Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Crash of the Titans/archive1


 * The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was not promoted by User:SandyGeorgia 03:13, 22 July 2008.

Crash of the Titans

 * Nominator(s): Cat&#39;s Tuxedo (talk)

I've significantally contributed to this article as of late, upgrading it based on a peer review and a copy-editor's commentary, so I decided that I'm going to take a risk and nominate the page as a featured article. I say it covers the major areas (gameplay, story, development, reception) quite well, and has nice prose and NPOV. Cat&#39;s Tuxedo (talk) 02:01, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Comments

Gary King ( talk ) 02:08, 8 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Put the publisher after the title in "JumpButton (April 24, 2007). "Crash Mania official interview with Radical Entertainment". Retrieved on July 13, 2007." since that's the format the article is following.
 * Link the unlinked dates in the references if they are going to be linked throughout the article.
 * The first paragraph has a lot of links in close proximity of each other; consider removing links such as North America, Europe, Australia, and Japan per WP:OVERLINK.

Comments
 * Much as I love GameFAQs myself, what makes it a reliable site?
 * What makes http://hpzr.freeweb7.com/index.htm a reliable site?
 * Likewise http://www.worthplaying.com/?
 * And same for http://www.codenamerevolution.com/?
 * What makes the author of this piece http://kotaku.com/gaming/beer-and-tractor-pulls/crash-of-the-titans-the-hummer-288623.php reliable?
 * What makes http://www.kidzworld.com/ a reliable source?
 * And http://www.cad-media.com/index.php?
 * Current ref 8 (Crash Mania official interview with Radical Entertainment) is lacking a publisher
 * Current ref 22 (IGN preview of Crash of the Titans) Has the publisher only given in the title of the link, it should be listed separate.
 * Current ref 27 (Crash of hte Titans Monster Edition rated PG by the BBFC) is lacking a publisher
 * Current ref 54 (Androvich, Mark "Dead Head Fred wins..) is lacking a last access date.
 * Same for current ref 55 (Grant, Christopher Dread Head Fred wins WGA..)
 * Otherwise sources look okay, links checked out with the link checker tool. Ealdgyth - Talk 12:34, 8 July 2008 (UTC)


 * I switched out the GameFAQs site with a more reliable source.
 * The interviews on HPZR were held with the developers of Radical and Amaze Entertainment. The developers of the game themselves are a quite reliable source of information.
 * The statement made on the WorthPlaying site was made by the producer of the game.
 * The statement made on the CodenameRevolution site was made by a developer at Radical.
 * The author of the Kotaku page appears to have been to the festival to cover the subject of the Crash hummer. It looks like he even took the photo to prove it.
 * Like the HPZR pages, the Kidzworld interviews were concocted with the actual developer of the game, so they're bound to be a reliable source of information.
 * I've fixed the other problems addressed. Cat&#39;s Tuxedo (talk) 13:35, 8 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Here's my problem with the "interviews are always reliable" argument: Interviews are only as good as the transcription/interviewee makes them. Yes, generally they are reliable for non-contentious information, but they are still 1) primary sources and 2) only as reliable as the person who publishes the information. With something like CNN or Time Magazine, we presume that the company that is in the business of doing news/journalism will get the information correct. Little sites that aren't known as well, it's not as clear that there might not be some bias that creeps into the interview, or other problems. Ealdgyth - Talk 13:41, 8 July 2008 (UTC)


 * That may be so, but I hardly see how it changes the fact that the answers come from the very people who made the game. I am aware that there may be some bias in those answers, but we have to take into account that game developers are human, so even they can be biased sometimes. Cat&#39;s Tuxedo (talk) 18:24, 8 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Some of the references are really long (the ones with quotes from in game). Can they be trimmed at all? —Giggy 10:38, 10 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I'll see what I can do about it. Cat&#39;s Tuxedo (talk) 12:45, 10 July 2008 (UTC)


 * The lead really should be three paragraphs; see WikiProject Video games/Newsletter/20080409 for useful information. —Giggy 06:07, 11 July 2008 (UTC)
 * "From there, the main goal of each "episode" is to complete fights against large groups of enemies or simply progress through the episode." - needs to clarify what an "episode" is; the article (Episode) doesn't seem to relate to the word's meaning in this game. —Giggy 06:15, 11 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I'll take responsibility from that one. I removed the explanation to improve flow in hope that the meaning could be assumed when copyediting. Obviously not. Sorry. Ashnard  Talk  Contribs  08:46, 11 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Don't sweat. :-) My issue really is that without jumping to the Setting section (which I read after making that comment), the first paragraph of the gameplay section, and indeed a fair bit of stuff after that, doesn't make that much sense. You can guess (I guessed that it was a level of some sort), but we don't want to make the reader guess - it's an FA and we can do better than that. Anyways, any ideas on how to fix this? —Giggy 09:27, 12 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm thinking that it could be wikilinked to Level (video game) to spare a prose-disjointing explanation. As I understad it, that's all it is, a level. Ashnard  Talk  Contribs  10:33, 12 July 2008 (UTC)
 * That works. —Giggy 09:28, 14 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Article switches between "Titans" and "Crash of the Titans" when referring to the game; be consistent. —Giggy 06:17, 11 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I fixed that problem. Cat&#39;s Tuxedo (talk) 23:42, 13 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Reviewing only image licensing: looks good, I think. --NE2 12:38, 14 July 2008 (UTC)

Karanacs (talk) 15:54, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Comments. I did a copyedit, and since I am not a gamer please make sure that I did not inadvertently change meaning.  Questions:
 * I'm not sure what this means "scoring a minimum combat hit combo"
 * What does this mean "Crash has a light and heavy attack "?
 * I don't understand the paragraph about the Nintendo DS version. Do the other versions not have islands with two levels? (Shouldn't the information about levels go in the Setting area, where this is better explained?)
 * What does this really mean -> "Radical observed that Crash Bandicoot's presence had diminished in the minds of modern gamers, and decided to refresh the franchise by producing Crash of the Titans"? and why isn't "diminished in the minds of modern gamers," in quotes since it was taken directly from the source?
 * Ok, now that is in quotes, but what on earth does it mean? Karanacs (talk) 15:12, 16 July 2008 (UTC)
 * " Originally, the Xbox 360 version would get a few extra months of development time to improve its graphics before setting a final release date" - does this mean that the extra development time was taken away?
 * The lead contains information that is not in the body of the article, notably the release dates and fact that it was not released in Japan (why not?).
 * Could a sentence or two be added to the lead to describe some of the information in Development and Audio?
 * In the lead, I am not really happy with the way the reviews are presented. Perhaps include one or two of the quotes to let the reader know what people really thought of the game.
 * According to WikiProject Video games/Newsletter/20080409, the first paragraph should state the name of the game (using both bold (to identify the article's name) and italics as per the manual of style), along with any other alternate names the game may go by. The genre of the game should be clearly identified as well as the developer and the publisher. If a notable person has been cited by the game as having worked on the game's development (such as Tim Schafer or David Jaffe), this should also be noted. Release dates should be given, along with the release of any ports, remakes, or sequels. The second paragraph should summarize the plot briefly in one or two sentences; a high level overview is only needed to set the stage for further discussion. One or two sentences should be included to discuss the gameplay, including any notable features of the game. The third paragraph should cover the reception of the game, citing its general critical reaction and any significantly notable successful or failing elements in the game. If the game has won awards, this aspect can be noted, but specific mention of any award is discouraged.


 * In short, I'm not sure if any Development or Audio info is necessary for the lead. And the release dates aren't usually included in the article's body. Cat&#39;s Tuxedo (talk) 16:53, 15 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Per WP:LEAD, however, The lead section should briefly summarize the most important points covered in an article in such a way that it can stand on its own as a concise version of the article. It is even more important here than for the rest of the article that the text be accessible. Consideration should be given to creating interest in reading the whole article.. The current lead does not include any information at all about 2 sections of the article. Karanacs (talk) 15:12, 16 July 2008 (UTC)
 * PS, WP:LEAD also says that info that is in the lead should be somewhere in the article body. I just noticed your comment about that.  I don't work on video game articles and don't review them very often, but I don't really see a good reason why a WP newsletter should override MOS guidelines.  Feel free to convince me otherwise :)  Karanacs (talk) 18:05, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I added some information about the development in the lead. Don't know what to say about the audio. Cat&#39;s Tuxedo (talk) 13:00, 19 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Comment: Crit. 3 (Images): Only a select images, all low-resolution, all have appropriate templates. One thing, however: for the screenshots under the 'replaceable' heading you have some stuff about 'if better quality could be found' and 'fair use image'; the purpose of that space is to defend using a fair use image. What should go in those spaces, then is "Non-replaceable; the studio has not released comparable images under a free license, so fair-use images must be used." or something of that sort. Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs ( talk  ) 12:49, 18 July 2008 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.