Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Common Firecrest/archive1


 * The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by SandyGeorgia 21:35, 26 November 2010.

Common Firecrest

 * Nominator(s):  Jimfbleak -  talk to me?  13:36, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

"Lovely bird, with thy golden crown./A kind and tender nurse art thou,/Making thy nest of moss and down,/And hanging it on the bending bough." At its GAN, this was given a thorough FAC-type review by User:Sasata. I think it's ready to roll.  Jimfbleak -  talk to me?  13:36, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

Sources comment: All sources and citations look OK. Brianboulton (talk) 21:48, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks, Brian  Jimfbleak -  talk to me?  08:42, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

Images comment: All images look good license-wise, and File:Regulus ignicapilla -Galicia, Spain -singing in a conifer tree-8 (1).jpg is adorable. J Milburn (talk) 23:47, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks for image review  Jimfbleak -  talk to me?  08:42, 8 November 2010 (UTC)


 * I think that not many people will be able to read "File:Temminck regulus.png", because it is not in English. The field for the language in its cited reference in the caption has not been used. I think that the translation in English could be added to the image description on commons, or this image could be removed from the page without much loss to the page. Snowman (talk) 14:53, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
 * It's an illustration, not intended as text. nevertheless, I'll put a translation on the image page, may not be today  Jimfbleak -  talk to me?  17:54, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
 * What is the point of an illustration that at least 99% of viewers can not read. Snowman (talk) 19:23, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
 * No big deal, image removed  Jimfbleak -  talk to me?  06:54, 9 November 2010 (UTC)


 * The image map looks a bit sketchy. There are some odd appearances at the borders of colour zones. Snowman (talk) 14:57, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
 * I've redrawn twice now at your suggestion, if you are still not happy, you are welcome to fix it yourself. The map is to give an impression of the range, not to win art awards.  Jimfbleak -  talk to me?  17:54, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
 * I have made some Improvements to the map. Snowman (talk) 19:21, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
 * thanks for that  Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  06:54, 9 November 2010 (UTC)


 * The binomial is listed as Regulus ignicapilla at IOC, so why does the page use a different spelling. Snowman (talk) 15:15, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Two instances now fixed <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  17:54, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Is the alternative spelling a synonym? if so it probably should be detailed in the infox. Snowman (talk) 12:15, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
 * I would say not, same genus name, just an (incorrect) variant of the species name. <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  06:39, 10 November 2010 (UTC)


 * "These mites live on fungi growing on the feathers." : This probably needs a bit more explanation. Is this beneficial to the birds or not? What do the fungi feed on? Snowman (talk) 18:38, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
 * I'll add a sentence about the fungi. Some level of mite presence seems to be very common, and presumably not normally harmful. Problems seem to arise mainly with domesticated birds. Unsurprisingly, there is nothing on which fungi are found on Firecrests, or their specific diet. <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  06:39, 10 November 2010 (UTC)


 * "interspecific territoriality" is incomprehensibly jargon to me. Snowman (talk) 18:38, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
 * now territorial conflicts between the species <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  18:59, 22 November 2010 (UTC)


 * "All species will catch flying insects while hovering": are the insects or birds flying or hovering? Snowman (talk) 18:41, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Not sure there is a problem here, it's clearly the insects that are flying and the birds hovering, nevertheless changed to All species will hover to catch flying insects. <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  18:59, 22 November 2010 (UTC)


 * I used an Google translate and found that kinglet is "βασιλίσκος" in Greek and not "βασιλικοεκς" which is what is currently on the page. I do not know what is correct, but I think it needs double checking. Snowman (talk) 19:14, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Typo, fixed now <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  18:59, 22 November 2010 (UTC)


 * Dab/EL check - no dabs, but is broken. -- Pres  N  23:13, 12 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Might want to check if one of the numbers in the URL is cut off. &mdash;Deckiller (t-c-l) 02:34, 13 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks for check. If only it was as simple as a typo. Birdlife have completely revamped their site so all the hundreds,if not thousands of links to this key site will now be dead. At least this one is fixed now. <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  07:45, 13 November 2010 (UTC)

Support. Ok, taking a read through, as I have been woken by drunk housemates. Hope this makes sense...
 * "Juvenile Common Firecrest might be confused with Goldcrest" Plurals or definite/indefinite articles?
 * added def articles


 * "Yellow-browed also" You've referred to it as "the Warbler", it's not being referred to as "Yellow-browed"?
 * added "warbler"


 * "The songs of the Mediterranean subspecies" Name?
 * added R. i. balearicus


 * "the Balearic Islands" Link?
 * linked in lead earlier


 * "the crests" This refers to Goldcrests and Firecrests collectively? Is there perhaps a generic name or something instead?
 * It's a common usage for the European birds, and just gives a bit of variation from "kinglet". The genus Regulus includes species in addition to the two European ones, and might be misleading


 * "in Europe from Southern England, France, Spain and Portugal east to Belarus, northwestern Ukraine and Turkey, and north to the [Baltic and southern Latvia." Spare bracket. Also, why a link to Baltic and not others? Belarus and Latvia are surely more obscure?
 * I think it's FAC practice now not to link countries, and I'm reluctant to decide on the relative notability of sovereign states


 * "ignore each other's songs" Caught my eye. Is that apostrophe correct?
 * I think so, there surely must be an apostrophe, and I've referred to the species in the singular. I'm prepared to be corrected though


 * "robbers like Grey Squirrels Eurasian Jays and Great Spotted Woodpeckers." Comma?
 * done


 * "as well as various arthropods typically avoided by adults, such as harvestmen, earwigs, and centipedes." Why?
 * No idea, and sources don't say. They are quite large and crunchy, so perhaps the adults prefer to shove them into the all-accepting gapes of the ravenous young rather than tackle these tricky items themselves


 * "warblers" Not caps?
 * The only occurrences I could see were references to genera (Sylvia, Phylloscopus) rather than individual species


 * "Throughout the Firecrest's range, the main predator of small woodland birds is the Eurasian Sparrowhawk taking avian prey as up to 98% of its diet." Another comma may be useful.
 * Yes, done


 * "including Proctophyllodes glandarinus on Firecrest" Link?
 * Done, although I'm not holding my breath waiting for the article to be written


 * "on fungi growing on the feathers" What sort of fungi?
 * One reason that I'm vague about the diet of the mites is that I can find nothing to suggest that anyone has researched the feather fungi on these species. Most work refers to pathological fungi in domesticated species


 * "feathers, emerged" Lose the comma?
 * Done


 * Perhaps "cultural references" would be better than "in culture"?
 * Well, I've used the latter consistently in my other FAs, so I'm inclined to stick with it


 * What's the poem you quote in the nomination? Does that not have a place in the culture section?
 * Minstrelsy of the Woods by Robert Mudie. It's by a scientist, not a poet, and very obscure - try Googling it! Too nn

Very nice. Now, bed. J Milburn (talk) 03:21, 14 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Sorry about your disturbed night, at least you've put it to good use, thanks for review and support, I hope I've adequately addressed your concerns <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  07:11, 14 November 2010 (UTC)


 * Support (moral or otherwise as WP brids member) reduced to minor nitpicks - looks good to go. Casliber (talk · contribs) 08:05, 18 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks for fix and support, sorry Sasata and J Milburn have left so little meat for you! <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  14:35, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

Impression: I have edited the article and I edit birds pages, which could be seen a as conflict of interest; however, I think that I have been objective. Very good article. It is possible that further copy-editing issues might be found; however, I would support FA after the three new problems I have listed above and any other issues yet to be listed have been repaired or explained. Snowman (talk) 16:52, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
 * all fixed above <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  07:23, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

Comments: (More to come.) Ucucha 22:38, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Regulus bulgaricus is not actually from the Pliocene when you place the Plio-Pleistocene boundary at 2.6 Ma, as you do in this article; it is from MN 17, which is 2.6–1.95 Ma. The confusion arises because the Gelasian (2.6–1.8 Ma) was previously considered Pliocene, but is now included in the Pleistocene. Also, why does the species not merit a red link?
 * I'm no geologist, so could you please check the revised version makes sense. The suggestion of a link to bulgaricus was good, since, to my surprise, there was already an article <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  07:20, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Much better; it could use some minor tweaking (you have "BP" once and "mya" another time, better to use the same measure; and you round 2.588 mya to 2.6 once but not the other time). Ucucha 14:02, 23 November 2010 (UTC)
 * First dates now (2.6 million to 12,000 years ago), so rounding consistent, and no BP now. I should have spotted the inconsistent rounding, it's something I castigate others for! Thanks <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  14:46, 23 November 2010 (UTC)


 * Do we know the identity of the fungi growing on its feathers?
 * No, Snowman asked me that above, I suspect that the research hasn't been done. <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  18:54, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

Ucucha 16:36, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Is the range expansion in Europe because of climate change?
 * So it appears, added a sentence and ref to "Status" <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  18:54, 24 November 2010 (UTC)


 * The map shows an isolated population in or near Abkhazia, which isn't mentioned in the text. Ucucha 16:41, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
 * the dubious race R. i. caucasicus was mentioned in taxonomy, but even I can see that's not very explicit, so added Caucasus to list in Range section <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  18:54, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Could you be more specific than "Caucasus"? The map suggests its distribution only includes a tiny proportion of the whole mountain range. Further, I think Crimea should also be mentioned there. Ucucha 19:12, 24 November 2010 (UTC)
 * There are isolated populations east of the main range in Abkhazia, the Crimea and Turkey. &mdash; It should be borne in mind that distribution maps are fairly crude, especially away from western Europe - BWP states, for example, that the distribution in Romania is probably more widespread than shown, and has question marks east of Poland. Nevertheless, both books show the Crimean and eastern Black Sea outliers, so amended as indicated <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  10:27, 25 November 2010 (UTC)

Support just a couple of nitpicks you need to take care of.
 * Lead - either "with fledging 22-24 days" or "which fledge 22-24 days"… the current phrasing is wrong.
 * changed to fledge <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  07:08, 24 November 2010 (UTC)


 * A lot of your sentences in the lead start with "It… " could a little bit of variation be possible?
 * lost or replaced several now <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  07:08, 24 November 2010 (UTC)


 * Description: "The Common Firecrest is a small plump bird, 9 cm (3.5 in) in length with a wingspan of 13–16 cm (5.1–6.3 in),[2] and weighing 4–7 g (0.15–0.25 oz)." Shouldn't that be "weighs"?
 * , yes, done <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  07:08, 24 November 2010 (UTC)


 * I think you may need to explain what a nominate form is, you refer to it often but never link or explain it.
 * Actually linked under "Voice", but now also in caption to taxobox image <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  07:08, 24 November 2010 (UTC)


 * I ran the article through CorenSearchbot and Earwig's without issues.Ealdgyth - Talk 22:52, 23 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Good, I wondered when the plagiarism scare started whether I had subconsciously based my own deathless prose on something I had read, relieved to see it's all my own fault! <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  07:08, 24 November 2010 (UTC)


 * Thanks for review, copyright/plagiarism check and support <b style="font-family:chiller; color:red;"> Jimfbleak - </b> talk to me?  07:08, 24 November 2010 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.