Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 March 3

 &lt; March 2 March 4 &gt;

Category:Peter Grant (book series)

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  16:41, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Peter Grant (book series) to Category:Rivers of London (book series)
 * Nominator's rationale: This is what the main article's title has been renamed to. KaraLG84 (talk) 21:41, 3 March 2023 (UTC)


 * Support per WP:C2D. The nomination could have been listed for speedy. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:04, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
 * @Marcocapelle Ah I didn't notice that option. KaraLG84 (talk) 22:47, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Speedy The main article was renamed with a formal WP:RM. - RevelationDirect (talk) 20:57, 4 March 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Members of Propaganda Due

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. Main consensus seems to be that membership is not defining, and the information is already in list form at Propaganda Due.  bibliomaniac  1  5  18:40, 13 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Members of Propaganda Due to Category:Propaganda Due members
 * Nominator's rationale: "Members of Propaganda Due" is already grammatically incorrect, it's "Members of the Propaganda Due." Regardless, it's probably better to have it be consistent with other set categories for groups of individuals involved in politics- I'm pretty sure there is a relevant MOS entry for category naming but I can't seem to find it. HadesTTW (he/him • talk) 19:51, 14 February 2023 (UTC)


 * Delete, not a defining characteristic. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:36, 15 February 2023 (UTC)
 * It was an important part of the background to the Years of Lead, fortunately less fatal than much of the other stuff. JASpencer (talk) 09:12, 20 February 2023 (UTC)
 * Maybe, but the category is populated with biographies for which it is not defining. Marcocapelle (talk) 07:16, 22 February 2023 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 05:15, 22 February 2023 (UTC) William Allen Simpson (talk) 05:25, 11 March 2023 (UTC) Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkl  talk  18:59, 23 February 2023 (UTC) Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkl  talk  21:04, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Support Originally created category and fine with proposed renaming. JASpencer (talk) 09:12, 20 February 2023 (UTC)
 * Strong Delete — suffix "members" is usually for WikiProjects. "Members of" for organizations. The organization is Propaganda Due, not The Propaganda Due. Propaganda Due is never mentioned in Years of Lead. Moreover, we don't usually categorize members of criminal and terrorist organizations (WP:BLPCRIMINAL). There is a list of supposed members in the Propaganda Due article, where they should be verified by citations. But the only article I've checked, Silvio Berlusconi, has absolutely no reference for membership. If the most prominent fails WP:V, then better to drop the whole lot.
 * Berlusconi's article not having much on his P2 membership is moreso a flaw of the English Wikipedia rather than it not being notable- the Italian Wikipedia has an entire section of his article on his controversial association with P2. All of the articles in the category contain at least a line about their membership in P2 and about half have a mention of it in their lede. The main Propaganda Due article itself has references for every single person mentioned. HadesTTW (he/him • talk) 01:12, 25 February 2023 (UTC)
 * Annoying to have folks add to the old discussion after relisting, so we don't tend to notice. We don't read the main article to look for references. If the reference isn't in the Biography itself, then the category cannot be attached to the biography itself.
 *  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 *  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

William Allen Simpson (talk) 00:45, 5 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Comment - Although there's clearly no consensus for deleting the category (and to be fair that wasn't the original proposal) there doesn't seem to be any objection to renaming it. Instead of relisting it, could we rename it and close it?  JASpencer (talk) 20:57, 4 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Nearly every word of my response is opposed to renaming. Each part of the renaming rationale.

William Allen Simpson (talk) 05:17, 11 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Delete Clicking through the articles, this is clearly WP:OCASSOC. Neutral on rename if kept. - RevelationDirect (talk) 20:59, 4 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep -- P2 was involved in great controversy and regularly mentioned in the news a couple of decades ago, which means that membership may well be defining. Note that "due" is not that English word but the Italian for two.  The main article starts by referring to "the Propaganda Due lodge", so that the cat-name is probably correct.  Neutral on rename.  Peterkingiron (talk) 17:45, 5 March 2023 (UTC)
 * No, "Propaganda Due masonic lodge" is unlike "The Beatles". Amazingly enough, the discussants seem to understand that "Due" means "Two", and "P2" is a shortcut, without condescension.
 * Delete, not defining. — Qwerfjkl  talk  16:46, 12 March 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Films about real people
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 March 12%23Category:Films about real people

User simple
Relisted, see Categories for discussion/Log/2023 March 12%23User simple

User mul
Relisted, see Categories for discussion/Log/2023 March 12%23User mul

Babel category enforcement
Relisted, see Categories for discussion/Log/2023 March 12%23Babel category enforcement

Babel category duplicates
Relisted, see Categories for discussion/Log/2023 March 12%23Babel category duplicates

Category:Sporting goods manufacturers of Lithuania

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  16:56, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Sporting goods manufacturers of Lithuania to Category:Sporting goods manufacturers and Category:Manufacturing companies of Lithuania and Category:Sport in Lithuania
 * Propose merging Category:Sporting goods manufacturers of Hungary to Category:Sporting goods manufacturers and Category:Manufacturing companies of Hungary and Category:Sport in Hungary
 * Propose merging Category:Sporting goods manufacturers of Bulgaria to Category:Sporting goods manufacturers and Category:Manufacturing companies of Bulgaria and Category:Sport in Bulgaria


 * Nominator's rationale: Per WP:SMALLCAT. This category has only 1 entry. Estopedist1 (talk) 20:48, 3 March 2023 (UTC)


 * Support per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:05, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Merge for Now With no objection to recreation if any ever get to 5+ articles. - RevelationDirect (talk) 21:02, 4 March 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Swedish sport websites

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  16:56, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Swedish sport websites to Category:Swedish websites and Category:Sport websites and Category:Sport in Sweden
 * Propose merging Category:Icelandic sport websites to Category:Icelandic websites and Category:Sport websites and Category:Sport in Iceland


 * Nominator's rationale: Per WP:SMALLCAT. This category has only 1 entry. Estopedist1 (talk) 20:37, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 05:59, 11 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Support per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:06, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Support


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Funerals by country

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  16:56, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Funerals in Argentina to Category:Death in Argentina and Category:Ceremonies in Argentina
 * Propose merging Category:Funerals in Azerbaijan to Category:Death in Azerbaijan
 * Propose merging Category:Funerals in Iran to Category:Death in Iran and Category:Ceremonies in Iran
 * Propose merging Category:Funerals in North Korea to Category:Death in North Korea and Category:Funerals in Korea
 * Propose merging Category:Funerals in the Soviet Union to Category:Death in the Soviet Union
 * Nominator's rationale: Each of these only contains a sub-cat for State funerals by country. This nomination is a logical follow-up after Categories for discussion/Log/2023 February 20. – Fayenatic  L ondon 17:29, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 05:59, 11 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Support per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:07, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Support


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Candidates for speedy deletion as empty categories

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: keep. (non-admin closure) William Allen Simpson (talk) 00:50, 5 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting candidates for speedy deletion as empty categories
 * Nominator's rationale: Is this category needed anymore as anything nominated under WP:C1 now gets included under Category:Empty categories awaiting deletion instead? BangJan1999 17:12, 3 March 2023 (UTC)


 * Keep They are two different categories. Category:Empty categories awaiting deletion is for empty categories during the 7 day period where they sit in case they have been emptied out of process or they are just temporarily empty. After the week waiting period is over, they should appear in Category:Candidates for speedy deletion as empty categories. It's a regular CSD category, not a holding category. This move of categories after 7 days doesn't happen as smoothly as it should as the bot that moves empty categories isn't functioning as well as it used to in the past but deleting a standard CSD category requires more than a sparsely attended CFD discussion to decide to delete. I think this nomination should be withdrawn. Liz Read! Talk! 17:59, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Just thought I'd mention that the problem with filling categories when they should is an ongoing problem that comes up on VPT fairly regularly. There is a delay, sometimes of hours, sometimes of days or longer, for pages to get moved into maintenance categories when they should be. It also happens with CSD R2, G6 and G8. Liz Read! Talk! 18:04, 3 March 2023 (UTC)


 * Keep per Liz. Perhaps the name of Category:Empty categories awaiting deletion is not clear enough. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:11, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep per Liz. There could potentially be a valid argument to restructure how CSD-related categories like this are organized, but it would have to be done very carefully — there have been a lot of cases in the past where project maintenance categories that got casually deleted at CFD broke important maintenance tasks and ended up having to be reverted (like the time CFD deleted a seemingly-redundant tracking category for uncategorized articles, except that it was the very category that our tools for locating uncategorized articles in the first place were depending upon, so the deletion broke the tools' ability to properly detect uncategorized articles at all until it was reversed). So something like this would need to be handled by a WikiProject discussion that could review and account for all the technical considerations that may apply, and should not be casually debated at CFD like a content category. Bearcat (talk) 15:12, 4 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep Categories tagged start off in, and once seven days have elapsed from the last edit, they are automatically moved to  (a WP:NULLEDIT might be necessary). They don't stay there for long though, because we have admins watching for  becoming populated, when they check the pages that are there and either de-tag or delete them. So the cat doesn't remain populated for long. Before deleting this category, you need to change the mechanism that populates it, I suggest a discussion at WT:CSD. -- Red rose64 &#x1f339; (talk) 19:21, 4 March 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:21st century in Foxborough, Massachusetts

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  16:58, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:21st century in Foxborough, Massachusetts to Category:Sports competitions in Foxborough, Massachusetts
 * Propose merging Category:20th century in Foxborough, Massachusetts to Category:Sports competitions in Foxborough, Massachusetts
 * Nominator's rationale: Nearly every article in this category relates to sports competitions or sports seasons held in the town. The few which are not about competitions can easily be manually removed. User:Namiba 16:48, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 05:50, 11 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Support


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Cemeteries in Dedham, Massachusetts

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  16:59, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Cemeteries in Dedham, Massachusetts to Category:Buildings and structures in Dedham, Massachusetts and Category:Cemeteries in Norfolk County, Massachusetts
 * Nominator's rationale: Per WP:SMALLCAT, this category is small (4 entries) and unlikely to be expanded due to the small town nature of the subject. User:Namiba 16:30, 3 March 2023 (UTC)


 * Oppose A cemetery is neither a building nor a structure. --Slugger O&#39;Toole (talk) 17:51, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Cemeteries are notable for the buildings and structures within them. That's why Category:Cemeteries is a subcategory of Category:Monuments and memorials, which itself a subcategory of Category:Buildings and structures by type.--User:Namiba 20:16, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Category:Cemeteries is a subcat of Category:Burial monuments and structures which is ultimately under Category:Buildings and structures. Now clearly, it's not the graves themselves but the related structures being categorized here and undoing this parent would be a broader discussion. - RevelationDirect (talk) 21:07, 4 March 2023 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 05:50, 11 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Merge Fails smallcat and, given the population density of the area, new cemeteries are unlikely. - RevelationDirect (talk) 21:07, 4 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Support


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Folk dance in Finland

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  16:59, 12 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Folk dance in Finland to Category:Dance in Finland and Category:Folk dance and Category:Finnish folk culture
 * Nominator's rationale: Per WP:SMALLCAT. This category has only 1 entry.  Estopedist1 (talk) 07:05, 3 March 2023 (UTC)

William Allen Simpson (talk) 05:57, 11 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Support per nom. Meanwhile there are two entries, but for the discussion that does not really matter. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:17, 3 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Merge for Now with no objection to recreating if anyone can drum up 3 more articles. -RevelationDirect (talk) 21:09, 4 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Support — but require 17 more articles. I was an avid folk dancer, spent a decade helping with NEFFA back in the day, and did a fair amount of scandi over the years, but we don't need this overcategorization. Broader categorization helps find related groups.


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.