Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of Chicago White Sox Opening Day starting pitchers/archive1


 * The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by Dabomb87 17:38, 11 October 2010.

List of Chicago White Sox Opening Day starting pitchers

 * Nominator(s): Rlendog, Wizardman  15:27, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

I am nominating this for featured list because it meets all features list criteria. I thought I'd take a break from draft lists and look through some other ones when I saw that this list was already about 90% ready for FLC. I did the other 10% and here we are. Wizardman Operation Big Bear 15:27, 20 September 2010 (UTC)


 * Comment—no dab links, but dead external links to http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1902/VCHA01902tm through http://www.retrosheet.org/boxesetc/1909/VCHA01909tm and http://www.baseballhalloffame.org/components/hofers/HallofFamersList.html Ucucha 16:06, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Retrosheet ones fixed. The baseball hall of fame site seems to be down right now, so I'll try replacing it tomorrow. Wizardman  Operation Big Bear 17:44, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Other one now fixed. Wizardman  Operation Big Bear 02:25, 22 September 2010 (UTC)


 * So what??? can somebody explain to me why do these articles exist here on wikipedia? This is such an in-universe article, with essentially zero outside relevance. It is a statistics (and in baseball the more statistics the better) that nobody outside of the sport sees any relevance. Let's make a comparison to soccer, and let's pick the team that is most probably the most well-known/familiar in the US: Manchester United. Why would anybody who is not a mega-fan care about the List of captains in the first match of the season of Manchester United? So what if they are the MVP of the team in the first day of the season? What does this show? Starting pitchers in the payoff or the final would be fine lists, but this is just plain stupid. I will go ahead and AfD this, and do expect a ton of baseball fans to probably snowball it . Nergaal (talk) 03:31, 21 September 2010 (UTC)
 * As a note, the AfD discussion that Nergaal has started can be found here. Nomader  ( Talk ) 06:14, 21 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Oppose for the following major reasons:
 * the article does not explain well the importance of the of being the starting pitcher on the starting day to readers not familiar with the terminology
 * there is no indication of any "aftermath" of the choices; in other words yes, they were chosen, but how well did they do? were they chosen as MVPs for the season, or did they get any recognition for their status later in the season? Or the bet did not pay up for the team in the end? The only mention is with the five times they reached the series, but what happened in the other 100+ cases?
 * "decision" should be switched to outcome since nobody took the decision to assign W or L decision should be clearly explained as it appears to be a notable statistics
 * 2nd lead paragraph does not fit well within the scope of the title of the article

Nergaal (talk) 03:33, 22 September 2010 (UTC)
 * To respond to your comments, I don't think the list should tell us about all the players' careers. The list notes exceptional circumstances in the lead, such as which pitchers were banned because of the Black Sox Scandal and which pitchers pitched during a world series season– I could maybe see noting Cy Young Award winners of a certain year (i.e. if someone was the starting pitcher in 1967 and then won the Cy Young that year), but that should be incorporated into the table and is only a minor addition. Otherwise, if the reader wants to know more about a particular player's career, they can open that player's article.
 * The second paragraph should stay as it tells the reader where the starting pitchers pitched at home. I think that's relevant enough to merit inclusion in the lead.
 * No decision is wikilinked on its first appearance, so the explanation is adequate. Nomader  ( Talk ) 14:11, 23 September 2010 (UTC)
 * I have (hopefully) addressed the first point, adding something about the significance about being the opening day pitcher. Point two I feel would make the lead too tangential, though I could see if any won the Cy Young Award that year; I wouldn't go beyond that. Point four I think fits, since showing records away and at home adds an extra layer to the significance of pitching on opening day (though it's difficult to explain). Wizardman  Operation Big Bear 19:57, 26 September 2010 (UTC)
 * "decision" is a major statistics but it is not explained. Considering how notable the statistics is, it is most likely deserving a note in the lead. Nergaal (talk) 23:26, 30 September 2010 (UTC)


 * Support. My concerns have been addressed and I feel that the changes have also addressed Nergaal's concerns above. As such, I feel that I can support at this time– well done, Wizardman. Nomader  ( Talk ) 02:43, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Comments –
 * "The first game of the new baseball season is played on Opening Day." Yes, but Opening Day varies depending on which team it is. The teams don't all start on the same day. The sentence should reflect this in some way; perhaps "of a team's new baseball season" would work?
 * "is considered an honor, and is given to...". The whole sentence reads awkwardly because of this. "an honor, which is given to..." would be a suitable fix.
 * "Williams was also the Opening Day started in 1920." "started" → "starter".  Giants2008  ( 27 and counting ) 23:15, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
 * Done. Wizardman  Operation Big Bear 20:40, 3 October 2010 (UTC)
 * Support – Meets FL standards.  Giants2008  ( 27 and counting ) 14:07, 4 October 2010 (UTC)


 * Support No complaints from me. Courcelles 10:14, 6 October 2010 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.