Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2008 May 2

= May 2 =

Contribs
How may one find out the number of contributions they have made? Thanks, Zrs 12 (talk) 00:43, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Various ways. When you're signed in, look at "my preferences" and your "user profile" page there has a list of edits, including deleted edits. This link gives you a more detailed breakdown of your editing pattern, but not including deleted edits. WP:KATE has other edit-counting tools.  BencherliteTalk 00:47, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * (ec)-- Kerotan Leave Me a Message  Have  a nice day :) 00:48, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * See: WP:EIW. --Teratornis (talk) 01:03, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Lake Qaraoun
✅ Can someone that understands Hebrew copy the image here http://he.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D7%AA%D7%9E%D7%95%D7%A0%D7%94:Qaraoun_Lake_1.jpg to Commons and then add it to the Lake Qaraoun article? Thanks, Spencer  T♦C 01:02, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Anyone?  Spencer  T♦C 21:29, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Ok, I'll try.  weburiedoursecrets  inthegarden  21:41, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks, Spencer  T♦C 00:30, 3 May 2008 (UTC)

Is there something in place for this?
It seems to me that some articles will be non-neutral one way or another because they're referenced primarily to articles of one opinion. And since they're referenced nobody does anything about it. This section is what I have in mind.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tibet#Human_Rights

It's clearly against China but since it's well referenced it's left alone. I've been seeing this in other articles too, but not as extreme usually.

Superstarwarsfan (talk) 03:48, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * And the question is? Calvin 1998 (t-c) 03:50, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * And by the way, those are clearly anti-China, pro-Tibet websites that they are referencing. Calvin 1998 (t-c) 03:52, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

The question is "Does Wikipedia have something in place to prove somethings not neutral even if it's referenced?" Superstarwarsfan (talk) 03:54, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Don't think so, but WP:Verifiability does say that the references do need to be to reputable, neutral sources- pro-Tibet websites can't possibly be reputable/neutral. Calvin 1998 (t-c) 03:57, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * You would think so. Yet theres a good size debate going on about this section thats been going on for a while. When I brought it up again one of the first things that happened is that the section got even more references. Is there anything that can be done? Superstarwarsfan (talk) 04:06, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * True, but as long as the sources are considered reliable (in terms fact-checking, etc.), it's not necessarily a huge problem. Human Rights Watch is probably reliable, even if they're not neutral on Tibet issues. -- B figura (talk) 04:02, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * I think you'll find Neutral point of view of interest.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 04:06, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * I think I might be missing something. While I agree that the wording of that section clearly has POV issues, I don't think that "China doesn't have the best human rights reputation" is really a minority viewpoint. Although this is probably getting away from the point of the HD -- B figura (talk) 04:35, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Let me try to illustrate my point better. I'm just making this up to explain myself better. Let's say that on the article for George Bush there are 5 references. But 4 of those references are from reliable anti-Bush sources. The George Bush article would thus be anti-Bush and not be neutral because most of the references have one viewpoint. Do you see what I'm trying to say? Superstarwarsfan (talk) 04:12, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * That's why WP:NPOV and WP:VERI are separate. You still must maintain NPOV and not place WP:UNDUE weight, as well as reference it. Calvin 1998 (t-c) 04:14, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * I think I agree with Calvin here. The article has to be kept neutral (by not assigning undue weight, and by not used biased wording), and all the info still has to be verifiable via reliable sources. -- B figura (talk) 04:39, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Also see WP:EIW. --Teratornis (talk) 08:12, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motorola
Hi,

There is an error in the article. The figure below on the following page is incorrect. The correct figure is in Millions not Billions

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motorola

Net income 	▼ $49.000 billion USD (2007)

Regards, Abdul Azeem —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.53.216.151 (talk) 06:19, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * No, I'm rather sure it's billion. If you are sure it's million, change it yourself! It is a wiki... Calvin 1998 (t-c) 06:29, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * A quick Google search found this: Earnings: Motorola Handset Sales Down A Third In 2007, No Short Term Fix which says:
 * For the full year 2007 Motorola saw sales of $36.6 billion (down 15 percent year-on-year) with a net earnings loss of $49 million.
 * --Teratornis (talk) 08:10, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Fixed. It may have been vandalism by an anonymous editor after checking the history; I've reverted to before the contributor's edits. For future reference, I believe it's (nearly?) impossible to have net income greater than revenue, especially if net income is derived from the difference when taking revenue and removing expenses from it. Gary King ( talk ) 08:50, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Wikipedia Static HTML Dumps
Hello to everybody I'm Roberto From Italy. Does someone know why the Wikipedia Static HTML Dumps for download is not available in all languages? The current is the 2008-02 but is stopped on the last days of January 2008. What happened? Regards Roberto Gerlando —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.103.207.169 (talk) 09:37, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * No idea, but as a wild guess, I don't think it was very popular, since if they wanted to, they could easily continue keeping it updated. On a side note, the database dumps have been failing to backup properly the past few days. Gary King ( talk ) 09:53, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Closing XFDs
Are there any instructions anywhere about how to go about closing XFDs? Not being an administrator, I can't go about closing ones where the outcome is/might be delete, but I would like to help out by closing some of the still open XFDs that are definite keeps (i.e. no delete votes and passes WP:SNOW keeps). Thanks! StephenBuxton (talk) 11:34, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Sure. See Deletion process and Non-admin closure, cheers.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 12:07, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks for that! I had a little trouble initially, but I think I've got it sorted now.  Could you please check that I've done OK with Articles for deletion/John Otto (park ranger)? Thanks! StephenBuxton (talk) 12:34, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm leaving for work now so I have little time to examine but on a quick look I think you should revert yourself and let someone else close that discussion. You should never close any XfD that you participated in, as you did in this discussion. Cheers.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 13:09, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * He's right. I've re-opened the debate.  Also, you have to leave it for a bit longer than a day to gain consensus.  Thanks for trying though!  weburiedoursecrets  inthegarden  13:19, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Right-oh, I'll remember that in future. Thanks for sorting it out.  I did close another one that I didn't participate in, it had been open for more than 5 days, looks nicely notable and only has keep votes (albeit not that many). Did I do better that time? Articles_for_deletion/Aterballetto_productions. StephenBuxton (talk) 14:16, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Yeah, that's a bit better. Usually it would be better to let an administrator close them though, some users aren't too keen on non-admins doing it, except for cases five days old with 10 keeps and no deletes.  Thanks for helping, mate.   weburiedoursecrets  inthegarden  14:57, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Leonidas
I DON'T CARE ABOUT ALL THIS AND ALL YOUR GUYS FORMALITIES AND I WISH I COULD JUST EMAIL IN AND SAY SOMETHING but you have a link under Alexander the Great that goes to Leonidas and it says Leonidas taught him but Leonidas died over a hundred years before alexander was born —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.47.186.59 (talk) 15:56, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Thank you for pointing out the error - Kittybrewster  &#9742;  16:39, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * I left a comment at Talk:Alexander the Great. This should get fixed pretty quickly.  I suspect we do not have an article on this Leonidas, thus it will just get unlinked.  --—  Gadget850 (Ed)  talk  -  16:46, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Feedback wanted on editing
So I'm basically rewriting the entirety of Metal.

What I'm going to do is, since the whole article's unsourced, is just rewrite the whole damn thing from scratch. I have about 3 textbooks regarding metals. Is this enough sources to write a great article? I can go to the library and get some more books if it isn't enough. I'm ultimately trying to get Metal to FA, but GA would be acceptable too. Someone please tell me if I'm doing a good job. Z i g g y  S a w  d u s t  16:06, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * If you'd like, you could share your progress on Requests for feedback. I don't have time to review the article, but I'll just say that 3 textbooks, while a good start, probably won't have all of the variety of information that could possibly be discussed regarding metals. They may cover a good deal of it, but FA is about complete coverage. That's just a general comment, without knowing which textbooks you have. Leebo  T /C 16:37, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * You could also go to editor review. Mister Senseless&trade; (Speak - Contributions) 02:56, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

Is there a way to watchlist additions and removals to a category?
Watchlisting a category page doesn't tell me when things are added to or removed from the cat; is there some way to watch for this? - Dan Dank55 (talk)(mistakes) 16:21, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Nope, only the editable part of a page can be watched; there is currently no way to watch the content of categories. See this page for further info. Thanks, PeterSymonds | talk  16:27, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks kindly. - Dan Dank55 (talk)(mistakes) 16:47, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Can I get a two-fer? Does anyone know of a tool that helps in creating wikilinks? What I have in mind is something that would create the link WP:Help desk on this page, by reading the title of the editing box and the section title at the top of this edit screen, or better yet, simply copy it to my clipboard, so that I don't have to. - Dan Dank55 (talk)(mistakes) 16:50, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Ooh, asking a lot ;) No I don't think that exists. What you could do is copy the relevant section of the URL before you click edit, and then paste in the brackets. I'm sure a code could be written though; you could request it at WP:User scripts. Thanks, PeterSymonds |  talk  16:58, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * It's not as simple as a watchlist, but using AutoWikiBrowser you could create and save a list of articles from a category, and then compare it to the category at a later time. This would actually tell you precisely the articles that have been added or removed from the category between saving the list and checking it again. Someguy1221 (talk) 17:31, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

(undent) I too wish for a simple way to copy and paste wikilinks in one step. For pages with sections that people are likely to cite frequently (such as sections in WP:NOT and WP:FAQ, and some entries in WP:EIW), we can manually create shortcuts and display them with the Shortcut template. See for example WP:BFAQ, which links to a particular business FAQ entry, and is easy to copy when you are viewing the entry. You don't need two separate copy and pastes to get the page name and the section heading, since we put all that in the shortcut. --Teratornis (talk) 22:03, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Robotics question moved to WP:RD/S. PeterSymonds | talk  17:13, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Eye Spy Publishing LTD
Regarding Eye Spy Publishing LTD.

The main paragraph is inaccurate and does not reflect the content or reputation of the magazine. The paragraph below: "The magazine claims to obtain its information from different intelligence group sources worldwide. In light of its entertaining nature it is debatable whether the information obtained by Eye Spy is reliable and accurate. Eye Spy has featured articles which discuss and analyze 'James Bond' style spy technology on a perfectly serious level."

Whoever wrote this obviously didn't research the magazine, or even read it. The editors include:

David Bickford - Senior Intelligence Consultant, Former MI5 and MI6 legal director (9 years) and current board member. Michael Smith - Associate Editor, Defense Correspondent 'The Sunday Times' UK, Colonel John Hughes-Wilson - Consultant, Retired Colonel on NATO's International Political Staff [Brussels], Nick Fielding - Senior Intelligence Consultant, Former senior investigative journalist 'The Sunday Times', Peter Jenkins - Surveillance Editor, Former Royal Marine Commando; President ISS surveillance company, David Hamer - Associate Editor, Vice-Chairman of Acquisitions, National Cryptologic Museum Foundation, National Security Agency, Kevin Coleman- Technology Consultant, Leading intelligence research specialist and training consultant, Daniel P King - Security Consultant, Retired NYPD Detective Anti-Terrorist Task Force, Jason Goldberg - Security Consultant, New York Anti-Terrorist Taskforce, Lynn Hodgson - Associate Editor Canada, Author on historical intelligence, Spiros Kopitsos - Hellenic Institute Strategic Studies, Former senior Greek Army officer, to name a few.

Eye Spy is subscribed to by every major intelligence agency in the world; by embassy staff in 54 countries, and used as a training tool in several military divisions. Eye Spy has maintained the highest standard and reputation for eight years.

The information is incorrect and an inappropriate representation of the company. In addition, the page for Eye Spy Publishing Ltd had incorrect company details; directors listed that have no - and never had - any association with Eye Spy, the company was listed as an electrical company - incorrect established date, which is important as Eye Spy was established and publishing prior to 9/11. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dmcd2528 (talk • contribs) 17:25, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Hello. Can you can provide a reliable, third-party source that it is published reliably and not for entertainment? Thanks, PeterSymonds | talk  17:35, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

change the default graphic on Wiki pages
I am the Site Admin, and one of the Wiki sysops, for a site in the DP (Distributed Proofreaders) community. We would like to replace the default graphic (you know the little MediaWiki flower in brackets) that appears in the upper left-hand corner of every one of our Wiki pages with a custom-designed graphic that says who we are. How do I do that? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.138.9.12 (talk) 18:30, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * You need to set $wgLogo. See http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Category:Configure, specifically http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:%24wgLogo.  For further help, please consult http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Project:Support_Desk  --—  Gadget850 (Ed)  talk  -  18:38, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * We have a nice interwiki link prefix for that site: mw:Category:Configure, etc. Granted, it's easier to copy and paste URLs. --Teratornis (talk) 21:57, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Single braces - usage
I've seen in several places the usage of single {...} 's with a series of pipe-symbols in them, doing fancy stuff, for example the animation in Shallow water equations and almost all of User:Piotrus/Talkheader.

Where is this usage documented? I have tried to RTFM, honest, but I can't seem to find it. Thanks! Franamax (talk) 18:46, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, according to the guys on IRC, they're tables ...... Dendodge . Talk Help 18:52, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * (ec) It sounds like you're describing the wiki-markup format of tables. Leebo</b> <sup style="color:#2A8E82"> T /<small style="color:"#2A8E82;">C 18:55, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Very cool image. The animation is included in the GIF.


 * The {| |  |} stuff creates a table.  In the water wave example, the table is just a box to put the gif into.


 * For creating tables see Help:Table. For creating gifs, I don't know.  Wanderer57 (talk) 18:55, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Ahh, tables. That is one impressively long help page, I'll be giving my sandbox a workout!
 * Followup question: are all the various CSS styles doumented somewhere (the class=xxx stuff), or do we just inspect MediaWiki:Common.css to figure them out?
 * Question for extra credit: Image:Shallow water waves.gif is a cool image, but how exactly did it get PD-licensed? The upload credits an author and links to a non-existent user page. Franamax (talk) 19:21, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Tables are a challenge but I think they are like child's play compared to CSS. I was asking recently about CSS. The answers I got are in the "CSS coding" section on my talk page. They would help answer your question, I think.


 * Image licencing makes CSS look like kindergarten, AFAIC. Wanderer57 (talk) 19:49, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * I should add, the answers on CSS are from an expert. Wanderer57 (talk) 19:58, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

(undent) See WP:EIW for more about tables, and WP:EIW for more about CSS. Just in case your schedule is open for the next three weeks or so to read all that stuff. --Teratornis (talk) 21:54, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

What the wiki!
What in the name of Jimbo Wales was That! When I tried to edit it said Wikipedia was in read only mode, locked from editing! Did anyone else see that? Dark Zorro  20:31, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Nope, but it happens quite a lot when the database is backlogged. It's temporarily locked so the servers can catch up. Nothing to worry about, it's automatic and only lasts a few minutes max. :) PeterSymonds | talk  20:33, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Yeah I was exaggerating. Thanx anyway- Dark  Zorro  20:39, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * You're welcome. PeterSymonds | talk  20:51, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Moving an image to a new name
i want to move to "Image:Paparizou_mambo_scandanavian.jpg" but i dont know how to move it. If someone could either move it for me or tell me how to that would be great. I have the image saved so i could also upload it under the new name and have someone delete the other. Grk1011 (talk) 22:16, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Simplest way would be to reupload, and tag the old one as a duplicate using . -mattbuck (Talk) 22:42, 2 May 2008 (UTC)
 * okay, thanks. Grk1011 (talk) 22:46, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

how to revert move of the talk page?
I have found a form of vandalism which I don't know how to revert..User User:Chaza super man moved his talk page to the article Super smah bros brawl. How to revert this?
 * I fixed it, it took some admin stuff to fix and merge the histories, it should be ok now.  « Gonzo fan2007  (talk ♦ contribs) @    22:39, 2 May 2008 (UTC)