Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Ficus rubiginosa/archive1


 * The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by Ian Rose via FACBot (talk) 13:32, 14 May 2016.

Ficus rubiginosa

 * Nominator(s): Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:52, 16 March 2016 (UTC)

This article is about a big fig tree, which can also be a good bonsai. Anyway, I hope readers care more than a fig about it. Promise to fix problems pronto...have at it, cheers, Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:52, 16 March 2016 (UTC)

Image review
 * File:Ficusrubiginosargemap.png: can you swap in a non-proxied version of that source link? Nikkimaria (talk) 20:59, 19 March 2016 (UTC)
 * fixed now with nonproxied version substituted Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:16, 22 March 2016 (UTC)

Support: All of my concerns were addressed. Thank you. Praemonitus (talk) 17:00, 23 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Comment: Here's a few observations:


 * "...exclusively pollinated the fig wasp species...": perhaps missing a "by"?
 * added Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:13, 23 March 2016 (UTC)


 * "The species' range spans...": this has been rendered somewhat ambiguous by the use of "species" in the prior sentence.
 * removed Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:13, 23 March 2016 (UTC)


 * "The Port Jackson fig was described by French botanist René Louiche Desfontaines...": when?
 * year added Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:13, 23 March 2016 (UTC)


 * Who is Dale Dixon?
 * added who he is, he is a fig expert and was tempted to add, but would need to hunt a source saying that... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:13, 23 March 2016 (UTC)


 * "Italian botanist Guglielmo Gasparrini, breaking up the genus Ficus in 1844...": improper tense.
 * tweaked Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:13, 23 March 2016 (UTC)


 * It would be good to be consistent about listing the nationality and profession of the persons mentioned. For example, Frederick Manson Bailey and Friedrich Anton Wilhelm Miquel.
 * added Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:13, 23 March 2016 (UTC)


 * Should the paragraph that begins "In a study published in 2008" be placed at the end of the section to maintain chronological order? Perhaps I'm missing some subtlety?
 * my thoughts were to present a chronology for taxon as whole, and then last para for various subspecific names, but I can switch if you feel it would flow better the other way...? Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:13, 23 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Okay, I won't worry about it. Praemonitus (talk) 17:00, 23 March 2016 (UTC)


 * Technical term "hemiepiphytic" should be wikilinked.
 * linked in the preceding section Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:55, 23 March 2016 (UTC)


 * "...monoecious — both...": looks like a spaced em-dash. See MOS:EMDASH.
 * despaced Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:13, 23 March 2016 (UTC)


 * What are "US Zones 10B and 11"?
 * linked now Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:55, 23 March 2016 (UTC)


 * One of your references has a warning tag: "Cite uses deprecated parameter |coauthors=".
 * fixed Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:30, 23 March 2016 (UTC)


 * Gasparrini (1844) should list the publisher (Francisci).
 * publisher and location added Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:30, 23 March 2016 (UTC)


 * For consistency, "PLoS Biol" should be written out as "PLoS Biology".
 * 'ogy' added Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:30, 23 March 2016 (UTC)

Otherwise it looks good. Praemonitus (talk) 16:12, 22 March 2016 (UTC)
 * thx! Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 19:47, 23 March 2016 (UTC)

Comments by Sainsf
You see, I can not resist your articles. ;) Sainsf  &lt;^&gt; Feel at home 08:44, 27 March 2016 (UTC)
 * I think I have too many pages on my watchlist...missed this and will attack it pronto.... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 01:15, 31 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Haha, I am staying away a lot this week as well... Sainsf  &lt;^&gt; Feel at home 07:57, 31 March 2016 (UTC)

Lead

 * Why not link "genus" if you link "species"?
 * I did worry about excess bluelinks but linked now Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 01:43, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 * in warm climates containing around 750 species Surely the climates do not contain 750 species. Better say "in warm climates and containing around 750 species"
 * tweaked now


 *  from 4–19.3 cm (1 1⁄2–7 1⁄2 in) long and 1.25–13.2 cm (1⁄2–5 1⁄4 in) wide I think the dash should be replaced by "to"
 * tweaked now Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:17, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 * round yellow fruit ripen and "ripens"? No, I think it should rather be "fruits", due to the "they" following it.
 * see I think of 'fruit' as a group noun, but no drama I can pluralise it and done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:24, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 * Link pollinated, outcrop
 * linked now Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:24, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 * which may in fact comprise four cryptospecies.  Why are we interested in the taxonomy of the fig wasp here? It may go into the main text, but is it needed in the lead?
 * each fig species is symbiotic with one wasp species, so is significant that there are four - also I can't remove segment as incorrect to say there is one.... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:27, 31 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Oh, I see. No trouble then. Sainsf  &lt;^&gt; Feel at home 11:03, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 * and at least 2 species  "two" as per the MOS.
 * I kept as number to align with the '14' just before it.... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 01:43, 31 March 2016 (UTC)
 * No trouble then. Sainsf  &lt;^&gt; Feel at home 07:57, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 * through to Bega Through what? Or is "through" redundant?
 * redundant and removed Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 01:43, 31 March 2016 (UTC)

Taxonomy

 * from a type specimen I think "type" could be linked?
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:29, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 * from a type specimen whose locality is documented as "New Holland". Include a citation at the end of this part.
 * these sentences are all from ref #3. So have added a comment to clarify this (to avoid duplicate footnotes) Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:17, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 * "specific" can be linked to specific name (botany)
 * That link is a redirect to Botanical name. Have linked a bit further down Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:34, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 * Why are the alternate common names in italics? They are typically kept in double quotes.
 * See, if you look at how italics are used, about halfway down it talks about words as words, which covers the formatting well here. I'd use quote marks for sentences and italics for words Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 09:49, 1 April 2016 (UTC)
 * I see. No trouble then. Sainsf  &lt;^&gt; Feel at home 09:52, 1 April 2016 (UTC)


 * If genus is linked in lead, it should also be linked here.
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:16, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 * into which direction the group radiated Radiated should be linked to Evolutionary radiation.
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:16, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 * Joseph Maiden described variety lucida You have been saying "var." until now. The full word and the link to "variety" should be added at first mention.
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:16, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 *  from the nominate form I think we could have a link or explanation here.
 * linked to appropriate section Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:16, 31 March 2016 (UTC)

Description

 * We need some consistency in how we refer to the plant. "Taxonomy" begins with "The Port Jackson fig", and this with "Ficus rubiginosa". Also, you say F. rubiginosa at places.
 * Have changed to species name throughout. Rule is full name at first mention then abbreviation thereafter. Some people start new paras unabbreviated as well. In two minds about this Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 09:58, 1 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Choose your style. :) Sainsf  &lt;^&gt; Feel at home 10:06, 1 April 2016 (UTC)
 * I have - abbreviated except at (a) first mention and (b) beginning of a section...having it abbreviated there just looks a little odd to me Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:33, 4 April 2016 (UTC)


 * the ovate, obovate or oval-shaped Are all the three terms the same? If the 3rd one is explanatory, then we can say either ovate or obovate.
 * the first means egg-shaped but flat, the second means egg-shaped but flat with the narrow end of the egg at the stalk end of the leaf, while oval-shaped is elliptical. I will link as these are really wordy to explain Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 09:58, 1 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Link or explain petiole, vein, nipple, preponderance
 * linked first two, "nipple" in this context just means "nipple-shaped thing", a bit like how nipple can be used for end of baby bottle and other objects. Unfortunately nipple focusses only on mammalian nipple so is misealding as a link. "preponderance" is a cumbersome way of saying "more of them". I have simplified that. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:12, 1 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Fruit ripen throughout the year "Fruits"?
 * the collective noun "fruit" sounds more natural to me but I am not strongly fussed so changed. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:17, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 * its relative the Moreton Bay fig We need a comma here
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:17, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 *  in the wild they are  "wild, they"
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:17, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 * the leaves of the Port Jackson fig Inconsistency in referring to the plant
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:12, 1 April 2016 (UTC)

Distribution and habitat

 * It extends westwards "The range" extends westwards?
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:20, 1 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Both forms co-occur for most of the range Better mention them by name again. It has been quite a while since Taxonomy.
 * of f. glabrescens  Not written properly.
 * rejigged as thus, unless you want me to unabbreviate f. to forma...? Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 19:08, 2 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks, it looks better. No rejig needed. Sainsf  &lt;^&gt; Feel at home 09:44, 5 April 2016 (UTC)


 * in any given population Is "any" not a bit too sure?
 * tweaked Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:20, 1 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Link limestone and outcrop
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:17, 31 March 2016 (UTC)


 * in Kanangra-Boyd National Park "the"
 * hmm, I'd not use "the" here, in the same way I'd say "in Yellowstone National Park"... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:17, 31 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Funny how "the" is used at places and not used elsewhere... everyone has their choices. Sainsf  &lt;^&gt; Feel at home 08:45, 1 April 2016 (UTC)


 *  in cracks in stone in cliffs and rock faces in natural environments Such a row of "in"s! Are we missing commas?
 * I rejigged to break up the 'in's. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:21, 3 April 2016 (UTC)


 * and in brickwork on buildings and elsewhere in the urban environment Citation for this part?
 * there is a commented-out note at the end of FN 16 noting that it covers the previous 4 sentences Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:21, 3 April 2016 (UTC)


 * well drained  Dash?
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:20, 1 April 2016 (UTC)


 * They are derived from sandstone, quartzite and basalt Can have links here.
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:20, 1 April 2016 (UTC)


 *  yearly rainfall of 600–1400 mm Convert.
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:20, 1 April 2016 (UTC)


 *  F. rubiginosa has naturalised What is meant by "naturalised"?
 * linked to Introduced species Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:20, 1 April 2016 (UTC)

Ecology

 * I think the bird and fox species should be arranged in the alphabetic order of their common names.
 * they are arranged by order - pigeons, cuckoos, then passerines... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:19, 1 April 2016 (UTC)
 * I am afraid I still can't get the logic behind this... Sainsf  &lt;^&gt; Feel at home 13:37, 1 April 2016 (UTC)
 * They are the taxonomic groupings. I did do the bats though. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:03, 2 April 2016 (UTC)


 *  Many fruit drop onto  "fruits"
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:19, 1 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Link plant cell, pupate, defoliated (Intro)
 * done first two, "defoliate" leads to Defoliant, which is not a good fit Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:19, 1 April 2016 (UTC)


 * and the life cycle is around six weeks Could not fully understand this.
 * it just means the little critters live for around 6 weeks. changed Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:16, 2 April 2016 (UTC)


 *  galls at night and wander about -->  galls at night, wander about
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:22, 2 April 2016 (UTC)


 * As with all figs, the fruit is actually an inverted inflorescence known as a syconium, with tiny flowers arising from the inner surface Would be more useful under Description. Syconium by the way should be linked under Description, its first mention.
 * moved Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:22, 2 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Link diverge, monophyletic, crown, bushfire (Reproduction and life span) and nematodes (Other life in the syconia)
 * done...though Crown (botany) wasn't exactly what I wanted but ostiole exists.. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:22, 2 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Duplink: inflorescenced
 * removed Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:24, 3 April 2016 (UTC)


 *  that a F. rubiginosa trees often bore  Errors?
 * aligned Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:24, 3 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Pleistodontes imperialis traversed  Simply "P. imperialis" would do.
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:24, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

Cultivation

 * and also in Hawaii and California, where it is also listed as an invasive species in some areas. Add a citation for this
 * added - mainly hawaii but does mention california Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 03:05, 3 April 2016 (UTC)


 *  Tolerant of acid or alkaline soils Linking possible?
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:32, 3 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Link or explain canopy, aerial layering
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:34, 3 April 2016 (UTC)


 *  It is a chimera that is lacking in chlorophyll in the second layer of the leaf meristem Meristem is a duplink. "that is" may be redundant
 * trimmed and removed duplink Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:34, 3 April 2016 (UTC)


 *  generally have more green  "are", not "have"
 * tweaked - I meant larger green patches Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:32, 3 April 2016 (UTC)


 * it is extremely forgiving to work with  What does that mean? "Extremely" could be too strong
 * bonsai with figs is very very easy. they are almost unkillable and I call them living plasticene. So "extremely" is justified to anyone who knows this field.... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:32, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

That should be all. Sainsf &lt;^&gt; Feel at home 09:16, 27 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks Casliber. I see no more issues with this beautiful article. So, Support. Sainsf  &lt;^&gt; Feel at home 09:47, 5 April 2016 (UTC)
 * thx! Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 10:15, 5 April 2016 (UTC)

Comments by FunkMonk

 * I'll review this more in depth soon, some preliminary comments below. FunkMonk (talk) 10:40, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Not sure that the standards are, but I'd expect showing an entire tree in the infobox?
 * found one...been meaning to take a snap when walking about but haven't seen a good one... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 13:53, 30 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Could the foliage photo under Cultivation be right aligned? It looks a bit crammed on the left side with the other image, and also interferes with the ref list.
 * rejigged a bit Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 13:53, 30 April 2016 (UTC)


 * "n searching for the type specimen" When?
 * Dale Dixon published the paper in 2001, so I have used that date for the selecting of the type. I presume he was looking for the type just beforehand but I don't know. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:21, 30 April 2016 (UTC)


 * "All these taxa were found to be indistinguishable from (and hence reclassified as) F. rubiginosa." When and by who?
 * this could be a bit fiddly - need to sit down and read a bit... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:47, 1 May 2016 (UTC)


 * update - F. baileyana was synonymised by Dixon and the others were done also by him or by Chew in Flora of Australia. Annoyingly the national herbarium website is down tonight. Will try and check tomorrow. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:11, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Alright, I can support once this is somehow elaborated a bit. FunkMonk (talk) 17:13, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
 * website up now. those forms all synonymised by Dixon Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 11:46, 3 May 2016 (UTC)


 * "Lithophytic, hemiepiphytic" These terms are only explained in the intro, should also be explained in the article body.
 * explained Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 04:47, 1 May 2016 (UTC)


 * "the ovate, obovate" Explain.
 * Casliber clarified above that these and a few other terms would lead to really wordy explanations, looks like we should leave a few. They are linked, at least. Sainsf  &lt;^&gt; Feel at home 12:27, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
 * They were explained after my request in another FAC at least (one of the Banksia articles?), so I don't think it could hurt here. For us non-plant people, much of such text is gibberish without explanations. FunkMonk (talk) 12:39, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
 * It would be the best to add notes for us non-plant folks! Sainsf  &lt;^&gt; Feel at home 12:42, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
 * "ovate" is "egg-shaped" but "obovate" is "egg-shaped-with-pointy-end-of-egg-shape-as-leaf-base"...so tricky to word without being cumbersome...have gone with "reverse egg-shaped"
 * Much easier to understand now. FunkMonk (talk) 15:17, 30 April 2016 (UTC)


 * "long petioles." Explain.
 * explained now Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:14, 30 April 2016 (UTC)


 * "inflorescence known as a syconium" Explain.
 * have tried at expand a bit - a fig is essentially a hollow fruity ball with the flowers lining the inside Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:14, 30 April 2016 (UTC)


 * "(damun in the Sydney language)" You don't refer to it as "Sydney language" in the article body, so the Easter-egg link is a bit confusing.
 * tweaked now Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 15:24, 30 April 2016 (UTC)


 * If the species can only be pollinated by a certain species of wasp, how is it pollinated in the other parts of the world where it has naturalised (and where I assume this wasp doesn't exist)?
 * I have explained in para 4 of Reproduction and life span - the wasp has flown to New Zealand and been transported elsewhere Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:14, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Heheh, I realised this while reading, but forgot to remove my comment before I pressed save... FunkMonk (talk) 15:17, 30 April 2016 (UTC)


 * "a metallic green wasp species." Why do we need physical description of a species that is uncommon on this plant, when the main pollinator isn't physically described at all?
 * the green is an unusual colour, while the main species is a nondescript colour.... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:27, 30 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Could be nice to show the pollinating wasp, but I guess we don't have an available image. Or is this it:
 * Hmm, that is probably the right one. F. platypoda is pollinated by P. cuneatus, and I am not aware of platypoda being in Hawaii. P. imperialis is the wasp of F. rubiginosa - will look into this. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:27, 30 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Maybe obvious to plant-people, but how can this turn intro a big tree when growing on rocks? Where do the roots go?
 * Aha, well I'm glad you asked - fig roots are incredibly vigorous and highly invasive - see thus local council report - scroll down and see the fun photos of Ficus roots wreaking havoc with sidewalk, drains etc. Ditto here or scroll down google images here. Short answer is fig roots grow..anywhere they want to. I will re-read to see if/how I can make it clearer. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:57, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Cool! FunkMonk (talk) 15:17, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Yeah, there are places around Sydney where they have really mangled the footpath...but last time I walked past the parked cars obscured the shot. I am keeping an eye out.... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 15:23, 30 April 2016 (UTC)


 * "as it is extremely forgiving to work with" Not sure what this means, and also seems like too informal/hyperbolic language.
 * It means a fig pot plant is hard to kill - much much easier to grow than many other plants - they are like living plasticene. "Forgiving" is a succinct way of the plant easily tolerating inept management by gardener. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:57, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Right, I was referring more to "extreme", "very" or some such would seem less loaded. FunkMonk (talk) 15:17, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Ok, I toned it down Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 15:21, 30 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Banyan and Moraceae are not mentioned outside the intro.
 * I nuked them - the term "banyan", even though it technically covers this one as well as the indian species, is rarely used and the information it conveys is imparted by the description of hemiepiphyte so is unneeded. The fig genus is more of a defined and notabel unit than the Moraceae family, so reverted to the former as a reference point in the lead Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:11, 1 May 2016 (UTC)


 * "a genus found worldwide in warm climates that contains around 750 species, including the common fig (Ficus carica)." Likewise.
 * More germane to genus than species, so ditched it Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:11, 1 May 2016 (UTC)


 * "The syconia are also home to another 14 species of wasp, some of which induce galls while others parasitise the pollinator wasps, and at least 2 species of nematode." None of these numbers are mentioned outside the intro.
 * The 14 spp are mentioned in sentence 2 of the Other life in the syconia section and listed in a footnote. The nematodes are mentioned further on - 2 added there now Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 15:44, 30 April 2016 (UTC)


 * "Many species of bird, including pigeons, parrots" No parrots are mentioned in the article body.
 * added some parrots Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 15:20, 30 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Support - much easier for a non-expert to understand now. FunkMonk (talk) 11:57, 3 May 2016 (UTC)
 * thx! Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:03, 3 May 2016 (UTC)

Ceoil

 * It is a banyan classified as a Ficus, a genus found world wide - As somebody that doesn't remember taxonomy, this is baffling. Overall v good, though the lead is very dense like this and assumes familiarity. Would like to see wording that makes the page more accessible. Not exactly dumming down, but... explaining terms. Ceoil (talk) 21:37, 30 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Removed some bits...you want me expain cryptospecies? Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:12, 1 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Moving to support, noting the efforts since last post, mainly re the density of the lead. Note I am a non specialist, but supporting from an interested none the less POV. Have made various, but mostly trivial edits. Ceoil (talk) 23:44, 7 May 2016 (UTC)

Opinions / Observation from Singora
Opinions / Observation Singora (talk) 14:44, 4 May 2016 (UTC)

These are just notes, opinions and general comments.
 * 1. "Beginning life as a seedling". Don't all trees begin life as seedlings?
 * Well, yeah, but I tried to change the emphasis - the 'that' making it more of a run-on clause. The "beginning life" shows that it germinated and developed there Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:07, 4 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 2. "which grows on other plants (hemiepiphyte) or on rocks (lithophyte)". Would it be accurate to swap "grow" for "germinate" in order to avoid the repetition (the sentence uses "grow" twice)?
 * "Germinate" doesn't impart the meaning of the little plant growing there, however I do agree about the repetition and so have changed 2nd "grow" to "matures"... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:07, 4 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 3. "The small round yellow fruits can ripen and turn red at any time of year" -> "Fruits are small, round and yellow, and can ..."
 * done, though my initial idea was to avoid a run-on "and", still I can see the point of saying the "fruit is x" Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:28, 4 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 4. "four cryptospecies" + "14 species of wasp" -> 4 + 14 or four + fourteen
 * yep/done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:09, 4 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 5. "Australian botanist Dale Dixon found one from the herbarium of Desfontaines at Florence Herbarium and one from the herbarium of Étienne Pierre Ventenat at Geneva" -> "Australian botanist Dale Dixon found one at the Florence Herbarium and another at the herbarium of Étienne Pierre Ventenat in Geneva". My link points to the Museo di Storia Naturale di Firenze, which includes the herbarium. What is the herbarium of Desfontaines?
 * I found this. I guess the best thing would be to mention it on Desfontaines' page...hang on... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:28, 4 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 6. "In a 2008 study published". Is this correct? I would use "In a study published in 2008"
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:28, 4 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 7. "The trunk is buttressed and can reach 1.5 m (4 ft 11 in) in diameter, and the bark is yellow-brown" -> "The trunk is buttressed and can reach 1.5 m (4 ft 11 in) in diameter. The bark is yellow-brown"'
 * split sentence Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:28, 4 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 8. Monoecious re-directs to Plant reproductive morphology. Should you link the word?
 * yep/done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 07:55, 5 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 9. "California in the United States". Do you need to mention the US? Could you link California?
 * no and yes, duly tweaked Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:28, 4 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 10. "planted widely in Malta since the early 1990s but has not been observed to set fruit". What's the difference between "to fruit" and "to set fruit"?
 * errr not much really...trimmed Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 07:55, 5 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 11. "Many fruits drop onto the ground around the tree, though others are spread further afield by the animals that eat them" -> "Many fruits drop onto the ground around the tree, though others are dispersed by the animals that eat them"
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 07:55, 5 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 12. "F. rubiginosa itself can endure cooler climates than other fig species". This and the preceding sentence end with "fig species". Could you change the latter to "than its relatives" or "than other members of the genus", etc.
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 07:55, 5 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 13. "P. imperialis traversed the waters between Australia and New Zealand". Hmmmm. Traversed the waters?
 * changed to "crossed" Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 07:55, 5 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 14. "P. imperialis has been transported to Hawaii, California and Israel and is pollinating its host in those places" -> "P. imperialis has been transported to Hawaii, California and Israel, where it pollinates its host", or "where it has been observed pollinating its host" / "where it is known to pollinate it host" / "where widespread host-pollination has been recorded".
 * tweaked Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 08:02, 5 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 15. "Trees can live to 100 years or more in age". The "in age" is implied.
 * trimmed Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 08:02, 5 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 16. "At least 14 species have been recorded, of which four—two each belonging to the genera Sycoscapter and Philotrypesis—are common while others are rare" -> "At least fourteen species have been recorded: ten are rare, while the others — two each belonging to the genera Sycoscapter and Philotrypesis — are common". Again, you're not being consistent re: 14 + four / two.
 * worded Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 08:02, 5 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 17. I don't follow this: "The community of wasps inside the syconium is made up mostly of pollinator wasps with much smaller numbers of these other species"
 * only the P. imperialis are pollinator wasps - the other species are all freeloaders..... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 08:02, 5 May 2016 (UTC)


 * 18. RE: "The parasitic wasps are around the same size as the pollinators and belong mainly to the genera Sycoscapter and Philotrypesis". You've just told me that 14 (or fourteen) species of non-pollinator wasps inhabit the syconium. You've said the most common of these parasitic, non-pollinators belong to the genera Sycoscapter and Philotrypesis. Are you not repeating yourself, then, by saying these wasps "belong mainly to the genera Sycoscapter and Philotrypesis"?
 * not quite as not all the nonpollinators are parasitic. These two genera are parasitic on wasps, while some others just make galls. Still, I reworded it a bit. Cas Liber (talk · contribs)


 * 19. I think this whole section Other life in the syconia needs tweaking. Begin by saying the community consists primarily of pollinators; describe how they develop deep inside the syconium; introduce the 14 parasitic, non-pollinators; state that 4 of these non-pollinators are relatively common while the others are quite rare; discuss in-fighting between the 4 common parasite species; mention that all parasites develop close to the wall of the syconium (away from the pollinators); conclude with a discussion of how genera of the less common non-pollinators induce galls.
 * I rejigged it - how's that? Cas Liber (talk · contribs)


 * 20. "suited for use as a houseplant in low, medium or brightly lit indoor spaces". Is the word "indoor" redundant?
 * I am not sure if laypeople automatically assume a houseplant is an indoor plant...but have removed it anyway Cas Liber (talk · contribs)


 * 21. Checked ref #44. You say the tree may reach 30m -- the source says it grows to over 30m. The source also says the best specimens are found in "dry rainforet". Is this covered by your text: "F. rubiginosa is found in rainforest, rainforest margins, gullies, riverbank habitat, vine thickets, and rocky hillsides"?
 * ok, added "or More" and reffed that bit - 30 m is generally seen as max ht so presuming Morris source means "a bit more" - "best" is subjective and esoteric, referring to woodwork, which is not a usual use for this tree... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 08:47, 5 May 2016 (UTC)

More from Singora 18:50, 5 May 2016 (UTC)

Let's play around with the Other life in the syconia section and see what we get.

As with many other Ficus species, the community of wasps inside the figs of F. rubiginosa is made up mostly of pollinator wasps. These develop deep inside the syconium, presumably protected there from parasites. Also present are much smaller numbers of other wasp species, which do not pollinate the fig. At least fourteen species have been recorded, of which four—two each belonging to the genera Sycoscapter and Philotrypesis—are common while others are rare. Investigation of F. rubiginosa syconia found that the fig seeds and parasitic wasps develop closer to the wall of the syconium. The wasps of the genera Sycoscapter and Philotrypesis are parasitic and are around the same size as the pollinator species. Their larvae are thought to feed on the larvae of the pollinator wasp. Male Sycoscapter and Philotrypesis wasps fight other males of the same species when they encounter each other in a F. rubiginosa fig. Several genera of uncommon larger wasp species enter the immature figs before other wasps and induce galls, which may impact on numbers of pollinator wasps in the fig later. An example of this is Pseudidarnes minerva, a metallic green wasp species.

Version 1

As with many other Ficus species, wasp communities inhabiting (residing in / found inside) the figs of F. rubiginosa comprise (are comprised of) mostly pollinator species. These develop deep inside the syconium, presumably protected from parasites. Also present are much smaller numbers of non-pollinator wasp species, at least fourteen of which have been recorded. Four of these species (two each belonging to the genera Sycoscapter and Philotrypesis) are common and similar in size to the pollinators. Their larvae are thought to feed on the larvae of pollinator wasps; males are known to fight. Several genera of larger, less uncommon wasp species enter immature figs before other wasps and induce galls, often leading to fewer pollinators burrowing into the fruit. One species known for this behaviour is the metallic green Pseudidarnes minerva.

Sorry -- gonna have to leave for this for now. I can't think properly. I can SUPPORT this, but am convinced the above para can be improved. It's too late now to do any more.
 * yeah, working on really fiddly stuff when fatigued can have that effect. I spent a fair while re-reading the articles and staring at a screen last night before rewriting once. I'll think about it some more but need some uninterrupted time to concentrate... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:39, 5 May 2016 (UTC)

Auburn Botanical Gardens Singora (talk) 17:50, 7 May 2016 (UTC)

Just noticed that your bonsai photo @ Auburn Botanical Gardens ought to be linked
 * well-spotted/linked. 21:15, 7 May 2016 (UTC)

From the lead section, paragraph 1: "The leaves ... measure from ... 1.25 to 13.2 cm (1⁄2–5 1⁄4 in) wide." I wonder if the precision of "1.25 cm" is really justified. I suppose that this precision derives from the conversion of the imperial measurement 1/2 inch. Would it be reasonable to change the statement to "1.2 cm"? Axl ¤ [Talk] 11:13, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
 * I went with the source - could also read it as a quarter of a centimetre.

From the lead section, paragraph 2: "It ... is used as a shade tree in parks and public spaces, and is well-suited for use as an indoor plant or in bonsai." There is a disconnect between its 30 m height/use as a shade tree and its suitability as an indoor plant. Are perhaps juvenile plants used indoors? Axl ¤ [Talk] 11:20, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
 * It's a pretty tough plant - just keep it in a pot and change the soil every few years and it is restricted to the size of the pot. So no, not particularly young plants. Would some sort of contrastive help the flow? I added "also" to highlight the different uses. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:02, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
 * In that case, how about "when potted it is also well-suited...." Axl ¤ [Talk] 11:30, 12 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Yeah I like that - incorporated Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:23, 12 May 2016 (UTC)

From "Taxonomy", paragraph 1: "The specific epithet rubiginosa related to the rusty coloration of the undersides of the leaves. Indeed, rusty fig is an alternate common name." It would be good to include a photo that demonstrates this "rusty" colour of the underside, contrasted with the top. Axl ¤ [Talk] 11:25, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
 * One does. I have moved it up the article and adjusted the caption Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:02, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Axl ¤ [Talk] 11:32, 12 May 2016 (UTC)

From "Taxonomy", paragraph 3: "In a study published in 2008, Nina Rønsted and colleagues analysed the DNA sequences from the nuclear ribosomal internal and external transcribed spacers (ITS and ETS), and the glyceraldehyde-3-phosphate dehydrogenase (G3pdh) region." If these terms are not used later in the article, then there is no need to include abbreviations. <b style="color:#808000">Axl</b> ¤ <small style="color:#808000">[Talk] 11:30, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
 * removed Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:02, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks. <b style="color:#808000">Axl</b> ¤ <small style="color:#808000">[Talk] 11:33, 12 May 2016 (UTC)

From "Description", paragraph 1: "F. rubiginosa is monoecious—both male and female flowers are found on the same plant, and in fact in the same fruit." The linked article has two definitions for "monoecious". It seems that Ficus rubiginosa could more specifically be described as bisexual/androgynous/hemaphroditic/synoecious/monoclinous? <b style="color:#808000">Axl</b> ¤ <small style="color:#808000">[Talk] 11:41, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
 * the most accurate term from that page would be "consecutively monoecious" - the article just uses the word "monoecious" so I am sticking with the source.... Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:06, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Hmm, okay. <b style="color:#808000">Axl</b> ¤ <small style="color:#808000">[Talk] 11:35, 12 May 2016 (UTC)

From "Description", paragraph 2: "It is also confused with the small-leaved fig (F. obliqua), the syconia of which are smaller, measuring 4.3–11.9 mm long and 4.4–11.0 mm in diameter, compared with 7.4–17.3 mm long and 7.6–17.3 mm diameter for F. rubiginosa." Is precision to 0.1 mm really justified? <b style="color:#808000">Axl</b> ¤ <small style="color:#808000">[Talk] 11:45, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
 * yes, a bit too exact maybe...rounded off now Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:06, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks. <b style="color:#808000">Axl</b> ¤ <small style="color:#808000">[Talk] 11:37, 12 May 2016 (UTC)

In "Ecology", paragraph 1, why is Coxen's fig parrot specifically called out as endangered? <b style="color:#808000">Axl</b> ¤ <small style="color:#808000">[Talk] 13:12, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
 * being the food source of a species that is endangered I feel is in and of itself important to note and this is the most succinct way of highlighting that fact Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 14:02, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
 * "being the food source of a species." F. rubiginosa appears to be a food source rather than the food source. Wikipedia's article about the parrot states that food availability is a major factor for the species, but is unclear how important F. rubiginosa specifically is in the parrot's diet. While loss of F. rubiginosa trees in a habitat would no doubt negatively impact the parrot's population, I would prefer to see a more definitive statement in a separate sentence with a specific reference. <b style="color:#808000">Axl</b> ¤ <small style="color:#808000">[Talk] 11:54, 12 May 2016 (UTC)
 * done Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:26, 12 May 2016 (UTC)

From "Ecology", paragraph 1, should "spectacled flying-fox" really be hyphenated? <b style="color:#808000">Axl</b> ¤ <small style="color:#808000">[Talk] 11:58, 12 May 2016 (UTC)
 * oops, removed Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:26, 12 May 2016 (UTC)

Source review

 * The article has sufficient citations, and everything is formatted properly.
 * Minor nitpicks:
 * In fn 14, I think "Csiro Publishing" should be "CSIRO Publishing".
 * Fn 36: isn't the publisher actually "Delmar Publishers"? --Coemgenus (talk) 14:39, 12 May 2016 (UTC)
 * yes x 2/fixed Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 21:56, 12 May 2016 (UTC)


 * OK, looks good to go then, as far as sources are concerned. --Coemgenus (talk) 01:59, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

Ian Rose (talk) 13:32, 14 May 2016 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.