Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2021 July 25



Category:Rodgers and Hammerstein

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: withdrawn (non-admin closure) Marcocapelle (talk) 17:23, 2 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting rodgers and hammerstein
 * Nominator's rationale: With Category:Musicals by Rodgers and Hammerstein already housing all related content related to the duo, this seems like another unnecessary eponymous parent category per WP:OCEPON. Star cheers peaks news lost wars Talk to me 22:54, 25 July 2021 (UTC)


 * Oppose. Part of a legitimate category tree connecting their works to Category:Songwriting duos and Category:American musical duos. Additionally, in doing a quick search I added multiple articles that are Rodgers and Hammerstein related that do not fit anywhere else. For example the New York Public Library for the Performing Arts has a section of its article on the Rodgers and Hammerstein Archives of Recorded Sound, There are also articles on special broadcasts and recordings of their music outside of the musicals, such as General Foods 25th Anniversary Show: A Salute to Rodgers and Hammerstein, Many a New Day: Karrin Allyson Sings Rodgers & Hammerstein, etc. All of that fits nicely under this category, and not anywhere else. Best.4meter4 (talk) 23:42, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Note that Rodgers and Hammerstein, the article, belongs in Category:Songwriting duos. The contents within Category:Rodgers and Hammerstein are not songwriting duos and the category should not be categorized as such. With the additional content found, however, I’m happy to withdraw the nomination, but with only two of the songs covered by Art Garfunkel on Some Enchanted Evening being written by Rogers and Hammerstein, that album doesn’t belong in this category. Star cheers peaks news lost wars Talk to me 00:30, 26 July 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Barnwal

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: soft delete (non-admin closure) Marcocapelle (talk) 17:25, 2 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting barnwal
 * Nominator's rationale: WP:SMALLCAT: Not enough content to expand the categories, aside from Baranwal itself and Modi (surname). –LaundryPizza03 ( d c̄ ) 19:51, 25 July 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Stone masons

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge (non-admin closure) Marcocapelle (talk) 17:28, 2 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Stone masons to Category:Stonemasons
 * Nominator's rationale: Stonemason appears to be more popular, though Stone mason is also used. User:Namiba 19:44, 25 July 2021 (UTC)


 * Merge to larger category. I am not strongly for either way, but I am sure we only need one.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:09, 30 July 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Indian Jain musicians

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete.  bibliomaniac  1  5  05:15, 23 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting Category:Indian Jain musicians
 * Nominator's rationale: delete per WP:SMALLCAT, currently only one article in the category. Merging is not needed, the article is already in Category:20th-century Indian Jains and Category:20th-century Indian composers. Marcocapelle (talk) 14:25, 25 July 2021 (UTC)


 * Delete per nom -- DaxServer (talk) 12:04, 26 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. Also a trivial intersection. -- Ab207 (talk) 12:19, 27 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete an intersection that does not conform to ERGS rules.John Pack Lambert (talk) 13:25, 20 August 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:University of Düsseldorf

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename all.  bibliomaniac  1  5  05:15, 23 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:University of Düsseldorf to Category:Heinrich Heine University Düsseldorf
 * Propose renaming Category:University of Düsseldorf faculty to Category:Heinrich Heine University Düsseldorf faculty
 * Propose renaming Category:University of Düsseldorf alumni to Category:Heinrich Heine University Düsseldorf alumni
 * Nominator's rationale: That is the article.  Rathfelder (talk) 12:41, 25 July 2021 (UTC)


 * Support - the name of the article Heinrich Heine University Düsseldorf agrees with the name on its website (https://www.hhu.de/en/). Oculi (talk) 08:07, 26 July 2021 (UTC)
 * It is established policy that the categories should follow the title of the article, unless there is some very good reason not to.Rathfelder (talk) 18:49, 28 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Indeed it is: WP:C2D. This is why I am supporting the nom. (That is, if the typically unindented comment above is a rejoinder to my contribution.) Oculi (talk) 17:29, 3 August 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Indian Jain directors

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete.  bibliomaniac  1  5  05:15, 23 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting indian jain directors
 * Nominator's rationale: delete per WP:OCEGRS, trivial intersection between occupation and religion. Merging is not needed, the articles are already in Category:Indian Jains by century. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:47, 25 July 2021 (UTC)


 * Delete as per WP:OCEGRS -- DaxServer (talk) 17:14, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. The intersection is not noteworthy. -- Ab207 (talk) 12:17, 27 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete This is a violation of ERGS rules. It may also violate "shared name" rules, since it may be grouping people by holding the title "director" without them actually forming a unified occupation group.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:10, 30 July 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Artist groups and collectives of the Northern Netherlands
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2021 August 23%23Category:Artist groups and collectives of the Northern Netherlands

Category:Pro golf tour event templates

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Professional golf tour events navigational boxes with no major objections towards synchronizing the category names.  bibliomaniac  1  5  05:17, 23 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Pro golf tour event templates to Category:Professional golf tour events navigational boxes
 * Nominator's rationale: In line with other golf navbox category names, eg Category:Professional_golf_tours_navigational_boxes, Category:Professional golf tour seasons navigational boxes. Nigej (talk) 11:33, 17 July 2021 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Marcocapelle (talk) 05:18, 25 July 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Chinese Communist Party committee secretaries

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename to option B. There's a general consensus to rename, but not a complete agreement towards a target. The major values stated during the discussion revolve around disambiguation and conciseness, and in that sense option B is listed as most people's first or second choice.  bibliomaniac  1  5  05:22, 23 August 2021 (UTC)

Option A
 * Propose renaming Category:Communist Party of China Committee Secretaries of Rehe Province to Category:Chinese Communist Party committee secretaries of Rehe Province
 * Propose renaming Category:Communist Party Secretaries of Xi'an to Category:Chinese Communist Party committee secretaries of Xi'an
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Sichuan to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Sichuan
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Communist Party Secretaries of Hebei to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Hebei
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Communist Party Secretaries of Jiangsu to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Jiangsu
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Communist Party Secretaries of Jiangxi to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Jiangxi
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Shaanxi to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Shaanxi
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Shanxi to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Shanxi
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Yunnan to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Yunnan
 * Propose renaming Category:Communist Party of China Deputy Committee Secretaries of Zhejiang to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Zhejiang

Option B
 * Propose renaming Category:Communist Party of China Committee Secretaries of Rehe Province to Category:Communist Party secretaries of Rehe Province
 * Propose renaming Category:Communist Party Secretaries of Xi'an to Category:Communist Party secretaries of Xi'an
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Sichuan to Category:Deputy Communist Party secretaries of Sichuan
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Communist Party Secretaries of Hebei to Category:Deputy Communist Party secretaries of Hebei
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Communist Party Secretaries of Jiangsu to Category:Deputy Communist Party secretaries of Jiangsu
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Communist Party Secretaries of Jiangxi to Category:Deputy Communist Party secretaries of Jiangxi
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Shaanxi to Category:Deputy Communist Party secretaries of Shaanxi
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Shanxi to Category:Deputy Communist Party secretaries of Shanxi
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Yunnan to Category:Deputy Communist Party secretaries of Yunnan
 * Propose renaming Category:Communist Party of China Deputy Committee Secretaries of Zhejiang to Category:Deputy Communist Party secretaries of Zhejiang

Option C
 * Propose renaming Category:Communist Party of China Committee Secretaries of Rehe Province to Category:Party secretaries of Rehe Province
 * Propose renaming Category:Communist Party Secretaries of Xi'an to Category:Party secretaries of Xi'an
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Sichuan to Category:Deputy Party secretaries of Sichuan
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Communist Party Secretaries of Hebei to Category:Deputy Party secretaries of Hebei
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Communist Party Secretaries of Jiangsu to Category:Deputy Party secretaries of Jiangsu
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Communist Party Secretaries of Jiangxi to Category:Deputy Party secretaries of Jiangxi
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Shaanxi to Category:Deputy Party secretaries of Shaanxi
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Shanxi to Category:Deputy Party secretaries of Shanxi
 * Propose renaming Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Yunnan to Category:Deputy Party secretaries of Yunnan
 * Propose renaming Category:Communist Party of China Deputy Committee Secretaries of Zhejiang to Category:Deputy Party secretaries of Zhejiang


 * Nominator's rationale: The parent categories for these categories are Category:Chinese Communist Party committee secretaries and Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries. Proposal A retains the complete name "Chinese Communist Party", using "Chinese Communist Party (deputy) committee secretaries". Proposal B shortens the usage to "(Deputy) Communist Party secretaries", removing the words "Chinese" and "committee". Proposal C shortens it still to "(Deputy) Party secretaries", removing "Communist". This is a follow-up to a speedy nomination discussion that was held, copied below. Articles about the positions are currently at Chinese Communist Party Committee Secretary and Chinese Communist Party Deputy Committee Secretary (though they was moved recently without discussion from Party Committee Secretary and Deputy Party Committee Secretary). Pinging participants in speedy discussion, . Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:18, 29 June 2021 (UTC)


 * Category:Chinese Communist Party Committee Secretaries to Category:Chinese Communist Party committee secretaries – C2A, capitalization per WP:JOBTITLES; C2C for the subcategories below Good Ol’factory (talk) 02:04, 21 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Category:Communist Party of China Committee Secretaries of Rehe Province to Category:Chinese Communist Party committee secretaries of Rehe Province
 * Category:Communist Party Secretaries of Xi'an to Category:Chinese Communist Party committee secretaries of Xi'an
 * Comment for concision I would suggest Category:Communist Party secretaries of Foo for local-level categories. The full title is a bit cumbersome, and when the name of a location is present the words Chinese and committee can be implied when one talks of a party secretary. A main article link or category explanation could help if you find that the scope is not obvious enough. Place Clichy (talk) 14:30, 21 June 2021 (UTC)
 * I don't think the more concise names are eligible for speedying. If we speedily rename the head categories I can follow-up on the others with a full discussion. Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:31, 22 June 2021 (UTC)
 * I would approve that: no objection to rename the head categories per C2D (as you may have noticed, I found identically-named main articles) while fixing capitalization and plural, but submit the local categories to full discussion to a less redundant name. Place Clichy (talk) 04:42, 22 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Category:Chinese Communist Party Deputy Committee Secretaries to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries – C2A, capitaliation per WP:JOBTITLES; C2C for the subcategories below Good Ol’factory (talk) 02:01, 21 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Sichuan to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Sichuan
 * Category:Deputy Communist Party Secretaries of Hebei to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Hebei
 * Category:Deputy Communist Party Secretaries of Jiangsu to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Jiangsu
 * Category:Deputy Communist Party Secretaries of Jiangxi to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Jiangxi
 * Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Shaanxi to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Shaanxi
 * Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Shanxi to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Shanxi
 * Category:Deputy Party Secretaries of Yunnan to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Yunnan
 * Category:Communist Party of China Deputy Committee Secretaries of Zhejiang to Category:Chinese Communist Party deputy committee secretaries of Zhejian
 * Comment: for concision I would suggest Category:Deputy Communist Party secretaries of Foo for province-level categories, as above. Place Clichy (talk) 14:30, 21 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment: the usual shorter title is "Deputy Party Secretary", without "Communist" (e.g. usage within the articles Chinese Communist Party Deputy Committee Secretary, Chinese_Communist_Party_Committee_Secretary, Jin Yinhuan), so I think the concise plural should be "Deputy party secretaries of Foo". – Fayenatic  L ondon 21:28, 22 June 2021 (UTC)
 * It is correct that, in context, in China or any other communist system, the often capitalized terms of "the Party" and "the Party Secretary" will unambiguously refer to the Communist Party. After all, these head articles were only recently from simply (Deputy) Party Committee Secretary. However category names are supposed to be clearly understood without too many elements of context, that's why I thought that " Communist (deputy) party secretaries of (Shanghai)" is both easily understandable and concise enough, without being too ambiguous, e.g. with KMT holders of a similar function pre-1949. Place Clichy (talk) 21:53, 22 June 2021 (UTC)
 * I have processed the head categories and moved the rest here as Opposed. – Fayenatic  L ondon 22:38, 28 June 2021 (UTC)

<div class="xfd_relist" style="border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 25px;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Oppose - these are contrary to standard category names, which use 'of Foo' rather than 'Fooian' for such entities: Category_names. I would have opposed moving the article too. And moving the parent categories should not have been speedies. Oculi (talk) 13:07, 29 June 2021 (UTC)
 * In option A, the "Chinese" is not a FOOian adjective, it is part of the name of the Chinese Communist Party. Good Ol’factory (talk) 00:52, 30 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Chinese Communist Party begins "The Communist Party of China (CPC), commonly known as the Chinese Communist Party (CCP)" and I expect the actual name is not in English. Oculi (talk) 07:55, 26 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Prefer Option B, then Option C, then Option A. These offices (and people) are most commonly called the party secretary or deputy party secretary (as clearly stated in the main article). I would therefore go for the more concise and common expression, however keeping Communist before party for clarity and avoiding ambiguity with potential holders of a similar title e.g. for pre-1949 KMT party secretaries in the same places. Place Clichy (talk) 16:18, 29 June 2021 (UTC)
 * would you mind providing a citation for "Party Secretary" being used for pre-1949 KMT? There are currently no categories using such a name within Category:Kuomintang. – Fayenatic  L ondon 19:09, 29 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Prefer Option A, then Option B, then Option C. --Just N. (talk) 19:07, 6 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Rename for consistency. I do not have a preference between A, B or C. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:25, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Question, shouldn't "party" be decapitalized in option B and C? It is no longer part of a proper name. User:Place Clichy in their comment also write "party" without capital but I am not sure if that was deliberate. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:25, 7 July 2021 (UTC)
 * , I thought it would be capitalized because it still refers to a specific party. I could be wrong though. Good Ol’factory (talk) 01:47, 9 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Prefer Option C but with lowercase "party", then option B, then A. This preference is based on brevity, and following usage in articles; I see no need for disambiguation. – Fayenatic  L ondon 13:35, 20 July 2021 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗  plicit  00:47, 25 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Suggest Category:Communist Party Deputy Secretaries of Sichuan, etc. "Deputy Secretary" is a title and should be capitalised.  It is unnecessary to include "Chinese" as that is obvious.  As ever my aim to to seek a short title to avoid clutter.  Peterkingiron (talk) 16:38, 28 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Apart from the issue about capitalization, this seems like a support for option B. Generally, option B is least often mentioned as the third choice, so I guess we should go for that. Marcocapelle (talk) 18:52, 28 July 2021 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia uses lowercase when job titles are mentioned generically, see MOS:JOBTITLES. – Fayenatic  L ondon 22:15, 28 July 2021 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.