Wikipedia:Featured portal candidates/Portal:Cuba

Portal:Cuba
This is a second nomination. The first nomination failed miserably, (see Wikipedia:Featured portal candidates/Portal:Cuba/archive1) and since that time, various measures have been undertaken to improve the portal and address the previous shortcomings.-- Z leitzen (talk)  02:34, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

Support

 * Oppose Support. Has somewhat improved, but once again I suggest referring to the portal peer review. Comments:
 * Merge "Detailed site map" into "Main topics".
 * Do you mean move the site map into the Main Topics section?-- Z leitzen (talk)  20:02, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
 * "Wikiprojects" > "WikiProjects".✅ The image in that section is absolutely unnecessary.
 * The image is the banner for the project, hence it's inclusion.-- Z leitzen (talk)  20:02, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
 * "Featured content" focuses solely on articles.
 * Previously I was told "If you are making a list then it should be named Featured content"-- Z leitzen (talk)  20:02, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Related portal should be related to the subject (e.g. the geography portal), not nearby countries.
 * Is that the case? I took my lead from other featured potals such as Portal:Germany. Besides, linking to other Caribbean portals is surely helpful to readers.-- Z leitzen (talk)  20:02, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
 * No need in a purge link in a certain section, adding "Show new selections" below the introduction would be enough.
 * Having the purge link in the section is a guide to users to change the selections in that section. There are no other sections that are randomised in that fashion, so if the purge link was moved, and a user wanted to see new selections they'd have to go to an unrelated part of the page.-- Z leitzen (talk)  20:02, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Image thumbnails or frames don't go well in portals and disturb the background. Look at our featured portals for styling.✅
 * The "Did you know..." could use an image. I advice adding this one.✅
 * "Randomized selections" > "Selection by date", not to mention there are very few good Cuba-related articles and images.
 * Could you clarify the "Randomized selections" > "Selection by date" comment? If you are asking why the articles, pics and so on are updated by date and the DYK section is updated at random, why not?
 * "In the news" section:
 * Avoid shortening months in the "In the news" section.✅
 * Remove the space between the dates and the colons.✅
 * Style all the "read more" links the same for constancy.✅
 * Could you clarify the third remark?-- Z leitzen (talk)  20:02, 16 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Remove each section's category from the portal's main page, leaving only Category:Cuba portal.  Michaelas10   (Talk)   15:30, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

I've added some ✅s. Some of the remaining points will require more thought and perhaps discussion. Regarding the other categories appearing on the main page, I don't know how to avoid that as they are transcluded from the sub categories on individual sub pages. Any idea how that is avoided? And could you clarify what "Style all the "read more" links the same for constancy" means in reference to "In the news".-- Z leitzen (talk)  19:09, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Regarding each of the remaining suggestions:
 * The "Detailed site map" provides exactly the same content already found on "Main topics". There's no need to add a separate section for additional less-important topics.
 * What are your thoughts on this? Personally, as a topics section in a portal should only contain major topics, I suggest to entirely remove the "Detailed site map" section.  Michaelas10   (Talk)   13:34, 17 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Although freely-licensed images may be used without a strong purpose, the image here appears to be confusing, giving the viewers the impression that the section solely lists this WikiProject. Maybe a small image next to each corresponding WikiProject would be better.✅ -- Z leitzen (talk)  00:57, 17 March 2007 (UTC)
 * The section's name isn't appropriate for its content. Either rename it to "featured articles" or add a subheader for them, leaving place for any future non-article additions.✅ -- Z leitzen (talk)  00:57, 17 March 2007 (UTC)
 * It does seem that Portal:Latin America lists all its countries inside the "Related portals" section, but they're all directly related to the subject, as opposed to nearby countries. Once again, I suggest adding portals that are closely associated with the country aspects.
 * ❌ Neighbouring countries are intrinsically associated with the country's aspects. Why remove them and make users have to go into another portal to locate Haiti, Jamaica, United States etc? I don't see that as a problem and it's an idea borrowed from featured portals Portal:Germany, Portal:Indonesia, Portal:Ukraine. -- Z leitzen  (talk)  00:57, 17 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I expect that a link inside a section would only apply to the section itself, not the portal in whole. Besides, the rest of the sections not being randomized is a subject to change.
 * ✅ -- Z leitzen (talk)  00:57, 17 March 2007 (UTC)
 * There are a few benefits of randomized display:
 * There isn't a need to return and update each of the sections. When you have found an article that you believe should be selected, just add it to the selections list.
 * As I've said, there are 9 FA/A class articles related to Cuba, which can hardly last until the end of this year. There aren't many good biographies as well.
 * Viewers don't have to wait an entire month or day for a selections switch.✅ -- Z leitzen (talk)  00:57, 17 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I've fixed that one myself.  Michaelas10   (Talk)   20:14, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

Hi Michaelas, Regarding the detailed site map, the initial inspiration came from comments in the previous nomination, that the portal lacked detailed links. Not being in anyway technically minded and getting help from my own more savvy kids, obviously I'm not going to approve of its removal as it took months of work and hundreds of edits to hone! Personally I though it was a triumphant innovation for a portal as it provides links to many, many pages in a clear and easy navigational form, that would WOW onlookers with its wizardry! Apparently not it seems :( In my opinion I would prefer it if the main topics section was removed, the site map was retained, and the guidelines be damned. The number one priority is the usefulness of the portal, and since the site-map was created I have found it very useful.-- Z leitzen (talk)  17:33, 17 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I would endorse if you think that the main topics section needs to be removed as a fork. However, unlike "site map", it is a very common section name in portals, so I suggest renaming the existing section following the removal. Anyhow I feel the portal has really improved since it was originally nominated, and I would be happy to support once all the corrections are made. Michaelas10Respect my authoritah 19:21, 17 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks Michaelas, I've removed the Main topics section - renamed the section and the site map "Topics" and uncollapsed the nav bar, which kind of works better for the portal! I've also sorted out the categories. The one remaining change I haven't initiated on your recommendations is the removal of "neighbouring countries" in the related portals section. I'd be interested to hear other users comments.-- Z leitzen (talk)  14:37, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

Further suggestions

 * A few things I can recommend for further improvements:
 * Additional portals could be useful, including Portal:Geography and Portal:North America. Also the bold text at the top of the section is unnecessary.✅
 * Minimize icons to 70px and add next to the corresponding WikiProjects (chronologically: Image:Wikiproject Cuba.jpg, Image:Central america.jpg, and Image:LocationWHLatinAmerica.png). Maybe reformat the section a little somewhat according to this (add additional bullets, remove the bolding for each WikiProject).
 * ✅ With some reservations as to how it looks.-- Z leitzen <sup style="color:orange;">(talk)  22:52, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I've modified it a little. Michaelas10<sup style="color:darkgreen;">Respect my authoritah 19:14, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
 * "Purge server cache" - Duplicates the existing "Show new selections".✅
 * Make formatting changes to the new archive according to the current; similarly add references in the "November" section.✅
 * "Quote of the day" - "Nominate" > "Nominate...". Michaelas10<sup style="color:darkgreen;">Respect my authoritah 16:19, 18 March 2007 (UTC)✅

Other than that, the portal looks good!  S.D.  12:32, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Support. A few more comments:
 * Related portals: I don't think "Related portals and portals of neighbouring countries:" is needed.✅
 * Categories: Maybe you could decrease the font size a little (example).✅


 * Thanks guys, your recommendations have been very helpful and have really improved the portal.-- Z leitzen <sup style="color:orange;">(talk)  21:32, 19 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Support Lots of work done, good job.  Jo  e  I  18:28, 1 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Comment The news section contains entries from February and very early March – that's not very well maintained.--cj | talk 01:32, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Well I check in every day to maintain this portal but that's Cuba for you, cj. One of the weirdest countries in the world with a state controlled media, only 11 million people and where very little happens or is reported at least. News is notoriously scarce and is not always what it seems. Foreign journalists are very rare and under supervision so news comes out in dribs and drabs. A new tractor in Bayamo can dominate headlines for days and one story about a school actually shared equal billing on main Havana paper Granma with Castro's sudden operation! Cuba state news has regular stories, but a lot of it is like this "Cuba Celebrates Victory over Invaders". it's important to have regular news stories but I don't want to turn the portal into a state news propaganda organ. I've been checking and updating news on a regular basis, but trust me, news from and about Cuba bares very little similarity to news about (say) France or India, and there is a cottage industry of blogs who can analyse the scant news we do get for weeks due to its scarcity. A latest front headline in Cuba state news was;;"The United States is a terrorist country and needs international criminals like Luis Posada Carriles to carry out its crimes against humanity."You get the picture. Actually, there are a couple of stories around at the moment so I can update now, but Cuba has been very quiet for months due to the political situation regarding Castro. To give you an idea, we still don't know what illness Castro is suffering from, and the Cuban papers went for over three months deliberately not mentioning him at all to focus on tractors and book fairs!!! Although you described the news section as not very well maintained, I checked other featured articles and would assess that this news section was in the top 10% for updated news. Which for a country so small and so lacking in news as Cuba was not bad going.-- Z leitzen <sup style="color:orange;">(talk)  01:50, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for providing some more recent stories. Given the scarcity of news coverage on Cuba, perhaps you should consider replacing the News section with another feature.--cj | talk 03:12, 23 April 2007 (UTC)