Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2009 October 17

= October 17 =

Uncommon surname matches name of city in Turkey
If a Wikipedia search for my name "Gocek" resulted in no hits, I wouldn't care to add a Gocek surname page. My frustration is that such a search results in redirection to a page about a city in Turkey. The implication is that that's what "Gocek" is, but in fact, there are English speaking people with the surname Gocek. The city's Wikipedia page exists largely to promote tourism ... that's fine, more power to 'em, I'm just saying that there is an alternate Gocek universe, and if Wikipedia is to contain "Gocek" content, it's proper to include the family as well as the Turkish city. *** IN MY PERSONAL SANDBOX *** I created a Gocek surname page, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:GaryGo/Sandbox). I tried hard to make this a good surname page. If I use this to create a Gocek_(surname) page, WILL MY NEW PAGE BE DELETED? —Preceding unsigned comment added by GaryGo (talk • contribs) 02:08, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Out of curiosity why do you presume your page would be deleted? Jeffrey Mall (talk • contribs) - 02:13, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * I haven't evaluated your page but note that if you click the "Search" button below the search box instead of clicking "Go" or the Enter key then you can get a search  of "Gocek" with some hits to pages mentioning people of that name. There are currently no articles where the subject is people of that name so it is accordance with Wikipedia policies that Gocek currently redirects to Göcek. PrimeHunter (talk) 02:27, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * The purpose of Wikipedia is not to "promote tourism". Wikipedia is an encyclopaedia, and exists to provide information about a variety of topics. If your surname is very uncommon, it probably won't have its own article. Intelligent  sium  review 02:28, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for all the reponses. Forget my comment about promoting tourism, my bad. I am concerned about deletion because the Wikipedia help pages warn profusely that surname pages are carefully checked and could be deleted. I can go to lots of search engines to search for the name; I want to create a Wikipedia surname page. I know that my surname does not have its own article, that's why I want to create one. My question remains, will my proposed surname page survive? —Preceding unsigned comment added by GaryGo (talk • contribs) 03:12, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Well, my last name is also the name of a town; never really had a problem with it though. Looking at the page in your sandbox it looks like it's got a lot of detail that article patrollers will pounce on. I think the best solution is to create a Gocek (disambiguation) page with links to town and all the people listed in your sandbox page. You might use Bury (disambiguation) as a model.--RDBury (talk) 12:12, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks RDBury, that answers my question. Let's say I create the disambiguation page. Currently, a search for "gocek" is redirected to the Turkish city because it is in the category for "Redirects from titles without diacritics". If I create the disambiguation page, will that automatically stop the redirection? Or do I have to do something special to stop the redirection? And, will my change to the redirection be undone by patrollers? —Preceding unsigned comment added by GaryGo (talk • contribs) 13:44, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

As the one who started the question, I think we should end it. I got the answer I needed, and after investigating Wikipedia's policies on notability, the disambiguation route is not proper, either. However, Wictionary contains a list of surnames and links which is more appropriate and that's the path I'm exploring now. Thanks for your comments. GaryGo (talk) 19:43, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

ESSAY ON TRAGEDIES
INFORMATION ON TRAGEDIES —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.65.63.146 (talk) 02:30, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks for posting, can you clarify what you are asking. Tiggerjay (talk) 03:09, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Are you looking for the article Tragedy? ≈ Chamal talk ¤ 04:21, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Is there any way to organize a list from recent to old without doing it manually???
In the List of Nobel Peace Prize laureates we agreed, using the discussion that it would probably be best to organize the laureates from recent winners going down (as it currently stands, it starts from first winner to last). Now I was going to change it but realized it would take forever, is there a faster way to accomplish this

Thanks! - Linestarz (talk) 04:56, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * You can simply make it sortable (see Help:Sorting). Then there's no need to rearrange. I'm surprised a featured list doesn't have a sortable table. ≈ Chamal talk ¤ 05:25, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Sorry, how would I do this (I did read your article, I just found it slightly confusing) - Linestarz (talk) 05:38, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Actually, sorting might not be possible, at least not easily. I'd have to look further into this, but since some of the cells in the table are merged vertically, wierd things happen when you try to sort it. Someguy1221 (talk) 05:42, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * See Manual of Style (lists of works). There are not many circumstances where newest to oldest is preferable. Garion96 (talk) 15:20, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Is there anyway to get information off of a now redirected page?
A page that once had information on it was decided to be redirected to a different page which was more concrete and had cited recources. However, there was a large amount of information on that page which is not in the new redirected page. I tried to access an older version of the page, but was unable to find any. Is there any way to get an older version before it was redirected, so that I can save some of the information? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.169.217.129 (talk) 05:08, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Which page? Someguy1221 (talk) 05:14, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Howl-O-Scream_(Williamsburg)&redirect=no —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.169.217.129 (talk) 05:29, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * The page was deleted before it was redirected. If you want, I can send you the deleted copy. Send an email to WikiWikiWoo1221 at gmail dot com and I'll get it back to you. Someguy1221 (talk) 05:37, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Recreating pointless articles

 * This thread is connected to one above. Dr Dec  (Talk)   12:11, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

A user keeps creating an article called Foundations of the Spanish kingdoms. All of the information is contained in the History of Spain article, and to a much higher editorial standard. The page was blanked and replaced by a redirect to the History of Spain article. The user has removed the redirect and has included all of the content again. I've blanked the page and replaced it, for the second time, with a redirect to the History of Spain article. Is there any warning that can be given, or action that can be taken, if this user continues to re-include this duplicated material? Dr Dec (Talk)   10:41, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * You need to do a WP:RfC on the issue to get a consensus opinion on the validity of the article. Or you can leave the article as is and nominate it for deletion. Either way, stop reverting edits until you are able to get some other people to agree with your case.--RDBury (talk) 11:53, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I already do. Andyjsmith was the first editor to blank the page and make a redirect. I came to the help desk to ask what to do. Orangemike changed the redirect to a specific section and therefore implicitly agreed with the blanking and redirect. I just reinstated someone else's redirect. Dr Dec  (Talk)   11:59, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Okay RfC made. Please comment. Dr Dec  (Talk)


 * Please note that the RFC should have been posted on the article's talk page, per the instructions at WP:RFC. I've moved it - the RFC is now at Talk:Foundations of the Spanish kingdoms and will soon be listed at History and Geography RFCs.  AJ  Cham  12:41, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Great! Thanks for that. This was my first RfC, so I wasn't too sure what to do. Dr Dec  (Talk)   12:53, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Disruptive AfD exchange
Starting 20:46, 15 October 2009 this AfD degenerated into a totally disruptive exchange on the nomination rather than on the article. Is there anything that can be done about that? Declaring that part of the discussion closed? Or an uninvolved admin issuing stern warnings to all involved. I was tempted to hide that part, but every few inches there are a few words that one might argue were about the article. —teb728 t c 10:47, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I skimmed it, it's very long and detailed and gets into a lot of side issues about the criteria for notability. I've seen a lot of AfD's turn into forums to debate notability criteria and if there is a policy against that kind of thing so that admins can step in then I've yet to see it applied. Admin intervention is more for when there's actual name calling or people deleting other people's edits or the like.--RDBury (talk) 11:39, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

How do I find the all the pages whoes name begins with X?
How do I find the all the pages whoes name begins with X? User talk:CarlaudeUser talk:Carlaude 12:57, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Go to Special:Allpages. You can also search Wikipedia articles titles by going to Google, restricting the search to Wikipedia with the delimiter  and then searching for titles using the format  . Cheers.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 13:27, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks. User talk:CarlaudeUser talk:Carlaude 13:33, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

i was refered here
will these do for notability of academics?

1. Distinguished Scholar award from the Communal Studies Association

2. Myers Center Award

? 212.200.205.163 (talk) 15:15, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Possibly. The best resource for establishing notability (academic or otherwise) is significant coverage in independent reliable sources. You may also want to read our info on writing your first article, as it contains useful info. TN X Man  15:19, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * So that people know what these two are about:


 * 1) Distinguished Scholar award from the Communal Studies Association "honors those persons who have contributed greatly to the study of communal societies past and present." according to the CSA's website (see their Guidelines)
 * 2) "The Myers Center Award for the Study of Human Rights in North America is presented annually to authors of the best scholarship on the subject of intolerance in North America" (as defined in The Gazette (Cedar Rapids-Iowa City), April 19, 1998
 * How notable these are is a question for others - it all depends on how reliable and notable the CSA and The Gustavus Myers Center For The Study of Bigotry and Human Rights in North America (see their award winners) are counted as being. NB the Myers Center closed down this year due to lack of funds. --  Phantom Steve  ( Contact Me, My Contribs ) 15:41, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * The Gazette isn't a very good paper. While I'm not saying it's not reliable, there are better sources out there.
 * I would think the person probably needs to have at least one other reliable source (or award) to their name. Xenon54 / talk / 15:59, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I only quickly looked up the two awards - it's a bit hard to do much when you have an upset 2 year old to deal with! --  Phantom Steve  ( Contact Me, My Contribs ) 16:22, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Sorry I didn't make that clearer - it was directed at the prospective article creator, not at you! =) Xenon54 / talk / 16:29, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Image not appearing in article
Image TheBrightPathLogo.jpg, which was uploaded to Wikicommons, is not showing up in article, The Bright Path for some reason. Can anyone figure out why? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Joelcan (talk • contribs) 21:38, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Even when using a gallery, the File: prefix must be added to images to include them in an article. I've gone ahead and fixed this for you. Robert Skyhawk So sue me! (You'll lose) 23:12, 17 October 2009 (UTC)
 * See WP:GALLERY for instructions you can follow next time. --Teratornis (talk) 05:30, 18 October 2009 (UTC)