Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2008 June 15

= June 15 =

User Page Problems
I tried using some thing from the main page on my userpage they worked fine but then i tried adding some stuff and it went all strange! Just take a look here. Drog  Lad 08:03, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Risks of old software
I am considering starting an article about the risks of using out of date software (unfixed bugs, loss of data, security problems, etc...), do you think that it would be "appropriate" to make an article about that on wikipedia? SF007 (talk) 02:28, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * First read the related existing articles, some which appear when we:, such as:
 * Legacy system
 * Software migration
 * Brownfield (software development)
 * Software brittleness
 * for starters. Wikipedia has lots of articles relating to software, so you should become familiar with what's here before adding new software articles. Occasionally users start new articles without being aware that very similar articles already exist, requiring laborious merging by other editors. As far as what is appropriate for Wikipedia, read WP:V, WP:RS, WP:CITE, WP:NPOV, and WP:NOT. Probably the most important criterion to justify a new article is that you have some reliable, published sources on which to base the article. Wikipedia does not want people to just write stuff off the top of their heads. Everything needs to have sources. --Teratornis (talk) 02:46, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Don't forget WP:OR. If the information would come from your own personal experience, for example, then it would not be appropriate for Wikipedia. The links Teratornis has already mentioned will give you info on what sort of sources you'll need to have. --Icarus (Hi!) 05:45, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

@Teratornis Thanks for the useful links, I had already searched wikipedia but had not found that, even in that articles I have found no information about what I mentioned... regarding the sources, yeah, the the biggest problem to find good ones... thanks SF007 (talk) 21:44, 16 June 2008 (UTC) @Icarus3 yeah, thanks. SF007 (talk) 21:44, 16 June 2008 (UTC)

age
what is the oldest age a person has lived to? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.227.226.56 (talk) 03:20, 15 June 2008 (UTC)


 * This question might be better suited for the reference desk. Wisdom89  ( T |undefined /  C ) 03:22, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * (e/c)This is a place for questions about Wikipedia, not general knowledge. However, according to Oldest people, that prize goes to Jeanne Calment, who reached the ripe old age of 122. Glass Cobra  03:23, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

"Do not move to commons" tag
Hi, is there any tag to place on an image, so bots wont move it to commons? I want this, because not all media can be moved to commons, and sometimes bots can't "see" that... Thanks. SF007 (talk) 03:48, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * That's a good question. Template messages/Image namespace lists almost the opposite of what you want: Copy to Wikimedia Commons. You could read through the list of image-related messagebox templates and see if any do what you want. You could also ask the owners of the bots you refer to if they programmed their bots to see any particular messagebox templates. --Teratornis (talk) 07:14, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Yeah, i also fin nothing about that... thanks anyway. SF007 (talk) 21:40, 16 June 2008 (UTC)


 * KeepLocal is what you want. Angus McLellan (Talk) 14:02, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

please help me
can you please help or pleas refer me to someone who can

[redacted]

Please help me

Can we help you to recover my account? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 122.107.96.210 (talk) 03:56, 15 June 2008 (UTC)


 * I'm terribly sorry. This is the help desk for Wikipedia, not Facebook. Perhaps you can find someone to assist you at their help page.   Also, please do not place personal information on Wikipedia (or any other wiki) as it may compromise your security and open you to identity theft -- ShinmaWa(talk) 04:03, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

How do I add myself to Wikipedia?
I've noticed that you can search many people by name, such as, "John Smith Wiki". How would I add a page about me, my bio, cinematography, etc.?

Thank you,

Dale Obert

—Preceding unsigned comment added by Obertdp (talk • contribs) 05:26, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Hello Mr. Obert, thanks for your interest in Wikipedia! Please take a look at Starting an article for instructions and help. The thing that you need to know is that we take the concept of notability very seriously, to try to keep a bar for article inclusion; if we allowed anyone to have an article, we'd be hardly able to keep up. A quick Google search for your name shows that you may pass our notability standard; however, when you go to create your article, it would help us out a lot if you could include links to newspaper or magazine articles that are about you, or other relevant coverage. Good luck, and feel free to drop me a line on my talk page if you need help! Glass Cobra  05:38, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * If you do meet the notability guidelines, then you may have an article about yourself. However, while there is no hard and fast rule against writing an article about yourself under such circumstances, it is strongly discouraged. Please read Autobiography carefully to understand why, and take it into consideration when you decide whether or not to make an article about yourself. --Icarus (Hi!) 05:51, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Anyone is welcome to make a biography page on WikiBios. --Teratornis (talk) 19:19, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Duplicate a watchlist
Is there a way I can "import" my main account's watchlist onto my alternate public account? It would be tedious to do by hand. Seraphim&hearts; Whipp  11:48, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Go to "my watchlist" and select "Edit raw watchlist." Copy & paste it into a text file, then log into your alt account and paste it into that one's raw watchlist. &mdash;  The Hand That Feeds You :Bite 11:51, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Do you know that in all my time here, I've never once used the raw watchlist lol. Thank you ever so much :D. Seraphim&hearts;  Whipp  11:55, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

A URL that leads nowhere
I have found the link below in articles about the Athens National Archaeological Museum and also in an article about the archealogical site at Vergina in Northern Greece. Both sites shared the "odysseus.culture.gr part of the URL

http://odysseus.culture.gr/h/1/eh151.jsp?obj_id=3297

I get only an empty screen with "done" noted at the bottom. Can you tell me if this URL is not working or is it just me? Rem47m (talk) 12:42, 15 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Yup. It's broken, I get the same thing. Harland1 (t/c) 12:51, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Dead for me as well. Please note the instructions at: Citing sources.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 13:02, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Please .. from it.wiki user
Can some take a look to this article Romanian crime in Europe, it has not a Neutral Point of view (the title is also horrible). In it.wiki was already deleted. thank you --Ignlig (talk) 14:47, 15 June 2008 (UTC)


 * I added a tag about the Neutral Point of View. I also saw that there was a tag for deletion already there. I hope the tags help, since I don't know much about the topic myself. Chimchar monferno (talk) 00:15, 16 June 2008 (UTC)

Image that covers the links
Earler today I posted a message to User talk:LaraLove‎ about an image of the page that covers the navigation links and makes returning to wikipedia's main page difficult. I checked back later and the message I posted was gone, and I have labels on my pages saying "An editor has expressed a concern that this user may be a sock puppet of Grawp." I don't understand. Then I asked Dave1185 who put the labels there about this and that comment has also just gone. What can I do? I just wanted to let the person know that their image made it difficult to browse wikipedia as it covered the links. I have nothing against the image, but maybe it could be made a little smaller or behind the links so that they are still clickable. Thank you. Fingers Mckenzie (talk) 15:12, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * I've removed the tags from your userpages as unfounded. I've also reposted your message to LaraLove: it seems to have been deleted as a result of the Grawp tags. Algebraist 15:44, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * As way of explanation "Grawp" was a vandal who has a habit of coming back. It sounds like there was a mix-up when you brought some of his vandalism to attention, and they thought you might be him. Looks like everything's been cleared up now, though. &mdash;  The Hand That Feeds You :Bite 16:49, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Editing the lead
Is there a way (maybe a script) that allows me to edit the lead alone like other sections? Thank you. Eklipse (talk) 16:01, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Special:Preferences, gadgets, User interface gadgets, Add an [edit] link for the lead section of a page. Algebraist 16:06, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * With this script you can edit the lead. macy talk 16:08, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Or this one (but you should probably just use the gadget). -- Meni Rosenfeld (talk) 16:11, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Eklipse (talk) 16:24, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

BOY GEORGE page error - a quick link change please
Hello,

I represent BOY GEORGE's management and his official website. When you do a search for BOY GEORGE the wikipedia page on him comes up first (congratulations!), but the link on that page to his "Official" page is actually pointing to a fan page (as does the myspace link).

Would it be possible to have the official website link changed from www.boygeorgeuk.com (fansite) to www.boygeorgelive.com (the only official site - maintained by boy george and his management)

and the myspace link changed from www.myspace.com/iamboygeorge (fansite) to www.myspace.com/boygeorgelive (official myspace page)?

Thanks so much!!!

Jud Haynes www.judhaynes.com 142.162.28.75 (talk) 16:42, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * [[Image:Crystal_Clear_app_utilities.png|20px]]Thank you for your suggestion. When you feel an article needs improvement, please feel free to make those changes. Wikipedia is a wiki, so anyone can edit almost any article by simply following the  link at the top. The Wikipedia community encourages you to be bold in updating pages. Don't worry too much about making honest mistakes — they're likely to be found and corrected quickly. If you're not sure how editing works, check out how to edit a page, or use the sandbox to try out your editing skills.  New contributors are always welcome. You don't even need to log in (although there are many reasons why you might want to).  Also see WP:COI ...... Dendodge  .. Talk Help 16:45, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * I've done it for you, but you could have done it yourself by clicking the 'edit this page' tab at the top of the page ...... Dendodge  .. Talk Help 16:48, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, but as Mr. Haynes is a person who is closely linked to the subject, WP:COI strongly recommends that he do exactly what he did -- bring his recommended changes to the community to have a disinterested third party make the changes on his behalf. Granted, this is usually done on a talk page, but this works as well.  We shouldn't be giving people a mixed message here by saying "edit it yourself" but "don't edit it yourself because of WP:COI" at the same time.   Mr. Haynes -- you did the right thing and thank you for your contribution to Wikipedia.  -- ShinmaWa(talk) 19:28, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Thanks so much for making my change - I noticed that the link under the Boy George photo on the right (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boy_George) still points to boygeorgeuk.com - would it be possible to also have that linked changed to point to www.boygeorgelive.com?

Thanks again for all your help!

Jud Haynes142.162.28.75 (talk) 04:11, 16 June 2008 (UTC)

Talk Page Archive Boxes?
Hey there,

Can someone put all of my talkpage archive subpages into one collapsible archive box over at my talk page? I currently have 3 separate boxes, due to my limited knowledge of wiki markup :P.

Thanks in advance, Perfect Proposal  Speak Out!  17:43, 15 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Done. See also Template:Archive box collapsible/doc.  – thedemonhog   talk  •  edits  17:47, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * You can make your archive pages searchable with Google custom:


 * which renders as: . Maybe Archive box collapsible could have that as an optional feature. It doesn't work in the article Talk: namespace, unfortunately, because Google does not index Wikipedia's article talk pages, but Google does index the other talk namespaces, such as User talk:. --Teratornis (talk) 19:16, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Linking to a site which violates copyright?
The Invisible Man (2000 TV series) contains a link to a fansite which is a direct copy of the SciFi Channel's website for the show. Shouldn't this be deleted? 92.0.71.59 (talk) 17:57, 15 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Yes—preferrably, the link would be replaced with one to the Sci Fi Channel's website. See Copyrights.  – thedemonhog   talk  •  edits  18:09, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

What's an outing website?
Not that I run one, but what is an outing website? I decided to ask that question here, because Ursasapien is currently absent, and if I asked him, he might respond late.Kitty53 (talk) 19:24, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Without context, it's difficult say for sure. However, in its usual connotation, an "outing website" would be one that exposes personal information about an individual(s) that that person wished to conceal, such as he or she is a homosexual.  See Outing.  For the Wikipedia side of this, see WP:OUTING.  This is especially important for biographies of living persons where we strive to do no harm.   Using an "outing website" as a source for a BLP would tend to do that kind of harm we wish to avoid and special care must be taken to never use them as a source, even if true. -- ShinmaWa(talk) 19:37, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * [[Image:Symbol move vote.svg|20px]] This page is for questions about using Wikipedia. Please consider asking this question at the Reference desk. They specialize in knowledge questions and will try to answer any question in the universe (except how to use Wikipedia, since that is what this Help Desk is for). Just follow the link, select the relevant section, and ask away. You could always try  for an article related to the topic you want to know more about.  I hope this helps.

Read more: Outing ......<em style="font-family:Bradley Hand ITC;color:#008000"> Dendodge  .. Talk Help 19:39, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * This is Kitty53, Dendodge. She's known around here and Ursasapien is her Adopt-a-user mentor.  I'm pretty sure she's asking in context of writing articles on Wikipedia.  <font style="font-variant: small-caps;">-- ShinmaWa(talk) 19:46, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * I just think it would make more sense on the refdesk (an answer would probably be more likely too) ......<em style="font-family:Bradley Hand ITC;color:#008000"> Dendodge  .. Talk Help 19:50, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * The question creates this uncertainty by not following the advice of Eric S. Raymond to Describe the goal, not the step. I.e., if Kitty53 would tell us the context in which this question came up, we could easily determine whether the question is about editing on Wikipedia, or just a general knowledge question. --Teratornis (talk) 20:05, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * I might add that when a question describes the step, and not the goal, then the bend-over-backward courteous way to answer the question is to answer all branches that the ambiguous question allows. The above answers collectively appear to do that. If one does not know the questioner, and if one cannot tell by examining the questioner's contributions, then it is pointless to try to guess which branch the questioner is on. Generally one will tend to guess as if one had posed the question oneself - and one's own inclinations are probably useless for guessing how a distant stranger's mind will work. See the related topic of Psychological projection. It's often hard to believe, but other people really can surprise us. --Teratornis (talk) 20:13, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Subject of harassment campaign - what can I do?
Dear Wikipedia administators. The Atheist Community of Austin and specifically Martin Wagner and Russell Glasser have commenced a harassment campaign against me, including trying to revise and delete my wikipedia page as they continue to manipulate my google results. I am asking you for help in please protecting http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yomin_Postelnik Please let me know whatever can be done. Thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ypostelnik (talk • contribs) 22:50, 15 June 2008 (UTC)


 * I'm sorry you feel harassed, and it may be that other users are behaving in a way you don't like, but please be aware that Yomin Postelnik is not your Wikipedia page. Once an article is created, any user can edit it or nominate it for deletion if they feel it appropriate.  Furthermore, it appears that the page in question was created by you yourself, and is about you.  Creating or editing pages about yourself is not a good idea as there is a potential conflict of interest, and you may experience Wikipedia's law of unintended consequences. --  Ka renjc 23:46, 15 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Anyone is welcome to make a biography page on WikiBios, so that's another option if you don't qualify for a biographical article on Wikipedia (the set of people who qualify is smaller than the set of people who think they quality). Be aware that whenever a content dispute occurs on Wikipedia, the side that best understands Wikipedia's policies and guidelines invariably wins. Everything you need to know to "win" on Wikipedia is in writing and is freely available. However, Wikipedia is unlike anything most people have experienced, so the rules here almost invariably trip up people who prefer a faith-based approach to new situations - that is, assuming they already know what is going on. Wikipedia is like a major sport, with a complex rulebook, and referees who enforce the rules without mercy. One cannot barge into, say, professional baseball, and try to invent one's own new game on the spot. Instead, one has to learn to play baseball the way the experienced players play it. The proper way to approach Wikipedia is to first empty one's mind of preconceived ideas - that is, to become humble - then to spend time reading and studying the instructions, and learning to edit our existing articles, until the way of Wikipedia sinks in. Wikipedia is "free" in the sense that nobody has to pay cash money to edit here, but Wikipedia is decidedly not "free" in the same sense that life in a jungle is not "free." There are many actions in the jungle which bring unpleasant surprises to those who are ignorant of the jungle. Everyone who has done much editing on Wikipedia has the scars and dings to prove this. --Teratornis (talk) 06:27, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
 * You may be interested in CreationWiki and Conservapedia. --Teratornis (talk) 06:35, 16 June 2008 (UTC)