Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Les Arts Florissants performs Dido & Aeneas

Les Arts Florissants performs Dido & Aeneas
Voting period ends on 23 Dec 2022  at 18:16:25 (UTC)
 * Reason:Very high-quality excerpt of a professional rendition of Henry Purcell's Dido and Aeneas by Les Arts Florissants
 * Articles in which this image appears:Lea Desandre, Dido and Aeneas, Henry Purcell, William Christie (musician), Les Arts Florissants (ensemble)
 * FP category for this image:Featured pictures/Culture, entertainment, and lifestyle/Culture and lifestyle
 * Creator:Les Arts Florissants, uploaded by user:czar


 * Support as nominator – czar  18:16, 10 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose - Copyrighted, see end titles. Does the uploader have permission from all involved? Also self-promotion and ineligible, was uploaded just 3 days ago and added to article(s) yesterday. --Janke | Talk 10:39, 11 December 2022 (UTC)
 * @Janke & Sca, yes, by the ensemble itself. This is the ensemble very clearly releasing their own performance on their official channel. The compositions are hundreds of years old and out of copyright. Being added to articles yesterday doesn't make the nomination ineligible—that's only a preference. It will not be removed from all articles. I fail to see what is self-promotional about this video given its high educational value, rare quality for this open license, and minimal titling. czar  15:04, 11 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose – Per Janke. – Sca (talk) 13:17, 11 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment – I don't see anything wrong with the CC copyright license (check the Youtube release description, the copyright owner is releasing it with a CC license). I very much doubt the video will be removed from its two primary-EV articles, namely, . As far as self-promotion, 1- the ensemble isn't uploading and nominating this video, 2- it isn't any different than FP images showing professional athletes playing their sport, or astronauts in spacesuit, but with the added benefit that this video has EV in two articles on art history (not just the articles of the individuals depicted, as is the case with photos of many athletes and astronauts). User:CZAR, since this is a recent upload, the file page has a copyright notice saying the copyright has not been reviewed by a Commons admin. In case this nom doesn't pass, I say wait until that notice is resolved and then renominate the video. Support, once the Commons review tag is resolved. Bammesk (talk) 16:53, 11 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose – I'm not as confident as others that this particular clip will stick in some of the articles into which it has just been inserted. In Dido and Aeneas it duplicates the existing audio file of Kirsten Flagstad's recording of the same aria, which (leaving aside cavils about "authentic" performance style) is a widely admired memento of the historic postwar production at the Mermaid Theater in London, which was arguably the most famous production of this opera in the 20th century. And in Henry Purcell, it's not clear (at least to me) what it is supposed to illustrate. The paragraph on Dido and Aeneas in that article focuses chiefly on the circumstances of the work's composition and its publication history; it mentions neither this aria nor any other specific musical passage. Even more perplexingly, the nominated clip does not appear anywhere near that paragraph; instead it has been inserted into the section at the end of the article devoted to Purcell "in popular culture", a motely collection of contemporary trivia where its presence seems especially gratuitous. Choliamb (talk) 00:48, 12 December 2022 (UTC)
 * And then it'll still be in several other articles... Even if used primarily in the Lea Desandre and Les Arts Florissants article, it still has high encyclopedic and educational value. Placement within the article is a matter of routine editing. czar  03:22, 12 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Support – Yann (talk) 19:28, 20 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Oppose per Janke and Choliamb. Moreover, no-one has ventured to explain how it meets one of the essential FP criteria, namely "must add significantly [my bold] to at least one article on Wikipedia". I see no evidence of this criterion being met, or even argued. Being a 'very high-quality excerpt of a professional rendition' (which I do not dispute) is not the issue here: in what way does it add significantly to any of the articles into which it has been inserted? Choliamb's comments are particularly relevant in this respect. Smerus (talk) 20:24, 21 December 2022 (UTC)
 * @Smerus, none of the other FPCs make such a rationale, if they give any rationale at all. Is it not abundantly clear that this is a high-quality example of the aria being performed by name-recognized (individually notable) performers? Is it not clear that it serves both to identify both the performers and the ensemble, for each of their articles? Is it not clear that in a copyright environment where performances are rarely released under free licenses, this video demonstrates, in high detail, each of the performers as they play their piece of the composition? To say it's unclear what it adds to these articles strikes me as disingenuous. If we need to pick one article to make the case, pick Lea Desandre. It's a world-class demonstration of her vocal performance.  czar  21:36, 21 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Perhaps Czar would care to explain what they mean by accusing my comment of disengenuiity. I did not make the rules for FP, nor is our concern in this discussion the qualification of other nominations for FP. Either the nomination meets the rules or it does not. This video, whilst it displays excellent music, does not seem to me to be in any way notable as a picture (which is what FP is about- "the finest images on Wikipedia" as you will see at WP:FP); no one in this discussion has indicated anything visually notable about it. If there was a Featured Video or Featured Performance item on WP, it might well qualify - but that is not what is under discussion. The video undoubtedly displays Desandre's abilities, but it does that aurally, not as a picture. Perhpas Czar could give examples of other videos which have been accepted as FPs (I am as it happens not myself aware of any) to assist us with the background of their nomination.--Smerus (talk) 09:12, 22 December 2022 (UTC)
 * About "examples of other videos", there are examples in the FP categories here,     and others. The FP criteria allows for videos and animations, see the last bullet in criterion 2. On a different note, the instructions on top of the WP:FPC page require oppose votes be accompanied with a rationale. There is no such requirement for support votes, so generally a support rationale isn't the default. It is very common to disagree on what is and isn't "significant EV". The FP criteria isn't very clear on that. Personally I interpret "significant EV" as enhancing an article(s) (compared to other potential/possible visual media candidates), relating to the article's content, and knowing our articles are viewed by expert, non-expert, and novice readers alike. Also sometimes I go by "being eye-catching to the point where users will want to read its accompanying article" per instruction on top of the WP:FPC page. Bammesk (talk) 02:44, 23 December 2022 (UTC)

--Armbrust The Homunculus 10:13, 24 December 2022 (UTC)