Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of journalists killed in Mexico/archive1


 * The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was not promoted by User:Hahc21 10:02, 16 September 2013 (UTC).

List of journalists killed in Mexico

 * Nominator(s): ComputerJA ( ☎  •  ✎  ) 20:25, 24 July 2013 (UTC)

I am nominating this for featured list because I believe the article is among the most important ones of the Freedom of Speech project. It is cited with reliable sources throughout the whole article, and I have not found a thorough list of journalists killed in Mexico in my research. ComputerJA ( ☎  •  ✎  ) 20:25, 24 July 2013 (UTC)

Comments- A few initial observations:
 * Date – If the default is supposed to be chronological, the second entry is out of order. Also, the sorting function for date is not working properly. Because the dates are not consistent in their format (i.e., some have day/month/year and others month/year, and a few just year) you may need to use a hidden key for sorting and should refer to MOS:DTT.
 * Good catch. I didn't see the second entry out of place. Some of the sources, unfortunately, only give the year. I'll do some research again for those that only have the year and see if I can find the complete dates.
 * See hidden key sort to get an idea of behind the scenes sorting.-Godot13 (talk) 20:45, 22 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Name – The column is sorting by first name, it would be better by last name.
 * Thanks for the suggestion. Do you mean I should put the last name first and then his first name (i.e. Doe, John)? I'm not sure what you're looking for.
 * That could be one way. I think the names look better as is, it's a matter of behind the scenes sorting to get them to list alphabetically by last name.-Godot13 (talk) 20:45, 22 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Location – Sometimes the town/city is accompanied by the state, sometimes it is not. This needs to be consistent. Also, the town (or state, if the town does not have an article) should be linked to the relevant article. Since this is a sortable table, it should be linked each time. What does “N/A” mean for location? The place of death is unknown? I’m not sure how that would be not applicable.
 * (1) The ones that stand by themselves are the states. Some sources only mention the state they were killed, unfortunately. I also left Mexico City on its own b/c it is a federal entity and is not within a state.
 * Ok.-Godot13 (talk) 20:45, 22 August 2013 (UTC)
 * (2) I just linked the towns, cities, and states without doing overlinking. So should I link each place for each journalist?
 * In a sortable table, a link in necessary each time. Given that the city link will provide the relevant state in its article, I personally don't think you need to link the state as well. But each line in the location column should have at least one link (in my opinion for a sortable table)-Godot13 (talk) 20:45, 22 August 2013 (UTC)
 * (3) Though it might be bizarre, there are sources that give all the other information (date, name, and media outlet) but do not mention the place. I'll make sure to double check on the web and see if I can find anything, though. The N/A in this case means "Not available."


 * Media outlet – Whenever possible, these should be linked to articles. Articles may not exist, please check to be certain.
 * Thanks, just linked the ones that have an article. Would linking a newspaper twice be consider overlinking?

ComputerJA ( ☎  •  ✎  ) 05:54, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * No, given it is a sortable table.-Godot13 (talk) 20:45, 22 August 2013 (UTC)

*Check reference 40 for the date.
 * Good catch. Ref fixed.


 * Suggestion – a relevant image for the lead paragraph that is visually engaging for the reader.
 * Thanks. I'll see if I can make a map of Mexico with the states and killings using data from Committee to Protect Journalists. The states with the most murders of journalists would be in darker red, and the ones with the least (or none) in lighter red or blank.


 * Looking through the references it is evident that you have put in a great deal of work on this list.-Godot13 (talk) 03:31, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Thank you, and thanks for your suggestions above. ComputerJA ( ☎  •  ✎  ) 05:54, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Just as a drive-by comment, the fact that the dates are sortable is, currently, not particularly useful. Rather than 1 January 2013/January 2013, you could format it as 2013-01-01/2013-01, which would allow us to sort by date. J Milburn (talk) 22:48, 12 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Hmm, interesting. Year-month-day, correct? ComputerJA ( ☎  •  ✎  ) 06:02, 17 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Support, extremely important page related to WP:Freedom of speech and Freedom of speech. &mdash; Cirt (talk) 20:30, 22 August 2013 (UTC)


 * The intro is very interesting to read, but it doesn't really cover the table very well. I would not mind another paragraph with some of the more famous assassinations, and perhaps some statistics; also, a graph about reported deaths per decade? Nergaal (talk) 20:04, 27 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your suggestion, Nergaal. Where do you think the statistics should go? On the first paragraph by the end or in the final (two-sentence) paragraph? Given that this Wikipedia list is WAY longer than any list provided by Committee to Protect Journalists, Reporters Without Borders, ARTICLE 19, and others, the figures provided by them will be conflicting with the number of journalists mentioned on this list. This is the only reason why I decided not to include so many stats and numbers, because many sources have different death-tolls—I assume this is rooted on the disagreement surrounding the definition of "journalist", who knows. ComputerJA ( ☎  •  ✎  ) 23:54, 27 August 2013 (UTC)

Quick comments/oppose The Rambling Man (talk) 09:30, 29 August 2013 (UTC)
 * The table needs to meet WP:ACCESS per MOS:DTT for row and col scopes.
 * The table sorting needs to be fixed (e.g. the date column's sorting is completely wrong).
 * Refs don't need to be sortable.
 * Section titles include "Drug War" but this isn't mentioned in that form in the lead. I would reduce the lead and have introductory paragraphs for each table.
 * Ref 26 for example, "p. 25-26." page ranges need to be pp. and use an en-dash, not a hyphen per WP:DASH. Check others.
 * Avoid SHOUTING in ref titles.
 * New York Times is The New York Times.
 * Global Post -> GlobalPost. And it looks like a publisher rather than a work.
 * Please add page numbers or ranges to refs which use PDFs.
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.