint denominations, and I am very unconvinced we need multiple sub-layers under it.John Pack Lambert (talk) 13:15, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Rename most — while GOF has found a nice reference, the "main article" calls them denominations. I'm a bit concerned that many of them claim the same main article, and it is actually a list. Most of the sub-sub-categories are in more than one sub-category, making this seem more like a scheme of beliefs rather than a scheme of denominations. Therefore,
 * Upmerge Category:Monotheistic sects in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Upmerge Category:Prairie Saints sects in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Upmerge Category:Rocky Mountain Saints sects in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Upmerge Category:Trinitarian sects in the Latter Day Saint movement
 * Rename Category:Latter Day Saints by denomination to Category:Latter Day Saint members by denomination
 * William Allen Simpson (talk) 13:50, 15 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Support this merge as well (next to supporting the rename, so this is my 2nd vote). The above categories are poorly populated and partially overlapping container categories. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:33, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * "Prairie Saints" and "Rocky Mountain Saints" is a relatively important—if not the most fundamental—division of Latter Day Saint denominations. I would be more inclined to upmerge some of the subcategories of these two categories rather than upmerging Category:Prairie Saints sects in the Latter Day Saint movement and Category:Rocky Mountain Saints sects in the Latter Day Saint movement. But in any case, there does seem to be general overcategorization here, with a lot of the subcategory information better explained in the list and individual articles. I would leave upmerging proposals to a follow-up nomination, as it is somewhat complex. Good Ol’factory (talk) 21:29, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Fair enough, I trust you will come up with an improved merge proposal after this renaming discussion has been closed. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:24, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Support I am not certain whether these groups are sufficiently distinct to be considered Christian denomination. But the term sect indeed has unfortunate implications in modern sociology. Per the main article: "they are described as newly formed religious groups that form to protest elements of their parent religion (generally a denomination). Their motivation tends to be situated in accusations of apostasy or heresy in the parent denomination; they are often decrying liberal trends in denominational development and advocating a return to true religion." ... "sects have, in contrast to churches, a high degree of tension with the surrounding society" ...  "Some religious groups exist in tension only with co-religious groups of different ethnicities, or exist in tension with the whole of society rather than the church which the sect originated from"." Dimadick (talk) 20:02, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Support "sect" has negative connotations to many. Carlossuarez46 (talk) 20:58, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Support - parent is so this is WP:C2C. Oculi (talk) 11:19, 18 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Endorse Simpson's merging proposals above. As I said though, I am unconvinced we need any subdivisions of the parent category.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:31, 19 February 2021 (UTC)
 * No view on sects/denominations, but Upmerge categories with few members, so that we eliminate small categories. Peterkingiron (talk) 17:11, 20 February 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Executive branch of the government of Republic of Artsakh

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Executive branch of the government of the Republic of Artsakh (hoping to get it right this time). Good Ol’factory (talk) 02:30, 2 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Executive branch of the government of Republic of Artsakh to Category:Executive branch of the government of the Republic of Artsakh
 * Nominator's rationale: rename, fixing a typo (missing "the"), the proposed rename was an alternative variant that came up in the speedy discussion below. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:36, 14 February 2021 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 03:38, 10 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Category:Executive branch of the government of Republic of Artsakh to Category:Executive branch of the Republic of Artsakh government – C2C minor mistake by during closing, missing "the" before Republic; match pattern of most others in Category:Executive branches of government, where government is trailing term (such as Category:Executive branch of the United States government).
 * Oppose - agree with Category:Executive branch of the government of the Republic of Artsakh (add 'the'); but in fact there is no clear pattern in Category:Executive branches of government to favour 'XXX government' (11 occurrences) over 'government of XXX' (20 occurrences). Oculi (talk) 19:11, 10 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Oppose  There's no point in substituting one typo with another typo. Let it be what was intended: Category:Executive branch of the government of the Republic of Artsakh. Laurel Lodged (talk) 13:34, 12 February 2021 (UTC)


 * pinging contributors to speedy discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:38, 14 February 2021 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 14:08, 15 February 2021 (UTC) William Allen Simpson (talk) 14:08, 15 February 2021 (UTC) William Allen Simpson (talk) 14:14, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Support  - per Category:Government of the Republic of Artsakh and the article Government of the Republic of Artsakh. It is not entirely clear whether Government of the Republic of Artsakh is a title, so OK with 'government'. Oculi (talk) 22:37, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Support Am quietly pleased to note that even GOF can make errors. Laurel Lodged (talk) 10:56, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * , more than I care to admit! Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:11, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Thanks to Marcocapelle, as I'd not realized there was an objection. I'm not a regular user of Speedy, so am not watching, rather I watch the nominated categories.
 * Rename to Category:Executive branch of the Republic of Artsakh government — fewer 'the', fewer mistakes. Oculi has a very tendentious counting of government as a trailing term. The form "the " has a trailing "government", with no duplicate 'the':
 * the United States government‎
 * the United Kingdom Government‎
 * the South African government‎
 * the Slovenian government‎
 * the Singapore Government‎
 * the Indian government‎
 * Instead, Oculi has done some very recent speedy nominations in the other direction to support the objection, that I'll be opposing.
 * Can you rephrase this to make sense? The articles are Government of the United Kingdom, the category is ; these names are nothing to do with me. The only one I can find which uses 'Fooian' is Welsh Government. Even the US uses Federal government of the United States. Oculi (talk) 14:44, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Tendentious? A bit early to fling that one out. Laurel Lodged (talk) 15:42, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * It is hardly tendentious to observe that the standard in category names is 'Government of Foo', not 'Fooian government' or 'Foo government'; see eg Category:Government by country. Or to rely on Category_names which recommends 'of country' for government: "Non-conformance to these naming conventions shall be treated as a criterion for "speedy category renaming" as defined on WP:CFD". Oculi (talk) 18:01, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * tendentious: pushing a point of view; explicitly or implicitly slanted.
 * This is not the parent Government by country.
 * This is Category:Executive branches of government (trailing), where its main subcategories with the word "government" are:
 * Category:Heads of government (trailing), and
 * Category:National governments (trailing).
 * In my speedy nomination and my argument here, I'm only concerned with those with the before the (usually compound) country pattern. I've listed such others above.
 * Oculi is correct that Category:Welsh Government is an outlier, yet it doesn't mention executive in its name. Moreover, it is an outlier in this trailing direction.
 * Also, another outlier Category:Executive branch of the government of Arkansas probably doesn't belong here at all, as no other US state government is included directly.
 * Finally, most of the articles don't belong here either, as they are not about executive branches. For example, article Government of the United Kingdom does not belong here; it is already represented by sub-Category:Ministerial departments of the United Kingdom Government (that I'd rename Category:Executive branch of the United Kingdom government later).
 * Therefore, the counts given by Oculi are tendentious, as they include things that do not belong, or are duplicative.
 * William Allen Simpson (talk) 12:57, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Quite a tetchy response. By the way, I've added Category:Executive branch of the government of California. Laurel Lodged (talk) 13:52, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Now there's a word I've not seen in a long time! However, my response was not intended to be bad tempered. It is a dry, numbered, recitation of facts, concisely responding to each of the previous points. When so many disparate arguments are floated, it is my preference to number them (rather than an impenetrable wall of text). That makes the discussion easier to read.
 * 'Executive branch' is not a UK term. I can't see the relevance of any of these carefully numbered points. All the 'fooian government' and 'foo government' are wrong. 'United Kingdom government' is grammatically wrong as 'United Kingdom' is a noun, as is 'Republic of Artsakh'. (All this verbiage is because Good Olfactory missed out a 'the' when implementing the entirely routine cfd 2021 January 27#Category:Executive branch of the Republic of Artsakh.) Oculi (talk) 11:39, 18 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Content relative to subnational entities should probably be moved to a subcategory. There is currently a, itself a child of . There may or not be an additional layer for executive branches besides the cabinet. However there is currently quite a mess here, I large part due to the fact that many countries use the words cabinet, government and executive interchangeably with a very similar meaning, while for some other countries the exact same words refer to a different reality. There is also confusion between categories for articles about the successive executives in a country vs. general articles on this executive's functions or the detailed system of government. In this regard,  and  serve an almost identical purpose. Place Clichy (talk) 14:21, 18 February 2021 (UTC)
 * That's true. For another day though. In the British isles, "Government" usually covers the 3 branches of government(executive, legislative & judicial). In other parts of the world, it means only the executive function. There needs to be a weeding out of those governments that only cater for the executive branch alone. Laurel Lodged (talk) 14:49, 18 February 2021 (UTC)
 * We should categorize these topics for the substance of what they are, not by the name they have, especially since for most non-English-speaking countries the foreign name will be alternatively translated as cabinet, government and executive depending on the personal preference or culture of the translator. Place Clichy (talk) 15:00, 18 February 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Urdu encyclopedias

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename. Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:53, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Urdu encyclopedias to Category:Urdu-language encyclopedias
 * Nominator's rationale: rename per WP:C2C, parent category is Category:Urdu-language books. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:22, 14 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Category:Urdu encyclopedias to Category:Urdu-language encyclopedias – C2C: Parent category is Category:Urdu-language books Gjs238 (talk) 03:13, 9 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Oppose speedy Categories_for_discussion/Log/2019_June_15 ended as no consensus whether to use "XXX encyclopedias" or "XXX-language encyclopedias". Armbrust The Homunculus 14:41, 9 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Well spotted, but the objection at that CFD was because of ambiguity between encyclopedias by nationality and encyclopedias by language. In this case there is no ambiguity, so IMHO your objection is unnecessary. – Fayenatic  L ondon 14:42, 10 February 2021 (UTC)


 * pinging contributors to speedy discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:24, 14 February 2021 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 14:37, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Support - follow Category:Urdu-language books, Category:Urdu-language literature. Oculi (talk) 22:29, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Support – follow Urdu-language, there isn't an Urdu country.


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Russian Empire agnostics

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename per the strong consensus here. – Fayenatic  L ondon 14:20, 12 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Russian Empire agnostics to Category:Agnostics of the Russian Empire
 * Propose renaming Category:Russian Empire Buddhists to Category:Buddhists of the Russian Empire
 * Nominator's rationale: rename per precedent in this previous discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:16, 14 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Category:Russian Empire agnostics to Category:Agnostics of the Russian Empire – C2C: convention within . Oculi (talk) 10:06, 9 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Category:Russian Empire Buddhists to Category:Buddhists of the Russian Empire
 * Oppose The proposed name is needlessly longer. The change of the parent name was done by an out of process internetion by an administrator against a unanimous concensus of those who had contributed that a rename to use this format was advised.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:37, 9 February 2021 (UTC)
 * , you may disagree with how the broader discussion was closed and may prefer the current format, but what would be the rationale for keeping these categories different than all the others in ? Good Ol’factory (talk) 23:07, 10 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Because it was a close that had no consensus for it. Speedy renames need to be uncontroversial, and this is not uncontroversial.John Pack Lambert (talk) 13:08, 11 February 2021 (UTC)
 * , so because you disagree with how a broad discussion was closed, we're going to keep two different formats? That seems awfully petty of you. Good Ol’factory (talk) 22:37, 11 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Speedy renames need to be uncontroversial. This is controversial, there was no consensus to rename as was done, it was a last minute imposition and never got widespread support.John Pack Lambert (talk) 13:03, 12 February 2021 (UTC)
 * This is simply untrue. In the cfd 2020_December_3#Russian_Empire_people Fayenatic London pinged all 8 earlier contributors on 24/01 requesting a decision between 'Russian Empire people' and 'People of the Russian Empire'. 4 explicitly preferred the latter, 2 said 'either', one didn't reply, and no-one opposed (other than JPL, on 20/01). There is nothing controversial about a close opposed only by the nominator. Oculi (talk) 20:01, 13 February 2021 (UTC)


 * pinging contributors to speedy discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:20, 14 February 2021 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 14:50, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Rename. Personal dislike of the adopted standard is not a good reason to oppose these changes at CFDS. It is petty. I too would favour "Russian Empire FOOs" as the standard, but there is no sense keeping just these two in one format and the vast majority of the others in a second format. We already have, , and . Someone should be administered a trout slap for having forced this to a full discussion. Good Ol’factory (talk) 21:37, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Rename - obvious renames per the cited cfd. Oculi (talk) 22:05, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Oppose The current form is shorter and more precise, which makes it a much better category name. The previous CfD was closed by an administrator imposing their will on it, not by actually following the consensus of the participants.John Pack Lambert (talk) 13:08, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Rename - the WP:CATNAME recorded guideline explicitly says we are changing leading "Imperial Russian" (the old standard adopted almost 20 years ago) to trailing "Russian Empire". "Imperial Russian" was adjectival (like American). "Russian Empire" is not an adjective. "Empirial" is not a word.
 * Rename per Good Olfactory. There is a clear convention in for the target format. Armbrust The Homunculus 19:25, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Rename per nom The new titles seem clearer. 20:04, 16 February 2021 (UTC)Dimadick (talk)
 * Comment. More "Russian Empire" categories have been nominated here. Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:29, 20 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Rename to conform with siblings. Peterkingiron (talk) 17:15, 20 February 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Congolese independence activists
Relisted, see Categories for discussion/Log/2021 March 3

Category:Freemen of Wolverhampton

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:51, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose Deleting/Listifying Category:Freemen of Wolverhampton
 * Nominator's rationale: Per WP:NONDEFINING (WP:OCAWARD)
 * The Freedom of the City of Wolverhampton was originally like a medieval business license for members of livery companies but later it became like an individual business licnese. Later, though, it became a municipal award like a key to the city given out to already prominent people. Locals tend to mention this award in passing with other honours while national officials seem to go from town to town collecting freedoms: Field Marshal Douglas Haig has 7 while Prime Minister David Lloyd George has a whopping 20, and is certainly not defined by this 1! I created a shortcut for categorization and the contents are already listified right here in a section of the Wolverhampton city article. - RevelationDirect (talk) 17:42, 14 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Background We previously deleted freemen cats for London, Canterbury, and Gloucester right here, here again, here, and here. - RevelationDirect (talk) 17:42, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * LIstify and delete -- This is an awards category. Wolverhampton was not a corporate town with guild restrictions on who could trade.  This is an OCAWARD case.  Peterkingiron (talk) 19:21, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete per WP:OCAWARD. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:59, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete clear case of over-categorization by award.John Pack Lambert (talk) 13:09, 15 February 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Dizengoff Prize recipients

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:49, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose Deleting/Listifying Category:Dizengoff Prize recipients
 * Nominator's rationale: Per WP:NONDEFINING (WP:OCAWARD)
 * The city government of Tel Aviv, Israel gives a sculpting and painting award called the Dizengoff Prize and often there is one winner per year in sculpting and several in painting, although it varies a lot over time. (The top Isreali award for sculpting and painting is the Israel Prize which is why we also have Category:Israel Prize in sculpture and painting recipients.) This award is typically listed in passing with other honours so it doesn't seem defining in articles like Michal Na'aman and Pinchas Cohen Gan. The category contents are already listified right here in the main article for any reader interested in the topic. - RevelationDirect (talk) 17:42, 14 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Background We previously deleted other Tel Aviv municipal awards here and here. - RevelationDirect (talk) 17:42, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete, obvious case of WP:OCAWARD. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:01, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete a clear case of over-categorization by award.John Pack Lambert (talk) 13:09, 15 February 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Slovak Catholic bishops

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:20, 24 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Slovak Catholic bishops to Category:Slovak bishops
 * Nominator's rationale: Unnecessary intermediate category.  Only content is Category:Slovak Greek Catholic bishops and Category:Slovak Roman Catholic bishops, both already properly categorised. Rathfelder (talk) 15:52, 14 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Merge per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 16:40, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Query I thought that there was a sort of a convention that every category with categories for both Eastern Catholic and Roman Catholic also had a parent called Catholic? Laurel Lodged (talk) 10:54, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Slovak seems to be the only one in Category:Catholic bishops Rathfelder (talk) 20:47, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * There is not much need to create a parent category for bishops in European countries because there is a quite strict geographical borderline between Latin Church countries versus Eastern Catholic countries. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:32, 16 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Comment if we make this change, we'll inevitable need to add Category:Slovak Lutheran bishops of which we have at least one article Juan Čobrda and there are several other notable ones including Pavel Uhorskai and Ivan Eľko. Carlossuarez46 (talk) 21:22, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Juan Čobrda can hardly be considered to be a Slovak bishop, as he moved to Argentina as a teenager. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:01, 17 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Ah this raises that other head scratcher: Bishops in Slovakia vs Slovak bishops: Juan Čobrda would be in the latter but not the former. Laurel Lodged (talk) 12:26, 18 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Comment I say those who emigrate before taking an office should be classed with their new country. The only people who should be in {x county bishops} and {bishops in y county}, are those who were either in the first country and then sent to the second one, or those who are clearly expatriate missionaries advanced to being bishops.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:38, 19 February 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:NBA G League players from Serbia

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:46, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting category


 * Nominator's rationale: Nominate for deletion. There is no need for categories looking at players of certain nationalities for a lower level league such as the NBA G League. The player will already be in the category “Serbian expatriate basketball people in the United States” as well as any relevant NBA G League team categories. This is WP:OVERCATEGORIZATION as this intersection is not defining. Rikster2 (talk) 14:57, 14 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Delete per nomination. Anything lower than the NBA is irrelevant. – Sabbatino (talk) 07:54, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete as a meaningless intersection; nationalities at the highest league (NBA) is the only time it's relevant. SportsGuy789 (talk) 20:08, 20 February 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Hermitages

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename. Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:41, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Hermitages in the United States to Category:Christian hermitages in the United States
 * Propose renaming Category:Hermitages in the United Kingdom to Category:Christian hermitages in the United Kingdom
 * Propose renaming Category:Hermitages in Switzerland to Category:Christian hermitages in Switzerland
 * Propose renaming Category:Hermitages in Spain to Category:Christian hermitages in Spain
 * Propose renaming Category:Hermitages in Portugal to Category:Christian hermitages in Portugal
 * Propose renaming Category:Hermitages in the Netherlands to Category:Christian hermitages in the Netherlands
 * Propose renaming Category:Hermitages in Italy to Category:Christian hermitages in Italy
 * Nominator's rationale: Not all hermitages are Christian. Need to disambiguate at a global level. Laurel Lodged (talk) 13:23, 14 February 2021 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 14:58, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Support, it is also a kind of WP:C2C per the parent structure. Marcocapelle (talk) 15:11, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep -- Hermitages in Christian countries will inevitably be Christian. This can be expressed if necessary by amending the headnote.  This will not cuase confusion since the parent is Category:Christian hermitages.  Peterkingiron (talk) 19:26, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Not true. There is an ashram in South Africa (Tolstoy Farm), and Skanda Vale in Wales might qualify. Oculi (talk) 22:24, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * What is a Christian country? A country ruled by a religious royal heirarchy? So you are objecting to United Kingdom, and only United Kingdom?
 * Support - in fact Category:Christian hermitages was created and populated by LL today (diff) after opening the nomination (perfectly reasonably). C2C now applies (assuming they are all Christian). Oculi (talk) 22:24, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * I had checked that all entries in the nominated categories contain only Christian hermitages. Laurel Lodged (talk) 10:52, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Most commendable. Oculi (talk) 11:56, 15 February 2021 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 14:58, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Support — with thanks.
 * Support Hermitages are not unique to Christianity. The main article Hermitage (religious retreat) includes Ashrams as a sub-topic. Dimadick (talk) 20:11, 16 February 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

People from Drama (regional unit)

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:38, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Doxato (municipality) to Category:People from Drama (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Doxato to Category:People from Drama (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Kalampaki to Category:People from Drama (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Drama (municipality) to Category:People from Drama (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Paranesti (municipality) to Category:People from Drama (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Nikiforos to Category:People from Drama (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Prosotsani (municipality) to Category:People from Drama (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Prosotsani to Category:People from Drama (regional unit)
 * Nominator's rationale: merge per WP:SMALLCAT, this concerns categorization by 3rd and 4th level administrative divisions of Greece, leading to a endless series of single-article or 2-article categories. The proposal is to merge to 2nd level administrative division, except cities and larger towns, in this case except Drama, Greece (45,000 people). This is follow-up on this earlier nomination. Marcocapelle (talk) 12:50, 14 February 2021 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 15:01, 15 February 2021 (UTC) William Allen Simpson (talk) 14:18, 18 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Merge for Now these small cats are hindering rather than helping navigation. (The Drama category is an exception but the intermediate layer does not aid navigation.) No objection to recreating any if they ever get up to 5+ articles. - RevelationDirect (talk) 01:46, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Merge as a good start — Should be targeting at least one million population, and categorizing from the top down, not the bottom up. Most of these aren't notable for having been anywhere other than Category:Greek people by occupation, but we can prune.
 * CommentOne million population in Greece will limit categories to one or two areas. Attica (region) alone has a population of 3,8 millions. Central Macedonia has a population of 1,9 million. Every other administrative region of Greece has a population of far bellow one million. See Administrative regions of Greece. Dimadick (talk) 20:24, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Some one-thousand-people places in Greece are more notable than some one-million-people places in the U.S. (or, say, China), like Delphi, Ithaca, Cythera, Sparta or Olympia. Place Clichy (talk) 21:56, 17 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Probably not to the US or Chinese. These aren't categories about ancient places. These are categories about people who notably populated the modern location, who are not otherwise categorized as "FOOian Fooers". (For example, notable governors of the location.) That needs a large well-documented location.


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

People from East Attica

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:34, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Dionysos to Category:People from East Attica
 * Propose merging Category:People from Stamata to Category:People from East Attica
 * Propose merging Category:People from Marathon (municipality) to Category:People from East Attica
 * Propose merging Category:People from Grammatiko to Category:People from East Attica
 * Propose merging Category:People from Marathon, Greece to Category:People from East Attica
 * Propose merging Category:People from Rafina-Pikermi to Category:People from East Attica
 * Propose merging Category:People from Rafina to Category:People from East Attica
 * Propose merging Category:People from Vari-Voula-Vouliagmeni to Category:People from East Attica
 * Propose merging Category:People from Vari to Category:People from East Attica
 * Propose merging Category:People from Vouliagmeni to Category:People from East Attica
 * Nominator's rationale: merge per WP:SMALLCAT, this concerns categorization by 3rd and 4th level administrative divisions of Greece, leading to a endless series of single-article or 2-article categories. The proposal is to merge to 2nd level administrative division, except cities and larger towns. In this case there is no such exception at all. This is follow-up on this earlier nomination. Marcocapelle (talk) 12:50, 14 February 2021 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 15:01, 15 February 2021 (UTC) William Allen Simpson (talk) 14:10, 18 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Merge for Now these small cats are hindering rather than helping navigation. No objection to recreating any if they ever get up to 5+ articles. - RevelationDirect (talk) 01:48, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Merge as a good start — Should be targeting at least one million population, and categorizing from the top down, not the bottom up. Most of these aren't notable for having been anywhere other than Category:Greek people by occupation, but we can prune.
 * Comment East Attica has a population of 502,000 people. Do you want to delete the parent category as well? Dimadick (talk) 20:33, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Good idea. Merging them all under Category:People from Attica would make more sense, as most of the population is actually part of Athens, dealt with in another nomination.


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

People from Euboea (regional unit)

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. There were individual calls to keep certain of these, but none garnered a consensus. Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:58, 16 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Chalcis (municipality) to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Anthidona to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Dirfys-Messapia to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Dirfys to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Messapia, Greece to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Eretria (municipality) to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Amarynthos to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Eretria to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Karystos (municipality) to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Kymi-Aliveri to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Dystos to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Kymi, Greece to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Mantoudi-Limni-Agia Anna to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Elymnioi to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Nileas to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit)
 * Propose merging Category:People from Skyros (municipality) to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit) and Category:People from the Sporades
 * Propose merging Category:People from Skyros to Category:People from Euboea (regional unit) and Category:People from the Sporades
 * Nominator's rationale: merge per WP:SMALLCAT, this concerns categorization by 3rd and 4th level administrative divisions of Greece, leading to a endless series of single-article or 2-article categories. The proposal is to merge to 2nd level administrative division, except cities and larger towns, in this case except Chalcis (59,000 people) and Karystos (5,000 people). This is follow-up on this earlier nomination. Marcocapelle (talk) 12:50, 14 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Comment Maybe we should follow a different procedure for islands? It doesn't make much sense to upmerge their members to the mainland that each island is tied to administratively. Skyros, specifically, is a "weird" case as it's geographically considered part of Thessaly, but administratively is part of Euboea (see Sporades). We can discuss this now, or maybe we should leave them for the moment and finish with the mainland first. --Antondimak (talk) 13:38, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * I have added a second merge target to Category:People from Skyros, would that solve the issue for now? (An alternative could be renaming Category:People from Euboea (regional unit) to Category:People from Euboea (island) and merging Category:People from Anthidona to Category:People from Central Greece.) Marcocapelle (talk) 15:08, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * It would probably be better to keep the consistency with the rest of the tree. If we are also going to delete the island categories, then yes, the second merge target solves the issue in this case. --Antondimak (talk) 18:29, 14 February 2021 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 15:02, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep  because of the notability of the town and child . Place Clichy (talk) 23:21, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep  because it is part of an established structure at and . Islands all have a notoriety which is not comparable to the municipalities created in 2011, precisely because they are islands and have always been there. The categories of people by island are not part of the batch created recently that is being purged. They follow an entirely different logic. Place Clichy (talk) 23:21, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Merge Most for Now/Keep Kymi-Aliveri and Mantoudi-Limni-Agia Anna The vast majority of these are small cats with little potential for growth that hinder rather than aid navigation. No objection to recreating any if they exceed expectations and ever get up to 5+ articles. (Category:People from Kymi-Aliveri and Category:People from Mantoudi-Limni-Agia Anna are already at 5 though; they would each need the two subcats under them to be upmerged differently than the nom though.) - RevelationDirect (talk) 01:57, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Merge as a good start — Should be targeting at least one million population, and categorizing from the top down, not the bottom up. Most of these aren't notable for having been anywhere other than Category:Greek people by occupation, but we can prune.


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Pope Pius XII appointments

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:41, 25 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Pope Pius XII appointments to Category:Diplomats of the Holy See
 * Nominator's rationale: This is the only category like this. We also have Category:Pope Pius XII advisers, Category:Bishops appointed by Pope Pius XII and Category:Cardinals created by Pope Pius XII. They all fit into trees of similar categories.  Its not clear to me what purpose this category serves. Rathfelder (talk) 11:25, 14 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Comment, Category:Diplomats of the Holy See is not a very good parent category neither a very good merge target, many people in the category weren't diplomats. If not kept, simply delete. Marcocapelle (talk) 11:46, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Oppose -- There are 15 articles in this category, which is enough to Keep. However I thought the correct term was "Papal Nuncio".  Peterkingiron (talk) 19:29, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Category:Diplomats of the Holy See includes nuncios as a subcategory.  I agree it isnt a good merge.  Better to delete it.  We dont have any other categories of miscellaneous appointments by pope, and I dont think we want them.  Rathfelder (talk) 00:08, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete I'm not seeing a point to this category and the creator hasn't been active in a couple years and can't clarify. - RevelationDirect (talk) 02:32, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete we have a category for bishops appointed by Pope Pius XII, It's not clear what these folks have in common other appointment to something by Pope Pius XII, which as noted above, is an outlier. Presumably a pope appoints all sorts of folks such as heads of offices, subheads of offices, nuncios, committees, bishops, cardinals, but a miscellaneous collection of all appointees isn't helpful as many of these folks have appointments under many popes (bishop of one place under a pope, bishop of another under a different pope, head of Caritas, subhead of the Vatican Bank, Nuncio to country X, then to country Y). Not appropriate. Carlossuarez46 (talk) 21:28, 16 February 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Period films

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge contents to appropriate subcategories of Category:Historical films. Note that there is also, , , and , all of which were not nominated in this discussion. Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:44, 25 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Period films to Category:Historical films
 * Nominator's rationale: Period films are the exact same as historical films. The sub-categories may be renamed Historical action films‎ and Historical horror films for consistency with historical drama and historical fiction. <b style="color: black;">Kailash29792</b> (talk)  07:16, 14 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Merge and leave redirect, it seems like this is an Indian WP:ENGVAR fork. There is a whole tree of Category:Period pieces that may be nominated. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:42, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * It is not specifically Indian though. Marcocapelle (talk) 15:00, 14 February 2021 (UTC)


 * , thank you for pointing that out. Yes, Category:Period pieces must be merged with this. <b style="color: black;">Kailash29792</b> (talk)  08:02, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Merge per nom We do not have an article on period film, just a redirect to historical drama. Dimadick (talk) 20:40, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment historical films/period pieces fall into many subjectively-defined types. There are those set in a past period (rather than the present), which is sufficiently common to be undefining. If this is containerized as the target is, it may be a decent-enough shorthand for the concepts of the subcategories. But again, it is being treated subjectively. We have the whole structure of Category:Films by period of setting which would take care of most of these in a more satisfactory resolution. The other problem presented in the use of 'historical' to connote films purporting to portray events that actually happened (e.g., documentaries) rather than things like History of the World, Part I or Life of Brian which clearly are not claimed to be historically accurate and would be odd to see claimed to be "historical films" in any encyclopedia. Carlossuarez46 (talk) 23:24, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
 * You are right, the proposed merge target is a container category so the content of the nominated category should be dispersed to Category:Films by period of setting and/or other subcategories. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:35, 17 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Comment: Historical does not always mean factual. That's why we have historical fiction and historical fantasy. <b style="color: black;">Kailash29792</b> (talk)  02:02, 17 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Another comment, it would probably be helpful to leave a redirect. Marcocapelle (talk) 16:59, 17 February 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:DuMont News & DuMont Sports
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename. Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:26, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:DuMont News to Category:DuMont news programming
 * Propose renaming Category:DuMont Sports to Category:DuMont sports programming
 * Nominator's rationale: The DuMont Television Network never actually had a dedicated news or sports divisions, so there shouldn't be categories for things that never existed. 2600:1700:C960:2270:446F:23ED:BD33:29E4 (talk) 04:47, 14 February 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.