Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Fakhr al-Din II/archive1

Fakhr al-Din II

 * Nominator(s): Al Ameer (talk) 05:11, 7 December 2021 (UTC)

This article is about Fakhr al-Din II, one of a long line of Druze chiefs from the Ma'n dynasty who far exceeded his ancestors in ambition and achievement. He became the governor and tax farmer of Mount Lebanon, Galilee and their ports and eventually much of the western Levant in the early 17th century. In the complex politics of his time, he was both an efficient tax collector and enforcer for the Ottoman Empire and an unprecedentedly autonomous and enterprising rural chief. Eventually his power became too much for the Empire to bear and he was crushed. Fakhr al-Din reinvigorated the ports of Sidon, Beirut and Acre by opening them to European commerce after a centuries-long hiatus and inaugurated the lucrative Lebanese silk industry. His most lasting legacy was the symbiotic union of the Druze and Maronites under his watch, which led to the precursor entities of the modern Lebanese state. Al Ameer (talk) 05:11, 7 December 2021 (UTC)

Image review

 * Suggest presenting the family tree as a template rather than an image, to improve its accessibility and allow for inline citation
 * Could you point me to a recommended template? While I agree, my feeling is that there's too many people in this tree to fit into a template. Alternatively, I could add a template, in addition to this more comprehensive chart, showing only the ancestors of Fakhr al-Din. Al Ameer (talk) 19:49, 7 December 2021 (UTC)
 * There are some options available at H:FT. Nikkimaria (talk) 03:31, 8 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Forgot to update here, but an interactive family tree was added, courtesy of . More than half of the citations and notes have been added, some more to go. Will update here as soon as these are completed. Al Ameer (talk) 19:26, 5 January 2022 (UTC)


 * File:Ferdinando_i_de'_medici_12.JPG: source link is dead, missing a US tag
 * Could not find archived link. Replaced with better sourced image of same person, though in his older age: File:S Pulzone Fernando I de Medicis Uffizi 1590.jpg. Al Ameer (talk) 19:49, 7 December 2021 (UTC)
 * This one is also missing a US tag. Nikkimaria (talk) 03:31, 8 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Added. Al Ameer (talk) 04:46, 8 December 2021 (UTC)


 * File:Emir_Fakhr_al-Din_and_Mustafa_Pasha,_Olfert_Dapper.png needs a US tag. Ditto File:Fakhr_al-Din_al-Maʿani,_Eugene_Roger.png, File:Emirs_Fakher_ad_din_II_%26_Bashir_II,_stamp.jpg
 * US tags added for for all three. Al Ameer (talk) 19:49, 7 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Just to clarify, you're referring to the PD-Art tag? This tag reflects that reproduction of 2D works does not garner a new copyright under US law, but it only applies if the original work is PD. There are some examples at commons:Commons:When to use the PD-Art tag that may be helpful in showing that. Nikkimaria (talk) 03:31, 8 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Thanks Nikki. I added the PD-US tags, but did so incorrectly. Fixed now. Al Ameer (talk) 04:46, 8 December 2021 (UTC)


 * File:Boats_at_the_citadel_of_Sidon._Coloured_lithograph_by_Louis_Wellcome_V0049486.jpg: what is the copyright status of the original work?
 * File:Emir_Fakhr_al-Dīn_Statue_in_Baʻaqlīn.jpg: as Lebanon does not have freedom of panorama, this will need a tag for the original work. Nikkimaria (talk) 13:38, 7 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Added tag. Al Ameer (talk) 19:26, 5 January 2022 (UTC)

Funk

 * Another important one, marking my spot. FunkMonk (talk) 01:05, 8 December 2021 (UTC)
 * "were commonly referred to in the sources as" What is meant by "the sources"? perhaps say "in contemporary sources"?
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 03:26, 10 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Link musket?
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 03:26, 10 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Link Ottoman?
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 03:26, 10 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Link Porte. I see it is linked at second instead of first mention.
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 03:26, 10 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "Ottoman efforts to tax and disarm the peasants of the Druze Mountain, who historically evaded taxes" Was there a religious angle to their persecution?
 * Added more background, mostly stolen from 1585 Ottoman expedition against the Druze. Al Ameer (talk) 03:26, 10 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Since he is denoted "II", I'd expect at least a footnote stating who "I" was, and their relation?
 * Kind of complicated, Fakhr al-Din I explains in more detail. Added explanatory footnote here. Al Ameer (talk) 03:26, 10 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "Fakhr al-Din was careful to present himself as a Sunni before the government." But didn't everyone know he was Druze?
 * Probably yes, but formally (officially) he presented himself as a Sunni. I have now added in the Origins section that Druze had to pretend being Sunni to obtain any official post so hopefully that adds more context to this. Al Ameer (talk) 03:26, 10 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "redoubt at the Krak des Chevaliers" Add "castle" for clarity?
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 03:26, 10 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Link Janissarie.
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 03:26, 10 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "he relocated to the Palazzo Medici Riccardi" The article about the palace states it was only sold to the Riccardi family in 1659, so should it just be called "Palazzo Medici" here?
 * Good point, revised. Al Ameer (talk) 03:26, 10 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Link Spanish Hapsburgs?
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 03:26, 10 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "Afterward, Fakhr al-Din was sent to Constantinople. There, he was imprisoned in Yedikule, while his two sons were sent to the Galatasaray." Needs citation.
 * Added. Al Ameer (talk) 18:33, 12 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "while his two sons were sent to the Galatasaray." Were these his only remaining sons?
 * Yes, mentioned now in the article. Al Ameer (talk) 18:33, 12 December 2021 (UTC)


 * State when the Sidon image is from?
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:33, 12 December 2021 (UTC)


 * The very end of the article seems pretty empty, any imagery that would be relevant there? Could show buildings he had built under "Building works" maybe?
 * Moved the picture of the Deir al-Qamar palace to Building works. Unfortunately, the palace in Beirut is no longer extant, and we have no images of the palace or the caravanserais of Sidon that he commissioned. We have images of Ma'nid constructions in Tyre but they were not necessarily built by Fakhr al-Din. May reintroduce them to article in a limited way (I relocated this section to Ma'n dynasty prior to the FAC). There is a good picture of the Khan al-Franj in Sidon, but this was not built by the Ma'ns, even though they are erroneously credited with it in popular narrative. Al Ameer (talk) 18:33, 12 December 2021 (UTC)


 * This Commons image seems amusing, if we could find the original. It seems to be here: And the book (Histoire des Druses, peuple du Liban) on archive.org also has an image of a wife, of his camp and other interesting things. I can upload the images if they're useful, seems some of them are already on Commons but will questionable sourcing. FunkMonk (talk) 16:46, 11 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Regarding that first picture showing the sheikh with the pipe, this is actually a real sketch of Muhammad Turabay, the Bedouin chief and Ottoman governor of Lajjun in north Palestine. See the article cited here by Chehab, Hafez, which is devoted to the artistic representations of Fakhr al-Din. As for the wife, while this is an 18th-century artistic representation (not a sketch of his actual wife), I have no issue including it in the article. Same for the military camp. They are both useful illustrations in my opinion. I do not think we should include the pipe-smoking sheikh since this has been proven to be someone else entirely. Would you please upload them (wife and camp) or correct the sourcing information of their existing images (assuming they are from the same source)? Al Ameer (talk) 18:33, 12 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Oh, that's odd with the pipe pictures. I've uploaded the wife (the version of it hereidentifies her by name, not sure if it's reliable, don't know much French so can't determine what the book's text says beyond the caption), but it appears the camp image unfortunately isn't folded out in the archive.org scan, I'll see if I can find it elsewhere. It also appears that this image on Commons that is said to be him is also from that book, but actually shows a Druze cavalryman: Not sure what the context is in the book or if it's useful here, but it seems the caption on Commons should be changed at least. FunkMonk (talk) 01:25, 13 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Seems the camp image is also plagiarised, from here, so probably not of use. Unless the emir mentioned is our subject, which should be doubtful? FunkMonk (talk) 01:25, 13 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Look at that, good find. I might want to upload it for the Turabay dynasty article since they were grand princes, so-to-speak, of the Bedouin in Mount Carmel, the Jezreel Valley and around Jenin until 1697. The image was "issued" in 1717, but King Louis XIV reigned from 1643 to 1715. Very likely that this sketch dates between 1643 and 1697. The Turabays did maintain low-level diplomatic relations with the French and did not have Bedouin successors. Al Ameer (talk) 21:26, 13 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Tell me if you need help with that, seems the version I linked is plastered with watermarks, should be possible to find a clean version. FunkMonk (talk) 01:31, 14 December 2021 (UTC)
 * I probably will. Also, I just noticed your comments on the wife picture, I will look into it further and probably add it to the Marriages and children section. Al Ameer (talk) 06:55, 14 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Usually, genealogical trees are placed at the end of the article, but not sure if there are really any conventions.
 * I will stick to the norm. Would it be redundant then to include the thumbnail image of the family tree in Early life with a caption link to the interactive chart? Al Ameer (talk) 18:33, 12 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Don't personally think it could hurt, but is there much room left there? FunkMonk (talk) 01:25, 13 December 2021 (UTC)
 * I guess not, will leave it out. Al Ameer (talk) 21:26, 13 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "and another large mulberry grove in nearby Hisah" Funny, a lot of my Lebanese family lives there, never saw it mentioned in an article (I created the village's article), hehe.
 * That’s great—always nice to come across my own folks' home-villages mentioned in a history article. I will add the mulberry grove fact to Hisah as well. Al Ameer (talk) 18:33, 12 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Cool! FunkMonk (talk) 01:25, 13 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Link Venetian at first instead of second mention.
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:33, 12 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Link mulberry tree?
 * Done. Any point to adding this picture of a silkworm on a mulberry branch (File:Silkworm mulberry tree zetarra marugatze arbolean3.JPG) to the Economic policies section? The relevance would be that Fakhr al-Din stimulated the silk industry in Mount Lebanon, including planting thousands of mulberry trees. Al Ameer (talk) 18:33, 12 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Seems a bit tangential, unless it was from the area? Here is an old picture of silk worms in Lebanon eating mulberry leaves, perhaps it would be more relevant. FunkMonk (talk) 01:25, 13 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Man I've been looking for a picture like this. Was planning on a 'silk industry in Mt Lebanon' article. I added the picture here, and will use it in the article I'm planning if I ever get back to it. Al Ameer (talk) 21:26, 13 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Nice! FunkMonk (talk) 01:31, 14 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Show one of the structures mentioned under Fortifications and troops?
 * Added picture of Subayba, one of his most strategic forts. Let me know if this is sufficient or if we should add one of his Sidon forts too.Al Ameer (talk) 18:33, 12 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Looks good! FunkMonk (talk) 01:25, 13 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "Fakhr al-Din also had a white concubine" White seems a bit of an odd term to use for the context, what does the source say? Any nationality? Or say European?
 * Odd choice indeed, but this was the author's description. I would have changed it to European (was not uncommon for powerful Ottomans to have Balkan concubines), but “white” could also mean Circassian from the Caucasus (which was not uncommon either). If Caucasus could be considered European, then will change it. Otherwise, might be better to just write 'concubine'. Al Ameer (talk) 18:33, 12 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Probably just keep as is, then. FunkMonk (talk) 01:25, 13 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Will do. Al Ameer (talk) 21:26, 13 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Link Janbulad family to Jumblatt under Assessment?
 * The Janbulads referred to here are the Kurdish clan of the Azaz/Kilis area. I will link Ali Janbulad until there is a separate article on the Kurdish Janbulads. The Jumblatts of the Chouf have been described by 19th-century local Lebanese historians as descendants of the Janbulads, and the family itself seems to claim it, but this is by no means certain and perhaps only a later legend. I have a few RS to work from and will expand on this subject in the Jumblatts article this week or next since you have brought it up. As of now, it would be a stretch to link them here. Perhaps after I add that material, it will make sense to plug in the Legacy section that the Jumblatts, perhaps the most powerful Druze faction of the Mountain and a major political player in local politics since the 17th–18th century, first settled there under the auspices of Fakhr al-Din's rule. Al Ameer (talk) 18:33, 12 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Ah, good to get that cleared up. FunkMonk (talk) 01:25, 13 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "who may have it as his" May have had it?
 * Fixed. Al Ameer (talk) 21:26, 13 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "erroneously calls calls him "Yusuf"" Double call.
 * Fixed. Al Ameer (talk) 21:26, 13 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Support - looks great to me now, again nice to see some significant non-Western figures at FAC, and this one hit close to home too. FunkMonk (talk) 01:28, 14 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Thanks, as always, for being thorough and helpful . I enjoyed learning about this important chapter in Lebanese and Levantine history. —Al Ameer (talk) 06:55, 14 December 2021 (UTC)

Comments Support by PM
Great work with this. It is always great to see some diversity among Milhist FAC candidates, and Ottoman bios are definitely under-represented. He seems an important figure, so kudos for getting the article to this standard. A few comments:
 * Lead
 * in the 1620s–1633→in the 1620s and until 1633.
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest the Sublime Porte (Ottoman imperial government)→Ottoman imperial government (Sublime Porte is an anachronistic figure of speech or metaphor that doesn't help the reader, as Porte has several meanings with regard to the Ottomans over time), needs consequent changes throughout
 * Revised, though in some places just "Ottomans" or "Ottoman government". Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "took over northern Mount Lebanon, which was predominantly Maronite"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "by timely forwarding of tax revenue"
 * Fixed. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "During a period when the empire was in a long economic crisis"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * link Sidon and Beirut when they are first mentioned singly, and unlink later mentions
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Origins and early life
 * nahiyas should be italicised as an isolated foreign word not in mainstream English dictionaries per: MOS:FOREIGNITALIC. It is best to use template:lang ie nahiyas This applies to a number of Arabic terms used in the article, you will need to check each one in Merriam-Webster (if it is not in it, use the template to italicise it)
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest avoiding the parens by rewording as follows: "Like other Ma'nids before him, Qurqumaz was a local rural chieftain in charge of a small area – known as a muqaddam. He was also a multazim of all or part of the Chouf – meaning that he was a holder of a limited-term tax farm known as a iltizam."
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * in a similar vein, suggest "were occasionally forced to pay the poll tax known as jizya which was reserved for Christians and Jews, and were the target of condemnatory treatises and religious edicts known as fatwas." (jizya and fatwa are in M-W)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "In countering their incorporation into the Ottoman administrative and fiscal system, the Druze benefited from rugged terrain and possession of muskets, making it difficult to impose Ottoman authority in the Druze Mountain."
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * delete (d. 1702)
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)

Down to Rise. More to come. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 22:52, 26 December 2021 (UTC)
 * suggest "When the veteran general Murad Pasha was appointed provincial governor of Damascus – known as beylerbey,..." (beylerbey is in M-W as beglerbeg)
 * Removed italics. Are you recommending 'beglerbeg'? I had the understanding that this spelling was outdated, but have nothing to back that notion. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)
 * No, just noting that it doesn't need the template as it is in M-W with a different spelling. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 03:51, 1 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "upon his arrival to at Sidon in September 1593"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "Murad Pasha reciprocated by appointing him the district governor – sanjak-bey , of Sidon-Beirut in December" (sanjak and bey are both in M-W) - why a reference to Turkish words, are they relevant to this period?
 * Revised. As opposed to the Arabic equivalents? I had not thought about it much, just assumed the Turkish terms were more appropriate and commonly used for Ottoman provincial and district offices. No strong preference though. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "The Ottomans' preoccupation with the wars against Safavid Iran – between 1578 and 1590 and again between 1603 and 1618 – and the war with Habsburg Austria..."
 * Revised.


 * suggest "the Shaqif and Tibnin nahiyas in Jabal Amil – in current-day South Lebanon,"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * why initial caps for "Emir"?
 * Removed 'Emir' throughout. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * recommend "to drive Yusuf Sayfa Pasha – the beylerbey of Tripoli and local chief of Akkar, from the nahiyas of Beirut and Keserwan" the current formulation is rather confusing
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "Although the Druze were often in conflict with the Ottomans, in principle the community was loyal to the ruling Sunni Muslim states, in contrast with the Shia Muslims, who formed a large component of the population of the Safed sanjak."
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "He cultivated close ties with Safed's Sunni religious scholarly class, known as the ulema." (ulema is in M-W)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "Among them was Khalidi, who was mufti of the city's Hanafis, the madhab – Islamic school of law – favored by the Ottoman state" (madhab is in M-W)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "foreseeing that he would benefit from Khalidi's close ties"
 * Added. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "careful to present himself as a Sunni before to the Ottoman imperial government" (if that is what is meant)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * link Levant at first mention
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "Although Khalidi held Fakhr al-Din's motive was to defend his territory" in what context did he do this? To the imperial authorities at the time, or in later writings etc?
 * I hope I have clarified this sentence now. Al Ameer (talk) 18:08, 30 December 2021 (UTC)


 * perhaps link redoubt to National redoubt, as redoubt is really about the actual fortification, not the concept
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * what was Al-Burini" historian?
 * Yes, clarified. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * link Piastre
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * delete (d. 1660)
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)

Down to First conflict with the Porte. More to come. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 01:01, 27 December 2021 (UTC)
 * "and promising him sanctuary in Tuscany in 1608 if he backed a future crusade" that he would get sanctuary in 1608, or he was promised it in 1608 for a future occasion?
 * suggest "After Janbulad's defeat, the Tuscans shifted focus to Fakhr al-Din, sending him an arms shipment originally bound for Janbulad. In 1608 they promising him sanctuary in Tuscany if he backed a future crusade." Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 03:58, 1 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "the Emir"→Fakhr al-Din, it is just potentially confusing, I wouldn't use it at all
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * link Anatolia
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Janissaries→janissaries there is a later examples, and of unnecessary initial caps with janissary as well
 * Done (throughout). Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * what is a kethuda?
 * An official, chief aide. Clarified. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "presented to his predecessor with by Fakhr al-Din's son Ali in 1607."
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * comma after "the chieftain of Baalbek"
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "with the Porte and revive their former power"?
 * Yes, revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * headquarter→headquarters, headquarters is a plural noun but singular or plural in construction, ie it can take a singular or plural verb in conjugation (eg the headquarters is, or the headquarters are), but itself is always headquarters
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Exile in Tuscany and Sicily
 * suggest Paul V→Pope Paul V for clarity, I wondered if this might be a new Tuscan ruler
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "Fakhr al-Din also began direct attempts to reconcile with the Ottoman government"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "in the former apartment of the late Pope Leo X" as it appears currently that there were two popes at the same time, whereas Leo X was long dead at this point
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "Spanish Habsburgs"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)

Down to Peak of power. More to come. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 05:43, 27 December 2021 (UTC)
 * suggest widening the piping of Sidon Eyalet to include all of "separate eyalet called Sidon"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "of the Ma'nid-held fortresses of Shaqif Arnun and Subayba"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "their support for Fakhr al-Din's former sekban commander Yaziji" as he has only been briefly mentioned before
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * recommend "The Emir thereafter sent his Maronite ally Abu Safi Khazen, the brother of his fiscal and political adviser and scribe – or mudabbir, Abu Nadir Khazen,..."
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)

Down to Battle of Anjar and aftermath. More to come. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 08:20, 27 December 2021 (UTC)
 * "as the sanjak-beys of Ajlun and Nablus respectively"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "Fakhr al-Din was notified that the imperial government had reappointed his sons"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "is a fabrication" this is a pretty controversial statement. Do scholars other than other than Abu-Husayn agree?
 * Will check other modern sources, but attributed to Abu-Husayn in the meantime. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * delete (d. 1684)
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * 1625–1630 appears to use an emdash?
 * Fixed. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * delete (d. 1716)
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "to smoke out the Fakhr al-Din"
 * Fixed. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "building hostel-warehouses – known as khans – for merchants there,..."
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "Medicis" is used as the plural of Medici, but I understand that it should just be "Medici"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "politically free Lebanon"→"free Lebanon politically"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * delete (1590–1635)
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "except its arched doorway entrance with its alternating yellow and white bands of limestone – known as ablaq"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "Fakhr al-Din had his government house – known as a saray – built in Sidon as early as 1598."
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * what is a qa'as?
 * Linked and defined (roofed or enclosed reception area). Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "who may have used it as his original residence"?
 * Revised.


 * suggest "in an endowment – known as a waqf, administered from Damascus"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "and a bathhouse – or hammam."
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * "mothered" is an unusual word, perhaps "gave birth to"?
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * delete the (b. 1587) etc
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)


 * suggest "where Fakhr al-Din renovated a palace for her."
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)

That's it. Mostly prose and MOS stuff really, a few substantive questions. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 03:25, 28 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Thank you for taking the time to review this article in detail. I accepted your prose recommendations and I believe your other points have been addressed, save for Khalidi's defense of Fakhr al-Din's rebellion in 1606–1607. Will work on that shortly. Also, I used the '—' without spacing, instead of the ' – '. Is this the same thing for practical purposes, or is the latter preferred? --Al Ameer (talk) 18:17, 28 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Great, given this is FAC I'll wait for an answer on the final point of two. As far as mdash vs ndash, they are effectively interchangeable as punctuation, but ndashes need spaces either side, mdashes don't. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 02:29, 29 December 2021 (UTC)
 * I believe that bit has now been cleared up, but let me know. Otherwise, the dashes have been dealt with, courtesy of . --Al Ameer (talk) 18:08, 30 December 2021 (UTC)
 * This is excellent, Al Ameer son. Minor point to address above, but supporting regardless. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 04:18, 1 January 2022 (UTC)
 * I made that last revision. Thanks for the support! Al Ameer (talk) 05:28, 2 January 2022 (UTC)

Drive by comment
 * Bibliography. Salibi, K. (1991) should be in date order. Gog the Mild (talk) 18:01, 30 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Thanks, fixed now. Al Ameer (talk) 18:08, 30 December 2021 (UTC)

Comments Support from Ham II
What a fascinating topic! Here are my comments:
 * Note b is missing a full stop before the reference.
 * Fixed. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" – I find this hard to parse; ""?
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" – I would replace "" and "" with "".
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" – Space instead of dash here.
 * Done. Response below regarding dashes, parens, commas. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised, using commas instead of parens, if that works. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Not sure that it does; my order of preference here would be parentheses > dashes > commas, so I think "" would be better than the current version. Also, it's strange that "" still links to Iltizam, but "" later in the sentence is unlinked – I'd link the latter instead. Ham II (talk) 09:44, 5 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 19:22, 5 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 19:22, 5 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * No source for the quotation from the Chevalier d'Arvieux. "" seems to be missing something; should this end "..."?
 * Missing citation added. This was a google translation. I did revise it anyway. Should I add the original description in French? Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * I don't know of any guidelines for this, but I think putting the original French quotation in a footnote would be wise in these circumstances. Ham II (talk) 09:44, 5 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Added in a note. Al Ameer (talk) 19:22, 5 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "[When Murad Pasha was appointed] " → "[When he was appointed] "
 * Done. Kept "Murad Pasha" instead of "He" since this is when he’s first introduced. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "[Murad Pasha reciprocated by appointing him] " → "[He appointed him] "
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Sorry; the text in square brackets (and in black rather than red or green) is simply to make the comment easier to read; I wasn't saying that "" should be changed to "". Ham II (talk) 09:44, 5 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Ah, understood. Al Ameer (talk) 19:22, 5 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" – No full stop in this note, and no reference.
 * Fixed. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * " [...]" → " [...]"
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised (without parens). Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * As this comes in the middle of a list I think commas impair the readability here, I'm afraid. Again, my order of preference would be parentheses > dashes > commas, so I don't mind there being dashes here – but there should be dashes on both sides of the clause "", not only at the beginning as previously. Ham II (talk) 09:44, 5 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 19:22, 5 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 19:22, 5 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" → "". Unlike Merriam-Webster, Lexico's American and British English dictionaries have the spelling madhhab, which is consistent with the title of our own article. Is there any reason to prefer "" over ""?
 * In response to the comments above by Peacemaker, I have been revising these Arabic terms per M-W, so that would be the only preference. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * That's fine by me. Ham II (talk) 09:44, 5 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" → " [...]", avoiding "holds" because of the "held" later in the sentence.
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" → "[...] "
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * It should be possible to find an earlier view than File:Jean-Baptiste-Camille Corot - Vue de Florence depuis le jardin de Boboli.jpg for a city like Florence. I'd suggest File:Giuseppe Zocchi - The Piazza della Signoria in Florence - WGA25992.jpg, which includes the Palazzo Vecchio where Fakhr al-Din stayed. I would also be inclined to change "" to simply "".
 * Excellent alternative, thanks. I replaced it. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * There are still four instances of "".
 * Fixed. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" – what was "the country"? The Grand Duchy of Tuscany?
 * Yes, clarified. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "[The Habsburgs] " → ""
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" – Either "" should be "", or it should be " [...] ".
 * Revised, went with “assisting”. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" is linked at its second appearance, not its first.
 * Fixed now? Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" – Replace the dash with a comma and space.
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" → "", and "" might be better still.
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" – Avoid "sketch" for an engraving. "" should presumably be "", and "" is better than "".
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" → "[...] "
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" – No comma needed here.
 * Removed. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * "" – Again, not a sketch; change this to "" or "" as in other captions. It might be best to use one of these consistently throughout – perhaps "pictured".
 * Done. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" → "[...] "
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" → "[...] " How is it named after him, though? I don't see any mention of him in our article Sidon Sea Castle.
 * Removed for now; will look into more a bit later. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Removed for now; will look into more a bit later. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Fixed.
 * Fixed.


 * "" – "The Vatican" is rather anachronistic here; try "" instead. What does the source for this say?
 * Revised. (The source uses Vatican). Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" – I would simplify this to ""
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" – Why "intrinsic"?
 * Removed. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" – Comma and space instead of dash here.
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * If this dash is staying, there should be a corresponding dash after the clause: "". Ham II (talk) 09:44, 5 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 19:22, 5 January 2022 (UTC)
 * If this dash is staying, there should be a corresponding dash after the clause: "". Ham II (talk) 09:44, 5 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 19:22, 5 January 2022 (UTC)


 * This is now the only punctuation left that sticks out like a sore thumb to me. I think it's to do with the gloss being at the end of a sentence (and a paragraph), rather than being a kind of aside in the middle of a sentence; it seems to draw too much attention to itself. You do say below that you prefer using parentheses for glossing foreign terms. Ham II (talk) 20:02, 6 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Fair point, revised. Please note my recent edit describing muqarnas (same section as this). Al Ameer (talk) 20:26, 6 January 2022 (UTC)
 * No issue at all with the explanation of muqarnas. Ham II (talk) 21:01, 6 January 2022 (UTC)
 * No issue at all with the explanation of muqarnas. Ham II (talk) 21:01, 6 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)


 * "" – Is this meant to imply that artistic licence has been taken by the European artist? I would change this to something like ""
 * Revised. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

Ham II (talk) 10:20, 31 December 2021 (UTC)
 * G'day . Just noting that Al Ameer son has already made quite a number of changes to eliminate parens as a result of my suggestions above. My understanding is that dashes are less formal but more intrusive, and serve to draw attention to the additional material, whereas parens are more formal but subtle. Over to Al Ameer son to decide on the best approach, but I would note it is largely a style preference (the MOS is silent on a preference, here is one guide on such things), and suggest that Al Ameer son makes a decision on a case-by-case basis. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 03:46, 1 January 2022 (UTC)
 * - Recently, a discussion at WT:FAC resulted in disallowing the use of the !xt and xt templates on FACs (the instructions above have been changed to indicate the new guidelines) due to the page having a limited number of template calls and those templates taking up an undue amount of our template transclusion space. If you must highlight text in color, please switch to using red and green (they change color but not font so take up less space against the transclusion ceiling) or simply indicate the text in quotes. Hog Farm Talk 15:07, 3 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks; I wasn't aware of the talk page discussion. Now done. I've also created the redirects and  as less obtrusive equivalents. Ham II (talk) 09:44, 5 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks for clarifying this PM and explaining the purposes of both. I personally prefer using parentheses for foreign terms or generally unfamiliar places. Except for potential consistency concerns, I do not see why both approaches cannot coexist so I am taking your case-by-case advice for now. Wherever Ham II recommended a simple comma as an alternative, however, I used that.
 * Thanks for the thorough review. Other than the bit about how best to explain the foreign terms used in the article, I believe I have addressed the rest of your concerns and suggestions. Al Ameer (talk) 01:56, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

It gives me great pleasure to support this candidate! Ham II (talk) 21:01, 6 January 2022 (UTC)

Source review
Spot-checks not done. It looks like all sources are consistently formatted. These all look like good sources but I note that many are decades old. Is William Harris (historian) a reliable source for Lebanese topics? Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 11:59, 12 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks for spotting that, it was a mix-up. Not the correct 'William Harris'. The 'William Harris' who is cited as a source here is a reliable source for Lebanese topics..
 * Most of the sources cited here which date from before the 1990s are by the top authorities for Lebanon's Ottoman history, i.e. Kamal Salibi and his student Abdul-Rahim Abu-Husayn. The others include entries in the Encyclodia of Islam's 2nd edition (including one by Salibi), an expert work by William J. Griswold (which is cited by almost any source discussing Ali Janbulad), and an expert work by V. J. Parry, a noted historian of the Ottoman period. --Al Ameer (talk) 15:34, 12 January 2022 (UTC)
 * I presume these early historians have not had their findings overturned by later research? Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 16:29, 12 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Salibi and Abu-Husayn have actually overturned a lot of what used to be the conventional history of the subject, and Ottoman-era Lebanon in general. In the case of Salibi, he has overturned some of his own conclusions and views from the 50s, 60s, and 70s, in part due to the findings of his student, Abu-Husayn. As for the information in the article, it is all the most current, so-to-speak. However, as Ottoman government records and other contemporary material continues to be researched, conclusions by the historians of this subject will continue to evolve. Al Ameer (talk) 20:17, 12 January 2022 (UTC)


 * Jo-Jo Eumerus Is this a pass for source review? (t &#183; c)  buidhe  20:42, 15 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Yes, providing that the current state of the article reflects that However, as Ottoman government records and other contemporary material continues to be researched, conclusions by the historians of this subject will continue to evolve since I don't know whether it does, not being familiar with the topic. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 21:44, 15 January 2022 (UTC)
 * To be clear, I am confident the information in this article represents the most up-to-date information about the subject. Al Ameer (talk) 06:25, 16 January 2022 (UTC)
 * OK then, that's a conditional pass from me. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 19:06, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

Gog the Mild (talk) 20:21, 18 January 2022 (UTC)