Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 May 28

 &lt; May 27 May 29 &gt;

Wildfires by country

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge. No new comments after the procedural relist. (non-admin closure) –LaundryPizza03 ( d  c̄ ) 04:00, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Wildfires in Algeria to Category:Fires in Algeria, Category:Natural disasters in Algeria and Category:Wildfires in Africa
 * Propose merging Category:Wildfires in Brazil to Category:Fires in Brazil, Category:Natural disasters in Brazil and Category:Wildfires in South America
 * Propose merging Category:Wildfires in France to Category:Fires in France, Category:Natural disasters in France and Category:Wildfires in Europe
 * Propose merging Category:Wildfires in Georgia (country) to Category:Fires in Georgia (country), Category:Natural disasters in Georgia (country) and Category:Wildfires in Europe
 * Propose merging Category:Wildfires in Germany to Category:Fires in Germany, Category:Natural disasters in Germany and Category:Wildfires in Europe
 * Propose merging Category:Wildfires in India to Category:Fires in India, Category:Natural disasters in India and Category:Wildfires in Asia
 * Propose merging Category:Wildfires in Italy to Category:Fires in Italy, Category:Natural disasters in Italy and Category:Wildfires in Europe
 * Propose merging Category:Wildfires in New Zealand to Category:Fires in New Zealand, Category:Natural disasters in New Zealand and Category:Wildfires in Oceania
 * Propose merging Category:Wildfires in Pakistan to Category:Fires in Pakistan, Category:Natural disasters in Pakistan and Category:Wildfires in Asia
 * Propose merging Category:Wildfires in Portugal to Category:Fires in Portugal, Category:Natural disasters in Portugal and Category:Wildfires in Europe
 * Propose merging Category:Wildfires in Sweden to Category:Fires in Sweden, Category:Natural disasters in Sweden and Category:Wildfires in Europe
 * Propose merging Category:Wildfires in Turkey to Category:Fires in Turkey, Category:Natural disasters in Turkey, Category:Wildfires in Asia and Category:Wildfires in Europe
 * Nominator's rationale: merge per WP:SMALLCAT. –Aidan721 (talk) 02:34, 4 May 2023 (UTC)

Relisting comment: Procedural relist, as the categories were not tagged. Five of the nominated categories were deleted in a duplicate CfD at Categories_for_discussion/Log/2023_May_13. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, –LaundryPizza03 ( d c̄ ) 23:00, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Merge per nom. The category of Georgia (country) may also be merged to Asia (the whole country is on the continent borderline), while the category of Turkey should be merged to Asia only (because the fires were specifically in the Asian part of the country). Marcocapelle (talk) 06:35, 4 May 2023 (UTC)
 *  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Criminals

 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: keep. There seems to be agreement, at least, that amcient and medieval criminals cannot always be classified with certainty as convicted, and with the other categories such as Category:Suspected criminals. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 17:39, 11 June 2023 (UTC)


 * Propose renaming Category:Criminals to Category:People convicted of crime
 * Nominator's rationale: This would bring things into line with the Category:People by criminal conviction. Also, there's the argument for the use of person-first language. I.e, we have a category called 'Category:People with schizophrenia', not 'Category:Schizophrenics'. I've been brought to this parent category after seeing a 'criminal' category at Jack Charles, who was indeed convicted of many crimes, but was famous for what he accomplished out of prison. Secondly, this category may be factually inaccurate in countries that operate a spent conviction scheme, where a person is no longer considered to have a criminal record after certain period of time, as would be the case with David Kang. Here is an example of a person who was indeed convicted of a crime, though is clearly not a career criminal, and no longer even has a criminal record, as the category would suggest. Damien Linnane (talk) 04:01, 20 April 2023 (UTC)


 * Oppose It narrows the scope of the category significantly. Things like Category:Works about criminals would no longer fit in the category's new scope. I should also note that your comparison is flawed; there is a Category:Schizophrenia that is similar to this one. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 05:16, 20 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Category:Works about criminals might be renamed the same way as proposed, but Category:Suspected criminals would really no longer belong here after renaming. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:02, 20 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Why couldn't Category:Suspected criminals be renamed Category:People suspected of criminal activity, or something along those lines?
 * Renaming does not help in this case. With or without renaming, they are simply not people convicted of crime as you propose the parent category to become. 08:26, 20 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Thanks for explaining; that makes sense. I'm sure we could just relocate it to Category:Crime then. Damien Linnane (talk) 08:45, 20 April 2023 (UTC)
 * There is also a problem with Category:Ancient criminals and Category:Medieval criminals who did not always get a trial. For example nothing is known about Ablabius (assassin) after his arrest. Marcocapelle (talk) 08:55, 20 April 2023 (UTC)
 * I know I'm somewhat splitting hairs here, but by definition, if they weren't given a trial or convicted, they weren't a 'criminal' in a legal sense at least. There aren't many articles in Ancient criminals. Picking the first one at random, Nasra of Tao-Klarjeti, shows the categories Category:Medieval murderers and Category:9th-century criminals. I don't see why we couldn't change 'Category:9th-century criminals' to 'Category:9th-century murderers', which is more specific and helpful anyway. Damien Linnane (talk) 02:05, 21 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Renaming to murderers does not help (besides Fatima bint Al-Aswad was a thief in the 7th century), the point is that information about a trial is sometimes lacking, and/or a trial was deemed unnecessary. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:26, 21 April 2023 (UTC)
 * I'm not seeing how renaming to murderers does not help, or your point with Fatima; just give her 'Category:7th-century thiefs' then instead of murderers. Lots of people throughout history have been executed without trial; that doesn't mean they were automatically guilty of whatever they were accused of.
 * I've come across issues in the past on Wikipedia where events in the ancient world don't fit in nicely with modern categorisation. This should not be surprising, and it wouldn't be hard to find a work-around, but it's clear this nomination isn't going to pass at this time, so I'm happy to drop the issue for now. Damien Linnane (talk) 02:01, 23 April 2023 (UTC)
 * I think it is your comparison that is flawed. Category:Schizophrenia is not remotely similar to Category:Criminals. Most articles in Category:Criminals are of individual people, whereas articles are in :Category:Schizophrenia are about health and treatment. Individual people within the parent category are instead located within Category:People with schizophrenia. Damien Linnane (talk) 06:35, 20 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Well, beyond that, WP:CONCISE is a thing and would prevent it from being renamed. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 06:47, 20 April 2023 (UTC)
 * I don't see how WP:CONCISE automatically overrules this. Being concise should not overrule being factually accurate, or being respectful. There are currently people in Category:Criminals that do not have a criminal record, and I personally would strongly oppose changing Category:People with schizophrenia to Category:Schizophrenics just because it's shorter. Damien Linnane (talk) 07:00, 20 April 2023 (UTC)


 * OpposeConvictions are non-defining. Descriptions of the specific crimes should have more relevance. Dimadick (talk) 19:50, 20 April 2023 (UTC)
 * I am assuming good faith. Can you please explain how :Category:Criminals, what I'm asking to replace, is more specific than :Category:People convicted of crime? Descriptions of specific crimes should have more relevance, but that's neither here nor there as far as I can see since neither what we already have, nor what I'm asking to replace it with, specifies the crime committed. Damien Linnane (talk) 01:58, 21 April 2023 (UTC)

Relisting comment: Was the only remaining open CfD on April 20, category wasn't tagged, and there is no clear consensus. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d c̄ ) 22:50, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * We have plenty of articles on known assassins and would-be assassins who were never put on trial. And several articles on members of organized crime who got away with murders. Big Jim Colosimo is famous for being a crime boss and founding a "criminal empire", but was never convicted of any crime or imprisoned. Based on your proposal, Colosimo would not qualify for the category Category:People convicted of crime. Dimadick (talk) 10:21, 21 April 2023 (UTC)
 * I don't see a problem with that. One definition of a criminal is a person convicted of a crime; that doesn't mean we have to blanketly insinuate everyone who has committed a crime is a career criminal, when we could instead use person-first language. Every person on the planet has violated a law at some point that they weren't caught for, even if that's just littering or going slightly over the speed limit. Besides, no matter whether we leave it as it is, or change to what I'm proposing, it's never going to fit perfectly with every imaginable article. As I've mentioned, we currently have people in Category:Criminals who are labelled as a 'criminal' as their identity as a person, even though they were convicted of an offence that did not even result in imprisonment, and who no longer even have a criminal record due to spent convictions. Damien Linnane (talk) 11:31, 21 April 2023 (UTC)
 * "Every person on the planet has violated a law at some point that they weren't caught for" Yeah, yeah. I already got the advice from my father that it is only a crime if you get caught. When I was a kid, he used it to justify several of his actions, from shop lifting to extramarital affairs. Former altar boys like dad have learned some lessons about secrecy. Dimadick (talk) 07:46, 15 May 2023 (UTC)
 * <p class="xfd_relist" style="margin:0 0 0 -1em;border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 2em;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.


 * Let me just add that in principle I support the proposal, in modern times it is the conviction that makes someone a criminal. But the farther away in history the more unsure and blurry everything becomes and historians can only assess probabilities rather than certainties. That should not prevent us from categorizing, which is just providing a convenient way to navigate between related articles. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:42, 29 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Asia Cup Qualifications
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Asia Cup Qualifiers. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 04:01, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * propose renaming:Category:Asia Cup Qualifications to Category:Asia Cup Qualifiers.
 * Nominators rational: Renaming will make it accurate. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2607:FEA8:761B:C900:B86A:A57:C187:5D28 (talk • contribs)

Relisting comment: May require an RM for an associated article to sort out... Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d c̄ ) 03:21, 16 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Comment Two of the articles use "qualifier" (2016 Asia Cup Qualifier & 2018 Asia Cup Qualifier) and one uses "qualification" (2022 Asia Cup Qualification). - RevelationDirect (talk) 01:43, 7 May 2023 (UTC)
 * As majority of the articles uses qualifier. The category should be renamed. Cactinites (talk) 05:50, 7 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Comment: Other similar category uses qualifier such as Category:ICC World Cup Qualifier, Category:ICC Men's T20 World Cup Qualifier.
 * Rename This is a clearer to me. (If there is some WP:ENGVAR issue here, let me know.) - RevelationDirect (talk) 02:26, 13 May 2023 (UTC)
 * <p class="xfd_relist" style="margin:0 0 0 -1em;border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 2em;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.


 * Comment See also Talk:2022_Asia_Cup_Qualification. –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d c̄ ) 03:27, 16 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Defer That discussion with people closer to the subject is more likely to get the right outcome. Defer to WP:RM. - RevelationDirect (talk) 20:04, 20 May 2023 (UTC)

Relisting comment: The article was moved to 2022 Asia Cup Qualifier. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d c̄ ) 22:24, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Wait for the outcome of the RM. Marcocapelle (talk) 04:34, 16 May 2023 (UTC)
 * <p class="xfd_relist" style="margin:0 0 0 -1em;border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 2em;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.


 * Support as the common name, as agreed in the now closed RM. <b style="color:#0033ab">Joseph</b><b style="color:#000000">2302</b> (talk) 07:21, 29 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Speedy Rename the outcome of the WP:RM makes it clear this is the right title. - RevelationDirect (talk) 00:29, 30 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Dynasty genealogy
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 June 18%23Category:Dynasty genealogy

Categories for presently serving Indian state legislators
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: no consensus. (non-admin closure) (t &#183; c)  buidhe  01:27, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Andhra Pradesh MLAs 2019–2024 to Category:Andhra Pradesh MLAs 2019–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Arunachal Pradesh MLAs 2019–2024 to Category:Arunachal Pradesh MLAs 2019–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Assam MLAs 2021–2026 to Category:Assam MLAs 2021–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Bihar MLAs 2020–2025 to Category:Bihar MLAs 2020–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Chhattisgarh MLAs 2018–2023 to Category:Chhattisgarh MLAs 2018–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Delhi MLAs 2020–2025 to Category:Delhi MLAs 2020–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Goa MLAs 2022–2027 to Category:Goa MLAs 2022–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Gujarat MLAs 2022–2027 to Category:Gujarat MLAs 2022–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Haryana MLAs 2019–2024 to Category:Haryana MLAs 2019–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Himachal Pradesh MLAs 2022–2027 to Category:Himachal Pradesh MLAs 2022–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Jharkhand MLAs 2019–2024 to Category:Jharkhand MLAs 2019–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Karnataka MLAs 2023–2028 to Category:Karnataka MLAs 2023–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Kerala MLAs 2021–2026 to Category:Kerala MLAs 2021–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Madhya Pradesh MLAs 2018–2023 to Category:Madhya Pradesh MLAs 2018–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Maharashtra MLAs 2019–2024 to Category:Maharashtra MLAs 2019–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Manipur MLAs 2022–2027 to Category:Manipur MLAs 2022–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Meghalaya MLAs 2023–2028 to Category:Meghalaya MLAs 2023–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Mizoram MLAs 2018–2023 to Category:Mizoram MLAs 2018–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Nagaland MLAs 2023–2028 to Category:Nagaland MLAs 2023–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Odisha MLAs 2019–2024 to Category:Odisha MLAs 2019–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Puducherry MLAs 2021–2026 to Category:Puducherry MLAs 2021–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Punjab, India MLAs 2022–2027 to Category:Punjab, India MLAs 2022–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Rajasthan MLAs 2018–2023 to Category:Rajasthan MLAs 2018–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Sikkim MLAs 2019–2024 to Category:Sikkim MLAs 2019–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Tamil Nadu MLAs 2021–2026 to Category:Tamil Nadu MLAs 2021–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Telangana MLAs 2018–2023 to Category:Telangana MLAs 2018–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Tripura MLAs 2023–2028 to Category:Tripura MLAs 2023–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Uttar Pradesh MLAs 2022–2027 to Category:Uttar Pradesh MLAs 2022–present
 * Propose renaming Category:Uttarakhand MLAs 2022–2027 to Category:Uttarakhand MLAs 2022–present
 * Propose renaming Category:West Bengal MLAs 2021–2026 to Category:West Bengal MLAs 2021–present
 * Nominator's rationale: Being a parliamentary system, the terms of Indian state legislators aren't fixed, subject to early dissolution of legislature, which may occur at any time even if the scheduled 5 years aren't over yet. Having the end year in the category name is WP:CRYSTALBALL. &#8212;CX Zoom[he/him] (let's talk • {C•X}) 19:55, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Oppose for Chhattisgarh, Madhya Pradesh, Mizoram, Rajasthan and Telangana. All these legislatures had their previous election in 2018, and their terms are definitely ending in 2023 (since 2023 has started). -MPGuy2824 (talk) 02:43, 29 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Comment: For the rest (ignoring the ones i opposed above), I take the point about CRYSTALBALL, but most of Indian state legislative terms have finished their full 5-year terms. Naming a category to "XYZ 2019–present" would need us to definitely do a rename at the beginning of the 5th year (2024 in this case) in 100% of the cases. My educated guess is that less than 10% of the legislative terms, since 2000, have been less than 5 years. Renaming the categories of only the much smaller percentage of legislatures that have attenuated terms, would involve less work. -MPGuy2824 (talk) 02:47, 29 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Keep; these are consistent with other current legislative terms worldwide, where it is generally assumed that the assembly will last its full term. It is easy to rename a category if an early election is called. A future year rather than the word "present" was added at a fairly recent precedent, Categories_for_discussion/Log/2021_July_17. – Fayenatic  L ondon 12:45, 30 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Azerbaijani-speaking countries and territories
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Countries and territories where Azerbaijani is an official language. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 04:04, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Azerbaijani-speaking countries and territories to Category:Countries and territories where Azerbaijani is an official language
 * Nominator's rationale: Per WP:C2C parent Category:Countries and territories by official language. Nederlandse Leeuw (talk) 17:28, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Ukrainian-speaking countries and territories
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 June 11%23Category:Ukrainian-speaking countries and territories

Category:Turkish-speaking territories in Syria
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge to Category:Turkmen communities in Syria. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 17:34, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose downmerging Category:Turkish-speaking territories in Syria to Category:Turkmen communities in Syria
 * Un-parent Category:Countries and territories by official language and Category:Turkish language
 * Nominator's rationale: The Turkish language is non-defining for these towns/villages/areas as "territories", because it has no official status. All 3 items are also already in the child category or one of its grandchildren, so it's a redundant category anyway. Nederlandse Leeuw (talk) 17:07, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Support per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:17, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Tamil-speaking countries and territories
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Countries and territories where Tamil is an official language. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 04:06, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Tamil-speaking countries and territories to Category:Countries and territories where Tamil is an official language
 * Nominator's rationale: Per WP:C2D main article List of countries and territories where Tamil is an official language, per WP:C2C parent Category:Countries and territories by official language, and per category description Countries and territories where Tamil language is official. Nederlandse Leeuw (talk) 16:58, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Comment, Tamil is also "recognized as a minority language" in various forms in other countries. This is another example where "official language" seems a too strict criterion. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:23, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Persian-speaking countries and territories
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 June 18%23Category:Persian-speaking countries and territories

Category:Somali-speaking countries and territories
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Countries and territories where Somali is an official language. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 05:11, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Somali-speaking countries and territories to Category:Countries and territories where Somali is an official language
 * Nominator's rationale: Per WP:C2C parent Category:Countries and territories by official language, and per category description Countries and territories where Somali is the official or national language. Nederlandse Leeuw (talk) 16:51, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Rohingya-speaking territories
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure)  Qwerfjkl  talk  15:05, 18 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting rohingya-speaking territories
 * Nominator's rationale: WP:ARBITRARYCAT. There seems to be no territory where the Rohingya language is official or co-official. The 3 territories which this cat had when I found it (Rakhine State, Cox's Bazar District, Maungdaw District) just had a certain amount of Rohingya speakers which the creator apparently found to be significant, without criteria. Although I think the fate of the Rohingya people should not be ignored, this categorisation is not the way to do it. I initially moved Cox's Bazar District to Category:Rohingya diaspora due to the large number of Rohingya refugees there, but I'm not sure it's a good solution either, because 725,000 refugees on a 2,823,265 total population is still not a majority. This topic is much better explained at Rohingya refugees in Bangladesh than by arbitrarily categorising this district as a "Rohingya-speaking territory". Nederlandse Leeuw (talk) 16:45, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Delete per nom. No jurisdictions where Rohingya is an official language. –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d c̄ ) 04:09, 11 June 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Unpopulated villages in Turkey
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 June 18%23Category:Unpopulated villages in Turkey

Category:Swedish-speaking countries and territories
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 June 18%23Category:Swedish-speaking countries and territories

Category:Parody television series based on Star Wars
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 June 18%23Category:Parody television series based on Star Wars

Category:Hindi-speaking countries and territories
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 June 18%23Category:Hindi-speaking countries and territories

Category:Chechen-speaking countries and territories
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 June 18%23Category:Chechen-speaking countries and territories

Category:Karakalpakstani Wikipedians
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 04:11, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting karakalpakstani wikipedians
 * Nominator's rationale: Empty category, not category material. * Pppery * <sub style="color:#800000">it has begun... 15:19, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:18, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:1569 establishments in Belarus
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 04:13, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting 1569 establishments in belarus
 * Propose deleting 1569 establishments in ukraine
 * Propose deleting 1795 disestablishments in belarus
 * Propose deleting 1795 disestablishments in ukraine
 * Nominator's rationale: Misguided categories that are being used to overcategorize the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. These aren't being used to categorize individual things (towns, organizations, etc.) that were established in the future-Belarus and future-Ukraine regions of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth during the Commonwealth era, they're being used to categorize the Commonwealth itself, so that it's being five-catted as a "YYYY [dis]establishment in the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth" and a "YYYY [dis]establishment in Poland" and a "YYYY [dis]establishment in Lithuania" and a "YYYY [dis]establishment in Belarus" and a "YYYY [dis]establishment in Ukraine" all at the same time. But neither Belarus nor Ukraine existed under those names at the time of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, so the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth was clearly not "in" either of them: the "what was in what" relationship went the opposite way. Bearcat (talk) 14:45, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Delete per nom. * Pppery * <sub style="color:#800000">it has begun... 15:19, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. Category:Belarusian rulers was recently deleted for similar reasons of anachronism. Nederlandse Leeuw (talk) 18:21, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:11, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Public high schools in suburbs of Atlanta
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 04:13, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting public high schools in suburbs of atlanta
 * Nominator's rationale: As at Categories for discussion/Log/2023 May 25, we categorize high schools by the places that they're in, not by the other places that the places they're in are near. Bearcat (talk) 14:10, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Delete and every article I checked is already in an appropriate subcategory of Category:Public high schools in Georgia (U.S. state) so there's no need to merge. * Pppery * <sub style="color:#800000">it has begun... 15:19, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:19, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Greek chronicles
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 June 18%23Category:Greek chronicles

Category:National Football League Olympians
Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2023 June 11%23Category:National Football League Olympians

Category:Rcat template documentation pages
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Redirect category template documentation pages. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 17:35, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Rcat template documentation pages to Category:Redirect template documentation pages
 * Nominator's rationale: Template:Rcat redirects to Template:Redirect template so either this should follow WP:C2D or use some other real world word that isn't "rcat". Gonnym (talk) 08:43, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Rename per nom. * Pppery * <sub style="color:#800000">it has begun... 15:19, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Oppose. Gentle reminder that "rcat" is an acronym for "redirect category", so this category's full name should be Category:Redirect category template documentation pages. The /doc pages found in the category are actually found on "redirect category templates pages, not on the "redirect template" page. The redirect template is in fact a meta template used within most redirect category (rcat) templates. So I really don't see any logical reason to make this change. If done correctly and renamed to "Category:Redirect category template documentation pages", we would just be making the category name overly precise. If the proposed name is used, then it would be not only less concise, but also incorrect. The entries in the category are not documentation pages of the redirect template, they are documentation pages of all of the redirect category (rcat) templates.  P.I. Ellsworth &thinsp;, ed.  put'er there 04:26, 29 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Support, pace User:Paine Ellsworth. I've never considered "redirect category templates" to be a helpful name. These templates go on hard redirect pages in mainspace, not on categories. Perhaps a widespread change to explain Rcats as "redirect categorization templates" would be helpful. – Fayenatic  L ondon 10:39, 30 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Have no problem with renaming Category:Redirect categorization template documentation pages. "Rcat" could mean either. Yet, I still don't see the need to rename at all. Acronyms abound in non-article titles and are defined in the content or documentation. If such precision is needed in page titles, I'm not really averse to it.  P.I. Ellsworth &thinsp;, ed.  put'er there 18:18, 30 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Foreign relations of the medieval Islamic world
Relisted, see Categories for discussion/Log/2023 June 11%23Foreign relations of the medieval Islamic world

Category:Novels set in deserts
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 * The result of the discussion was: keep. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 04:14, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting novels set in deserts
 * Nominator's rationale: WP:NONDEF. These works are not widely described by their setting if they are discussed. For example, one might read "Children of Dune, the well-known science fiction novel", but not "Children of Dune, the well-known desert novel".  Sandstein   05:52, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Keep. There is a wide body of already existing categories meant to sort novels by their primary contents (see All categories with prefix Novels about, All categories with prefix Novels set in; and compare categories like Category:Novels set in swamps, Category:Novels set in castles, Category:Novels set in libraries, Category:Novels set on islands, Category:Novels set in outer space, etc. etc.). Some novels may be misplaced in these categories, in which case of course they should be removed. That does not mean the categories themselves should be deleted. — the Man in Question (in question)  06:24, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep. Per the Man in Question. I'd also note the other related category trees Category:Deserts in fiction and Category:Fiction by setting. Further critical commentary on the Dune series does widely discuss Children of Dune as being set on a desert planet as it is a central point in relation to events in the novel. That was a bad example as the cat is more than appropriate for that work.4meter4 (talk) 09:50, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep, appropriate category for articles like The Gobi Desert (novel). Marcocapelle (talk) 08:28, 29 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Quazar albums
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: keep. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 05:12, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose deleting quazar albums
 * Nominator's rationale: DELETE WP:SMALLCAT -- there can only be 1 album in this category as the founder of this band died before the album was released in 1978 and the band immediately dissolved. The band does not have an article, so the albumcat header template is pointing to the wrong article (Quazar) as the "main" article. The sole article, Quazar (album) can be upmerged to  and  --  64.229.90.172 (talk) 05:40, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Keep - the band is the paramount defining characteristic of an album. Also Category:Albums by artist states "Please note that all single-artist album articles may have subcategories here, even if it's the only album the artist has recorded." Oculi (talk) 10:25, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * It shouldn't be "Quazar" as the current title indicates (as it currently mislinks to the wrong article), as any potential article would be Quazar (band) or further disambiguated, so if this is kept would need to be renamed or further disambiguation.
 * And we delete low entry band categories, which would seem to be extremely defining (such as the missing parent for this album article isn't in the band category tree) Tree navigation from the bands/artist trees has been broken since we've been deleting low count categories from it, so no cross-link between an albumcat and their corresponding bookcat or songcat. etc. Thus this doesn't seem like it is a good exception, if we don't have the full category tree by artist, only a partial tree coming through albums.
 * -- 64.229.90.172 (talk) 17:39, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * This comment may be based on a misunderstanding. We do not need a complete tree of eponymous categories by artist at all, because the albums and songs are complete and are linking to each other. Eponymous categories usually do not add anything. See also WP:OCEPON. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:15, 29 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep per SMALLCAT exception. The albumcat header can be adjusted so it doesn't link to the "Quazar" article, or the category can be renamed with a disambiguator as suggested by the IP. Star cheers peaks news lost wars Talk to me 15:49, 2 June 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Witch trials in America
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: merge to Category:Witch trials and Category:American witchcraft. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 04:17, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose merging Category:Witch trials in America to Category:Witch trials
 * Nominator's rationale: merge, redundant category layer with only one subcategory. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:03, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Merge per nom. –Aidan721 (talk) 23:44, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Double merge, also to Category:American witchcraft, unless there is a rationale for removing the content from that hierarchy. – Fayenatic  L ondon 12:59, 30 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Brunei Wikipedians
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: rename to Category:Bruneian Wikipedians. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 04:17, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Brunei Wikipedians to Category:Bruneian Wikipedians (NO BOTS)
 * Nominator's rationale: Use the denonym instead of just the name of the country. - nathanielcwm (talk) 02:30, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Rename to same format as Category:Bruneian people. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:11, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Governor General's Performing Arts Award winners
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure) –<b style="color:#77b">Laundry</b><b style="color:#fb0">Pizza</b><b style="color:#b00">03</b> ( d  c̄ ) 04:19, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose renaming Category:Governor General's Performing Arts Award winners to Category:Governor General's Performing Arts Award recipients or Category:Governor General's Performing Arts Award honorees
 * Nominator's rationale: The Governor General's Performing Arts Awards are not a competitive award like the Oscars or the Junos, but are a lifetime achievement award that's essentially Canada's equivalent to the Kennedy Center Honors -- so the category is really more accurately named "recipients" or "honorees" rather than "winners", because it's not an award that has "winners" or "losers" as such. Bearcat (talk) 00:41, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Delete per WP:OCAWARD and WP:NONDEFINING. I read through the first 5 articles, and this award is usually listed in passing with other honours that were typically earned earlier in their career: see 1, 2, 3, 4, although the 5th is an exception and lists it in the lede. Lifetime achievement awards tend to just reflect the pre-existing fame of people rather than defining them. (Alternatively, if kept, support the rename.) - RevelationDirect (talk) 01:44, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * It's not one iota less defining than . If that gets a category, this does too. I'll grant that nobody was previously arsed to write a full article that listed all of the nominees, and instead it's long made do with a redirect to a subsection in the general overview Governor General's Awards alongside awards in five other domains, but that's going to change in about 20 minutes as soon as I'm done referencing the 2010s in sandbox. Bearcat (talk) 03:04, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * The WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS argument is more persuasive for countries with few English speaking people or those with less access to technology where we have to worry about systemic bias. Even though we disagree on the cat, appreciate your work to improve the article space! - RevelationDirect (talk) 04:13, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * No. The onus is on you to demonstrate a reason why the Kennedy Center Honors would be notable enough to merit a category and yet this somehow would not. Bearcat (talk) 14:14, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * I don't accept that other stuff exists burden (see WP:CFDSCOPE), but I'll reply anyway: both categories are non-defining and should be listified, and the same goes for a majority of other award recipient categories. - RevelationDirect (talk) 17:33, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * If someone just CfD's Category:Kennedy Center honorees, we can find out who's right... Nederlandse Leeuw (talk) 18:26, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Delete per WP:OCAWARD. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:07, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Grammy Award venues
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 * The result of the discussion was: Delete. (non-admin closure) (t &#183; c)  buidhe  01:32, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose Deleting Category:Grammy Award venues
 * Nominator's rationale: Per WP:OCVENUE and WP:NONDEFINING
 * I'm sure venues are very excited when they book the Grammys but Madison Square Garden, Radio City Music Hall, Crypto.com Arena, and The Beverly Hilton host many prominent events. If the The Recording Academy constructed purpose built theatres, this might be defining, but this is just categorization by rental agreement. There is already a separate list article, List of Grammy Award ceremony locations, for any reader interested in the topic. - RevelationDirect (talk) 00:04, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:08, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. QuietHere (talk &#124; contributions) 16:29, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. –Aidan721 (talk) 23:44, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Tarski lecturers
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 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was: Delete. (non-admin closure) (t &#183; c)  buidhe  01:34, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Propose Deleting Category:Tarski lecturers
 * Nominator's rationale: Per WP:PERFCAT, WP:OCAWARD & WP:NONDEFINING
 * Since 1989, the University of California Berkeley hosts the annual Tarski Lecture on mathematical logic and this category groups people who gave the talk. It's considered an honor to be invited but the performance sure isn't treated as defining in the articles: about a third mention it in passing while about two thirds don't mention it at all. The category contents are already listed right here in the main article for any reader interested in the topic. - RevelationDirect (talk) 00:04, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Background We've deleted similar academics by lecture categories here, here and here. - RevelationDirect (talk) 00:04, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:09, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.