Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2007 December 8

= December 8 =

getting rid of red
When I sign my name, my user name is red. Most people's are blue. Can you change it for me or tell me how to do it? Thank you. Bothsidesspin (talk) 00:08, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * It's red because you haven't created a user page. To do that, just click the red link, write something, and save. PrimeHunter (talk) 00:11, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

GoodDay (talk) 00:15, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Huh? A registered user is defined as a user with an account, and somebody with an account name clearly has an account. I don't know whether you are thinking of autoconfirmed accounts (happens after 4 days), but that doesn't change the user page link. The link was red because it went to a page which had not been created at the time. See Red link. This goes for all pages and is nothing specific to user pages. The only way to avoid a red user page link in the signature, without somebody creating the user page, is to change the signature away from the default. PrimeHunter (talk) 00:28, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * My mistake, ignore my above observation. GoodDay (talk) 00:35, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * The custom on the help desk is to strike our errors, like this: Oops, my bad (and yes, I've had practice at this - but note, because of the way the brain forms memories, it turns out the more embarrassing our gaffes, the more firmly we will remember the accompanying lesson. I can still remember at least one word definition I missed on the Scholastic Aptitude Test decades ago). While we're on the subject of user pages, it's interesting to scroll around in Special:Listusers and note the low percentage of users who have them. Most user names appear as red links on Wikipedia. This suggests the majority of users who have created accounts have not yet gotten very far with editing on Wikipedia. --Teratornis (talk) 00:41, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Changes to American Dream
Could some of the experienced editors please review the recent changes to this article ? I'm having a hard time working out if this is vandalism, a violation of WP:NOR or simply a good faith (but confusing) rewrite. Thanks. CultureDrone (talk) 00:42, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Someone's finally taken the plunge and reverted the edits.CultureDrone (talk) 09:32, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Invalid password
Icannot get my password right. My e-mail address is . Thank you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.166.46.230 (talk) 01:28, 8 December 2007 (UTC)


 * If you set up an e-mail address for your account, you can click "E-mail new password" from the login page. This should send an e-mail message to you letting you change your password. Pyrospirit  ( talk  ·  contribs ) 02:03, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * If you have not set up e-mail, then I believe your only option is to create a new account. Algebraist 03:40, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

disappearing references
Can anyone tell me why my references disappeared on my page about Mary Kenny O'Sullivan? Eliz83 (talk) 01:41, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * You put where you wanted . I fixed it. --teb728 t c 01:55, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! Eliz83 (talk) 01:51, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Finding out who deleted a page
Is there some way I can find out who deleted some user-subpages I created? I created them and then they were deleted.

Thanks DTGardner (talk) 04:48, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * See Why was my page deleted? which describes how to search the deletion logs. --Teratornis (talk) 04:54, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

I have Searched the Deletion log and cannot find the article. DTGardner (talk) 05:02, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Never mind, the articles have been un-deleted... DTGardner (talk) 05:02, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Joe Klein article ("Controversy" section)
I need some advice rather quickly. I may -- or may not -- have started an edit war in the "Controversy" section of the Joe Klein article. An anonymous editor believes that the section is biased/unbalanced. I believe (quite firmly, I might add) otherwise. I would really appreciate input from experienced editors/administrators A.S.A.P. --Nbahn (talk) 04:55, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Luckily, based on what I have seen, this has not escalated to an edit war. Try to work out a compromise with the anonymous editor and, if the debate gets, heated, always remember not to get angry and to assume good faith. Because the other user believes the article is too critical about Klein and you believe it's fine as is, I would suggest adding some things that support Klein but remembering that most of the article shouldn't have an opinion at all. -- Qmwne 235  02:23, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

Business Ethics
Moral Philosophies in Business Ethics —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.152.90.103 (talk) 06:03, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * This page is designed for questions about Wikipedia only. You might want to ask on the Reference Desk, or try searching Google. Raven4x4x (talk) 06:58, 8 December 2007 (UTC)


 * If you want any sort of a meaningful response, you're better off writing a full sentence. If you want to type that word in a search engine, use google or the search box on the left of your screen. - Mgm|(talk) 08:50, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Uploaded image to en and commons, now want to get rid of en version.
Is there a way to delete an image I uploaded in error? Basically I have uploaded a newer version in commons and I'm not sure how to reference it specifically - the en version seems to take precedence. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mikeoligny (talk • contribs) 10:01, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * You can use NCD to tag the en image as moved to commons.  N F 24 (radio me!) 11:41, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Perfect, thank you! Mikeoligny (talk) 11:51, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Creating separate articles
I edit mainly Malaysian related articles, and i notice a lot of articles on places talk about two things in one article. Eg: Muar is a town in Johor state, and is also an administrative district (named after the town/capital). Many other articles are also like this: Sandakan, Kudat, Kuantan, Raub, etc. I think there should be separate articles for the town and districts. Should i proceed to create separate articles? kawaputra torque 10:47, 8 December 2007 (UTC)


 * There is no requirement to do this as a policy, but there is no prohibition against doing this either, so you must use common sense. The articles are not so large that a split is justified by the article size guideline. However, I think you should split them. As you say, each article is really about two distinct entities, and we generally prefer not to do that. When two governmental divisions are co-extensive, we generally do have a single article, but this is not the case here. If there is an appropriate wikiproject, please discuss this at the project first. -Arch dude (talk) 15:16, 8 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the reply. I'll consult the Malaysian wikiproject and will most probable create separate articles. kawaputra torque 03:47, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

Translating
Hello, I am interested in translating some articles from English to Czech. How will I do it? Thank you Marketa —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.147.239.227 (talk) 12:37, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Try the Czech Wikipedia (Interwiki links won't work today...). We over here at the English Wikipedia can only help you with translating articles from Czech to English; you can do this at WP:RFT if you are interested.  N F 24 (radio me!) 12:47, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Problem using Twinkle
I just installed Twinkle in my monobook and I'm using Firefox. But nothing has happened. Could someone please explain why? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hmrox (talk • contribs) 15:07, 8 December 2007 (UTC)


 * You need to click on Ctrl+Shift+R to clear the browser cache!  The Helpful One (Talk)(Contributions) 15:11, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Delete redirected page?
I redirected savanna theory to human evolution. Do I need to delete the savanah theory page? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Woland37 (talk • contribs) 16:46, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Hmm...after checking out the talk page, it seems it's been discussed what is should be redirected to. But seen as there is no clear cut consensus, I'd undo the edit, and contact WLU further. &mdash; Rudget speak.work 17:20, 8 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I'd say no. There is no benefit from deleting the page and you haven't shared any reason that would fit the deletion policy. If you incorporated any of the text from the redirected page in the redirect target, deletion would even be illegal. --Mgm|(talk) 10:37, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

New User
I want to make a new account to expirience what a new user experiences on WIki. Is there any way that I can do this without being considered a sock puppet? ♠ ♦  ♣  ♥  16:50, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * An alternative account is a sockpuppet, so there's no way to avoid it. An account like that is allowed, I believe, though I can't find it at WP:SOCK any more.  But if an account isn't creating problems, then it will not be scrutinised.  The same goes for sockpuppets.  x42bn6 Talk Mess  17:10, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * You're pretty new already, aren't you? &mdash; Rudget speak.work 17:17, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Referring to Wikipedia as "Wiki" is a bit of a newb shibboleth. --Teratornis (talk) 18:04, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * There is info at: Wp:sockpuppet; where it states "prominent users might create a new account to experience how the community functions for new users". --Jon186 (talk) 18:36, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

I've noticed that you if edit certain controversial articles, there is a chance people will call you a "sock" if they disagree with you (like evolution/creation, Israel, etc.). You can also be called a "sock" if you write extremist material. If you write on obscure topics, you will probably be ok. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Spevw (talk • contribs) 00:14, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
 * It's okay to have a sockpuppet account as long as you don't abuse it by voting twice, or fake more support for an idea or viewpoint than there really is. Using an alternate account to see how newbies are treated is perfectly fine. - Mgm|(talk) 10:35, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

pictures.
Please, I can't for the life of me figure out how to post pictures. I see the little button, but I'm not sure how to use it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by AlicetheDroog (talk • contribs) 17:01, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Click on the button to the left, "Upload file". Once you filled in all the boxes, it should upload. If you have any other troubles, I could upload it for you. :) &mdash; Rudget speak.work 17:16, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * You might also want to check this out before you upload the picture. VivioFa teFan   (Talk, Sandbox) 20:23, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

problem of format of audio and video files
the other day i asked the problem which is as followed: Hello, this is one poor guy, need your help badly....! coz the format of all the audio and video files is some kid "ogg" and on simple windows media player it doesnot run... we are here for study in cuba, and here the internet is fully restricted' except some sites like wikipedia... now i yearn to learn spanish, there is enough material for begginers in wikibooks' learn french catagory, but the main problem with the french is its pronunciation. here i cant download the extra codecs to listen the audio files given in content. plz do change the format,compatible to simple windows media player so that this poor guy could be able to fullfill his innocent wish. Please.....!

and i was suggested to download VLC players... and this i tried to do by every mean here.... but COULDN'T! the other one was:

You should check the file info page. There is a Java program that allows playing such files directly from your browser.

plz explain this, because i didnt understand where can i catch that "file info page". and how it can help me....

and plz do also suggest some other wayto do that.... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.220.222.140 (talk) 17:21, 8 December 2007 (UTC)


 * [[Image:Example.ogg|thumb|right|[[Media:Example.ogg]], a sample sound file that you can use to test.]] If the sound file you're trying to listen to is called "Example.ogg", then the info page for that file is at Image:Example.ogg. If you go to that page, you'll see a button similar to the one at right, which you can click on to play the sound file. For your convenience, I've included that button here for you to see what I'm talking about. If you click on the little blue "i" logo beneath the play button, you'll be brought to the info page for this file. I hope that helps, but please come back if you are still having trouble. Hers fold  (t/a/c) 18:17, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Lost my entry
I had just finished putting in a new entry, went to save it and got booted out. Any way to find the missing entry? —Preceding unsigned comment added by DonnPulley (talk • contribs) 17:49, 8 December 2007 (UTC)


 * If you didn't save the page, no, there is no way to access the changes you were making. Sorry. Hers fold  (t/a/c) 18:09, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Help needed to post a transalted article
I wrote an article "Abortion in Russia" for List of articles about abortion by country. I mostly use materials from Russian Wiki ru:Искусственный аборт. I am a new user and it is very difficult for me to figure out how to post and link this article. Can someone please post it?



Abortion in Russia According to the Basic Law of the Russian Federation on Citizens’ Healthcare ( July 22, 1993), every woman has a right to make decisions regarding her motherhood. Abortion on demand can be performed up to 12 weeks of pregnancy, due to social reasons - up to 22 weeks, and due to medical necessity and upon the woman’s consent – at any point during pregnancy. Abortion can only be performed in licensed institutions (typically hospitals or women’s clinics) and by physicians who have specialized training. According to the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation (article 123) performing abortion by a person who does not have a medical degree and specialized training, is punishable by fine up to 80,000 RU, or by fine up to 6 months income of the convicted, or by community service from 100h to 240h, or a jail term from 1 to 2 years. In cases when the illegal abortion resulted in the death of the mother or significant harm to her health, the convicted faces a jail term up to 5 years. Despite a significant reduction of the abortion to birth ratio since mid 1990s, the countries of the former USSR maintain the highest rate of abortions in the world. In 2001, in Russia 1,320,000 children were born, while 1,800,000 abortions were performed. [2] In 2005, 1,600,00 abortions were registered in Russia; and 20% of them involved underage mothers. [3] History Prior to the October Revolution of 1917 the Russian law considered abortion a homicide and was punishable by a 4 to 5 year jail term with the loss of civil rights. In 1903 the punishment was reduced to 3 years. Since then a popular demand to eliminate the punishment of the mothers, and to punish only the doctors, was growing. However, the old law effectively remained in force until November 18, 1920, when the Bolshevik’s government issued a Decree on Women’s Healthcare, which provided for free and on demand abortions for the first time in the world. The legalization reduced the fatality of abortions from 4% to 0.28%. [8] On June 27, 1936 the Stalin’s government issued a decree that prohibited abortions, while increasing financial help to mothers, families with multiple children, expanding the availability of obstetrician services and childcare facilities, more strictly enforcing child support obligations, and providing for minor changes in the divorce law. Abortion was allowed only in exceptional cases, such as a severe threat to a mother’s life or health, or upon indication of debilitating hereditary diseases of the parents. Some studies show that the rate of criminal abortions and the number of fatalities skyrocketed during this time. After the Stalin’s death, the prosecution of women for abortions was terminated on August 5, 1954. On November 23, 1955, the ban on abortions was lifted and on demand abortions in medical institution were legalized. This resulted in a significant reduction of women’s deaths during the abortion. Other consequences of this change were a significant growth of the number of abortions and what was widely perceived as discrimination against the reproductive and parental rights of fathers who had no right to interfere with the abortion decision. The new law gave women the leading position in parenthood planning, which changed the gender roles in the family and affected the Soviet society as a whole. [9] The abortion statistic in the USSR was classified until the end of the 1980s. [10] During this period the USSR had one of the highest abortion rates in the world. The abortion rate in the USSR peaked in 1964 when 5.6 mln. abortions were performed, the highest number in Russia’s history. [11] Nevertheless, the legalization of abortions did not fully eliminate criminal abortions [E.A. Sadvokasova].

1.	↑ http://www.zerkalo-nedeli.com/nn/show/234/21178/ 2.	↑ Заявление главного акушера и гинеколога России, директора Научного центра акушерства и гинекологии Владимира Кулакова 3.	↑ http://www.utro.ru/articles/2005/08/23/470519.shtml 4.	↑ Late consequences of abortion. British Medical Journal (Clin Res Ed). 1981 May 16; 282(6276): 1564—1565 5.	↑ Последствия абортов: мнение ученых // Мир православия (перевод статьи с ZENIT.ORG — католического информационного агеснтва США) 6.	↑ Abortion, Motherhood, and Mental Health: Medicalizing Reproduction in the United States and Great Britain (Book Review), British Medical Journal 2004; 328:1022 (24 April) 7.	↑ Ellie Lee. Abortion, Motherhood, and Mental Health: Medicalizing Reproduction in the United States and Great Britain. ISBN 0-202-30681-X 8.	↑ http://slovari.yandex.ru/dict/bse/article/00000/17000.htm 9.	↑ Оценка влияния абортов на семью и общество в статье «Матриархат в СССР» 10.	↑ Рассекреченная статистика числа абортов на 100 живорождений, 1960-2003 СССР-СНГ 11.	↑ Сайт «Демография России» 12.	↑ http://www.zerkalo-nedeli.com/nn/show/381/33825/ 13.	↑ http://www.zerkalo-nedeli.com/nn/show/254/22925/ 14.	↑ http://www.zerkalo-nedeli.com/nn/show/393/34767/ 15.	↑ http://www.zerkalo-nedeli.com/nn/show/39/40163/ 16.	↑ http://www.zerkalo-nedeli.com/nn/show/614/54504/ 17.	↑ http://www.zerkalo-nedeli.com/nn/show/358/32078/ —Preceding unsigned comment added by Walter Tau (talk • contribs) 17:53, 8 December 2007 (UTC)


 * The pages at Help:Starting a new page and Your first article should have most of the information you need. Before you begin, please carefully read through our policies and guidelines on notability, citing reliable sources for verification, neutrality, and formatting and article layout, where many new users commonly make mistakes. You may also want to consider checking out what Wikipedia is not, the deletion policy and criteria for speedy deletion so you know specifically what to avoid when writing your article.  Hers fold  (t/a/c) 18:07, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Looking for work
i have been watching your program and have noticed that you are looking for people to come and work for you but can not find any info on your web site could you please tell me where to find this info?

217.171.129.69 (talk) 18:28, 8 December 2007 (UTC).
 * Hmm...erm, you could donate? Not the same thing, but I can't find that link either! :) &mdash; Rudget speak.work 18:30, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Hi. I suspect, based on your question, that you found one of our over two million articles, and thought that we were affiliated with the organization the article was about, and comcomitantly thought this help desk was attached to that organization. If I am right, please note that this place is Wikipedia, an online free encyclopedia, and this desk is for questions about using the encyclopedia, so we have no specific information about work opportunities at a particular organization. You might try searching Google for the homesite of the organization. We do have a reference desk for asking knowledge questions, though I donlt think they will be able to help you much with a general employment inquiry at a specific company.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 18:39, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia is owned by Wikimedia, which has a job vacancies page at http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Job_openings, in case that helps. You may also be interested in local chapters. --Jon186 (talk) 18:45, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Very few people get paid at Wikipedia. Most people who write here do it so that they can see what they write appear on the internet. Spevw (talk) 00:12, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Jon186 is correct; the Wikimedia Foundation is hiring, and if you want a job doing something for Wikipedia, click on the link there.-- Qmwne 235  02:26, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

weight a baggage
hello for plane air asia what is the weigt of baggage ? and for more 15 kg by baggage  for price for 1 kilo one more please? email —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.83.242.123 (talk) 19:31, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I really don't think that Wikipedia is the place to figure out the weight of baggage. Try the website of the airplace service. ~ Bella   Swan  20:15, 8 December 2007 (UTC)  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bella Swan (talk • contribs)
 * This is the help desk for the free encyclopedia Wikipedia. Maybe you saw one of our more than 2 million articles, for example AirAsia, and thought we were the help desk for the subject. PrimeHunter (talk) 21:15, 8 December 2007 (UTC)


 * The best answer might be from asking Air Asia. Usually if your suitcase is even 1 kg too heavy, they could force you to check it in.  If checked luggage is too heavy, you have to pay a fee (most airlines). Spevw (talk) 00:10, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

Archive size
Greetings, anonymous help desk employee whose assistance I request. I should like to know whether there is any suggested or preferred size for talk page archives. I am under the impression that my archives are too short, and I shouldn't like to have overly numerous subpages; the only existing guidelines about archives that I am aware of provide general tips about breaking archives up thematically. Waltham, The Duke of 20:32, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't believe that there is a recommended size for archives. It really depends on the amount of discussion you get; maybe 32K is enough for normal users, while a quick canvass of several admin's talkpages shows a preferred archive size of about 100K. It's really up to you.  N F 24 (radio me!) 21:24, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * "Article size", I've written? I'd better change this. Anyway, my first two archives are 114K and 125K respectively; pretty longer than I remembered, actually.
 * This may sound strange, considering my previous question... I should probably split those archives, shouldn't I? Waltham, The Duke of 21:54, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * You might find some relevant information under WP:EIW. --Teratornis (talk) 23:27, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Nothing particularly useful there. I guess I shall try and keep the size of my archives around 100-125K, as they are not supposed to be edited (so there will be no size problem there) and it seems to me to be a good size for research purposes.
 * In any case, this Index I had barely noticed before. It is, to use a word I do not utter often, awesome. I am certain that it will help me find information about various things more easily.
 * Well, thank you all for the help. I guess there's one thing less to worry about. Waltham, The Duke of 00:06, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
 * The Editor's index is still under construction. The author will move it to the project (Wikipedia:) namespace when he "finishes," and we will also add links to it from various entry points into the Wikipedia help, to make it more obvious. I agree that the Editor's index deserves superlatives, both for its own usefulness, and for the underlying body of information it represents. That body of information, by the way, is the continuously mutating answer to the question: "How do we recruit millions of volunteers from every nation, background, and point of view, persuade them to work together to produce the largest encyclopedia in history, and make sure they know what to do in every editing situation that comes up more than once?" --Teratornis (talk) 07:02, 9 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I archive my talk page by month. Some people do it every 50 discussions, some do it every x kb. There is no right or wrong answer, but if you are worried about creating too much subpages, just use the method that uses least of them. - Mgm|(talk) 10:31, 9 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I guess that it is only to be expected that all these thousands of editors archive their talk pages differently, so it is hard for a unified standard to exist (even between bots). The problem is, Mgm, that if I do follow your advice, I shall have to create a single archive that will probably reach a Megabyte in size if given enough time, as few very long discussions have been held in my talk page so far (a situation that is now changing, nonetheless, with many new short messages).
 * And thinking of it in terms of numbers, I don't think I shall end up with that many archives after all, even in the long run, at the current rate: 2.5 archives per year. I hope.
 * Interesting background on the Index, Teratornis; I had been wondering why it was in User namespace, even though there are a couple of other useful pages linked to from official tutorials and introductions that are also located in user space. I couldn't agree more, of course, as far as its usefulness and documenting value are concerned. The Wikipedia community is truly vast, and more or less chaotic, and after at least two years of plain observation and one year of direct involvement (including several months of active exploring), there are still several dark nooks and crannies that I know nothing about.
 * The Signpost cannot cover everything, of course.
 * Still, I believe it should be noted that the Index's role is supplementary; the Department directory is more than capable of giving a good overview of the community's organisation, as well as directing editors to the places they are most often looking for (even if sometimes indirectly). My only concern is that it also lists a couple of inactive pages, like the FA Help Desk, which I think had better be removed—if a page serves no purpose, why on Earth send editors there? Waltham, The Duke of 22:09, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

screwed up on posting info
Hi Wikipedia, I updated an entry for Nicholas Longworth but I screwed up and entered my name in the entry. Can you please tell me how to get my name off of the page?

Thanks, Jennifer Lekisch —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jlekisch (talk • contribs) 23:13, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * You made a signature in by typing ~ (or by clicking a button that does it). Just click "edit this page" at the top of Nicholas Longworth and remove it. Talk pages and this page are supposed to have signatures, but not articles. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:18, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Small bug?
Hello,

I want to split my See also into three columns nicely. This is what I have done:

An admin needing help
Good day, I am a newly appointed admin in the Tagalog Wikibooks which has a very great community - none! Our community their is dead that's why I am going to ask this here. How do you change the text special pages so that I can translate them to the local langauge? Thanks a lot! -- Felipe Aira 23:56, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Try meta:MediaWiki localisation. That will probably contain information you need to get off the ground. Good luck! I've also fixed the wikibooks link; more than one prefix requires a page name.  N F 24 (radio me!) 00:22, 9 December 2007 (UTC)