Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Missing My Baby/archive1


 * The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was not promoted by GrahamColm 08:51, 27 August 2012.

Missing My Baby

 * Nominator(s): Jona  talk to me  14:50, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

I am nominating this for featured article because... It has gone through a GA nomination, PR and two GOCE copyedits. I believe it satisfies the criteria. Jona talk to me  14:50, 7 August 2012 (UTC)

Oppose – I don't find the prose exceptional and there seems to be substantial original research. Some examples:


 * "The song was intended to showcase Selena's diverse musical abilities on her album Entre a Mi Mundo (1992), and to allow a diverse selection of music to be included on the album." – Second part of the sentence seems redundant.
 * Done by Stfg. Best, Jona  talk to me  17:18, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * "Selena's use of melisma and her emotive vocalization emphasize the song's title and its central theme." – The liner notes are cited here. Do they really attest to this? Do they also attest to the third paragraph of the "Background" section?
 * Yes, the reissue of Entre a mi Mundo was released in 2002 and her family, friends and former band gave a commentary review for each song. Best, Jona  talk to me  17:18, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I was hoping the liner notes contained a quote borrowed from a critic, but yikes. I'm averse to presenting an opinion of someone close to the artist as if it were objective fact. If you'd like to modify the sentence to attribute the statement to its owner, that would be acceptable, although it would remove whatever weight the sentence carried.  Two Hearted River  ( paddle /  fish ) 18:19, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * So you want me to add their comments in quotes? Wouldn't that border WP:QUOTEFARM? I think the prose flows better like it is, but how about I add a notes section that states their review? Best, Jona  talk to me  20:38, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I think THR was asking for attribution, not quotation. Is it possible to state who said it? --Stfg (talk) 21:10, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Oh ok, it was Brian "Red" Moore, a family friend. Best, Jona  talk to me  22:39, 13 August 2012 (UTC)


 * "...moves at a moderate 144 beats per minute" – No need to tell the reader that 144 bpm is "moderate"; you've presented the actual number, so the reader can judge for himself. You can cut "moves", too, and just say "...the beat is set in common time at 144 bpm".
 * Not done not all readers will be familiar with music terminology. Best, Jona  talk to me  17:18, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Actually, I did change this to be redundant non-redundant. --Stfg (talk) 17:38, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * That's what the wikilink is for.  Two Hearted River  ( paddle /  fish ) 18:19, 13 August 2012 (UTC)


 * "It was among the station's most-played clips according to Billboard, and was positioned at number 47 out of 50 music videos for that channel." – Similarly, don't tell us it was among the most-played, just saying it was 47th is enough. Also, this only applied for one week; that fact should be mentioned.
 * Done by Stfg. Best, Jona  talk to me  17:18, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Despite a few citations, the "Lyrical interpretation" subsection is almost entirely original research.
 * How? Jona  talk to me  17:18, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Example: "She keeps a positive outlook by thinking of their happy times, but she desperately wants to express her feelings to him." What is the source that told you this is how the lyrics should be interpreted?  Two Hearted River  ( paddle /  fish ) 18:19, 13 August 2012 (UTC)


 * The "Critical reception" section advances no thesis and instead reads like a list.
 * Done Jona  talk to me  17:18, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * "...was awarded platinum plaques..." – What is a platinum plaque? Who awarded them? Why?
 * It's according to Vibe magazine and no other information is provided for this. Best, Jona  talk to me  17:18, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Then it's useless and should be removed.  Two Hearted River  ( paddle /  fish ) 18:19, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I think so too, and have done so.
 * "plague" is a synonym for "disc". I saw this term in a Jet magazine, and believe it is very important. Regards.--Kürbis (✔) 10:43, 14 August 2012 (UTC)
 * That would be plaque :)) That link shows blank pages in a French-language magazine. Feel free to revert me if you like, Kürbis. --Stfg (talk) 11:36, 14 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Then plaque. Perhaps change .com to .de, then you will see the pages :P Regards.--Kürbis (✔) 12:12, 14 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Very good. So I've restored it, but replaced "plaques" with the more normal "discs" and wikilinked to an explanation. --Stfg (talk) 12:55, 14 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I think THR wanted removed because the claim is only on one magazine. Note that RIAA (which is the official certification issuer for the United States regarding singles and albums) did not issued both of those singles a gold certification (denoting shipments of 500,000 units). Furthermore, "Missing My Baby" was not released as a physical single nor a promotional recording so that contradicts the entire article. But if we can change it to "According to Vibe" I think it would be better. Best, Jona  talk to me  13:00, 14 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm not a topic expert, so cannot judge what is due weight about this. Please do as you think best. --Stfg (talk) 13:05, 14 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I fixed it =) Best, Jona  talk to me  13:14, 14 August 2012 (UTC)

 Two Hearted River  ( paddle / fish ) 20:06, 9 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Update: Original research remains and the prose is still lacking. For example, there remains a number of sentences in which the subject (usually "it") is ambiguous, and the quote about "hint of aspiration" is somewhat misrepresented. I suggest finding another set of eyes to go over the text.  Two Hearted River  ( paddle /  fish ) 18:19, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I've corrected the "hint of aspiration" quote and given its context. I've also been through looking for ambiguous sentence subjects and "it" (whether subject or otherwise) and corrected what I found. What other issues do you see with the prose? --Stfg (talk) 19:25, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Sourcing issues and a dearth of information are going to prevent this from passing, so I'm disinclined to continue this back-and-forth regarding the prose.  Two Hearted River  ( paddle /  fish ) 12:17, 17 August 2012 (UTC)
 * What sourcing and information issues does the article have? Best, Jona  talk to me  01:20, 18 August 2012 (UTC)

Comment: at a glance, I'm inclined to agree with Two Hearted River about the prose. The article is generally in Ok shape, but I don't think it's at 1a standards. Striking my oppose since the article has been copyedited since I last read it. Mark Arsten (talk) 17:01, 13 August 2012 (UTC) I don't mean to come across as too negative, the FA prose requirements are very difficult, even for experienced contributors. Haven't looked closely enough at the other issues to comment. Some possible issues: Mark Arsten (talk) 20:10, 10 August 2012 (UTC)
 * "Vibe magazine said that it was because of "Missing My Baby" and "Techno Cumbia" that Quintanilla III was awarded platinum plaques for these recordings.[15] Another writer for Vibe said that the song is a "hint of aspiration"." I'd suggest mentioning a writer in the first sentence if you're going to say "Another writer" in the second.
 * Done by Stfg. Best, Jona  talk to me  17:18, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * "Chris Riemenschneider and John T. Davis of Austin American-Statesman stated" I think you need "the" in front of the paper's name, should check the rest of the article too.
 * Done by Stfg. Best, Jona  talk to me  17:18, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * "Cary Clack of San Antonio Express-News wrote that "Missing My Baby" was played on non-Tejano radio stations and believed it would have been a posthumous hit.[9] A music video for "Missing My Baby", which included some of Selena's personal home videos, was released posthumously for VH1 in 1998 to promote the album Anthology." Try to avoid the repetition of "posthumous" here.
 * Done by Stfg. Best, Jona  talk to me  17:18, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * "The Virginian-Pilot said that "Missing My Baby" was built on hooks that recall Diana Ross' "Missing You", which is a tribute to Marvin Gaye.[13] Cary Clack of San Antonio Express-News believed the recording "displays her wonderful vocal and emotional range"." You should probably identify "her" in the second sentence.
 * Done by Stfg. Best, Jona  talk to me  17:18, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * "However, keeping a positive mind, she believes he will always be hers, though she believes this is because it is in her mind." Repetition of "believes" here. Check for repetition of "tells" and "love" in the same section.
 * Done by Stfg. Best, Jona  talk to me  17:18, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * "She believed it would convince EMI Records' chairman Charles Koppelman that she was ready to release a crossover album.[1] At the time, the record label did not want to launch a crossover career for Selena until she had a bigger fan base.[4] Although EMI did not push for a crossover, Selena decided to include the song on Entre a Mi Mundo." Is there a way to avoid the repetition of "crossover" here?
 * Done by Stfg. Best, Jona  talk to me  17:18, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I have asked User:Stfg if he could copy-edit the article, which he accepted for Monday. Best, Jona  talk to me  11:44, 11 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I've done so today. I believe I've dealt with those of the above comments that concern prose, but I may have overlooked some WP:OR (or I may not) as some of the sources are subscription only. Please would Two Hearted River and Mark review? --Stfg (talk) 16:56, 13 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I just pinged both of them. Thanks again for the c/e! Best, Jona  talk to me  16:58, 13 August 2012 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.