Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Chrono Trigger: Crimson Echoes/archive1


 * The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was not promoted by Gimmetoo 18:33, 12 November 2011.

Chrono Trigger: Crimson Echoes

 * Nominator(s): GamerPro64  18:39, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

Chrono Trigger is considered by many as one of the best games of all time. While there was a sequel to the original in 2000, there hasn't been another installment in the Chrono franchise. So to fill the void, a group of dedicated fans decided to make an unofficial sequel to the game, set between Chrono Trigger and Chrono Cross. It was stated to be released in 2009 but after Square Enix, the creators of the Chrono games, sent a cease-and-desist letter to the group, it caused the five year project, with all of the 98% of the work, to be cancelled. This article is about the game that would have been. I believe the article meets FA criteria and that you too will agree. GamerPro64 18:39, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

Source review - spotchecks not done. Nikkimaria (talk) 19:24, 14 October 2011 (UTC)
 * "The development team made the battles more difficult than in Chrono Trigger, as they felt players would be familiar with challenging role-playing games." - source?
 * Couldn't find a source to it so I removed the sentence. GamerPro64  20:52, 20 October 2011 (UTC)


 * Who is the author of this site?
 * It says ZeaLitY at the bottom and that was already taken care of. GamerPro64  19:58, 14 October 2011 (UTC)


 * FN 9: publisher?
 * Done. GamerPro64  19:58, 14 October 2011 (UTC)


 * The Guardian should be italicized
 * Done. GamerPro64  19:58, 14 October 2011 (UTC)


 * I don't read Japanese, so can you explain what makes this a high-quality reliable source? this? this? this? Nikkimaria (talk) 19:24, 14 October 2011 (UTC)
 * I asked if the sources are reliable here. GamerPro64  22:11, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Not much of a response there, maybe try RSN? Nikkimaria (talk) 20:57, 26 October 2011 (UTC)


 * Oppose I have placed multiple images in the article up at PUF. Until that is resolved, or the images are removed, I must oppose.  S ven M anguard   Wha?  17:33, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
 * The two articles you nominated for PUD are both considered to be part of creative commons. I was told by User:Zeality, who was one of the people that was part of the project, that they were here. If you would like the consenting e-mail I can ask him. GamerPro64  21:53, 15 October 2011 (UTC)
 * I looked at Zeality's comment again and it looks like File:C99 KingZealsketch.jpg should be deleted as I didn't get permission from the artist. The other picture, File:Chrono Trigger Crimson Echoes art.jpg, was created by Ramsus, which I was told I can use his pictures. But again, if you want the e-mail, I can get it. GamerPro64  00:29, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Send the email to OTRS, have them put a ticket on it, and then I will be happy to close the PUF. Also, I should have mentioned this earlier, but I'd appreciate it if you converted the FURs on the other two images into modern, templated FURs. It shouldn't be too hard, you just have to move the information already there.  S ven M anguard   Wha?  04:13, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
 * I tagged KingZealsketch CSD G7 (uploader requested) and pointed to your comment at the PUF. That'll speed things up. Please get the email for the other image to OTRS as soon as possible.  S ven M anguard   Wha?  12:55, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
 * I e-mailed Zeality for the consenting e-mail but for the rest, unfortunately, I have to take care of later tonight. GamerPro64  14:04, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Update - I sent a request for a Creative Commons ticket and I updated the FURs. GamerPro64  01:41, 17 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Everything is good now.  S ven M anguard   Wha?  02:09, 20 October 2011 (UTC)
 * OTRS put a ticket on the image. I think I got everything done. GamerPro64  20:46, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

Copyscape check No issues were revealed by Copyscape searches. Graham Colm (talk) 18:08, 17 October 2011 (UTC) -- Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs ( talk ) 21:14, 24 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Oppose—I'm not sure this article meets 1b/1c of the criteria.
 * "The game, as a ROM hack, runs on the Chrono Trigger engine and has similar gameplay to the original. It is based five years after the events of Chrono Trigger and features all the playable characters from the original game. The plot involves the characters across different time periods coming together again to fight against an enemy that is attempting to change the past, involving elements from both official games. The game concludes by setting up several plot points that would be used in Chrono Cross."
 * The "ROM Hack" and "characters across different time periods" parts to this paragraph give me pause. I'm not sure what a ROM hack is, I'm not sure why there are different time periods, or if these are so important to understanding the topic.
 * The gameplay section doesn't really tell me much about the gameplay, providing a game I haven't played as a point of comparison.
 * I'm having a little trouble understanding your problem. The game has gameplay the same as Chrono Trigger and has added features to it like mini-games. What exactly is the section not telling you about the game's gameplay? GamerPro64  00:10, 27 October 2011 (UTC)
 * But I have never played Chrono Trigger so comparison doesn't do much to help me. An article should be able to stand alone if necessary; if I have to link away to another article to understand something I'm not coming back. It's bad web usability and bad writing to presuppose knowledge. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs ( talk ) 17:23, 29 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Maybe some basics, but otherwise it would just be a cut-and-paste with minor tweaking from CT. ∞ 陣  内  Jinnai  18:49, 30 October 2011 (UTC)
 * The characters and plot sections are incredibly long and gets me bogged down in details I can't remember by the end of the section. I'm left wondering why I should care, if the lead told me the game was cancelled?
 * Likewise, there's little development information, which for an unreleased game like this I feel would need to be the centerpoint of discussion. The pseudonym Zeality is given without pause, but then I'm confused as to who exactly he/she is.
 * Once again, what is a ROM hack? I should have some idea without linking out.
 * Images: Given that none of the images are the subject of critical commentary, I'm not sure any of the non-free images are defensible per WP:NFCC, especially as they might be infringing on the original IP's rights and wishes regarding the desist order (i'm not sure OTRS really solves this, if the characters are non-free; I think the works, then, are derivative.
 * So once I get to the reaction section... I'm left wondering how notable this mod really is. There's only a handful of sources that directly and solely discuss the game, and those only stem from its cancellation. There just doesn't seem to be enough meaningful journalism about the product to cover all aspects of a game article.

Oppose - The prose is way below the required FA standard. I am reluctant to list examples here because from my experience nominators of these poorly prepared FA candidates tend to address the examples alone. The article needs a radical overhaul from top to bottom. Graham Colm (talk) 23:46, 26 October 2011 (UTC)
 * I requested an editor to copyedit the article. GamerPro64  00:00, 27 October 2011 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.