Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Andjar Asmara/archive1


 * The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by GrahamColm 18:13, 20 September 2012.

Andjar Asmara

 * Nominator(s): — Crisco 1492 (talk) 23:40, 11 September 2012 (UTC)

I am nominating this for featured article because I feel it is a good look at his life and work. He is from an era where little survives, and unlike my previous biography FACs there doesn't seem to be a book about Andjar. This has gone through a copyedit from several users and expanded after comments from Sarastro1. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 23:40, 11 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Support as GA reviewer. Can't see any problems for FA also. Well done! TBrandley 00:40, 12 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Comments: Supported below I copyedited this last week in preparation for this nomination and I think it is in good shape. Just a few unresolved issues I noticed while c/eing.
 * "He is remembered as a pioneer of theatre and one of the first native Indonesian film directors" remembered by whom? Indonesians in general or film experts?
 * Changed to "Historians recognise him...", as the average Indonesian's answer to "Who was Andjar Asmara" would be "who?"
 * Looks good. Mark Arsten (talk) 17:05, 12 September 2012 (UTC)


 * "He believed the troupe to be dedicated to the betterment of the toneel as an art form" Who is "He" here?
 * Clarified that it was Andjar in both the text and footnote.
 * Ok, good. Mark Arsten (talk) 17:05, 12 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Do you know which year he married?
 * Personal information is very light in the sources, so sadly no.
 * Ok, no prob. Mark Arsten (talk) 17:05, 12 September 2012 (UTC)


 * "writing several pieces on the history of local theatre under both his birth name and pseudonym." Is it that he sometimes used one name, and used the other name at other times, or is it that he signed two names on each thing he wrote?
 * Clarified
 * Good. Mark Arsten (talk) 17:06, 12 September 2012 (UTC)


 * "With Dardanella, in 1936 Andjar went to India" I'd suggest a comma after the date here. You should check for consistency in date commas in general too.
 * A comma after 1936, like "With Dardanella, in 1936,..."? That doesn't seem gramatically sound. Point taken about the other commas.
 * Hmm, I guess that was a mistake on my part. Mark Arsten (talk) 17:05, 12 September 2012 (UTC)


 * "That same year, he became head of the entertainment magazine Varia, assisted by fellow director Raden Ariffien." So did Ariffien assist him in becoming head of the magazine, or did he serve as his assistant once he became the head?
 * Clarified
 * Looks good. Mark Arsten (talk) 17:05, 12 September 2012 (UTC)


 * "Andjar held the position until his death.[1] Meanwhile, he continued to write and publish adaptations of local films in serial format.[32]" It's a little jarring to mention his death, and then say meanwhile he continued to write.
 * Would "Andjar held the position for more than a decade" be better?


 * "After Indonesia's independence, Andjar returned to journalism, moving to Purwokerto to lead the daily Perdjoeangan Rakjat.[1] He later returned to film," Some repetition of "returned" here.
 * Got rid of the "return to journalism" bit as it wasn't adding much of anything to the sentence.
 * Good. Mark Arsten (talk) 17:05, 12 September 2012 (UTC)


 * "Matthew Isaac Cohen, a scholar of Indonesian performing arts, describes Andjar as "Indonesia's foremost theater critic during the colonial period", noting that he wrote extensively on the history of theatre in the Indies. However, Cohen believes that Andjar also worked to justify the toneel style and distance it from the earlier stambul" I'm not sure the "However" works here.
 * " a critique of the Balinese caste system, which followed lovers from different castes" Is there a way around the "caste...castes" here?
 * Hmm... perhaps "a story of lovers from different castes in a critique of Bali's dominant social system", but that has an easter egg.


 * "Andjar's toneels were generally based on day-to-day experiences, rather than the tales of princes and ancient wars which were standard at the time.[6] Regarding these" The beginning of the second sentence is a bit unclear.
 * How's this?
 * Good. Mark Arsten (talk) 17:05, 12 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Alright, looks good, my hunch is that this will be an easy FAC. Mark Arsten (talk) 06:40, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I think I got everything. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:10, 12 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Support Ok, I'm satisfied with the article. It looks like its writing and presentation is up to FA quality. Good work, this was an easy one to review. Mark Arsten (talk) 17:39, 12 September 2012 (UTC)

 Leaning support : I commented extensively on this article at an earlier stage in its development, since when it has improved even further. This is a subject on which I know nothing, and cannot comment on comprehensiveness, but I found it very interesting and everything was carefully explained for background. I have a feeling that the prose would stand a further tweak in a place or two, but that may come down to personal style and preference, and I am confident it is at FA level. An excellent piece of work overall. Just a few last comments to clear up before I switch to full support. Sarastro1 (talk) 18:40, 16 September 2012 (UTC)
 * "a Malay adaptation of the Dutch-language magazine Filmland that contained original coverage of the domestic theatre and film industry": Could be read that the Dutch magazine contained original coverage, where I assume that this is about Doenia Film.
 * How's this? A bit wordier, admittedly. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 22:55, 16 September 2012 (UTC)


 * "He published many of his stage plays using the group's backing": Maybe "with" rather than "using"? Also, what stage plays; the ones he wrote in Padang? These are the only ones mentioned so far. And this begs the question: were his earlier plays ever actually performed in Padang, or did he only write them without taking them further?
 * Reworked completely. Also added "These works were well received.", which implies that several were in performed Padang. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 22:55, 16 September 2012 (UTC)


 * "With Dardanella, in 1936 Andjar went…": Thinking about it, I'm not sure that this quite flows correctly. Better to start with "In 1936, Andjar went with Dardanella…"
 * How's this? — Crisco 1492 (talk) 22:55, 16 September 2012 (UTC)
 * "Upon his return to the Indies, Andjar formed another theatrical troupe, Bolero, with Effendi, but Andjar left the troupe"
 * Sounds okay. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 22:55, 16 September 2012 (UTC)


 * I'm a little confused by the serials, both in the lead and main body. In what medium were the serials published? The implication is in book form, but I think clarification is needed.
 * Reworked. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 22:55, 16 September 2012 (UTC)


 * "which received critical derision": Maybe "was critically derided", but that may just be personal preference. Sarastro1 (talk) 18:40, 16 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Cuts a couple characters, sounds fine. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 22:55, 16 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the review! — Crisco 1492 (talk) 22:55, 16 September 2012 (UTC)

Support: Changes look good and I'm happy to fully support now. As a minor point, already mentioned above, the article still has "using the group's backing", which I'm not sure sounds great, but this does not affect my support. Sarastro1 (talk) 17:02, 17 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Dur, got it now. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 22:59, 17 September 2012 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.