Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2009 November 18

= November 18 =

Adaptations of films
Which one is correct? I've seen it done both ways on Wikipedia; I'm not sure which is correct. And also, if there is one, could you please include a link to a project page, so I can use it for edit summaries? Thanks, C Teng [talk] 00:28, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Tom Cruise starred in the 2005 adaptation of The War of the Worlds. [link is to book]
 * Tom Cruise starred in the 2005 adaptation of The War of the Worlds. [link is to film]


 * It depends on context. With the quote in your post, "of The War of the Worlds" refers to the book, so the book should be linked on that term. But the quote mentions Tom Cruise who is connected with the 2005 film and not the book, so it would seem better to make a formulation where the film is referred, for example:


 * Tom Cruise starred in the 2005 film War of the Worlds, adapted from the book of the same name. (this ignores "The" in front of the book title).
 * It's also possible to link both without repeating the title, for example with your original formulation:


 * Tom Cruise starred in the 2005 adaptation of The War of the Worlds.
 * All the above ignores that there were actually three 2005 adaptations of the book. PrimeHunter (talk) 01:22, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Images
When I place an image on a page, and save, I can click on the image, and it will take me to the image description page. How do I change that? In this case, I am not using a caption. Thanks, Griffinofwales (talk) 01:43, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Just add  as a parameter. For example Kitten-stare.jpg. If you want to use thumb or frame formats, however, you have to use an imagemap. See below for an example --Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 02:06, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks. Griffinofwales (talk) 02:39, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

One more thing. How does one get an icon (such as the padlock or the GA/FA icon) into the proper place level with the title? Griffinofwales (talk) 15:06, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * You can use, a metatemplate for creating little icons on the top-right of a page. Except for certain uses that are already created, it is meant to be used on user pages and user talk pages only.  --Mysdaao talk 15:22, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

request to add hindi in wikipedia publications
I will like to know if HINDI language can be used for wikipedia publications.HINDI is avery rich language.Nobel laureate like Ravindra Nath Tagor have written in this language and have enhanced its enrichment. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.80.151.154 (talk) 01:56, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Most of the world's current languages have their own Wikipedia. The Hindi Wikipedia is at http://hi.wikipedia.org. Xenon54 / talk / 01:58, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * There is a list of Wikipedia languages at List of Wikipedias. You can use Hindi sources in the English Wikipedia. See Citing sources. PrimeHunter (talk) 03:25, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

User talk page text
How can I change the text on my user talk page to show in Green Courier font on the black background? --William S. Saturn (talk) 03:24, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Put &lt;span style="font-family:courier;color:green"&gt; at the beginning of the text you want to style (in this case, before the top section). It is not wise to close it because new sections will go below it.  Btilm  04:18, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * That works if I place the code at the top of each section, is there a way to do it, so that it occurs automatically each time someone edits the page? --William S. Saturn (talk) 05:20, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Friendly
At this section on the Friendly talk page, I want people to provide their opinion and vote on this matter. Where do I make the general announcement on Wikipedia so that people will get involved? Btilm 04:06, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * You could either post at WP:PUMP, or start a WP:RFC on the Friendly talk page. -- B figura (talk) 04:17, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

PDF
When I download an article as a PDF file, the infobox is always centered at the top of the article. Is there a way to change this so that the infobox is to the right of the lead? --William S. Saturn (talk) 05:53, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * You could use PDF creator software on your computer, which will enable you to create a PDF by clicking the print option in your browser (or in any other software for that matter) - the program will appear in the list of installed printers. An example would be the imaginatively titled PDF Creator, at http://sourceforge.net/projects/pdfcreator/. I believe the Village Pump would be the correct place to propose changes to the server's PDF rendering software. Regards,  AJ  Cham  09:19, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Getting help with deletion rationale
Hi - where can I go to ask for other, more experienced users' opinions on whether a particular article is suitable for speedy deletion? For various reasons to do with the page's history, I don't want to just stick a speedy tag on it and see what happens. Gonzonoir (talk) 09:05, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Without knowing which article it is, it's hard to advise you! I assume that you have read Criteria for speedy deletion? Which criteria do you think the article would fall under? --  Phantom Steve  ( Contact Me, My Contribs ) 09:27, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Also, have you considered discussing this on the article's talk page? --  Phantom Steve  ( Contact Me, My Contribs ) 09:27, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * A further thought (can't you tell I've had my coffee?) - I assume that either it has had a Speedy Deletion tag placed on it before - or that a deletion would be controversial? I would consider taking it to Articles for Deletion, and let the community decide. Also, would it be possible to rescue the article - find reliable sources, etc? Again, without knowing which article it is, it is hard to give reasoned advice. --  Phantom Steve  ( Contact Me, My Contribs ) 09:32, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * It's Team touchdown. I have begun discussing it on the talk page there, but I don't think anyone except me and the creator are reading that page. It has twice been speedily deleted under A7, but was recreated with the claim that the team had been covered in the national press for competing at a national level. Taking this as a claim of importance, I removed the speedy tag, asked the creator to cite this claim, and said I would prod if no evidence was forthcoming. Meanwhile I looked for sources to establish notability myself: it's not an easy term to Google, but I could find none. (Searching the archive of the newspaper that purportedly covered the team brought no hits)


 * A day later the page had begun to attract a lot of vandalism (the team purportedly competes against opponents "Milff" and "L33t Poodlez", and there's some other obviously absurd claims about players), but also the addition of some external links apparently intended as verification (though none looks, to me, to satisfy notability criteria); I stubified the article, reverted reinstatements of what looked (to me) like vandalism twice, and added a prod tag. This has since been removed again; the editor who removed the prod tag has commented on the talk page to the effect that he thinks the team is important and that the page shouldn't be deleted.


 * So... where do I go from here? The removal of the prod tag would suggest AfD, but as it stands the page actually contains no plausible claim of significance and thus perhaps meets speedy criteria. I'm also not sure whether to regard the removal as being in good faith, since the editor who did it has clearly vandalised other pages and the article itself - but I am worried that by wholesale reverting his changes, which can be construed as attempts to assert notability, I'll get myself into a 3RR mess.


 * Just basically lost my perspective on this one, and am looking for somebody with a wiser head. Gonzonoir (talk) 09:36, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * I just found the above through looking at your talk page! I'll put it up for AfD myself, unless I can find reliable sources. --  Phantom Steve  ( Contact Me, My Contribs ) 09:37, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Cheers. I probably overthought it a bit. Will comment at the AfD. Have re-stubified the article for now. Gonzonoir (talk) 09:41, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Merging
Had a quick query hopefully for merging. If youve placed a merge tag on a page but have not recieved any feedback or discussion regarding the merge (support or opposition), how long is it appropriate to wait until being bold and doing the merge? Is it better to hold off and wait until anyone comments? Hope this is the right place thanks Ottawa4ever (talk) 09:59, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * If you haven't received any feedback, it might be an idea to look at the article's history, and drop a note to the main contributors letting them know about the proposal. Say that you will wait for a week (and place a note on the article's talk page as well) and that if there are no objections raised, you will do the merge. --  Phantom Steve  ( Contact Me, My Contribs ) 10:45, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * You might also get additional opinions by leaving a note at the talk pages of relevant WikiProjects. This is especially encouraged if the page targeted to be merged is sparsely watched/edited. Glass  Cobra  17:56, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Deleting a file
Hi, Last month I had uploaded a file. Then I uploaded a better version with a different name. But the older file is still in Wiki as an orphan and it is completely useless. I'd like to learn how to delete it. Nedim Ardoğa (talk) 14:25, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * If the orphan file is a true duplicate, add to the unused file, replacing ImageName with the name of the other file that is being used.  This will request a speedy deletion under criteria F1, "Unused duplicates or lower-quality/resolution copies of another Wikipedia file having the same file format".
 * By the way, this site is called Wikipedia, not wiki. A wiki is any website using wiki software; there are thousands of them. --Mysdaao talk 14:57, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Acces denied
Hi, yesterday I may a mistake writing a new Email-address for my login and a new password. The Email address I entered was (removed). Could you switch to my older address ? because the new one doesn't exist for me. Maybe have I to wait 24 hours until this is done automatically ?

--91.179.68.54 (talk) 15:26, 18 November 2009 (UTC) (login : User:CUSENZA Mario)


 * If you log in to your account, and select "preferences" from the menu at the top of the page, you can make this change yourself. No one else at Wikipedia has access to your account, so it would be impossible for anyone besides you to do so.  -- Jayron  32  15:52, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * OK but I am not logged and I may not. So I'll wait 24 hours hoping that the changes will be aborted by not responding the Email sent to axrl19.  Thanks


 * --91.179.68.54 (talk) 16:00, 18 November 2009 (UTC) (login : User:CUSENZA Mario)


 * If a new password is requested by email from the login screen then the old password will still work if the new is not used. PrimeHunter (talk) 16:49, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * OK, I'll have to wait 10 days (because the new Email addres does not belong to me (in the same time I changed the password that I don't remember). So I hope that after the 10 days the old Email address will automatically return and I will ask the password again.
 * --Essai00 (talk) 13:06, 19 November 2009 (UTC) (User:User:CUSENZA Mario)


 * I was referring to the "E-mail new password" button at Special:UserLogin. If you changed the password in your preferences then the old password will no longer work. If you changed the email stored in your preferences then it will not change back by itself. If you have forgotten your password and cannot receive mails at the address in your preferences then you have permanently lost access to the account. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:34, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Just a thought: do you have any facility to create the email account you specified (the one that you've been saying doesn't exist for you now)? If you can do that I would have thought you can regain access. Gonzonoir (talk) 13:40, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

OK, all in order ! now. I found which was the false email I wrote (...@gmail.com) and create it in www.gmail.com. I received the new password in this manner. (Now I reseted the old address and use a new  password). Sorry for all this trouble... --CUSENZA Mario (talk) 15:08, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

Draft To Live
How do I take my draft and make it a live article? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nroth82 (talk • contribs) 16:14, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Maybe by openning the live article and copy-paste the text into !
 * --91.179.68.54 (talk) 16:18, 18 November 2009 (UTC) (User:CUSENZA Mario)
 * NO! You "make it live" by moving it to the mainspace. Only autoconfirmed users (account is 4 days old and has made at least 10 edits) can move pages. – ukexpat (talk) 16:29, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * I just check your contributions and the page is "live" at Maritz, sales and marketing services company. However it has been tagged for speedy deletion because it is too promotional in tone. Please take a look at WP:YFA, WP:SPAM, WP:CORP, and WP:RS. – ukexpat (talk) 16:33, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * You are allowed to copy and paste a page if you are the only contributor to the page, as is currently the case for User:Nroth82/Maritz. This is a common procedure for drafts created by a single editor in their userspace. However, Maritz, sales and marketing services company has been deleted as promotional. If others have contributed to a page then it must be moved instead to preserve the page history and satisfy the GFDL license by allowing readers to find the other contributors in the history. PrimeHunter (talk) 16:44, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

process related to submitting an article
I see how to submit using the wizard, etc. however myself and two colleagues put together an article on Perinatal Grief Scale and I am wondering the following

my user name comes up before the article title.

Will Wiki editors finalize my submission to be an article without my name?

Or how would you search for this without my name?

Is there a period of time before it would go into the general search engine?

thanks Karmour —Preceding unsigned comment added by Karmour (talk • contribs) 17:35, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * It appears you put the article into your user-space, which is a good place for drafts. If you want it moved to article-space, any autoconfirmed user can do that. Or you can use the following code to do it once you're ready:


 * TheNewPageName Short reason. ~


 * Hope that helps. -- B figura (talk) 17:39, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * And that code is placed on the talk page of the draft, ie User talk:Karmour/The Perinatal Grief Scale-Short Version-33 Item. However, IMHO it is not ready to be moved yet - it reads too much like an essay or scientific paper than an encyclopedia article. Please take a look at a few of our help pages: WP:YFA, WP:LAYOUT, WP:CITE to name just a few. – ukexpat (talk) 18:40, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Also note that the licensing terms under which we operate mean that you generally are claiming sole authorship. All text that you did not write yourself, except brief excerpts, must be available under terms consistent with Wikipedia's Terms of Use before you submit it. -- Orange Mike  &#x007C;   Talk  19:25, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Previous text Input which has disappeared
I am an old Scholar from Addey and Stanhope School which has a Wikipedia page. I added two references in the old scholars section on two brothers (Duff's) (one whom, Stanley, had an OBE for services relating to the UK National Health System (re the 'Beveridge report). Both entries were accepted but now seem to have disappeared (leaving lesser entries still there). Can you explain as to whether suich entries are subject to secondary review and deltion. I spent some time obtaining the facts about these two brothers both of whom held important posts in the public sector and insurance. Thanks —Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.20.30.206 (talk) 19:00, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * My guess is that you're talking about this edit, in which the two that you'd added were removed, along with one other. The editor who removed them did not leave an edit summary explaining his actions, I'll go leave him a note on his talk page, referring him here and asking for an explanation. Glass  Cobra  19:13, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Right, I left him a message; however, the user's last significant edits were in June, so I'm not sure if we'll receive any kind of timely response. If he hasn't responded in a day or two, I'd be happy to restore the names for you myself, as they appear perfectly suitable to be included in the article. Glass  Cobra  19:19, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * (e/c) Your edits (made when you were logged in as User:OAMJB1949) were reverted without explanation by User:Larkman, but probably because you did not cite a source. Do you have a reliable source for you edits? – ukexpat (talk) 19:17, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

For more information about how to communicate with other editors, see Help:Talk page and Talk page guidelines. See Help:History and Help:Diff for details about how you can see who has edited an article such as Addey and Stanhope School. Wikipedia's ability to track the revision history of every page is fundamental for allowing the collaborative editing model to work. --Teratornis (talk) 19:25, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Arrange List in Alphabetic Order
Hi Sir, I want to ask, how can I arrange any list on Wikipedia article in an alphabetic order. I have searched on the site but cant find any method for this, Thanks. Managerarc (talk) 19:43, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * If you mean entries in a table, see Help with sorting tables. If it is just a text list then copying and pasting to move the entries around is the only way. – ukexpat (talk) 19:57, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * If you need to sort a list, try http://sortmylist.com/. It can add delimiters, such as the asterisk used to create bullets. ---— Gadget850 (Ed)  talk 21:14, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Moving a User Page
I created a user page for a new topic, and feel I am almost ready to move it to Wikipedia proper. I can't figure out how to move my article, which is currently at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Bento00/Mary_Tuthill_Lindheim, to the "live" Wikipedia. I read the "Moving a page" help page but still couldn't find enough information about moving it. Must I request a move, or can I move it myself (and how is this done? I have already confirmed my email address.

Thanks for any help. Bento00 (talk) 20:00, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Done. See Mary Tuthill Lindheim. I believe you need to be autoconfirmed to move things, so you may just need to wait a few days before you'l be able to do it on your own (details on that are at WP:MOVE). -- B figura (talk) 20:02, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Help!
Can somebody explain to me why I needed to create [this redirection] and how I was able to do it? Is there some trouble in the program? --Againme (talk) 20:31, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * It's not exactly the same:
 * Your page: "Tarz%C3%A1n_L%CF%8Cpez"
 * Other page: "Tarz%C3%A1n_L%C3%B3pez"
 * So it's not an error! Both of those strings appear identical when they are on-screen, but aren't in the coding--  Phantom Steve  ( Contact Me, My Contribs ) 20:39, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * To explain a bit further, as far as the Wikipedia is concerned, there are 170,000 different unique characters (see Unicode). The fact that two of these characters are rendered exactly the same way is a bit of a problem, but from Wikipedia's point of view %CF%8C and %C3%B3 are different characters, even if they use exactly the same shape when rendered using Wikipedia's font.  -- Jayron  32  20:46, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks for that, Jayron - I knew what was happening, but couldn't think of how to explain it better than I did! --  Phantom Steve  ( Contact Me, My Contribs ) 20:49, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the enlightment guys... so I guess we should create redirections on every name with this kind of characters to avoid confussion... --Againme (talk) 21:03, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Probably not, since English does not natively use accents anyways, and most English keyboards do not make rendering accents 'easy', nearly all (99%) users will be typing the unaccented name anyways. It probably isn't worth it to create a redirect from an obscure character set which will likely never be typed in anyways.  -- Jayron  32  21:13, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Oh! We Spanish-speaking grammar Talibans use it more than most people think! --Againme (talk) 21:15, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Your ó appears to be the correct Spanish character so I have moved the article to the spelling of the redirect you created. PrimeHunter (talk) 21:39, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Duplicative articles
I would note that Uniform Bill of Lading Act and Uniform Bill of Lading Act of 1916 are essentially the same article. RadioBroadcast (talk) 21:46, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * They need to be merged. See WP:MERGE --  Phantom Steve  ( Contact Me, My Contribs ) 22:09, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * They were created by the same editor six days apart and may refer to different bills but I'm not sure. 64th United States Congress lists:


 * August 9, 1916 - Uniform Bill of Lading Act of 1916
 * August 29, 1916 - 2nd Uniform Bill of Lading Act of 1916
 * PrimeHunter (talk) 22:21, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * I have left messages at WikiProject Law and WikiProject United States History about it. Hopefully the knowledgeable bods there can work out if the two articles are for the same Bill, or if they are for the different bills --  Phantom Steve  ( Contact Me, My Contribs )


 * Thank you both. RadioBroadcast (talk) 15:55, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

internal links to Guampedia have changed
Good morning from Guam,

I see there are at least 20 references to Guampedia, Guam's Online Encyclopedia, in Wikipedia. While the main address is the same, the internal links have changed. How can I go about changing them in Wikipedia? I see it listed in the references but when I try to edit I only see this:

In the Guam flag and seal article, for instance, the new address should be http://guampedia/guam-flag-and-seal/

Can you help please?

Shannon Murphy Guampedia managing editor
 * Hi. I have taken the liberty of making the template you posted display. The text of the references are in the body of the article. The template,, makes the references display there when in read mode. What you need to do is click "edit this page" at the top of the article and scroll to the link that need to be changed. Probably the most efficient way to do this, would be to have two screens open: one in edit mode, and one in read mode. Find the URL (the address of the link) from the read mode document, then go to other and click + to access your browser's find function. Paste the address and you will find the link to change in the article in seconds. Rinse and repeat until done. Cheers.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 23:18, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Chelation information--article sites "Quackwatch" as a source
"Quackwatch" is a highly polarized organization mainly supported by a belief system rather than scientific knowledge. Your Chelation article suggests that heavy metal chelation is dangerous and unscientific when used for autism. However, several organizations dedicated to scientific research in autism support the use of heavy metal detox and chelation such as Defeat Autism Now and Autism Research Institute. This chelation article is slim on information and fat on opinion. Wikipedia should not be an opinion piece and I feel that the chelation article is just that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.164.37.122 (talk) 23:32, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * I think you want the Reliable Sources Noticeboard. -- B figura (talk) 00:09, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

My new page doesn't show up in Google. How do I do that?
I made an article on a specific person. When I type their name into Google, that person's personal web page is the first hit. When I type their name and Wikipedia into the search bar I get other people's Wikipedia articles who have a similar name first. In fact, I can;t even find my article at all using Google. I think those other authors must have done something to their Wikipedia article to make it show up before mine. How do I get my page to show up when I search for it? Mabsal (talk) 23:34, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * If it doesn't get deleted, it won't be too long. When I make a new article, it comes in the search engine a few minutes after.  Zoo Fari  23:39, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * My article went live about a month ago. It's still standing. I wonder if it is because there are actually three articles on Wikipedia about three different men with the same name. The one who shows up in Google is the guy whose page shows up in Wikipedia when you type the name in. You have to click the disambiguation link on that guy's page to get to the article I wrote and the other guy's article. Does that make sense? Mabsal (talk) 23:45, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Our purpose here is to provide information, not to improve your Googlehits. We do not care who shows up where on a Google search, and we will not cooperate with efforts at SEO for your articles, nor provide SEO advice. (And of course, we have no control over Google, any more than they do over Wikipedia.) -- Orange Mike  &#x007C;   Talk  23:49, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * (edit conflict) In regards to searching within Wikipedia its self, Dan Clark has a hatnote to the disambiguation page where Dan Clark (motivational speaker) is listed.
 * It is already flagged for deletion. I believe with the correct refs it will stand but will discuss it over there. Please also make sure you do not have more than an encyclopedic interest in this and can stay neutral. Wikipedia isn't for advertising so a top google hit is not necessarily the goal. Cptnono (talk) 23:50, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm just wondering why one of three shows up in either a search engine or on Wikipedia itself. I often type a search term and then Wikipedia if I am trying to get to a Wikipedia article so that is my only concern. I tried to write the article in NPV. Wikipedia was linking to the wrong guy (an actor) in a Chicken Soup article, which is why I started the page. This is my first page and I was just wondering how pages show up on search engines. I don't think it is an odd question. Cptnono, I will try to go to a conversation on the page, but I am not sure I know how that works. Mabsal (talk) 23:57, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Orangemike, are you saying what I did there with the hatbar (?) is not proper procedure? I tried to imitate the Jupiter example. Mabsal (talk) 00:04, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
 * The hatnote is appropriate. Orangemike's point was that we are here to build an encyclopedia, not engage in a contest for Google page rankings. – ukexpat (talk) 15:54, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Google only shows a few hits from each domain and this article happens to not be among those Google chooses to show from wikipedia.org. There is nothing wrong with that. If you tell Google to show results from Wikipedia with then Dan Clark (motivational speaker) and hundreds of others show up. PrimeHunter (talk) 00:18, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Mabsal, considering that you were the one to upload all the pictures used on the article to Wikimedia Commons, and are the author of the article, I highly doubt that this was an innocent creation on your part. Furthermore, the article reads like a badly disguised puff piece. I would strongly recommend that you read Conflict of interest and refrain from editing the article any further. Glass  Cobra  01:00, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
 * I wanted to know why some worked and some didn't. I will use the advice of PrimeHunter from now on when I want a Wikipedia article. I won't edit this article any further.146.86.72.228 (talk) 23:26, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
 * I wanted to follow-up on this. It looks like the subject does meet the notability guidelines. This doesn't mean that clean up isn't needed but the article is good enough to not be deleted in my opinion. I was looking for assistance on the disambiguation question. It appears that Dan Clark may be better known since he is on TV but I do not think that makes him the primary topic. Since there are two other Dan Clark's + multiple see alsos (please see Dan Clark (disambiguation), the current Dan Clark article might need to be renamed with a modifier (date of birth?). Thoughts?
 * Also, should Dan Clark (motivational speaker) be renamed with date of birth since his writing appears to make pay a substantial role in his notability?
 * Cptnono (talk) 00:29, 20 November 2009 (UTC)