Wikipedia:Featured and good topic candidates/Aston Villa F.C.

Aston Villa F.C.
I am nominating this for Featured topic as I believe it meets all the criteria, and it is complete. This follows in the wake of Gillingham F.C., York City F.C. and Ipswich Town F.C.. There is also Bodymoor Heath, Second City Derby and possibly Aston Villa F.C. Reserves and Academy but they are all peripheral to the main topic. Perhaps a future supplement. Thanks for your time. Regards. Woody (talk) 21:08, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Support - Obviously it would be preferable to have all of the articles at Featured status, but six out of eight articles being featured is enough. I can't see any obvious holes in the scope of this topic. Good work Woody! – PeeJay 21:29, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Just to add that this should be a co-nomination, worked with me on a majority of the articles, though he hasn't edited Wikipedia in about 4 months. Regards. Woody (talk) 21:52, 14 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Support Fantastic set of articles, easily meets the criteria. Well done. Mattythewhite (talk) 22:04, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Support BTW: should we have a second look at the 3(c) article is Gillingham F.C.? Zginder 2008-09-14T22:12Z (UTC)
 * Comment - Do Aston Villa do a Player of the Year award? And I guess Aston Villa L.F.C. is another potential future addition, along with a few others. (And yes, there are actually 3 problems with the Gillingham topic, I've been planning to nom it for removal for quite a while) - rst20xx (talk) 23:54, 14 September 2008 (UTC)
 * The ladies team is an "affiliated team" and have little to do with Aston Villa, not least of all the first team which this topic is about. As with all teams there is a player of the year in various forms see the current list, but I don't know anywhere where this is studied in detail. I really don't think a list could be created about it, see its google hits for a understanding of why that is. I have two Villa books that go into a lot of detail into Villa, neither of them mention the player of the year awards in any detail whatsoever. Regards. Woody (talk) 00:13, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Comment Why are the individual player articles ont included? –Juliancolton Tropical Cyclone  13:41, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment - Villa have probably had upwards of 1,000 players turn out for them in their 130+ year history. Surely you aren't saying that every single individual player, right down to the level of some guy who played once in 1897, would need to be included in the bundle to constitute "full coverage of the topic" or whatever the term is......? -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 13:52, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Weak oppose - you're right that the Player of the Year stuff is hard to find, but what you can find (e.g. 2008) I'd like to see worked into the topic somewhere. Also, List of Aston Villa F.C. players currently covers all players with 125+ appearances, and Featured Topics are very much a precedent-based thing - the bar is currently set at 100+ for this. These are minor complaints, but lead me to weak oppose, sorry - rst20xx (talk) 13:58, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I could work on the list of AVFC players, but the Player of the Year is an impossibility; it is simply not an area of study in sourcing (note not reliable sourcing, just sourcing of any kind). I have been all around Villa Park and haven't seen anything about it. The players of the year that do matter, see Aston Villa F.C.. If other people consider the List of AVFC players a concern, then it can be worked on. It hasn't been seen as an issue though even through various discussions on FLRCs regarding season lists in general. See this FLRC for Arsenal, Wikipedia Signpost/2008-05-12/Dispatches and Wikipedia_talk:NOTED_PLAYER for some background. I note, WRT to your observation about precedent that Gillingham is 50+. It all depends on the club; it meets the FLC criteria and it has been discussed at length before; the core topic is complete in my opinion. Woody (talk) 14:40, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia talk:NOTED PLAYER just shows to me that Aston Villa is the only one with a bar higher than 100. I agree that this is more a concern for FLC, but I think this is also a concern for FTC as FTC is looking for notable gaps, and I feel this is a notable gap. Also notice that I said that you could only mention players of the year when it is sourceable (e.g. 2008). I suppose however this information would look out of place if it only appears for some years and not others, this could be worked around by deferring the information to the seasons articles, which would take it out of the scope of the proposed topic but would also mean it's there somewhere, available for a possible future subtopic - rst20xx (talk) 21:37, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I didn't say I would include it, even if I did have a complete and definitive list (which doesn't exist as far as I am aware). In 2 hours of searching through the internet and through 10 years worth of old programmes, I find little to no mention of it. It is simply not a topic of study, no matter how much you, or I, wish it to be. Randy seems to have reinvigorated it. Pushing it off to the seasons would seem appropriate, though that would involve creating those articles; the category is quite bare as I am dubious about the usefulness of them. If a definitive list of them was required for it then frankly that is exasperating to me. In terms of the players list, I can't remember anyone else deeming it to be a concern, and I certainly don't think it is a gap in the topic, though I would like further opinions. I have a book that I could update the list with, I am just uncertain as to whether it is a neccessity, or needed. Regards. Woody (talk) 22:15, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Well OK, how many years can you find player of the year information on? rst20xx (talk) 01:34, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * 2007-2008 Gabriel Agbonlahor
 * 2005-2006 Steven Davis
 * 2001-2002? Paul Merson
 * 2000-2001 Paul Merson
 * 1996-1997 Dwight Yorke
 * 1995-1996 Dwight Yorke
 * It simply isn't notable for Villa, we don't have cups that some of the smaller clubs have such as York and Ipswich. Villa tend to concentrate on nationally recognised awards such as the PFA, which are included in the Villa main article. Woody (talk) 14:58, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * OK, add a mention that Gabriel Agbonlahor was POTY to the (admittedly needing work) Aston Villa F.C. season 2007-08 article and I'll drop that half of my oppose - rst20xx (talk) 22:18, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Done. Woody (talk) 22:29, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Thank you - rst20xx (talk) 14:58, 17 September 2008 (UTC)


 * (<--Indent) Note, opened discussion at FOOTY. Woody (talk) 15:04, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Support without the need for player of the year list or expansion of the players list to 100+. On the POTY, I accept what Woody says about it not being a major thing for Villa, and so the topic is complete without it; on the expansion of the list, unless the FL star is removed through FLRC, surely the existence of the star is enough for FT purposes. The FT criteria don't have (as I read them) an extra standard saying that the FT process can go behind the award of the FL star and say that the list should be improved. BencherliteTalk 19:55, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Support as is, I feel the topic is complete as it stands -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 15:11, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Support as is. ErikvDijk (talk) 19:43, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Close with consensus to promote - good work - rst20xx (talk) 21:58, 24 September 2008 (UTC)