Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Echmiatsin

Echmiatsin
Voting period ends on 17 Sep 2014  at 19:45:13 (UTC)
 * Reason:Great EV. Exceptional quality.
 * Articles in which this image appears:Etchmiadzin Cathedral, Vagharshapat
 * FP category for this image:Featured pictures/Diagrams, drawings, and maps/Drawings
 * Creator:Jean Chardin


 * Support as nominator – Étienne Dolet (talk) 19:45, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment - The crop is not straight, even though the original engraving is. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 01:40, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
 * The original is the crop and the crop is the uncropped version? Nothing confusing there [head spins round, flies off]. Belle (talk) 15:18, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment They are both crops. The original, as Crisco purports, is not aligned. I just provided a new one. Étienne Dolet (talk) 17:58, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Support ALT 1 with caption - or ANY Hafspajen (talk) 08:25, 10 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Oppose I'm not keen on prints being cropped to remove their titles. (Which of the criteria is that you say? 8 maybe? Feels wrong to me anyway.) Belle (talk) 16:55, 10 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment - the fram has spots and marks .. probably this is why it is cropped. Strictly the frame is not part of the engraving, it is just the paper it is printed on. I recognize this building, even if the presentation doesn't saying it, is considered the oldest cathedral in the world. Hafspajen (talk) 18:05, 10 September 2014 (UTC)
 * I'm not talking about the paper, I'm talking about the title which is part of the original engraving. Belle (talk) 21:18, 10 September 2014 (UTC)
 * I'm quite confused over your reasoning behind the oppose vote . For one, the "title" is in a foreign language. Why have it when it can be easily conveyed to the reader in a form of a caption that can be easily translated into English? In fact, I don't see this as a title at any rate. It's more of a caption than anything else. Étienne Dolet (talk) 04:37, 11 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Call it an aesthetic choice if you wish. Caption, title, it doesn't make much difference; it is part of the engraver's work. Perhaps I'm looking at it from the point of view of featuring the the engraver's work rather than featuring a representation of the cathedral, so that it is not in English doesn't alter my feelings at all; the caption gives it some context. I don't like the tight cropping of plates either, the size of the image in relation to the paper is often an artistic choice too. I'll strike my oppose as I'm on shaky ground with the criteria (woooo, I felt it give a bit then), but I won't support either (so, a wall of text for no discernible change in the nomination's status; good one, Belle). Belle (talk) 08:06, 11 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Personally, I rather keep the captions for images like this, as they are part of the artist's creative endeavour, presentations to viewers and readers. Hence why I haven't !voted here. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 09:47, 11 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Probably Étienne can provide us with a third alt ALT 3 with caption? Hafspajen (talk) 11:53, 11 September 2014 (UTC)
 * I've added ALT1 with caption. Let me know what you think:, , Étienne Dolet (talk) 18:34, 11 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Well, I still support it, and the reason is that the Armenian Church has a very special position in the history of the early christianity. They were actually the first Christian church outside the original Jewish Christian Church of Jerusalem, earlier then both the early Coptic church and the Roman Early Christian church too, now that is something, you know. And this building as I pointed out is considered as the first or one of the first cathedral.  So,,  - now that Etienne gave you the third picture? Hafspajen (talk) 09:16, 12 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Getting there. Could still use a bit of restoration though. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 09:23, 12 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Restauration such as ... ? Hafspajen (talk) 10:49, 12 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Hairs, pencil marks, dirt... — Crisco 1492 (talk) 15:04, 13 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Also, without the caption, you're also removing the edges of the image, which means it could never be printed in such a manner that it was at all similar to how engravings are printed - razor-sharp borders are not something seen in engravings. Adam Cuerden (talk) 04:59, 13 September 2014 (UTC)

--Armbrust The Homunculus 19:46, 17 September 2014 (UTC)