Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2022 September 7



Category:Female–female vocal duets
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2022 September 15%23Category:Female–female vocal duets

Category:Russian and Soviet theatre directors
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2022 September 15%23Category:Russian and Soviet theatre directors

Category:Moth species

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  16:58, 15 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting moth species
 * Nominator's rationale: Multiple reasons:


 * Very partially implemented category (there's at the moment 49 articles in there while it actually applies to oh, about 70000-80000 or so articles), that is
 * effectively redundant to other parts of the moth categorization structure (e.g. the entire "moths described in year" category tree, which is a species-of-moth-specific tree), and
 * which has been accumulating about as many articles that don't actually belong in there (lists of moth genera are not, by any reasonable definition, moth species) as actually correctly-categorized articles, and
 * which unlike the rest of the Moth taxa by rank categories is not a continuation of the wider "x taxa by rank" tree: there's no such thing as a or  or  or even ; and which also does not have a butterfly counterpart.  AddWitty  NameHere  09:13, 7 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Delete We typically categorize by some sort of taxonomic group, instead of keeping all species in the same category. Dimadick (talk) 14:05, 15 September 2022 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Danish municipality categories

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Wikipedia categories named after municipalities of Denmark and reparent. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  16:59, 15 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Danish municipality categories to Category:Municipalities of Denmark
 * Nominator's rationale: The lead articles are in the parent, and the categories for each municipality would normally be at that level too. The other sub-cats of are already separated to the top of the page by special lead characters such as +, so there will be no confusion between local sub-cats and generic sub-cats. – Fayenatic  L ondon 08:24, 7 September 2022 (UTC)


 * Rename to Category:Wikipedia categories named after municipalities of Denmark and re-parent (cf Category:Wikipedia categories named after counties of England). The proposed merge is unnecessary as the categories are already in eg . Oculi (talk) 11:51, 7 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Happy to support this alternative proposed by Oculi. – Fayenatic  L ondon 15:13, 7 September 2022 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Mayors of City of San Marino

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  16:59, 15 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Mayors of City of San Marino to Category:Mayors of places in San Marino and Category:People from the City of San Marino
 * Nominator's rationale: only one member page, so merge for now as WP:SMALLCAT. – Fayenatic  L ondon 06:30, 7 September 2022 (UTC)


 * Support per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:01, 8 September 2022 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:American SBNRs

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  17:00, 15 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting american sbnrs
 * Nominator's rationale: Creator claims that this category refers to American people who are "spiritual but not religious", and added to it one constituent, George Lopez. There is no evidence that the meaning of "SBNR" will be understood as a noun by anyone other the creator of the category, and for many potential constituents including Lopez, this will not be a defining characteristic. The creator of the category seems to be determined to create a similar category to Category:Irreligious theists and Category:Religiously unaffiliated Americans, which they were previously unsuccessful in creating.  General Ization  Talk  03:31, 7 September 2022 (UTC)
 * How does the category "Spiritual but not religious people from the United States" sound as an alternative? We could use that instead. Sausage Link of High Rule (talk) 03:47, 7 September 2022 (UTC)
 * No, because once again it calls for a determination by the editor placing a page in the category as to who and/or what is spiritual and/or religious, and in neither of the (now two) additions you made to the category is this determination evidently based on any reliable source nor defining of the article's subject.  General Ization Talk  03:52, 7 September 2022 (UTC)


 * Delete per WP:NONDEF. It could be defining, hypothetically, for chairs of associations of spiritual non-religious people or people writing books about spiritual non-religiousness. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:30, 7 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Delete not a defining characteristic for most (or all) of the non-religious folks who are spiritual, and even for those who it is a prominent trait, we can easily cover this within the prose instead. The use of a vague acronym doesn't help either by presuming all readers will know what it stands for. SNUGGUMS (talk / edits</b>) 12:01, 7 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment This category has been emptied. Liz <sup style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #006400;">Read! Talk! 01:07, 8 September 2022 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Coal miner organizers
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete and recategorise the pages somehow. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  20:23, 15 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Coal miner organizers to Category:Coal miner activists
 * Nominator's rationale: merge, there does not seem much difference between "organizers" and "activists". Marcocapelle (talk) 06:46, 20 August 2022 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Ceso femmuin mbolgaig mbung, mellohi! (投稿) 21:53, 30 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Downmerge to Category:Mining trade unions and move the one article to a people subcat. Essentially these are duplicate categories.  Peterkingiron (talk) 17:45, 20 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Fair enough, the effect is the same. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:24, 20 August 2022 (UTC)
 * @Peterkingiron, I'm sorry, can you clarify what you're suggesting? Is it to move the category to Category:Mining trade unions (which would put it at the same level as United Mine Workers, it's parent), and categorise the article somewhere else?<span id="Qwerfjkl:1661703118956:WikipediaFTTCLNCategories_for_discussion/Log/2022_August_20" class="FTTCmt"> — Qwerfjkl  talk  16:11, 28 August 2022 (UTC)
 * <p class="xfd_relist" style="margin:0 0 0 -1em;border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 2em;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗  plicit  01:48, 7 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Perhaps I should have suggested a new subcategory of Category:Trade union leaders, such as Category:Mining trade union leaders. This should be allowed to include activists, organisers, etc to cover founders and union precursors.  This should be capable of population, for example Arthur Scargill.  Peterkingiron (talk) 15:18, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
 * <p class="xfd_relist" style="margin:0 0 0 -1em;border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 2em;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.


 * Creating a new subcategory for leaders can be done regardless of the outcome of this merge discussion. For now, Peterkingiron and I are agreeing on the redundancy of one of the two nominated categories. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:34, 7 September 2022 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Works based on real people
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2022 September 15%23Category:Works based on real people

Category:Milliners
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: reverse merge. The preferences in this discussion were evenly balanced, so this close is swayed by the use of "milliner" in Hatmaking and as a qualifier in several biographical article names. – Fayenatic  L ondon 16:49, 15 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Milliners to Category:Hat makers
 * Nominator's rationale: Milliner is a redirect to Hatmaking. I cant detect a distinction between the two terms, other than that milliner seems to be used more for people and Category:Hat makers includes some companies. Rathfelder (talk) 21:00, 22 August 2022 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkl  talk  14:16, 30 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Keep - milliners are people, subcat of Category:Fashion designers by type. Move the people in Category:Hat makers into the subcat Category:Milliners and move the non-people in the latter into the former. Oculi (talk) 22:21, 22 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Merge or reverse merge as the two categories appear to have the same purpose. Non-people articles should be moved to Category:Hatmaking. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:00, 23 August 2022 (UTC)
 * <p class="xfd_relist" style="margin:0 0 0 -1em;border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 2em;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Relisting comment: Reverse merge has been proposed, but Category:Hat makers was not tagged. Done now. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗  plicit  01:43, 7 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Merge to Category:Hat makers, although I think sometimes "milliners" are just the retailers, but mostly they make/made them too. Johnbod (talk) 02:08, 1 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Merge or reverse merge (leaving cat-redirect - They are much the same thing. Peterkingiron (talk) 15:29, 4 September 2022 (UTC)
 * <p class="xfd_relist" style="margin:0 0 0 -1em;border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 2em;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Nippon Professional Baseball infobox templates
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗  plicit  01:38, 7 September 2022 (UTC)
 * The result of the discussion was: soft merge to Category:Baseball infobox templates and Category:Nippon Professional Baseball templates. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  17:03, 15 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting nippon professional baseball infobox templates
 * Nominator's rationale: One article. Move the article into both parent categories. –Aidan721 (talk) 19:40, 30 August 2022 (UTC)
 * <p class="xfd_relist" style="margin:0 0 0 -1em;border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 2em;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Yazlovets
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. – Fayenatic  L ondon 21:14, 15 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting yazlovets
 * Nominator's rationale: delete, redundant category level with just the eponymous article and a subcategory. We hardly ever have categories for villages anyway. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:41, 22 August 2022 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkl  talk  14:24, 30 August 2022 (UTC) Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗  plicit  01:22, 7 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose. Add also other pages to category. Yazlovets has a great history, some articles should be written or translated from Ukrainian or Polish Wikipedia. --Микола Василечко (talk) 16:55, 23 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment -- A village of 600 people does not usually need a category. The normal minimum is 5 items, which this has not reached.  Peterkingiron (talk) 18:10, 29 August 2022 (UTC)
 * <p class="xfd_relist" style="margin:0 0 0 -1em;border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 2em;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * <p class="xfd_relist" style="margin:0 0 0 -1em;border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 2em;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * per nom.<span id="Qwerfjkl:1663261438964:WikipediaFTTCLNCategories_for_discussion/Log/2022_September_7" class="FTTCmt"> — Qwerfjkl  talk  17:03, 15 September 2022 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Fictional child killers
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename and purge as per nom. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  20:21, 15 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Fictional child killers to Category:Fictional murderers of children
 * Nominator's rationale: Even though most people would be able to tell what this category means, its parent category Category:Murderers of children has no ambiguity whatsoever in definition and cannot be mistaken for killers who happen to be minors. most It would also have better consistency with its parent category's name. Sergei zavorotko (talk) 04:19, 30 August 2022 (UTC)


 * Speedy rename per WP:C2C and also support to make it less ambiguous. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:20, 30 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment: Done. Sergei zavorotko (talk) 23:01, 30 August 2022 (UTC)
 * what do you mean with "done"? Nothing ought to be done until an uninvolved editor closes this discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 04:21, 31 August 2022 (UTC)
 * I notice now that the category has been listed at WP:CFDS in parallel. Well surely it will lead to some outcome. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:28, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

Relisting comment: Use "killers" or "murderers"? Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗  plicit  01:22, 7 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment it seems to me there are content in the category who are child killers but not child murderers. Considering the in-universe morality system, and what constitutes murder versus other forms of killing, there should be a split between fictional murderers of children and fictional killers of children. A (not serial killer) monster hunts and kills children, but it isn't murder though. -- 64.229.88.43 (talk) 08:43, 2 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Hm, there are very few monsters in this category. If this is really an issue then at least rename to Category:Fictional killers of children to make it less ambiguous. Marcocapelle (talk) 10:01, 2 September 2022 (UTC)
 * <p class="xfd_relist" style="margin:0 0 0 -1em;border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 2em;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.


 * Rename per nom and per its parent Category:Murderers of children. Any articles about killers rather than murderers should be removed. Oculi (talk) 19:05, 7 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Yes, I would prefer this solution over renaming to Category:Fictional killers of children. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:04, 8 September 2022 (UTC)


 * Rename per nom To match the parent category. And non-sentient characters should probably not be in a category for killers. Dimadick (talk) 14:08, 15 September 2022 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.