Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of First Ladies of the United States


 * The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by Scorpion0422 19:20, 27 January 2009.

List of First Ladies of the United States
Fully referenced list of the official First Ladies, according to the White House and National First Ladies' Library. Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 03:30, 11 January 2009 (UTC)

Comments by --  SRE.K.A nnoyomous .L. 24 [c]
 * Tables could be sortable.
 * I had considered this, but then figured that the numbered column and the tenure date would be in the same order, as would the names of the First Lady and President if sorted by last name. Some had more than one religion, such as when they took on their husbands -- sorting wouldn't work well on that column because it would only sort the first one. So I thought that in this case it probably wouldn't work well on this list.


 * Protestant on Michelle Obama's row should be linked.
 * Done

--  SRE.K.A nnoyomous .L. 24  review me 04:10, 11 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Thank you for taking a look. Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 04:59, 12 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Comments
 * Big problem: both Helen Taft and Ellen Wilson are listed as number 28, so everyone after that should be one higher. And in the lead it should say there are 44 first ladies and 45 first ladyships, with Michelle Obama being number 46.
 * done


 * It doesn't need to be removed, but I do not see the reason to include religion in the table.
 * Religion is a big thing in the US. The religious beliefs of their leaders seems to be a big deal. The White House and First Ladies' Library also gives the religion of each First Lady, too.. it just seemed appropriate.


 * The table needs to be reconfigured to be sortable. This includes listing the two presidents with two wifes twice in different cells and modifying the headings.
 * I don't think sorting would work well for this list. See my reasoning above, at my reply to SRE.K.A.L.24. Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 04:59, 12 January 2009 (UTC)


 * I have centered the tables, but you need to remove style="text-align:center"| from the dates within the cells.
 * done


 * Explain or link what nee means.
 * done


 * Overall a very good and well-referenced list. Reywas92 Talk  16:57, 11 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 04:59, 12 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Support Excellent list. Reywas92 Talk  18:50, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Wait! You fixed the numbering in the table, but not in the lead. It should say "there have been 44 First Ladies and 45 First Ladyships...his wife Michelle Obama will become the forty-sixth First Lady" Reywas92 Talk  21:33, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Fixed! Thanks for spotting that! Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 22:45, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * And the written-out number: "Michelle Obama will become the forty-sixth First Lady" Reywas92 Talk  22:50, 17 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Comment I would like to thank MatthewEdwards for his dedication over the last few days to improving this list. I created the article a few months back and I'm happy to see it up for FL. Just a quick comment on the images, some of the first ladies are represented by their official painted portraits and some are represented by photographs. In my opinion, it should be standardized. I had a discussion at Talk:List of Presidents of the United States where they recommended using portraits because the early first ladies could not have photographs taken. Happyme22 (talk) 18:55, 11 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I've changed the images. Thanks for your comments, Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 04:59, 12 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Support I see there was a lengthy discussion about the images. I'm satisfied if others are satisifed, however. Nice work, Matthewedwards! Best, Happyme22 (talk) 20:23, 23 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Support good job — Chris!  c t 20:11, 12 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Thank you! Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 20:06, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Comment - It would be nice if a picture of Martha Skelton Jefferson could be found and added to article to ensure that a picture of every first lady is presented. Not necessary for FL but it would be nice. Remember (talk) 14:26, 14 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree it would, but neither the White House or the First Ladies Library have images of her. She was married to him 19 years before he became President. As far as I am aware there are no sketches, paintings or engravings of her. Findagrave.com has a picture, http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=6654871, but I don't know if that's based off another bona fide image or just the artist's impression. Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 20:06, 14 January 2009 (UTC)
 * That's cool then. I support this list (but we should all be on the lookout for a image of Martha Skelton Jefferson so we could include it in the future). Remember (talk) 18:50, 17 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Support Even though you haven't added the info about Hillary Clinton and Michelle Obama. I definitely think that a former First Lady becoming Secretary of State and an African-American entering the White House in the same week are notable events that should be mentioned in the lead. BomBom (talk) 01:10, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Images - Now resolved, Rambo's Revenge (talk)  18:02, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Sorry to throw a spanner in the works but it is unclear whether the portraits of the First Ladies are infact free. On commons two have been tagged for deletion 1, 2. There has been an unresolved lengthy discussion at Possibly unfree images/US government portraits about if such portraits are free. Hillary's portrait has infact previously been deleted after discussion at her articles FAC. Since this discussion on my talk page, I am no longer sure that the Hillary Clinton portrait (which I uploaded) is free. Similar reasonings may apply to the other portraits. Rambo's Revenge (talk)  00:56, 15 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Update: The two portraits I mentioned above have both been deleted from commons. To be the safest you can with the images I would suggest removing all the portraits of First Ladies who died after January 1, 1923 or who's portraits were painted after that (if the date is known) and replace them with PD images where possible. Rambo's Revenge (talk)</b>  00:25, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm going to go over the images myself and then I'll ask an image person, too. Thanks! Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 04:15, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I was the one who nominated the pictures for deletion. Why not just use their official photos? Those are PD. — BQZip01 —  talk 06:09, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I assumed that because they appear at the First Lady entries at http://www.whitehouse.gov that they were official portraits. Not to worry. Could you help me in locating actual official portrait paintings or photos, please? Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 07:41, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Comment I request that the nominator be permitted a little extra time to solve the problems of the deleted images. — BQZip01 — talk 06:10, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Thank you. I appreciate that. I was becoming a little disheartened! Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 07:41, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I have update the images. Hopefully they are all okay now. Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 04:59, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Looks fine to me now. — BQZip01 —  talk 04:05, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

I am happy with how the image issue has been resolved. I will not cap the discussion so any unaware reviewers can see why portraits are no longer used. <b style="color:#E32636;">Rambo's Revenge</b> <b style="color:#FFA500;">(talk)</b>  18:02, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Due to an extensive image review below by BomBom, I have reconsidered my position. Due to my lack of experience with images, I should have originally waited and let someone else review them thoroughly. Apologies, <b style="color:#E32636;">Rambo's Revenge</b> <b style="color:#FFA500;">(talk)</b>  00:20, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

Support, I am now happy with all aspects of the list. This FLC generated a fair bit of work for Matthew, but instead of removing the images with issues he fixed or sought out replacement images instead. Good job! <b style="color:#E32636;">Rambo's Revenge</b> <b style="color:#FFA500;">(talk)</b>  15:11, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Support, all issues resolved. Dabomb87 (talk) 16:53, 17 January 2009 (UTC)

Sources look good. Dabomb87 (talk) 18:57, 16 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Support with condition - can you change the prose of President James Buchanan was a lifelong bachelor whose niece, Harriet Lane, served as First Lady. She is the only person not married to a President who is considered an official First Lady. by combining sentences?  miranda   00:06, 17 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Thank you! I did change it somewhat. Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 04:07, 17 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Comment All image issues have been resolved. All images used are now confirmed to be free. BomBom (talk) 01:10, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Comment - The White House has kindly redesigned their site; the ref links to the First Ladies no longer work. I am working to get them all back. Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 20:34, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Done Matthewedwards (talk • contribs • email) 21:15, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.