Wikipedia:Featured picture candidates/Sha-có-pay, (The Six), Chief of the Plains Ojibwa

Sha-có-pay
Voting period ends on 25 Jan 2014  at 04:59:28 (UTC)
 * Reason:High level of historic value. Sha-có-pay who's name apparently means "The Six" was painted from life by George Catlin. Catlin traveled throughout Western North America and painted Indians at a time when the only contact with Whites was from explorers and traders. The painting shows traditional Plains Ojibwe clothing such as a beaded buckskin shirt, a buffalo-hide blanket robe, eagle feathers, hair pipes, and a beaded necklace that is unique to the tribes of the northernmost plains (Ojibwe and Cree). Painted at Fort Union in 1832.
 * Articles in which this image appears:Ojibwe people, Sha-có-pay, George Catlin, Saulteaux
 * FP category for this image:Featured pictures/People/Traditional
 * Creator:George Catlin


 * Support as nominator --MatGTAM (talk) 04:59, 15 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Support - Nice to see this sort of nomination again. Solid painting, solid scan. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 05:31, 15 January 2014 (UTC)
 * As a side point, couldn't we have an article about this painting/person? — Crisco 1492 (talk) 05:31, 15 January 2014 (UTC)


 * Support - I just made the article right now.--Theparties (talk) 15:37, 15 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Thank you, that's a very useful article and helps increase the EV of this image. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 12:35, 16 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Support. Love the caption- the main page blurb will practically write itself! Great EV for Carlin, the Ojibwe people and, of course, the subject himself- would fit in People/Political, People/Traditional or Painting FP categories. J Milburn (talk) 17:46, 16 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Support J e e  07:10, 18 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Oppose. This is not the best Catlin painting - or the best image by him that Wikipedia has. It has very limited EV stuck in the bottom of a gallery on Catlin's article and the article written on the painting itself can't even determine which of the several Shacopee's this is a painting of. He may even be a "multi-tribal" person so the painting's use as an example of dress in individual tribe articles may be limited. Rmhermen (talk) 18:24, 21 January 2014 (UTC)
 * The other Shacopee's are Dakotas (albeit with Ojibwe heritage) but the one Catlin painted could only be Shacopee II, however that Shacopee was forced to only identified himself as Dakota after the signing of Treaty of Fond du Lac in 1826. The man in the Catlin painting also has an Ojibwe wife and was painted far from Minnesota at Fort Union in North Dakota along the Montana border. I have already nominated two other Catlin paintings that now have feature status and believe this one to be of equal quality. The remaining images by Catlin on this site are too small for feature quality. The image has a better place in the George Catlin article. MatGTAM (talk) 10:41, 21 January 2014 (UTC)
 * "the article written on the painting itself can't even determine which of the several Shacopee's this is a painting of. " - Pardon? — Crisco 1492 (talk) 23:20, 21 January 2014 (UTC)
 * This may or may not be Shacopee II who was a Ojibwe adopted by Sioux - and later in life identifying with the Sioux - and his clothes have been identified as Sioux, not Dakota in a source in Sha-có-pay. (And the related painting of his wife is claimed to show her wearing a Dakota man's garment.) There are questions on Caitlin's reliablity here. See also the discussion on identity at Talk:Sha-có-pay. How much EV can this have if we haven't id'ed the subject? The image has been stuck in the Saulteaux article, despite that being a Canadian tribe (maybe also "far from Minnesota" where Shacopee II lived?). Rmhermen (talk) 20:30, 23 January 2014 (UTC)
 * That does not affect the EV of an article on the painting itself. Rather, it makes the article more interesting. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 23:20, 23 January 2014 (UTC)

--Armbrust The Homunculus 08:51, 25 January 2014 (UTC)