Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Fôrça Bruta/archive2


 * The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by Ian Rose via FACBot (talk) 31 January 2019.

Fôrça Bruta

 * Nominator(s): Dan56 (talk) 14:56, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

This article is about a 1970 album by the Brazilian singer-songwriter Jorge Ben, accompanied by the Trio Mocotó band. It was a musical and thematic departure from Ben's previous work, a successful work in the contemporaneous Tropicália artistic movement, and pioneering of what later became known as samba-rock. It received retrospective critical acclaim and attention from North American publications after a re-release in 2007. The previous nomination was closed a week ago due to prolonged inactivity and belated activity, but I have been allowed to renominate. Dan56 (talk) 14:56, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

Support from Brandt Luke Zorn

 * Support per my exhaustively thorough review in the first nomination. Most of it can be found here, but it was concluded on the article talk page here after the nomination closed. At a glance, my review (including Dan56's responses) is ~72k characters in length, while the article itself is ~28k—a good indicator that no stone was left unturned. I'm now convinced that the quality of research, sourcing, prose, etc. is excellent and that the article meets all FA criteria. This is an exceptional article that helps to expand English Wikipedia's coverage of music from outside the Anglosphere; if it passes FAC this time, it appears (judging from Category:FA-Class arts in Brazil articles) Fôrça Bruta would be the encyclopedia's first featured article about Brazilian music or arts, which is a very valuable contribution. —BLZ · talk 17:38, 6 December 2018 (UTC)

Support from TheAmazingPeanuts
I don't really have much to say about this article because I mostly do hip hop-related articles, but this article is well sourced and well edited, I think it deserves to be featured. TheAmazingPeanuts (talk) 07:45, 17 December 2018 (UTC)

Support from Magiciandude (Erick)
Support per last nomination. Erick (talk) 16:02, 19 December 2018 (UTC)

Image review
, you offered a media review in the previous nomination, where BLZ also responded to your concern about. The media have remained unchanged since then. Does this article pass a media check? Dan56 (talk) 07:11, 20 December 2018 (UTC)

As far as I know, there isn't a problem with me knocking out an image/file review so I'll go ahead and do that. Here's a run-through of every image and audio file on the page, whether free-licensed or copyrighted: If anyone has further concerns about file usage, there should be enough information here to assess any issues. —BLZ · talk 23:16, 22 December 2018 (UTC)
 * File:Forca Bruta.jpg — The album cover found in the infobox. Appropriate fair use rationale and licensing tag. At 300 × 300 px, the image has a lower resolution than the 0.1 megapixel res recommended for copyrighted images at WP:IMAGERES. Includes appropriate alt text.
 * File:Br-força bruta.ogg — 0:02 PD audio file of the pronunciation of "Fôrça Bruta" ([fˈoxsɐ bɾˈutɐ]), as spoken and recorded by Dan56. Very minor recommendation: The file description indicates this is a pronunciation of the album title as "spoken in São Paulo dialect of Brazilian Portuguese". I don't know if there would be any difference in the pronunciation of this phrase between Portuguese and Brazilian Portuguese, but Template:IPA-pt shows that there is a way to indicate a "Brazilian Portuguese" pronunciation. I'd recommend relabeling it to avoid any error in case there is a difference in pronunciation, but also because the artist is Brazilian. Other than that, there are no usage or copyright issues with this file.
 * File:Jorge Ben e o Trio Mocotó no Teatro da Lagoa, 1971.tif — A photo of Ben and the backing band Trio Mocotó, used in the "Recording and production" section. The image is free-licensed, as it entered the public domain in Brazil for the following reasons: the photo was "first published before 1 March 1989 without complying with U.S. copyright formalities, such as copyright notice" (the image is dated November 1971) and it is a "Photographic [work] not considered to be 'artistic creations' produced before 19 June 1998" (it is considered a "non-artistic," "documentary" photograph under the applicable standards of Brazilian law.) See Commons:Copyright rules by territory/Brazil#Threshold of originality for further info.Regarding some comments from the last review: in my view, using this image—rather than removing it or using another image—is appropriate. This is a reasonably contemporaneous image of the musicians, only one year after the album was released. The only other available PD image of Jorge Ben from the 1970s is File:Jorge Ben, 1972.tif, which is a year later and does not include the backing band. There is no indication that there is a superior PD image with the backing band closer in time to the recording. While there are some minor imperfections in the scan—a rectangle drawn around Ben's head, some slight damage near the top of the photo—none of these are significant enough that they detract from the image's educational value. This scan of the photo was taken from the Brazilian National Archives, so it's fair to presume this is the best-preserved scan available anywhere. In general, this is a PD image that adds a lot of informational value; its minor flaws and slight distance in time from the recording time period don't strike me as reasons to remove the image. Includes appropriate alt text.
 * File:Oba, Lá Vem Ela.ogg — Sample of the song "Oba, Lá Vem Ela" (4:13) in the "Musical style" section. At 0:25 in length, it is less than 10% of the original song length. Non-free use rationale and licensing both check out. Article includes commentary on the song; the song is also used to illustrate the overall sound of the album.
 * File:Almeida Júnior - O Negrinho.jpg — PD image of a 19th c. Brazilian painting, "The Black Boy", used in the "Themes" section. Appropriate licensing (the last image review noted that a US-PD tag was needed, and one has been added.) The article discusses the racial themes of Ben's lyrics and their relation to historical conditions of slavery in Brazil, so use of this image is appropriate as a PD representation of that subject matter. Includes appropriate alt text.
 * Thanks for this review. And yes, I have now modified the IPA template to indicate Brazilian Portuguese. Dan56 (talk) 05:16, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

Laser brain
The article is very well-written and I enjoyed reading about a genre I've not explored. I'll be back to offer a few more small comments but overall I think it's strong.
 * "after a four-year leave from the label due to creative differences" Is there any more detail available on this? It might be nice to expand a bit to give more context.
 * Yes; the creative differences stemmed from the label pressuring Ben to "crank out lesser versions of his debut classic, padded out with sometimes-questionable covers of tunes by other writers." But I felt this section should be more involved with establishing this album's timeframe than going back further, possibly distracting readers with more detail about Ben's career developments from four years prior. I will include this information in Jorge Ben and the article of the preceding album, though, in the spirit of summary style. The articles on Ben's other preceding albums should also have more information to establish the career narrative, rather than here; maybe will get to those in the future.
 * "String and horn sections were recorded for the final mix but went uncredited in the album's packaging" This is slightly confusing.. are the strings and horns actually on the album? Maybe it could be rephrased like "String and horn sections are present on the final mix but went uncredited in the album's packaging" -- Laser brain  (talk)  15:28, 3 January 2019 (UTC)
 * I prefer to include "recorded", to sustain the section's narrative of a recording process; I added "and included [in the final mix]", to make it clearer. Dan56 (talk) 17:50, 3 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Support at this time, as anything else I have would be a subjective nit-pick. Well done. -- Laser brain  (talk)  19:51, 3 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Thank you. For the support, and for inspiring me to expand Jorge Ben (album) today. Dan56 (talk) 21:00, 3 January 2019 (UTC)

Coord note
I've seen a few mentions above re. sourcing but I don't think we've had a formal review for formatting and reliability (correct me if I'm wrong). Cheers, Ian Rose (talk) 04:00, 5 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Only with certain print sources, not everything. I'll make a request. Dan56 (talk) 04:21, 5 January 2019 (UTC)
 * As this seems to be stalled waiting for a source review, I wonder if or  could do the honours? Sarastro (talk) 22:57, 24 January 2019 (UTC)

Source review (BLZ)
Starting one now. I've already looked through the sources fairly extensively in my review (often in minute detail, checking the source and also the precision of translation, etc.) so, with that familiarity I think I will be able to finish a source review fairly quickly. —BLZ · talk 02:44, 25 January 2019 (UTC)

Overall, sources look good. I made some minor formatting edits. Most of the online sources are straightforward and standard. I've discussed the offline sources with Dan56 previously and had made some corrections in my first review (when double-checking the articles published in Time and The Wire). I spent some extra time with two articles, both published on the platform Medium:
 * I removed one of the posts published on Medium because I didn't think there was enough to substantiate its reliability (Medium both allows self-publication and publishes articles with editorial oversight). I searched for the writer's background/credentials and came up a bit blank. That said, the source was unnecessary because the only information the source was used to verify was that "Fôrça Bruta" translates to "Brute Force", a claim which is virtually evident on its face (the phrases are cognates) and can be checked against any Portuguese-to-English dictionary or translation software in the world. Dan56, if there is any reason you feel this source should be considered valid, please let me know, but again I don't think a source is necessary for this purpose. (As I'm writing this, I just noticed Dan56 moved the source into the "Further reading" section, which is appropriate).
 * There is another Medium post, a 2017 Portuguese-language article by Gabriel Proiete de Souza, who appears to be a legit Brazilian journalist. As can be seen on his Contently profile, he has been published in a number of well-established Brazilian/Portuguese-language journalistic outlets. I don't see any reason to doubt his credentials or reliability as a source in the context of how his work is cited in our article. —BLZ · talk 05:13, 25 January 2019 (UTC)

Great. Good work. Now is this nomination finished and worthy of being passed? Dan56 (talk) 08:47, 25 January 2019 (UTC)

Ian Rose (talk) 12:19, 31 January 2019 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.