Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/The Rite of Spring/archive1


 * The following is an archived discussion of a featured article nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured article candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The article was promoted by GrahamColm 17:19, 11 September 2012.

The Rite of Spring

 * Nominator(s): Brianboulton (talk) 22:10, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

Stravinsky's music for the 1913 ballet The Rite of Spring has been called one of the 20th century's cultural milestones. It caused a near riot when it was first performed, nearly 100 years ago, and still quickens the pulse. The original production came from an amazing coalescence of creative talent—Stravinsky, Nijinsky, Nikolai Roerich and Pierre Monteux—and has since caused further sensations with innovative new productions from each new generation's top performers. After all that, the article may seem a bit of a let-down, but it is the result of some devoted work, not least from a team of peer reviewers. And let us not forget User:Tim riley, in temporary (we hope) retirement, who provided many of the article's sources and has passed on a number of suggestions from over the water. The aim is to work for a TFA on 29 May next—the centenary of the premiere. Brianboulton (talk) 22:10, 4 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Support My say came at the peer review. I've given it a glance over and don't have any additional comments.  Well done.--Wehwalt (talk) 22:40, 4 September 2012 (UTC)
 * One thing more, actually. I did look online, rather comprehensively, mostly using Google Books and Google News Archive for pre-1923 images of the backdrops, and drew a blank.  It's certainly discussed pre-1923, but I could find no images.  I'm actually suspecting that Roerich kept them out of his exhibits, though I couldn't guess at the reason.  I'd like to see the programme from the 1922 US premiere, but I suspect there wouldn't be anything.--Wehwalt (talk) 18:52, 5 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your support - and for your voluntary research work. As the 1922 US premiere was for the concert version I very much doubt that the programme would have shown the Roerich designs; US didn't see the ballet until 1930. Brianboulton (talk) 09:24, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Support - per comments at PR. Should The Rite of Spring Dancers image have a period at the end of its caption? --  Cassianto Talk   22:54, 4 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your peer review work, and for your support here. The period is correct since the caption constitutes a full sentence. Brianboulton (talk) 09:24, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Comments
 * "episode's main tune.[99][94]" -- refs out of sequence.
 * Fixed Brianboulton (talk) 09:24, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
 * "Grove Music Online" -- if this ref is online, where's the URL? (refs 2, 3, )
 * My typos in template: fixed by the Rabbit (see below) Brianboulton (talk)
 * Ref 6 "Griffiths, Paul (2012). "Diaghilev [Dyagilev, Sergey Pavlovich"]. " has an extra ending ]
 * Fixed Brianboulton (talk) 09:24, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Ref 55 needs a publisher
 * Again my typo in template. Now fixed Brianboulton (talk) 09:24, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Ref 49, the OCLC number can be linked in the cite template.
 * Fixed by the Rabbit Brianboulton (talk) 09:24, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Refs 73,74, 75, 77 78, 80, 86, 94, 112, 122 need retrieve dates, most of the your web refs have them
 * The refs you highlight are all online links to printed sources. I have never given access dates for these, and as far as I know most others don't, either. Brianboulton (talk) 09:24, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Ref 95 should have a comma after Hill, not a period Pumpkin Sky   talk  23:26, 4 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Fixed by the Rabbit Brianboulton (talk) 09:24, 6 September 2012 (UTC)

Image review
 * Support support now that my issues and the images issues from Nikki are fixed. Pumpkin Sky   talk  21:17, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Any chance of a sound clip?
 * The article previously included a 12-second computer-generated approximation of the opening bassoon melody. My view was that this did not help readers in their understanding of the music (poor tone, dodgy tempo etc), but rather than remove it, I asked peer-reviewrs for their opinions. None supported its retention in the article. If someone knows how to make a sound clip from a recording and to create a usable media file from it, I'd be delighted, but I'm afraid it's beyond my ability. Brianboulton (talk) 18:48, 6 September 2012 (UTC)


 * File:Bakst_daighilev.jpg needs US PD tag
 * File:Vaslav-nijinsky-in-le-pavillon-d-armide-1911.jpg needs US PD tag
 * File:Massine,_Leonide_(1895-1979)_-_1914_-_Ritratto_da_Leon_Bakst.jpg needs US PD tag
 * I have added the PD-US tags


 * File:Moscow_Bolshoi_Theatre_2011.JPG: given the lack of clarity around freedom of panorama in Russia, would suggest image description mention when the theatre was built. Nikkimaria (talk) 04:46, 5 September 2012 (UTC)
 * I have added appropriate wording to the file description. This is not, incidentally, an important image as far as the article is concerned, so if you think it should be deleted I'll remove it. Thanks for this review. Brianboulton (talk) 18:48, 6 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Support - a well-written and well-organized article worthy of a Featured Article. Nice work. Lord Sjones23 (talk - contributions) 05:00, 5 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Thank you. I am glad that you enjoyed the article. How's Mozart? Brianboulton (talk) 14:32, 7 September 2012 (UTC)

ref reviewundefined
 * The refs to "Stravinsky and Craft" need a bit of tweaking. One (fn #37 #53) is undated and presumably refers to the 1959 source. The 1981 (Dialogues) source as an invalid ISBN (ISBN 0-520-04404-7), which is probably supposed to be ISBN 0-520-04650-1, which is what the gBooks link is pointing at; that's also saying 1982, instead of 1981, which would make it ambiguous with the other "Stravinsky and Craft" 1982 (Expositions and Developments), who's ISBN (ISBN 0-520-04650-1, again!) should probably be ISBN 0-520-04403-7 ('4'→'3') and is a 1981 paperback. nb: I've fixed the fn#49 and fn#95 issues PS commented on. the missing urls, too. Br&#39;er Rabbit (talk) 06:00, 5 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the tech fixes. I'm not sure what the problem is with ref 37. I have sorted the dates and isbns for the later Stravinsky and Crafts, which I had got rather muddled. Brianboulton (talk) 09:24, 6 September 2012 (UTC) Note: I got edit-conflicted while making the chaanges but all looks well now.
 * (looks like the ec was me; ma'af) I meant fn#53; sorry. It's "Stravinsky and Craft, pp. 47–48" and I'm thinking it needs a (1959), else that ref is unused. Or it's one of the others... Nits aside, it's a fine article and I'll be supporting. Br&#39;er Rabbit (talk) 10:04, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
 * I have fixed ref 53 - the missing date was indeed 1959, thanks for spotting that. Brianboulton (talk) 18:18, 6 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Support; above bits sorted out fine and I've no other worries. Nice work, Brian. Br&#39;er Rabbit (talk) 20:37, 6 September 2012 (UTC)

Comments by Gerda Arendt - my comments at the PR were taken, I am more than appeased ;) For a featured article of such an important work, I would like to see a bit on the translation history of the title. The review of the premiere in the New York Times said "The Consecration of Spring", how come it became known as "The Rite"? I personally would not use "The Rite" for anything said before the title ever was translated to English, that means the history of conception, composition and the premiere. - There is plenty of time until May 29 ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:18, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
 * I honestly think there is nothing more to be said on this aspect. The work has always been known in English as The Rite of Spring. The title appears thus in the record of an interview which Stravinsky gave the day after the premiere. The fact that a NYT subeditor used a slightly different wording is neither here nor there. None of the large number of Stravinsky scholars whose work I've consulted has ever suggested there is any issue connected to the English version of the name, for good reason; there isn't. Brianboulton (talk) 18:18, 6 September 2012 (UTC)

Support, learning ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:31, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks, Gerda. I am learning, too, as always. Brianboulton (talk) 23:53, 6 September 2012 (UTC)

Comments Support - an excellent, highly polished article, worthy of the FA status. - SchroCat ( ^  •  @ ) 18:58, 7 September 2012 (UTC) Feel free to ignore any that go counter to any forms of good English use!
 * Shouldn't there be a nbsp; before the ellipses points?
 * Well, I haven't given much thought to nbsp since about 2007. But in relation to ellipses, I think you have a point; they do improve presentation, if only by preventing a line starting with the ellipsis. So I have inserted them (all 17!)


 * For '"...the poor boy': I think there should be a space (a nbsp;?) between the three points and "the"
 * I don't use a space if I start my quote in the middle of a sentence. Likewise, if my quote finishes midsntence, I go... without a space. Other conventions may exist, but my practice is widespread.


 * "work's centenary. [82]": there's a space between full stop and reference
 * There may have been, but it if there was


 * a "ghastly cariacature": I'm presuming the spelling is as quoted, so perhaps think about using [sic] ?
 * No, just my crap copying/spelling. Sorry


 * "abruptedly"? should that be "abruptly"?
 * Same thing, I'm afraid

Apart from these very minor points, a very, very good article. - SchroCat ( ^  •  @ ) 19:51, 6 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks for these useful points, all duly attended to. Brianboulton (talk) 23:53, 6 September 2012 (UTC)

Note to delegates and/or further reviewers: I shall be off-wiki for a couple of days or so, which means a slight delay in dealing with any further review comments, should these arise. I think sources and images are done. Brianboulton (talk) 22:50, 10 September 2012 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.