Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Liza Soberano/archive1

Liza Soberano

 * Nominator(s): Pseud 14 (talk) 16:41, 11 May 2024 (UTC)

After tackling two Filipino musician bios, back again with an actor BLP this time. Liza Soberano is an American born Filipino actress who began her career as a model in the Philippines before she ventured into acting. Since then, she has appeared in commercially successful projects primarily with frequent collaborator Enrique Gil, both of whom are depicted in the media as a "love team". Dismayed at being typecast to parts as an on-screen couple with Gil, Soberano returned to the United States in 2022 to pursue an acting career in Hollywood and has since made her breakthrough in the 2024 comedy horror Lisa Frankenstein. Constructive criticism, in any form and from anyone, will be appreciated. Happy to address your comments and thanks to all who take the time to review. Pseud 14 (talk) 16:41, 11 May 2024 (UTC)

750h
Will leave comments soon. 750h+ 02:15, 12 May 2024 (UTC)
 * lead
 * "For her performances of a gutsy young aristocrat in the drama series Dolce Amore (2016) and a tribal heroine in the" recommend linking "aristocrat" to Aristocracy (class).
 * Linked


 * "In an attempt to shed her image as an on-screen couple with Gil" I think for conciseness this could be changed to "Attempting to shed her..."
 * Done


 * career
 * "She portrayed a fruit farmer who supervises Gil's character after being forced to work in the plantation." I think this should be "on the plantation". I think though.
 * Changed


 * link "aristocrat" to Aristocracy (class).
 * Linked


 * "...experience, as she did neither understand nor suffered from a break-up." suffered should be changed to "suffer".
 * Done


 * "Mari-An Santos of the Philippine Entertaiment Portal particularly" Entertainment is spelt wrong.
 * Thanks for catching this. Fixed


 * "It featured flight sequences which required her to perform stunts while" "which" should be "that".
 * Done


 * "The series was controversial for whitewashing the cast; Soberano's character was meant to be of indigenous Filipino ethinicty." Ethnicity is spelt wrong too.
 * Fixed


 * advocacy
 * "Soberano is a gender equality advocate and supports women and children's rights." ==> "Soberano is a gender equality advocate and supports women's and children's rights."
 * Done

That's all I got Excellent work on this article and i hope to see more in the future! 750h+ 08:08, 12 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your review and for catching the typos 750h+. All comments have been actioned. Let me know if there's anything I may have missed. Pseud 14 (talk) 15:03, 12 May 2024 (UTC)
 * No problem Pseud! I'm happy to support  the nomination. 750h+ 22:58, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

MyCat
I promise to not delay reviewing this one- let's take a look!
 * - could be condensed: "Around this time, a talent scout found her on social media and introduced her to..."
 * Done as suggested


 * Also, what did the talent manager find? Singing videos? Acting videos? Or did they just say "she ought to be a model" (which is entirely possible)
 * Every source I checked only mentions a social media post and did not detail anything else. So I am of the assumption it was purely based on her appearance and likely the latter.


 * - seems a bit wordy; possibly, "she had signed a one-year deal"
 * Done as suggested


 * - whose urging?
 * By Diaz, clarified this


 * - the next para says her breakthrough was in Got to Believe; does this mean "break" in a different context?
 * Revised this sentence, as her first series (and not necessarily a breakthrough, yet)


 * - which show is 'this'
 * Tweaked for clarity, as this pertains to the show mentioned in the preceding sentence


 * - acting workshops? singing workshops? learn-filipino workshops?
 * Clarified as acting workshop, since voice lesson is also mentioned separately


 * - 'she appeared' is less wordy, but I'm unsure if there's a specific reason it's worded this way
 * Revised as suggested


 * - this detail is more about the film than about Soberano- what did she play? Otherwise I don't think this detail is needed
 * None that I could find. Removed/tweaked


 * - this echoes the previous quote, not sure it's needed
 * Removed


 * - this confuses me a bit- I think I know what's being said here, but it's in the wrong order; perhaps "as she had never experienced a break-up and did not empathize with the character" or something of the sort that fits what the source says
 * Done as suggested (partly), I think "as she had never experienced a break-up" sums up why she couldn't draw from real-life experience


 * - 'it' is kind of vague- she found another genre? Rephrase here
 * I believe the preceding statement satisfies that, she actively looked for parts in other genres, it would refer to "parts" or "roles" she sought/found in the animated genre. Hopefully that provides some clarity


 * - exact same as what?
 * Tweaked this to clarify it was her line delivery


 * - no citation after this
 * Thanks for catching, added now.


 * - one can 'receive' acclaim, or 'achieve' stardom, but I'm not sure you can 'achieve acclaim'
 * Should be the former. Fixed.


 * - I can't find a citation for this in ref 79's massive list- am I missing it?
 * It should be in the 2018 ref Liza Soberano No. 4 on ‘100 Most Beautiful Faces of 2018’ list : Liza was awarded the Most Beautiful Face of 2017 last year

That's all for me- amazing work on another huge BLP! MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 12:37, 14 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your review MyCatIsAChonk. Very much appreciated. I have provided my responses to your comments. Let me know if there's anything I may have missed or needs clarification. Pseud 14 (talk) 13:44, 14 May 2024 (UTC)
 * All good now- thanks for the impressively fast fixes! Support. MyCatIsAChonk (talk) (not me) (also not me) (still no) 13:58, 14 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your support and for always taking the time to review. Pseud 14 (talk) 14:08, 14 May 2024 (UTC)

Support from Ippantekina

 * "at age twelve" can simply be "at twelve"
 * Done


 * "sought roles in other genres, including the 2021 Netflix series Trese." that's the name of a series, not a genre
 * Thanks for catching. Added the genre and made some tweaking


 * "In 2022, she returned to California to pursue an acting career in Hollywood, and has since starred in the horror comedy Lisa Frankenstein (2024)" convoluted grammar? Suggest "She returned to California to pursue an acting career in Hollywood in 2022 and has sinced..."
 * Done as suggested.

I've read up to "2011–2015: Early roles and breakthrough". Ippantekina (talk) 07:46, 20 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your review Ippantekina. I have addressed your initial comments. Looking forward to the rest. Pseud 14 (talk) 16:49, 20 May 2024 (UTC)


 * Consider unlinking "breadwinner" as it's a fairly common term.
 * Unlinked


 * "the film and their performances were criticized for its overdone clichés and formulaic plot" I always favor the active voice, so I suggest something like "reviews criticized the film and their performances for..." plus "its" is grammatically incorrect
 * Revised as suggested


 * "Soberano learned to speak in Italian"
 * Done


 * "praised her as the production's prime asset" reads sensationalistic, maybe "praised her as the film's highlight"?
 * Revised


 * "play the part by deglamorizing" am I correct to assume that this means she sort of "glowed down"?
 * Correct. I think it might have been a term I've read in some actor BLPs that would refer to being a character who is awkward, unkempt, completely unglamorous


 * "The film emerged as a commercial success" suggest "was" (I prefer simplicity y'all)
 * Done


 * "Filming took place in Dubrovnik, Croatia, and featured Soberano as a struggling overseas worker" this means "Filming featured Soberano as..."? Suggest something like "Filmed in Dubrovnik, Croatia, it featured Soberano as..."
 * Revised as suggested


 * "the series was ultimately cancelled" but the series did make it to the airwaves right? Would be helpful if we know after how many episodes was the series cancelled.
 * Yes it did air. TV series in the Philippines are usually aired daily, like a soap opera, and there isn't usually sourcing that provides info on the number of episodes. What is often available online is the premiere date or the show's end date, so I had to go with when it ended and why it was cancelled.


 * "She found it in the Netflix animated series Trese (2021)" found what..?
 * I believe the preceding statement satisfies that, she actively looked for parts in other genres, and it would refer to "parts" or "roles" she sought and found by taking part in the animated genre project. Hopefully that provides some clarity
 * That would be grammatically questionable... ("it" = "parts/roles"?). I suggest something like "She found an opportunity with the Netflix animated series...". Ippantekina (talk) 08:05, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
 * That actually reads much better. Revised and thanks. Pseud 14 (talk) 15:46, 22 May 2024 (UTC)


 * "Reception for her voice acting" reception of
 * Done


 * "Kathleen Llemit of The Philippine Star thought that she had "dynamics" in delivering her lines, but viewed it to be "almost the exact same cadence"" what does "it" refer to here?
 * it would refer to the deliver of her lines.
 * Ditto, grammatically unclear. I suggest: "Kathleen Llemit thought that her delivery had "dynamics" but contained "almost the exact same cadence". Ippantekina (talk) 08:05, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Revised as suggested as well.


 * "She became aware of a forthcoming comedy horror film" so this plan has not realized? If so I'd remove it per WP:CRYSTALBALL
 * It prefaces the next paragraph on how the role/project came about.


 * "Lisa Frankenstein (2024), starring Kathryn Newton in the title role" sooooo is Lisa Frankenstein the comedy horror film previously discussed?
 * Correct, to answer your comment above.
 * If so why don't we remove the "forthcoming" thing? I would just summarize how Soberano moved to LA in 2022, got involved with Zelda Williams, and shot the film without mentioning the details of how she had doubts about a yet unnamed film (that's for the film article). Ippantekina (talk) 08:05, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
 * I have removed "forthcoming" to avoid ambiguity. I've re-read the source and by the time this was pitched to her, it was already greenlit with a name/title and script. Additionally, I would respectfully argue and as I have seen in other FAs for actors, it is generally acceptable to discuss initial reluctance/doubts about projects and what made them accept those roles (unless those projects did not materialize, then it would def not be worth mentioning, IMO). As examples:
 * In Leonardo DiCaprio's article about taking on Jack in Titanic:
 * Jennifer Lawrence on how she accepted the Hunger Games role:
 * Anne Hathaway's doubts about doing a sequel to Princess Diaries:
 * Jessica Chastain on accepting a role for her Broadway debut: Pseud 14 (talk) 15:46, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
 * I personally would leave that information for the film article, but this is not a make-or-break issue so I'm fine with it :) Ippantekina (talk) 02:51, 24 May 2024 (UTC)


 * "She also founded a production company which will produce a yet-untitled drama thriller film" ditto CRYSTALBALL
 * Removed.

Will review "Reception and public image" and subsequent sections later. Ippantekina (talk) 04:06, 21 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks Ippantekina. Responses provided to your comments. Let me know if I may have missed anything. Pseud 14 (talk) 17:45, 21 May 2024 (UTC)
 * I replied above; a few instances of dangling modifiers but so far they're not detrimental. Ippantekina (talk) 08:05, 22 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your responses Ippantekina. Made the changes and provided my response to the last point as well. Pseud 14 (talk) 15:46, 22 May 2024 (UTC)


 * Be mindful of MOS:LQ; a few full quotes are not being cited properly
 * Done (I think). Feel free to edit if there's anything amiss. I still struggle with MOS:LQ from time to time :)


 * "with her "angelic eyes, symmetrical features, a refined nose and lips" as her trademark features" I would attribute direct quotes to sources per WP:ATTRIBUTION
 * Done


 * "In 2017, Soberano topped TC Candler and The Independent Critics's listing" are these listings notable?
 * I believe it is, it has been publishing this listing since 1990 and has had coverage in various editions of Vogue, as well as US Weekly


 * "She uses her platform to speak out on social and political issues" what's "platform" here? I'm assuming social media, is this the case?
 * That would be correct. I used it for variation and not having to use "social media" repeatedly
 * I'd use "social media" as "platform" is too vague a term. Ippantekina (talk) 04:14, 24 May 2024 (UTC)


 * "She began dating co-star Enrique Gil" I think "She began dating Gil" is enough as Gil has been introduced previously, and his name appears throughout the article
 * Done


 * "She is reticent to discuss her personal life on social media, and refuses to share posts involving her family" I don't think the comma is needed
 * Removed


 * "A K-pop music enthusiast" err, trivia?
 * Removed

This concludes my review. Overall a nice read. I'm happy to support once my points are addressed :) Ippantekina (talk) 02:51, 24 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks Ippantekina. I have addressed and replied to your remaining comments. Let me know if there's anything I may have missed. Pseud 14 (talk) 04:08, 24 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Happy to support on prose though one point remains unaddressed above. Ippantekina (talk) 04:14, 24 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your support Ippantekina. I've tweaked that sentence and simplified it, hopefully that works now. Pseud 14 (talk) 04:29, 24 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks for addressing everything, I'm happy to give my full support. By the way, I would very much appreciate it if you could give some input to my current FAC for "You Belong with Me". Cheers, Ippantekina (talk) 04:44, 24 May 2024 (UTC)

Aoba47

 * I would encourage you to add WP:ALT text to the infobox image (File:Liza Soberano 2016.jpg).
 * I missed that, thanks for spotting this. Added


 * I am confused by the infobox note (i.e. Soberano was born an American citizen and does not use her mother's maiden surname, hence her middle name is Elizabeth.) It is not common for children in America to take on their mother's maiden name. Why the need for the note?
 * I've considered removing it, but I've seen some editors (mostly IP, which I assume are Filipinos and fans) constantly edit it to include her mother's maiden name. And may be unfamiliar with American naming conventions. Hoping that the note would deter those from more disruptive editing.


 * I am unsure about this sentence: (Described by media publications as among the most beautiful Filipino actresses of her generation, Soberano is vocal about gender equality, women's rights, and mental health.) These two ideas (i.e. her perceived beauty and her activism) seem too disparate to put into a single sentence in this way.
 * Fair point. I have split the two.


 * I do not think "of American descent" is really a commonly used phrased. I would just simplify it to say that she is American.
 * Done.


 * Why was Soberano raised by her grandparents and not either her mother and/or father after the divorce?
 * All the sources I've read seem to just mention that her parents split and she was left with her maternal grandparents in the US. I've found other sources that mention both have remarried. So I've included that as well. Although this happened much later.


 * The lead says that she relocated to Manila, but the "Early life and background" section says that she moved from the U.S. to Pangasinan and later Quezon City.
 * The mention in the lead I believe is for when she started working. Although she did move much earlier than that. I wanted to highlight the move as something related to her starting her career. I've linked Manila to Metro Manila in the lead to be specific, which is generally what we refer to when you are in the capital. Quezon City is one of the cities in Metro Manila. Hopefully that makes sense.
 * The new link in the lead is an Easter egg. Since the link says just "Manila", I would have assumed it would go straight to the Manila article, not the Metro Manila one. It is still unclear to me as I know absolutely nothing about the Philippines. I would either change the lead to say Quezon City or the article to say Metro Manila. Quezon City seems like the better choice as it is more specific, but I will leave that up to you as you know better. I think consistency between the lead and the article is the most important part. I would not assume that readers would know that Quezon City is one of the cities in Metro Manila. I did not know that. Aoba47 (talk) 14:52, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Agree, I've switched it to Quezon City now for specificity. Pseud 14 (talk) 15:48, 28 May 2024 (UTC)


 * I believe this sentence could be condensed: (When she became fascinated with the reality series America's Next Top Model, her motivations shifted to modeling, although she deemed it an unlikely career choice.) Something like (She became interested in modeling after watching the reality series America's Next Top Model, but saw it as unlikely career choice.)
 * Revised as suggested.


 * I am unsure about this part, (despite not knowing to how to speak the language). You do not really need to know how to speak a language to watch a television show? If this is implying that she was unfamiliar with Filipino, then I would say that more directly (i.e. despite not knowing the language). Also the link for Filipino should be moved up to here.
 * Revised and switched wikilink


 * The "talent management arm" phrasing seems off to me. Would there be a way to revise it?
 * Revised to talent management group


 * For this sentence, (she eventually signed with Diaz, but he recommended that Soberano learn to speak in Filipino in order to get acting jobs), I would substitute "but" with "and". There is not a contrast between Diaz getting her as a client and then saying she should learn Filipino.
 * Done


 * I would condense ("assumed the responsibility of being the family breadwinner") to (became the family breadwinner). Also is there any information or context as to why she became the breadwinner for her family?
 * Revised. From what I gather in the source, it seemed to have been just a statement that she became the breadwinner. (Filipino culture of "giving back" is definitely a driving force to that. She wouldn't be the first actor or artist to do so. I could only assume, but nothing specific as to why she chose to assume the responsibility, other than that notion)


 * I have a question for this part, (and took on voice lessons). Is this referencing singing lessons or actual voice therapy?
 * That would be singing lessons, which I have now changed.


 * Is there any further information or context on why Malou Santos asked her to use a stage name?
 * In this case, nothing more elaborate than what was said in the source. I would sometimes read with other actors reasoning such as better recall or something much memorable, but did not want to imply as it is not stated in the source.


 * For the Abigial Mendoza quote, I do not believe you need to add Soberano. The original quote with "She" can be used as it would be easily understood from context.
 * Done


 * For this part, (as a weblog writer), I would just say (as a blogger). I honestly have never seen "weblog". I think that word has been largely phased out.
 * I have always thought blogger was informal so I used the definitive full word. I have revised nonetheless.


 * I would avoid one-word quotes like ("stereotypical").
 * Paraphrased this.


 * I find this part, (through a web of conflicts and struggles among the noble warriors), a little overly wordy. There is slight repetition with using both "conflicts" and "struggles" in the same sentence, and I do not think the "a web of" part is needed.
 * Reworded and simplified


 * I have a few comments on this sentence: (The series was controversial for whitewashing the cast). I would attribute who is making these claims (i.e. critics, etc.) and it is whitewashing the characters, not the cast.
 * Tweaked


 * I would add the year that Erin Brockovich was released.
 * Added


 * I would condense this part, (considered her a character miscast), to (considered her miscast).
 * Done


 * I do not think Lisa Frankenstein did well in the box office. Is there a reason why this is not addressed here? I was just curious as the article only seems to bring up the box office when it is positive.
 * Good point, I think I missed that. I have now added the box office performance before the reviews.


 * For this part, (The journalist Sophie Agustin from Cosmopolitan Philippines), I do not think "the journalist" is necessary.
 * Removed


 * I am unsure about the linking in this part, (a "communist" group). Why not just say New People's Army instead? I find the current linking an WP:Easter egg as I did not expect it to go to an article about a specific group.
 * Revised.


 * I have a question about this part, (Teased as a child for her weight and skin). What about her skin did she get teased for?
 * Revised to be specific (color of her skin)


 * Do we know anything else about her relationship with Enrique Gil beyond 2017? I know that the article says that she is private, but I get the vibe that they are still together so I just wanted to confirm this.
 * I initially wanted to include Gil's name as "Partner" in the infobox, but then I wasn't sure myself. And also didn't want to include a statement of the relationship ending without a reliable citation. But this source from Feb 2024, does confirm that they are still together.


 * For the citation for this source, the film title should be italics.
 * Thanks for catching this. Done.

I hope these comments are helpful. Once everything is addressed, I will read through the article a few more times to make sure I did not miss anything. Best of luck with this FAC. Aoba47 (talk) 11:01, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thank you very much for your review Aoba47. It's so great seeing you back on this space again (and wiki in general). I have provided my responses to your comments. Let me know if there's anything I may have missed or that requires more changes. Pseud 14 (talk) 12:15, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
 * I am just glad that I could help. I have left a response above and I have a few more comments below, but none of it is major.


 * The article is included in Category:American people of Ilocano descent. It does mention how Soberano defended her Filipino heritage, but should there be a more specific mention of Ilocano people to support the category?
 * The article uses two Catholic categories, but there is not mention of this in the actual text.
 * I have a similar question for Category:Star Magic as Star Magic is not referenced in the article.
 * I'm actually not sure and have never gone over the categories that have been randomly added over time so I typically don't meddle with those who add it. But I have removed the categories you mentioned in the first 2 bullets. As I have no way of confirming if she does indeed have Ilocano background. As for Star Magic, it is the talent management group of ABS-CBN which produced all her television and movie projects. We usually don't refer to talent management groups (unless necessary) as much as possible to avoid sounding promotional. Pseud 14 (talk) 15:48, 28 May 2024 (UTC)

That should be everything. Once everything has been addressed, I will be more than happy to support this FAC. Aoba47 (talk) 14:50, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the comments Aoba47. All responded to and actioned. Pseud 14 (talk) 15:48, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thank you for addressing everything. I support the FAC for promotion. If possible, I would greatly appreciate any feedback for my current FAC for Kes (Star Trek), but I completely understand if you do not have the time or interest. I hope you have a great rest of your week! Aoba47 (talk) 17:58, 28 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your review, it has been always helpful. Sure I'd be happy to look at it in the coming days. Pseud 14 (talk) 19:05, 28 May 2024 (UTC)

Source and image review
It seems like we are using fairly mainstream Filipino newspapers, and international news media. Kinda wonder if there are book biographies or somesuch, though. Is Philippine Daily Inquirer a high-quality reliable source? ALT text is OKish I guess. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk) 10:50, 2 June 2024 (UTC) Thanks for taking up the image and source review Jo-Jo Eumerus. I have provided my responses to the points you raised regarding the citation and the availability of a book/biography. Let me know if they are to your satisfaction or if anything needs clarification. Pseud 14 (talk) 16:03, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
 * From what I've gathered and searched online in scholarly or academic sources, there hasn't been a book or a biography published with coverage of Soberano yet. I think it could be largely attributed to the fact that her career in the Philippines only began around 2011/2012.
 * The Philippine Daily Inquirer is considered one of the Philippines' leading authoritative and independent newspaper. It has a large circulation and news-gathering function and was founded in 1985, with over three decades of publication. It has editorial oversight consisting of a pool of reputable journalists (some of whom have Wiki articles, including Rina Jimenez-David, Letty Jimenez Magsanoc, Randy David, Nestor Torre Jr.) which I believe supports its credibility as an independent and high-quality source. When looking up for sourcing, it is also one of the newspapers for Filipino-related articles available via Google Book archives.

Drive-by comment

 * The lead is to long in proportion to this relatively short article. It goes into unnecessary detail and has too many paragraphs per MOS:LEADLENGTH. It needs trimming. MOS:LEAD offers useful guidance. Gog the Mild (talk) 18:46, 4 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the comments Gog. Revised and now be trimmed to 3 paragraphs. Let me know if there's anything else I may have missed. Pseud 14 (talk) 20:57, 4 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Looks good. I have lightly copy edited it. Are you ok with these changes? It is fine if you're not - just say. Gog the Mild (talk) 21:23, 4 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Looks good Gog. No complaints :) I really appreciate the edits. Pseud 14 (talk) 21:40, 4 June 2024 (UTC)

Gog the Mild (talk) 22:01, 4 June 2024 (UTC)