Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Image:Anschlusstears.jpg

Crying Sudeten woman saluting Hitler, 1938

 * Reason:This famous image has been used as propaganda both by the Nazi government as well as the U.S. Originally published in the Völkischer Beobachter, the Nazi explanation was that here were portrayed the intense emotions of joy which swept the Sudeten Germans as Hitler crossed the Czech border at Asch and drove through the streets of the nearby ancient city of Eger [the German name for Cheb], 99% of whose inhabitants were ardently pro-Nazi Sudeten Germans at the time. However, in the National Archives and Records Administration, this image is captioned, "The tragedy of this Sudeten woman, unable to conceal her misery as she dutifully salutes the triumphant Hitler, is the tragedy of the silent millions who have been 'won over' to Hitlerism by the 'everlasting use' of ruthless force."
 * Articles this image appears in:Sudetenland, German occupation of Czechoslovakia, History of Czechoslovakia
 * Creator:Völkischer Beobachter (National Socialist newspaper)


 * Support as nominator &mdash;  howcheng  {chat} 20:41, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I am pretty sure that this is a cropped version of the original, or perhaps 2 photographs were made within a short period of time, some have derided this photograph as being deceptive, but I'm sure someone else will mention thisBleh999 21:19, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
 * never mind you did include a link to the original Bleh999 21:25, 4 June 2007 (UTC)
 * never mind you did include a link to the original Bleh999 21:25, 4 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Support Bleh999 21:25, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Discussion reopened. I took the liberty of moving this back to the top of the nomination pile, since we didn't really get much comment on it due to the copyright clarification.  howcheng  {chat} 06:36, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Copyright issue clarified. I would like to drop my opposition to this photograph on copyright grounds.  It was difficult to get an explicit statement on the copyright status of these photos from NARA, but I finally got one, which I much appreciate.  Please see User:Pharos/NARA.--Pharos 04:08, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
 * [[Image:Symbol support vote.svg|15px]] Support, conditionally with the assumption that this is copyright eligible, if it ends up that it isn't and I don't get a chance to change my vote please disregard. Cat-five - talk 15:54, 7 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Support Provided that the caption (image page and in article) do no inaccurately represent the image one way or the other. &mdash; BRIAN 0918 &bull; 2007-06-19 14:51Z
 * Support If the copyright works out. 8thstar 23:18, 19 June 2007 (UTC)
 * The copyright has been worked out.  howcheng  {chat} 00:24, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Sweet... ;) 8thstar 01:11, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Support A good historic depiction of something that couldn't be re-created. Jellocube27 17:16, 20 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Weak oppose Yes, a good historic depiction of something, but of what? Perhaps it's a good historic depiction of an emotive scene that was photographed and served opposing propaganda roles? Do we have an article on that? This is a powerful image, no doubt, but it's a propaganda image first, and a historic one second. Would be a good candidate on Commons. —Pengo 00:22, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I have to admit, the fact that the photograph was (perhaps deceptively) cropped does lessen its encyclopedic value... Bleh999 05:43, 21 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Weak support Emotive and very high on enc. value, but the crop leaving a "floating arm" really destroys it in terms of the picture itself. Pedro | Chat  07:49, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Oppose. I was going to support until I saw Pengo's post. Considering we do not even know whether she was crying from joy or sadness, this picture is of low encyclopedic value (unless the use of the image as propaganda is being discussed in the main text, which it is not).  It can't be used to show what the normal emotional response of people in Sudetenland was to Nazi occupation, or even really as an example of one woman's emotional response, because the photo is ambiguous without some sort of accompanying interview, which we obviously don't have. Calliopejen1 08:34, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Interestingly the same photograph was used by the nazis as evidence of her being overcome with emotion at the entry of German soldiers, while the allies used it as propaganda that she was crying out of sadness, the truth may never be known Bleh999 09:01, 21 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Strong support: A photo used by both sides? One worthy of discussion in and of itself? Definition of encyclopædic. Adam Cuerden talk 10:33, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Hmm, that said, though, maybe we could crop it a bit tighter? That would remove (most of) the hand. Adam Cuerden talk 10:56, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

--Raven4x4x 09:43, 27 June 2007 (UTC)