Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2008 August 6

= August 6 =

Lo-Debar/Lo-debar
There are two articles on the same subject: Lo-Debar and Lo-debar. I wish to combine them. Which is the preferred spelling? Donnie Love (talk) 01:49, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * [[Image:Symbol move vote.svg|20px]] This page is for questions about using Wikipedia. Please consider asking this question at the Reference desk. They specialize in knowledge questions and will try to answer any question in the universe (except how to use Wikipedia, since that is what this Help Desk is for). Just follow the link, select the relevant section, and ask away. You could always try  for an article related to the topic you want to know more about.  I hope this helps. Hers fold  (t/a/c) 01:52, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Donnie, a quick Google search showed more results for the lowercase D spelling, so I redirected Lo-Debar to Lo-debar. Glass  Cobra  04:46, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Formatting references
If a sentence in an article is followed by several references, the result can be like this.[23][24][25][26][27]

This is very distracting. Is there a way to include multiple references that is visually less distracting?

Thanks, Wanderer57 (talk) 02:23, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Not if they are separate footnotes, no. I searched Google to see if there is any extant hack to allow individual users to hide their display but I didn't find anything--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 02:31, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I've quite often seen several references written one after the other in the same footnote: I've done that in articles that later got featured. AndyJones (talk) 12:36, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I've seen some proposals thrown around from people who want to change this. One I particularly liked was removing the brackets, like so23 24 25 26 27 (compare to[23][24][25][26][27]).  Another wanted to group incrementing references, like this.[23-27]  Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like consensus has formed for any changes yet.  -–– Pie4all88  T  C 20:28, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

"Rgy" question
what are the 3 words in the english language that end in rgy. thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by 144.135.0.76 (talk) 04:14, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * The Help Desk is for questions about using this website. Have you tried consulting a dictionary? If you're really stumped, try asking at our reference desk. Glass  Cobra  04:47, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * ...who will probbaly tell you that this is variation on the -gry puzzle, and there is at least one possible answer on that page. Gandalf61 (talk) 11:01, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * As they would say on Fark.com, "oh no not this sh*** again...". – ukexpat (talk) 17:05, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * As we say on Project Wombat, "Time to rotate the tires again!" -- Orange Mike  &#x007C;   Talk  13:15, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

hi
I was wondering since I'm new to this. Is it possible that you can erase my IP Address from the board that nobody see's it. I'm very sorry for this inconvence. I'm trying to do something nice for my community and I guess being a probie at wikipedia it backfired. Now that I that I got educated and finally made a password. Can you please do this. It would be gladly appreciated. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pennstatefan13 (talk • contribs) 04:33, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * No. Ten Pound Hammer  and his otters • (Broken clamshells • Otter chirps • HELP) 04:53, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, that was a little terse. The slightly longer answer is that it is not possible (AFAIK) to delete a user account in Wikipedia - either a named account or an anonymous IP address account. It might be possible in some cases to delete all edits made by an account, but I think that would be a labour-intensive process, so would only be considered under very exceptional circumstances. However, now that you have a named account, it is very unlikely that anyone will be interested in tracing back edits that you made under an anonymous IP account. Everyone on Wikipedia was new at one time and everyone has made (and continues to make) msitakes - so I don't think you have anything to worry about. Gandalf61 (talk) 10:56, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Lincoln High School (Los Angeles)
Hello, I am Robert Granados, historian for the Lincoln High School Alumni Association. I must point out that under "notables" on your Lincoln High site entry, Frank Capra, famed Hollywood director, is listed as having gone to LHS. He IS NOT a Lincoln alum. Frank Capra graduated from Manual Arts High School, also in Los Angeles. I have not found anything, anywhere that says he went to Lincoln High. Your web information on Manual Arts High School lists Frank Capra as one of their own. I have verified this on the TMC website and elsewhere. Please make this correction as soon as possible. My guess is that someone mixed our alma mater with Manual Arts High because our school back in the early nineteen hundreds was very well know for its industrial arts programs. Thank you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.129.41.49 (talk) 08:15, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I see you have made the deletion yourself. Thank you —teb728 t c 08:52, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * There are far too many cases like this where supposedly notable people attended a school or lived in a town, with nothing to substantiate the claim. I stick a fact tag on all of them when I see them, but they rarely get fixed.   Corvus cornix  talk  18:11, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Help with an image
Hi, I uploaded this image, (Image:IMGP2517.jpg) but it's been taken from my page saying it's non free. I do need help with this. -- S.C.Ruffey fan  10:54, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I see your user page still has Image:IMGP2517.jpg, which is still uploaded, on it. A bot removed it originally with this edit. I'm a little unsure of copyright policy when it comes to screenshots taken with a camera of non-free software.  The Mii interface on the Wii is definitely non-free, so I believe your licensing listed on the image page is incorrect.  I do not think your non-free use media rationale is valid because it does not offer encyclopedic value to the project, so I think it might have to be deleted.  If nothing else, it should be renamed to something more descriptive.  Non-free content has more information about our policy regarding non-free images.  Anyone else here know what should be done with this?  We can always post at Media copyright questions (I'll do so later if no one else responds here).  -–– Pie4all88  T  C 20:11, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Screenshots of non-free software are probably considered derivative works, therefore making them non-free (see Template:Non-free software screenshot) and have to meet the criteria at WP:NFCC. Calvin 1998 (t-c) 20:35, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Links to other languages and making categories
Apologies if this has been answered before.

Basically, I edited and made some articles. But I can't see how I can link them to the pages in other languages if they are available. Can't either see which categories I should put below the articles.

Hope that this is done automatically. But is it so?

Thanks. Georginho (talk) 11:13, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * All other wikis have different prefixes. For instance, the Spanish category for people is es:Categoría:Biografías (but without the colon in front of es; i put the colon in front to show you the link, if i remove to colon, it will show up on the left side of the screen under the language box). It works the same way as categories (example: Category:People; removing the colon on this one will put this page into the people category).  Syn  ergy 11:18, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * See also Help:Interlanguage links and Help:Category. If you add one interlanguage link going to an article which already has interlanguage links to other articles then those links may be copied by a bot at some time. If you want PSMS Medan to have an interlanguage link to id:Persatuan Sepak Bola Medan Sekitarnya then place  at the bottom. Categories are not added automatically except by some templates. I just saw you removed categories and interlanguage links in . I have restored them. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:40, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Here is the list of InterWikimedia links. If you give us the article names, we can be more specific in our help. --—— Gadget850 (Ed)  talk  -  11:43, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

3RR
Would I be breaking the 3RR by reverting this? Dismas |(talk) 12:32, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Probably, but I wouldn't be...GbT/c 12:36, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Good call Gb. And Dismas, its fine as long as its dealing with BLP concerns as outlined here, and you made the right move in notifying another editor (you got an admin response first off, which was good). If it persists, inform an admin (or report it).  Syn  ergy 12:40, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks, both of you. And good luck with Spiderman 5!  :-)  Dismas |(talk) 13:24, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Uploading Image on User Page
Hi, how do i upload an image in the user page, I did not find any browse or upload option. --Nisha 13:22, 6 August 2008 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nisha1983 (talk • contribs) 13:21, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * In the toolbox to the left of the screen click the "upload file" (or just click here) and follow the instructions. Please also take the time to familarize yourself with what images are acceptable on your user page (in summary: free/public domain = OK,  non-free/fair use/copyrighted = Not OK).  Astronaut (talk) 16:32, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Images contains information and links to help with the syntax for placing the image on your user page.

björn again
i would like to discuss with an administrator some changes and corrections and deletions which really should be made to this page please - could you put me in touch with the person who deals with this pls - regards rod stephen björn againCaymanarosa (talk) 13:36, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, Wikipedia is the encyclopaedia that anyone can edit, but if you have an involvement with the band concerned, you probably have what's called a conflict of interest, so should avoid editing articles relating to you or the band. If you'd like, feel free to leave a message on my talk page highlighting your concerns with the article? Alternatively you can email me by visiting my user page and clicking on the "Email this user" link you should see down the left hand side of the screen. GbT/c 13:41, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Deleted Article
I had tried to write an article on a new company I was interested in called B2X. After I published the article, it was deleted with a messaging claiming it was blatant advertising. I edited the article and took out some information and provided just basic information and added a few more external links which were credible. I was in the process of adding more when it was again deleted because of "blatant advertising" I did not see how the second article was advertising and do not know what I need to do in order for this article to remain on wikipedia. Please let me know why it was deleted. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.74.94.98 (talk) 13:47, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Put simply, Wikipedia is not a means to publicise a business. However, if a company is notable, and you don't have a conflict of interest, an article can be written.  Unfortunately, one impact of having the article repeatedly deleted, is it attracts the attention of the admins who deleted it, and they might block it's future re-creation.  The easy way to develop a new article is to register as a user and then create it as a subpage of your user page.  Once you are ready, you can request that the subpage be moved into the main article space; at which point it will either become an article or you will receive guidance as to why it is unacceptable.  Astronaut (talk) 16:48, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * You have to be a user to create a page anyway, so i assume this use has an account. What sometimes annoys me is when you make a stub article, and a second later it is speedily deleted, even tho you were in the middle of editing it. An article cannot be up to wikipedia standards 2 minutes after it is created. There should be a time limit before deletion and a message to the user, not saying it was already deleted, but that it will be shortly and try to fix it if you can. Grk1011 (talk) 17:00, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * There's a couple pretty easy solutions to this. Either don't save the article yet when it's one sentence long, unsourced, and has no assertion of notability, or create the article over time in your userspace and then move it to mainspace when it's complete. It's easy to grump about things being deleted too fast, but 95% of those stubs never get fleshed out. Tan      39  17:04, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * There has been much debate over the issue of very quick tagging, including a current discussion at Wikipedia talk:Criteria for speedy deletion. Please also see Hasty.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 17:15, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I understand that Wikipedia is not a means to publicize a business. I am also a registered user for wikipedia. This article was an informative article of a business, which there are many of on Wikipedia. I do believe that the article was quickly tagged and deleted before it was up even 24 hours to allow for edits. I will make the subpage as suggested instead, but there should be some rule in place about allotting a certain amount of time between the deletion warning and the actual deletion. Ahf1286 (talk) 13:45, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * There is a lot of good information at Why was my page deleted? and FAQ/Business. --—— Gadget850 (Ed)  talk  -  18:36, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * While you may not have intended the article to be promotional, there can be a very fine line between encyclopedic and spilling over into PR-speak - that's where the problem usually lies, setting out mission statements, interminable details about the management team and their achievements, use of peacock terms etc, rather than sticking to the facts. Balancing out the article with a short list of competitors and any controversies related to the company can help avoid non-neutral POV problems. – ukexpat (talk) 19:19, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * A POV tag could have been added then, not speedy delete. Grk1011 (talk) 19:26, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Speaking of rules that should be in place, it would be nice if we had some way to warn new users before they create new articles, as to how difficult it can be for new users to understand Wikipedia's complex policies and guidelines well enough to write new articles that "stick." (By "warn," I mean we should display some warning that the user must confirm as having read it. Merely displaying a warning doesn't always get through, as the occasionally-ignored instructions at the top of this Help page illustrate.) I was active on Wikipedia for at least six months before I had any idea about the incredible pace of article deletions on Wikipedia. I think the view the new user gets of Wikipedia is a little too encouraging, and most people's previous computer experience probably gives them an understanding of the word "Save" which isn't at all like how that really works on Wikipedia. When we "save" data in normal applications, it usually stays there until we either remove it, or the disk crashes. On Wikipedia, "save" really means "invite everyone else to decide whether this belongs." --Teratornis (talk) 06:13, 7 August 2008 (UTC)
 * We have the welcome template for new users, which point them to many useful pages. Also, pages like Your first article are very much geared to new users. &mdash; QuantumEleven 12:22, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Thank you very much for the information. I have the article on my usepage and am making all the edits which I hope will be appropriate for wikipedia. When I am finished with my edits how do I go about requesting that it be made into an article? Ahf1286 (talk) 19:20, 7 August 2008 (UTC)
 * You have basically two choices. You can 1) move the article from User:Ahf1286/B2X article to B2X Corp., or you can 2) create the page and paste the content into it. The first option preserves the article's edit history. This is required if the page has more contributors than just you for GFDL licensing purposes, but doesn't matter if you're the sole editor. Note than when you do the move, it automatically creates a redirect to the article from the former name; you should add the template db-u1 to that redirect page. All that being said, I took a look at the current text of the article and it appears to me to be a candidate for speedy deletion as an article about a company that fails to indicate its importance. Though I don't think it meets the criterion, I wouldn't be surprised if it was tagged for deletion as blatant advertising as well. What you should do is make the language more neutral and (this is crucial), cite to reliable sources in the article which discuss the company is substance, thus showing its notability as a topic for an article, and verifying the article's information content. Cheers.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 00:00, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

mobile wikipedia
I understand that Wikipedia is now available as a stand alone application that runs locally on PC's and mobile devices and is about 180mb in size. I can find no reference anywhere to this except for a short magazine tidbit. Is it true and if so where is it? If this is off topic please accept my apologies, this is the only place that seems to fit. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.196.231.33 (talk) 14:26, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * See Mobile access and Version 1.0 Editorial Team. --—— Gadget850 (Ed)  talk  -  15:01, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * There is also the Wapedia. Admiral Norton (talk) 17:59, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Which is linked from the Mobile access page. --—— Gadget850 (Ed)  talk  -  18:03, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Sorry, didn't see it. Admiral Norton (talk) 18:15, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Figured you didn't, so I pointed it out. --——  Gadget850 (Ed)  talk  -  18:17, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

World's Tallest Building
Whis is world's tallest building59.180.17.55 (talk) 15:19, 6 August 2008 (UTC).
 * Please see List of tallest buildings and structures in the world. Note also that this page is about questions related to using Wikipedia. Future knowledge questions such as this should be asked at the appropriate section of the reference desk. Cheers.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 15:21, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * The Burj Dubai. − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 20:58, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Strange WP:CHU question
Out of curiosity: can a bureaucrat rename themself? Admiral Norton (talk) 18:14, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Yes, they can. Best, PeterSymonds (talk)  18:54, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Cherry Seeds
Where do I go to find information on planting cherry seeds? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.128.205.194 (talk) 18:35, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Try asking on our reference desk. This page is for questions about Wikipedia itself. &mdash;  The Hand That Feeds You :Bite 18:53, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * See Fruit tree propagation, which says people usually don't grow fruit tree cultivars from seeds. --Teratornis (talk) 06:15, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Redirect template
Where is the redirect template that goes "Somebody redirects here. For the [relevent profession/field] see Somebody Else. I've checked a lot of Category:Disambiguation and redirection templates —Preceding unsigned comment added by Yohan euan o4 (talk • contribs) 18:51, August 6, 2008
 * It's called a hatnote. &mdash;  The Hand That Feeds You :Bite 18:55, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * See also Redirect,Otherpersons, Otheruses, For. Each of them have variations by placing a number after them e.g., Redirect2. The documentation page for any one of those templates has a lot of information.-- —Preceding unsigned comment added by Fuhghettaboutit (talk • contribs)
 * Hatnote has some more information about them, if you're interested. -–– Pie4all88  T  C 19:28, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I'll have a look at Hatnote too. Yohan euan o4 (talk) 00:34, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Emailing copyright scans
I've spend some time reading Wikipedia's policies, but can't find an answer to this one. At Request for Comment, I found a request to look at the Ray Joseph Cormier article, which I did. There are references cited, but they are old and not available on the Internet. Ray Joseph Cormier also is User:DoDaCanaDa. Ray wants to email me scans of the copyright newspaper references in the article so that I can revise the Wikipedia article. OK, my question is does this violate Wikipedia's copyright policy? I don't want to do anything wrong for Wikipedia. Thanks. Suntag (talk) 20:24, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * You aren't putting those scans on Wikipedia or Commons, so reproduction of the articles for research purposes is probably fair use. --—— Gadget850 (Ed)  talk  -  00:39, 7 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks! I didn't think of that. Suntag (talk) 02:15, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

how to bookmark articles in Wikipedia?
how to bookmark articles in Wikipedia? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jinlin.wang (talk • contribs) 21:10, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * First of all, you should always sign your discussion page posts with four tildes ( ~ ), which will automatically produce your signature (a link to your userpage and a timestamp). To answer the question, you can either simply bookmark them in your browser, or you can go to a page like your userpage (which can be found by going to Special:Mypage) and placing a link to it there. Calvin 1998 (t-c) 21:18, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * You can bookmark them in your web browser (there are many web browsers including Internet Explorer, Safari and Firefox. How you bookmark pages depends on which web browser you use; but will work the same for all websites (not just Wikipedia). You can also keep track of updates to pages by adding them to your watchlist on Wikipedia - information here. --h2g2bob (talk) 23:47, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * This appeared as a Tip of the day: Tip of the day/July 28, 2006. --Teratornis (talk) 04:15, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Photos placed in article
I have been editing the article 'Passive Infrared Sensor' and have uploaded several photos to illustrate to what the text is referring. I am using the format:

The photos then appear next to each other on one 'line' which is a perfect format in this case. My question concerns the fact that only four photos are positioned next to each other while the fifth (and presumably others) is/are relegated to the next line in the text body. There appears to be ample room to accommodate at least a fifth photo on the same line as the previous four. Am I doing something wrong or is this just the way it has to be?

TIA, Duexdad —Preceding unsigned comment added by Deuxdad (talk • contribs) -- Nataly a 21:51, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Nope, you're not doing anything wrong - the gallery tag automatically puts four images per line. You can override that and specify the number of images per line, as shown at Help:Images_and_other_uploaded_files.  Keep in mind that depending on a reader's screen size/web browser, there may not be that much space. -- Nataly a  21:51, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Indeed. Many users will have to scroll to the right to see a fifth image. I assume the default 4 images per line in galleries was chosen with that in mind. You can do what you want in your user space but I suggest sticking to 4 in articles if there are no special circumstances. There is no way to specify that the number of images per line should depend on the window size of the reader. PrimeHunter (talk) 22:32, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Motto of the day
We need your help! MOTD has been running for over two years, as an informal project publishing a daily unofficial Wikipedia motto each day through the MOTD templates. It's intended to be a way to gather the Wikipedia community together to a common purpose and help portray our mission through a often clever or witty phrase. Unfortunately, activity in the project has started to drop of late, and we only have mottos scheduled for the next week. For this project to run smoothly, we need plenty of original suggestions from editors like you, as well as people to comment on existing suggestions, close old discussions, and schedule approved mottos. It's a great way to take a break from your run-of-the-mill editing, and you may learn something about Wikipedia in the process. Please stop by WP:MOTD and take a look around. If you have any questions, please post below, on our project's talk page, or drop me a line. Thanks for your time, and happy editing as always. Hers fold  (t/a/c) 23:03, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Email Associated with Account No Longer Valid
The employee in charge of updating our account is no longer with the company so we can't access the password to change the account and edit the page. Is there a way to change the email address and password to an active employee?

216.241.41.50 (talk) 23:35, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * What do you mean "our account"? According to our policies, role accounts controlled by more than one person must have approval from the Wikimedia Foundation, or they will be blocked on sight. Hers fold  (t/a/c) 23:38, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * But to answer your question (sorry), no. We have no way to access or change your password, or give it to you in the event it is lost. Hers fold  (t/a/c) 23:39, 6 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Which page do you want to edit? Assuming it's not an administrator account, any new or in some cases autoconfirmed account can edit the same Wikipedia pages as the old account. Are you referring to another wiki than Wikipedia? PrimeHunter (talk) 23:45, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

I was trying to move this page http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Tabboards to a a main article instead of just a user article, but I wasn't the original user--rather a co-worker was. Could I creat my own account and move it?216.241.41.50 (talk) 14:39, 7 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Autoconfirmed accounts (usually meaning at least 4 days old and made at least 10 edits) can move pages (you shouldn't cut-and-paste it into a new article because the edit history is lost that way). But the current content is unsuited for a Wikipedia article which often happens when people write about their own company. See FAQ/Business and the links there. PrimeHunter (talk) 14:58, 7 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Per our conflict of interest guideline, employees or members of an organization should not create articles or make substantial edits to articles about them. If the organization really is notable someone else will make an article.--  Oni Ookami Alfador Talk 15:54, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

Okay, thanks. I just saw our competitors do it so figured it was okay since there was no promotional info in it--just facts, but I guess not.216.241.41.50 (talk) 16:27, 7 August 2008 (UTC)