Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of New York Islanders team captains/archive1


 * The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was not promoted by Dabomb87 22:35, 1 August 2009.

List of New York Islanders team captains

 * Nominator(s):  iMatthew  talk   at 13:46, 19 July 2009 (UTC)

I've read this over a few times, and everything looks okay to me. However, when we write things, they always look fine to us. So any and all help is appreciated. Nonetheless, I believe it meets the criteria.  iMatthew  talk   at 13:46, 19 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Comment There's an error in Potvin's playoff stats: $$ 33 + 72 \ne 91 $$. Otherwise it looks OK. -- Maxim (talk)  15:12, 19 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Fixed.  iMatthew  talk   at 15:40, 19 July 2009 (UTC)


 * There's one disambiguation link; check the toolbox. Dabomb87 (talk) 15:56, 19 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Done.  iMatthew  talk   at 17:23, 19 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Comments from
 * Dabs and external links
 * Both check out fine.
 * Lead
 * The Islanders arrived in Uniondale in 1972, and play their home games at the Nassau Veterans Memorial Coliseum. -- 1)When you say arrive, it sounds like they came from somewhere else. How about were founded instead? 2)for the second part how about rewording it to and have played their home games at the Nassau Veterans Memorial Coliseum ever since.
 * I don't see this as a necessary change. It sounds just fine to me the way it is. I happened to copy it directly from another NYI list.
 * Hmm, I guess it can fly. But how about The Islanders arrived in Uniondale in 1972, and have played their home games at the Nassau Veterans Memorial Coliseum.?
 * I don't think so. Your suggestion says "have played." Since they still play there, "and play their" sounds better to me.  iMatthew  talk   at 11:35, 25 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Bryan McCabe served the shortest length of time—56 regular season games -- This is optional but how about Bryan McCabe served the shortest length of time as captain, playing only 56 regular season games.
 * Done.
 * I disagree with this change for two reasons: it introduces many redundancies, as well as a grammatically incorrect noun plus-ing structure.  Maxim (talk)  23:50, 19 July 2009 (UTC)
 * True. Which is why I said optional, and I think I may have been wrong to introduce this change. Sorry, undo.-- T ru  c o   503 02:24, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Reverted.  iMatthew  talk   at 11:35, 25 July 2009 (UTC)
 * As of July 2009, the Islanders still do not have a team captain. --> As of July 2009, the Islanders team captain position remains vacant. (I just think it sounds better like that)
 * Hmm, what was suppose to go here lol? [this was empty at the time im writing this].-- T ru  c o   503 02:24, 20 July 2009 (UTC)\
 * Fixed  iMatthew  talk   at 11:35, 25 July 2009 (UTC)
 * There was no captain for the 2000–01 season either. -- Why not?
 * They don't give an explanation, usually. I searched for one, for about 30 minutes, but found nothing.
 * Would it be possible to state that in the lead, that it was for unknown reasons or a footnote, it just leaves the reader in suspense.-- T ru  c o   503 02:24, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Sure, fixed.  iMatthew  talk   at 11:35, 25 July 2009 (UTC)
 * List
 * Don't most of these lists have a key explaining the position acronyms?
 * I feel like a link to the articles are enough. But if you feel it's necessary, I'll add it. Just let me know.  iMatthew  talk   at 23:35, 19 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I think the one used here shouldn't be too much of a problem.-- T ru  c o   503 02:24, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Fixed.  iMatthew  talk   at 11:35, 25 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Refs
 * Check out fine.-- T ru  c o   503 23:24, 19 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Replied.  iMatthew  talk   at 23:35, 19 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Neutral -- Previous issues resolved/clarified; 3b issue needs discussion.-- T ru  c o   503 15:11, 1 August 2009 (UTC)

Neutral Support ; although all issues were resolved and the list meets most of the criteria, I'm not sure it meets 3b, and it's worth more discussion. Dabomb87 (talk) 22:41, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

Sources look good. Dabomb87 (talk) 02:17, 24 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Netural I see it being FL level, but the possiblity it could be merged is still there so I don't feel like I should vote support nor should I vote oppose.-- Will C  15:14, 30 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Comments from Wrestlinglover


 * Lead
 * Is "captaincy" even a word?
 * Of course. :)  iMatthew  talk   at 01:22, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I'll take your word for it. I've never seen it used in a sentence before.
 * Link "vacant" appropriately please.
 * Done.  iMatthew  talk   at 01:23, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Key
 * The key doesn't need its own section, just move it into the captains one.
 * Yes it does, most other featured lists have the key as it's own section.  iMatthew  talk   at 01:22, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Possibly, but in this case it seems out of place.-- Will C  01:57, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Seems fine to me...  iMatthew  talk   at 02:01, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Explain what the dashes mean in the table. Just to be safe than sorry.
 * It's common sense. Case of don't fix it if it's not broken, IMO.  iMatthew  talk   at 01:22, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * IDK, I've seen some dumb ips and editors, so common sense at times is just non-existent.-- Will C  01:57, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Articles shouldn't be built based on "dumb ips and editors" though.  iMatthew  talk   at 02:01, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * True, but it helps to avoid problems and make sure everyone can understand the article.-- Will C  02:47, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * While we try to make our articles as accessible as possible to readers, we have to assume that they have a basic level of intelligence. As a comparison, imagine having to explain every bit of jargon in sports articles, or adding a citation needed tag to basic facts such as "The United States is a country." Dabomb87 (talk) 02:56, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Captains
 * Seems fine.
 * References
 * What makes The Internet Hockey Database reliable?-- Will C  01:14, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I couldn't tell you off the top of my head, but it's a proven reliable website, used in tons of featured hockey content. If you can't take my word for it, I'll get you some links of recently approved FLs that use it.  iMatthew  talk   at 01:23, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Featured list candidates/List of Chicago Blackhawks players/archive4 Dabomb87 (talk) 01:23, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * In retrospect though, I don't know if that's good enough. Some of the sources in their bibliography are questionable. For example, "The Hockey News. It's great as a secondary source, but it's accuracy is questionable."
 * Well I'll take it in good faith.-- Will C  01:57, 29 July 2009 (UTC)


 * (ec) Oppose – 3b. Sorry to come in and drop a bomb on this discussion, but at the last NHL captains FLC, it was decided that a seperate list was unnecessary. Several reviewers, including myself, suggested that the captains be highlighted on teams' player lists instead. Taking into account the fact that this list is much shorter than the Blackhawks' list, I believe this fails the much-discussed new criterion against content forks.  Giants2008  ( 17–14 ) 01:32, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I'd have to disagree. This list goes into more detail about the team's captaincy, and I do believe (not just because I'm looking for this to pass) that it deserves it's own article. It could probably be merged with the players list, but that gets rid of a lot of the information. It doesn't allow readers to know when the players was captain, and their statistics from their term as captain.  iMatthew  talk   at 01:37, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't think that Wikipedia's only coverage on the history of Islanders' captains should be covered by a silly color code on a (currently non-existent) table, containing every player to ever play for the team.  iMatthew  talk   at 01:40, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I've also questioned if this is long enough for its own article. I can see this easily fitting into another article.-- Will C  01:57, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Did you read my reply?  iMatthew  talk   at 02:01, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes, I did.-- Will C  02:47, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Looking at the list again, I'd have to agree that this could reasonably be merged. If you wanted, you could create a separate section in the players list in which you could put this table. Dabomb87 (talk) 02:20, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't think that's possible. The players list is already long enough as a plain list. It's on my list of projects to do. When I expand it, the list will be turned into a big table, like the other players lists. In that huge article, which I was trying to even cut in half (see User talk:Resolute) I don't see room for another list and more prose.  iMatthew  talk   at 10:28, 29 July 2009 (UTC)
 * List of Chicago Blackhawks players has a paragraph in the lead on team captains, so some of that detail could be included in a players list. Also, I'd expect that all of the table's information would be included as well. Unfortunately, there's nothing unique about this list that merits a split, hence the 3b problem.  Giants2008  ( 17–14 ) 22:13, 1 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Oppose - per 3b - sorry, but in my opinion, this list is a content fork because it can be merged.— Chris!  c t 01:34, 30 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Can you explain how it could be merged, and where? I gave an explanation above about why it really can't be merged. A list of team captains shouldn't have colors on a (currently non-existent) table be it's only representation on Wikipedia. It is a notable topic. It was also suggested adding the table and prose to the players list. That wouldn't work, because it's already very long. A discussion is even going on about splitting the goalies and skaters on the players list (into different articles) because it's so long.  iMatthew  talk   at 11:04, 30 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Comment -- I see how this could potentially be 3b, just because it passes the "theoretical" 10-item rule does not mean it automatically deserves a list by itself. The only way I see that this could pass 3b is if the tables were expanded to add more about the captains and not just stats, or just make 'em larger in general. If not, I think a fix-up of List of New York Islanders players might be needed and this captains list merged in there.-- T ru  c o   503 15:11, 1 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree totally with Truco.— Chris!  c t 19:19, 1 August 2009 (UTC)
 * If the Islanders players list proves to be too long, you can always split it alphabetically: List of New York Islanders players (A–M) and List of New York Islanders players (N–Z). Dabomb87 (talk) 19:22, 1 August 2009 (UTC)
 * What additional information do you suggest adding to the table? Dabomb, then where would the team captains go? A-M or N-Z?  iMatthew  talk   at 19:24, 1 August 2009 (UTC)
 * You could put in a dedicated table for captains whose last names begin with the given letters, and use a see link for convenient access to the other list of captains. Dabomb87 (talk) 19:35, 1 August 2009 (UTC)

Oppose - This is how it would look like if the article was merged into the main one. The only thing that could strike my oppose is if new information is given for the NYI captains. Also, could someone nominate List of Vancouver Canucks captains for FLRC? That would be appreciated. --  SRE.K.A.L. &#124; L.A.K.ERS ]]  19:38, 1 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Done. Dabomb87 (talk) 19:47, 1 August 2009 (UTC)


 * I'll figure out what to do with it soon. I'll probably wind up merging it back into the main NYI article. Thanks for your input, everybody! Please close this as withdrawn,  iMatthew  talk   at 22:21, 1 August 2009 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.