Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Omaha, Nebraska/archive1


 * The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was not promoted by User:SandyGeorgia 00:25, 8 September 2008.

Omaha, Nebraska

 * Nominator(s): • Freechild   'sup?   

I'm nominating this article for featured article because several editors have completed the archived peer review and assisted the article in meeting each of the criteria for FA status. • Freechild   'sup?   13:36, 5 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Comments I should have mentioned these things ages ago, but I held off because I thought they were excessively nit-picky (but if there's a place where that would be appropriate, it's here):
 * References should use citation templates (cite web, cite book, cite news, etc.)
 * I can't distill this down to a concrete suggestion, but whenever I read the this article, I get the feeling that it sometimes misses the forest for the trees; that is, while it has lots and lots of sourced information, some of the information (nearly all of which exists in sub-articles) could be removed and replaced with text that creates a better narrative. If this feeling is restricted to me, then ignore this suggestion; if not, it'll require a stronger copyediting hand than mine. – Swid (talk · edits) 16:12, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
 * No specific citation method or template is required; WP:WIAFA calls for consistent citations, regardless of method used to generate them. Sandy Georgia  (Talk) 19:13, 5 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Comment:
 * I don't believe that citation templates are necessary in an FA. Consistent citation style is necessary.
 * I scanned through the article and notice entire paragraphs without any citations. This must be amended immediately. --Moni3 (talk) 16:48, 5 September 2008 (UTC)


 * '''Comments by
 * Several links are dead according to Checklinks tool.
 * Fixed. Only 2 legitmate links to dab pages remain. - Icewedge (talk) 23:45, 5 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Several links go to disambig pages. It'd be better if they went to exact articles to help with accessibility.
 * D.M.N. (talk) 17:17, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

Strong Oppose by 
 * Besides the problems with the references that are invalid (404s and other missing pages), and that some are missing publishing info and access date, what makes the following sources reliable?
 * "Andreas' History of Nebraska"
 * HistoricOmaha.com
 * LivelyOmaha.org
 * MemorialLibrary.com
 * "Czech Heritage in Nebraska" - note: Just because it is hosted by a university, does not mean that the page's content is a reliable source.
 * CinemaTreasures.org - note: the source even has a disclaimer: "All information on this site is provided "as is". We are not responsible for inaccuracies, but do our best to correct them."
 * OmahaRiverfront.com
 * US Gen Net
 * OmahaTrails.com
 * The prose is just not good in general. There are grammar issues, the text doesn't flow very well, and the body of the article is organized in a haphazard manner. As another reviewer said above, the article is certainly loaded with facts but the article does not, in my opinion, provide a good overall summary of Omaha.
 * Sourcing in areas is quite thin. In some places, including whole paragraphs, assertions and hard facts go without references. This certainly needs to be corrected.
 * Various MoS problems. However, given the more serious overall problems with the article, technical and style problems are the least of this article's concerns.


 * FYI, I understand your concerns about the reliability of several of the citations mentioned above. By way of noting it, Andreas' History... was published in 1882, and is widely respected and cited source material. Additionally, if there are additional concerns beyond these few citations ("more serious overall problems"), could you please be specific? Thanks. • Freechild   'sup?   07:34, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I replaced each of the aforementioned links. • Freechild   'sup?   08:25, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

I would recommend this article for a more thorough peer review first, followed by a run through WP:GAN, which is a good way to make sure that the article's content is in order and the sources check out. Best, epicAdam(talk) 00:14, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

Comments by : Even though FAC is more of a judgment than a peer review, since the editor has requested more details as to what style and technical problems I have with the article, here are some more overall concerns and my thoughts on the lead:
 * Please check out the guidelines at WP:USCITY to determine the appropriate section order and content for city articles. While following guidelines are not specifically required, those guidelines were developed as a community to make sure that city articles provide readers with as much pertinent information as possible and didn't develop into a dustbin of random facts and trivia. Following the guidelines there will also help cut down on the overuse of section headers and subheadings.
 * Prose should always be favored over lists of information. If the events in the "Major events" section are notable, they should be mentioned and included within a narrative prose.
 * "Metropolitan area" is literally a sentence, map and a table. The information about each individual community should not even be present here since the article is on Omaha itself, not its surrounding area. A sentence about the metro area's population, etc. would be sufficient in the demographics section.
 * Non-breaking spaces are needed between numbers and their units of measurement.
 * Lead issues:
 * There are many citations in the lead. The lead is supposed to be a summary, meaning that while some of information can be cited in the lead, especially if it's controversial, the vast majority of the information should be cited below in the article's actual prose.
 * "The stand-alone city is the nation's 42nd-largest" "stand-alone" means there are no others. Perhaps the word is "independent"? And if so, how is it an independent city if it's a county seat? Do the laws of the county not apply to its county seat?
 * "The city grew along the Missouri River, with the first settlement extending from the Lone Tree Ferry crossing from Kanesville, Iowa in the early 1850s." awkward. There's no context.
 * "Along with transportation and jobbing, early industries that were important to the city through the mid-20th century were its railroads, breweries, stockyards and meatpacking plants." Really poor prose. Better: "Railroads, breweries, stockyards, and meatpacking plants were Omaha's main industries in the mid-20th century." And really, why is this important? The information is provided but it's not clear why it's in the lead...
 * How does the third paragraph summarize the city? Surely the city is more than the corporations that are headquartered there, right? It's essentially just information that belongs in the economy section.
 * Sweeping phrases like "comprise important elements of the cultural background of Omaha", "have been lauded by numerous national newspapers", "music has always been important to the city", and "music scene being historically significant" mean absolutely nothing to the reader. Don't tell us that something is important, demonstrate its importance through examples.

Let me know if/when you take this article to peer review and I'd be happy to go through it more. Best, epicAdam(talk) 15:56, 6 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Comment are ISBNs optional? There are not present. Ling.Nut (talk&mdash;WP:3IAR) 06:46, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
 * According to WP:RS they are optional. • Freechild   'sup?   07:20, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Oppose. Two sections are simply lists; one section is an image; the prose is very far from sparkling or even engaging: "Two native sons who achieved prominence nationally were born in Omaha, with their families moving away shortly thereafter". I hate to sound literary, but there isn't much sense of flow to many sections. I'd like to commend the primary editors of this article on the obvious hard work they've done, but it just isn't far enough along in the development process to be an FA. It will get there at some point if its editors continue seeking outside input/help, but I suspect that time is not now. Ling.Nut (talk&mdash;WP:3IAR) 08:36, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

Oppose from —A random spot check of the Notable residents section reveals these problems: I'm sorry, but I can't support or even remain neutral when there are so many problems in a small, 2-paragraph section. Please withdraw this nom and submit for a peer review, find people to copyedit the article, and then submit it to GAN before coming here. Dabomb87 (talk) 15:37, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
 * "Omaha is the historic and modern birthplace and home of notable politicians, actors, musicians, business leaders, sportsmen and cultural leaders."
 * "His son Peter Fonda also briefly lived in Omaha." Peter Fonda should be wikilinked. A rather awkward, stubby, sentence overall.
 * "Mrs. Brando had helped found the playhouse." This idea could be integrated into the sentence before the last.
 * "Tennis player Andy Roddick, former ATP ranking leader, was born in Omaha." a former ATP ranking leader.
 * "Omaha's rich musical history produced legends such as Wynonie Harris, Preston Love, Buddy Miles, Calvin Keys, Eugene McDaniels and others." Did the history actually produce these legends. Who's to say that Omaha's musical history is "rich"?
 * "Warren Buffett, in 2008 the richest man in the world, lives in Omaha where he made his fortune in business." Comma use and awkward phrasing: "in 2008 the richest man in the world"--> the richest man in the world as of 2008.
 * "Two native sons who achieved prominence nationally were born in Omaha, with their families moving away shortly thereafter." Who are these two native sons?
 * "Activist and son of a Baptist minister, Malcolm X, first known as Malcolm Little, was also born here." Switch around phrases here. Do we really need to know that Malcolm X's alternate name?
 * "Academy Award winner Henry Fonda also grew up in Omaha." Also is unnecessary.


 * Noted, there are WP:MOS and WP:ACCESSIBILITY issues throughout; I fixed a few, but there are others. Sandy Georgia  (Talk) 21:02, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.