Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2011 July 29

= July 29 =

Information Needed on How My Corrections Have Been Deleted
I just tried, for the first time, to do a major edit on an article, titled "John C. Cremony." I had just finished his "Life Among the Apaches* and wanted more information on the author. I found a very misleading article, and corrected it, quoting from the "Life" to prove my point. Much to my surprise, my correction was deleted, and the original article reinserted, within seconds of my post. Thinking that perhaps I had not correctly posted my revisions, I rewrote them and posted them a second time, only to again have the original article substituted for mine almost immediately. Although my contribution, from LosAngeles08, is listed in the "discussion" section, I could not access it.

Could somebody tell me what is going on? Can the author of an article somehow automatically delete any corrections or additions as soon as they are posted? Is my version accessible? How do I write an account of my experience that will inform readers who consult the article, but cannot be immediately deleted? In other words, can I write something for the "discussion" section that is not a [censored] correction of the article itself? I'm clueless as to what is going on, and disillusioned. — Preceding unsigned comment added by LosAngeles08 (talk • contribs) 00:23, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * You can see the article history here, which shows other users' reasons for reverting your changes. The other editors believed that your additions were dubious, original research ("OR"), and not supported by the sources cited. I'd recommend starting a discussion at Talk:John C. Cremony about the changes that you would like to make. Calliopejen1 (talk) 00:37, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * The other editors' undoing of your edits have comments such as "not in the source, OR" and "Reverted addition of dubious unsourced content". I don't know anything about the topic or the sources, but sounds like either various editors disagree on the meaning of sources, or at least different editors using different sources are finding different information. It happens a lot in my experience, since not everyone has access to the same sources and definitely don't all have the experience to understand them all. Perfect example of the sort of dispute that can be hashed out on the article's talk-page. Things like "the article says X but source A says B instead; what is the basis for saying X?" would be a good starting-point there. Then others can explain why X is viable as-is, or help adjust the writing to agree with all sources ("A says B whereas C says X"), or maybe find more sources to break the tie or help re-interpret A itself. DMacks (talk) 00:43, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * In addition, the tone of your writing was not appropriately encyclopaedic; it offered an opinion, and thus did not conform to a neutral point-of-view. You are offering an interpretation of the book, based on your own ideas, which is not permissible on Wikipedia. Instead, we need verifiable facts that have been published in reliable sources - such as, newspaper articles or other books about the person / his work.  Chzz  ► 00:48, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Need to have a comment I made redacted due to the threat of legal action
I need to have a comment I made redacted due to the threat of legal action. The comment is on a previous version of my talk page.

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:Alxxthegeek&diff=387355724&oldid=381439736

line 64

The comment is

The requested redaction is by deleting the words

I need to get them deleted asap to avoid legal action.

Alex Gibson — Preceding unsigned comment added by Alxxthegeek (talk • contribs) 00:57, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Where's the threat of legal action? Bielle (talk) 01:06, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * I'm confused...that talk-page comment does not look like a legal threat. Or are you threatening legal action if it's not removed? It's rare that we would remove partial comments except under extreme circumstances, and it's generally sufficient to remove the whole message (but again, I don't yet understand the severity of the situation you are seeing). DMacks (talk) 01:06, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * I am being threated with legal action unless I get the comment I made "" redacted. The threatened legal action is in Sydney Australia.Alxxthegeek (talk) 01:08, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Can you provide a link to the threat? GB fan please review my editing 01:13, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Sounds related to Sockpuppet_investigations/MileyFan1990 (see archived sections for 28 August 2010 and 02 September 2010). I'll ping oversighters, but might be a job for wplegal (it's technically impossible to make the edits completely invisible to everyone). DMacks (talk) 01:18, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * I don't see what DMacks is seeing (and in 2010, no less) at Miley Fan or any threat at all being made against Alxxthegeek. What am I missing that would interest oversighters? Bielle (talk) 01:27, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * As I understand it, the user the quoted comment was directed at is threatening Alxxthegeek with legal action because of the accusation of . Presumably the threat is made off wiki in Australia. Alxxthegeek has given info about work which could be used to track somebody down. I find it hard to believe anybody would use resourses on actually taking legal action over the quote. It sounds more like bullying. Here is a checkuser statement that the accused user has indeed : . PrimeHunter (talk) 01:42, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * The name mentioned in the comment in question matches a name involved in the SPI as part of a series of abusive edits by that sockfarm on the same topic as the comment in question. Other parts of that SPI make the connection to Australia, the source of the legal threat Alxxthegeek noted. DMacks (talk) 01:47, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * I've been told all I can post about the legal threat is:


 * At this stage, it's better to advise Wikipedia that "At this stage the matter is confidential. Please take the steps you think appropriate to responde to my request to redact my statement". Alxxthegeek (talk) 01:44, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * So ID092833535 gets blocked (again?)? I am feeling really stupid, so forgive me but what could a (known?) sockpuppet possibly find sufficiently disturbing in the text cited to cause a legal threat, especially if he/she should be still blocked as a sockpuppet? Bielle (talk) 01:56, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * If I understand correctly, I think PrimeHunter has it right, and this is a sockpuppet bullying Alxxthegeek with obnoxious legal threats. The comments were already blanked a year ago, so that can't be what they're asking. While I can't imagine the threat having any basis, I think it would ease Alxx's mind if we revdel'd or oversighted them, and I'd be inclined to do so (doesn't really fit any of the revdel criteria, but nobody's going to mind, right?).  Alxx, would it be enough to wp:revdel them, so the general public can't see the text?  If so, I'll do that for you.  If you need it hidden from admins as well, you'll need to contact oversight; you can email them at Special:Emailuser/Oversight. --Floquenbeam (talk) 02:07, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Just in case, I have edited the above posts to replace all copies of the original comment with "details removed". If this is a matter for revdel/oversight then about 20 revisions of the Help desk will have to be hidden as well. -- John of Reading (talk) 08:19, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Thank you-- Alxxthegeek (talk)


 * Sorry for the delay in replying. Thank you for the help!. I've been requested to ask that the comments be revdel'd.- Alxxthegeek (talk)

Shuttle Columbia Disaster
The shuttle disaster was 1/8/86 not 2005 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.121.143.223 (talk) 02:00, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * The article, Space Shuttle Columbia disaster, says it occurred February 1, 2003. Do you have a question about this?  GB fan please review my editing 02:06, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * If you are referring to a claim in Wikipedia then please say which page it is on. Space Shuttle Columbia disaster was February 1, 2003 over Texas during re-entry. Space Shuttle Challenger disaster was January 28, 1986 off the coast of Florida shortly after take-off. PrimeHunter (talk) 02:13, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Express card slot.
I have a hp laptop which has a slot on the side about 50mm wide. According to the "Help" section it is for an Express Card. There is no information as to what an Express Card is or does. Any information would be appreciated. Joe Blow~ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.214.41.154 (talk) 04:13, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * I suspect, based on your question, that you found one of our over 6 million articles and thought we were affiliated in some way with that subject. Please note that you are at Wikipedia, the free online encyclopedia that anyone can edit, and this page is for asking questions related to using or contributing to Wikipedia itself. Thus, we have no special knowledge about the subject of your question. You can, however, search our vast catalogue of articles by typing a subject into the search field on the upper right side of your screen. If you cannot find what you are looking for, we have a reference desk, divided into various subject areas, where asking knowledge questions is welcome. Best of luck.
 * PS: I see you attempted to sign with a single tilde. We actually sign with four tildes ( ~ ). Thanks again,  An  editor since 10.28.2010.  04:18, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * For an information about ExpressCards see ExpressCard. —teb728 t c 04:55, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Part 2 of my question (here's a link to part 1)
PLEASE click the link and read the previous discussion. Can I 'd it?  An   editor since 10.28.2010.  04:37, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * What specifically would you like to include on the page? Ryan Vesey  Review me!  04:39, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm not really sure what you're asking here. If you're asking if you can have content in violation of WP:UPNO if it's hidden? Then I'd have to say no, it'll still be there. Doing so could just be seen as an attempt to game the system. If you want to actually specify what you want to hide, then maybe I can give a more specific answer. Rehevkor ✉  10:04, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Okay, it's probably not suitable, then. Thanks anyway,  An  editor since 10.28.2010.  21:21, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

The page I edit comes blank !?
I have just created an account in order to edit an article. Unfortunately this article comes blank when I click the "edit" button. Any clue what I should do? Your instructions will be highly appreciated!

Thanks, CRABCHAMURA (talk) 06:29, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Remember to hit the "Save" button. Special:Contributions/CRABCHAMURA says that the only edit you have saved so far is this one here. Which page did you think you'd edited? - David Biddulph (talk) 06:32, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Maybe you're clicking the 'edit' link at the side of a blank section?
 * Use the 'Edit' tab at the top, near the right - where it says, Read Edit   View history   Search
 * See also Tutorial.  Chzz  ► 07:22, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * If you are trying to edit references then for the most common type of reference you have to edit where the reference is used and not where it is displayed. See Referencing for beginners. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:57, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

iPhone
I have an iphone and wikipedia has a certain Internet theme on the iPhone which I accidentally turned off, I was wondering how I can get this back? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.85.244.87 (talk) 07:35, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Click this link - Enable Mobile Version CaptRik (talk) 08:11, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

tool to analyse breakdown of edits, etc
Just wondering if there's a tool available that will list by percentage (for example) of how many edits that I have made have been to a certain page, or how many times in total I've edited there, that sort of thing. I'm far more active on certain pages than I am on others, and was just wondering how much of my time they actually take up, compared to many single instance edits - to remove vandalism, etc.  a_man_alone (talk) 08:26, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * One tool is "X!'s Edit Counter" - to get details, you'd have to create the page User:A man alone/EditCounterOptIn.js to 'opt in' - it doesn't matter what you put on the page, it just has to exist. And then, the tool will show your "Top edited pages", which will probably cover what you want, here.


 * There's also a website (unaffiliated with Wikipedia), http://en.wikichecker.com/ - that shows "Frequently edited pages" if you click the thingy to expand it, but it defaults to just the most recent 500 edits. If you do "Analyze all edits of this user", it'll show all of them - here.
 * Yet another is http://wikidashboard.appspot.com/ - if you go to a user page, it lists the top-5 edited articles, and you can choose 10,20,50.
 * See also WikiProject edit counters.  Chzz  ► 08:38, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Sorry - been a bit lax here. X! is eactly what I wanted.  Thanks for letting me know.   a_man_alone (talk) 11:16, 1 August 2011 (UTC)

Category:Non-English_welcome_messages for zh users
Are there enough traffic from Chinese editors so a separate welcome template can/should be created? I wouldn't mind taking on this task, but I'd like some gauging and other views. - Penwhale &#124; dance in the air and follow his steps 10:07, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * non-english welcome messages
 * I've used those templates from time to time, so one day I might need a Chinese version. So, yes please. -- John of Reading (talk) 10:15, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Just realized: Should I have it in Traditional Chinese, or how should I deal with it? - Penwhale &#124; dance in the air and follow his steps 10:41, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * In any case, Welcomeen-zh done in Traditional. - Penwhale &#124; dance in the air and follow his steps 10:53, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Added the docs and the category. Tried to match things after the foreign language to the Spanish (not that I read either Spanish or Chinese. :)Naraht (talk) 13:00, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Much obliged. - Penwhale &#124; dance in the air and follow his steps 13:10, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Debbie Johnson of Ham Lake MN
She is no longer married, has been divorced for at least 5 years and is no longer the owner of Blaine Hardware. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 156.99.30.174 (talk) 12:49, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Do you have any reliable sources. We can't just take your word on this.  -- Jayron  32  12:56, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

How do I create an article?
I have looked at all my buttons & searched it, but I cannot find how to create an article to submit. I would be grateful if you could anwser my query, if you can understand it. Thanks, Crystalbrook — Preceding unsigned comment added by Crystalbrook (talk • contribs) 16:27, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Before creating an article, please search Wikipedia first to make sure that an article does not already exist on the subject. Please also review a few of our relevant policies and guidelines with which all articles should comply. As Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, articles must not contain original research, must be written from a neutral point of view, should cite reliable sources which verify their content and must not contain unsourced, negative content about living people.


 * Articles must also demonstrate the notability of the subject. Please see our subject specific guidelines for people, bands and musicians, companies and organizations and web content and note that if you are closely associated with the subject, our conflict of interest guideline strongly recommends against you creating the article.


 * If you still think an article is appropriate, see Your first article. You might also look at How to write a great article for guidance, and please consider taking a tour through the Tutorial so that you know how to properly format the article before creation. An Article Wizard is also available to walk you through creating an article. TN X Man  16:33, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Anti-vandalism program
I'd like to start using an anti-vandalism program, but I don't know which to use. Is STiki any good? Or is there another one that doesn't require rollback that's better? Thanks! --Nathan2055talk 16:55, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Eh, I have seen a lot of problems with STiki. Try using Lupin's Anti-vandal tool combined with Twinkle.  You need to add the code into your common.js file and then the tools will appear in your toolbox.  Click filter recent changes to start the process.  Ryan Vesey  Review me!  17:53, 29 July 2011 (UTC)


 * I use Twinkle when I do anti-vandal work. I have never tried STiki, but I have seen problems with the more automated tools.  I just go to recent changes.  I like to look at each edit individually in my browser and decide what to do with it.  Then I use Twinkle to revert and warn if appropriate..  GB fan please review my editing 18:02, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * The anti-vandal tool looks great! Does it require rollback (I don't think it does)? --Nathan2055talk 17:39, 30 July 2011 (UTC)
 * I just added the anti-vandal tool, but the extra options aren't available in my toolbar. I can use the manual links, though. --Nathan2055talk 17:45, 30 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Hmm, are you using the vector skin? Try going to Special:MyPage/vector.js instead.  If you are using a monobook skin go to Special:MyPage/monobook.js.  Ryan Vesey  Review me!  01:23, 31 July 2011 (UTC)
 * I figured out the problem: the links appear in the toolbox, not the toolbar! I've began using the program, and like it a lot, especially it's rollback feature. It can even auto-warn. I give it a 10/10! Thanks for your help! --Nathan2055talk 02:48, 1 August 2011 (UTC)

Parent company
Hi there,

I was trying to create a page for our company called Boston's the Gourmet Pizza. Our parent company, Boston Pizza, is in Canada. When they expanded the business to the states, the name was changed to Boston's the Gourmet Pizza. I created a page for us yesterday, linking the Canadian page (which mentions us and uses our logo) to our page. This morning I went to check back and make some changes on our page and saw that my creation had been removed and dubbed "Copyright infringement." I'm trying to figure out why I can't create our separate company a separate page. This has happened twice now and its frustrating as we are our own company, with our own identity, our own history and our own future. Please help as we are trying to expand our brand online and would love to include a Wikipedia page in that particular portfolio.

Any help you can offer is greatly appreciated,

74.203.164.146 (talk) 16:57, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * First of all, Wikipedia does not exist to serve the purposes of your organization. Second, a copyright violation is a copyright violation.Jasper Deng (talk) 16:59, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * I see your IP's talk page (talk) already has a conflict of interest warning, you should really read that and the other messages explaining the situation (and what to do about it), for convenience you can start here: Conflict of interest. Rehevkor ✉  17:01, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Also, that article was created by User:BostonsMarketing. This username indicates that you are here for promotional purposes. Please know that Wikipedia does not tolerate promotion. —teb728 t c 21:25, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Category: Dangerous Professions
Greetings, I, user Corusant, am proposing a speedy deletion template for the main category: Category:Dangerous Professions, since most of the users are voting for a deletion to the the main category page. Preferably, db-templatecat--Corusant (talk) 04:40, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Such proposals belong at WT:CSD. Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ukexpat (talk • contribs)


 * Deletion debates run for 7 days, and there is no need to end this one early. Furthermore, "speedy deletion" is used only in a very narrow set of circumstances, and this category doesn't qualify. There is no rush on issues like this, so just let it go until such time as an administrator chooses to close the debate and act on it. -- Jayron  32  17:45, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

TIME- The Weekly News-Magazine Vol. 1 N0. 1 March 3,1923
I have a copy of the first published Time news-magazine, March 3, 1923. I want to sell this, do you know where? Please contact me @. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.42.162.2 (talk) 18:29, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * I suspect, based on your question, that you found one of our over 3.6 million articles and thought we were affiliated in some way with that subject. Please note that you are at Wikipedia, the free online encyclopedia that anyone can edit, and this page is for asking questions related to using or contributing to Wikipedia itself. Thus, we have no special knowledge about the subject of your question. You can, however, search our vast catalogue of articles by typing a subject into the search field on the upper right side of your screen. If you cannot find what you are looking for, we have a reference desk, divided into various subject areas, where asking knowledge questions is welcome. Best of luck. TN X Man  18:34, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

Vauxhall Page
My edit to add Lord Voldemort to the list of Noteable people for the Vauxhall page was denied because he "is not a real person". He may not technically be a living person, but he is known around the world as the darkest Wizard of all time. If he is not a real person then why does he have his own Wikipedia page? I added a reference (Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets, page 232) which outlines that Tom Riddle (Voldemort's given name) is from that area of London. Please reconsider this. It is obviously a link to his Wikipedia page where people can learn that he is a character in Rowling's book if they choose to do so. Please reconsider adding Lord Voldemort to the list of Noteable people section of the Vauxhall Wikipedia page.

Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Karissa89 (talk • contribs) 19:59, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * An article on a real place should only list real people, the reasons for this should be so obvious I cannot begin to explain them. Яehevkor ✉  20:13, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

There is obviously a reference to a fiction book but we could put Lord Voldemort (fictional character). — Preceding unsigned comment added by Karissa89 (talk • contribs) 20:25, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * For the record, the diary is from Vauxhall Road, London(Just dug it out to check), not specifically Vauxhall itself, and there doesn't appear to be a Vauxhall road in Vauxhall. Also just because the diary is from there doesn't mean he is-- Jac 16888 Talk 20:33, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * There are plenty of precedents for including notable fictional characters on lists like this, if the assertion is properly sourced. -- Orange Mike  &#x007C;   Talk  20:39, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * I suppose there are now I look. But there would need to be sources other than the book, indeportant souces establishing the connection and it's significance; random example. Яehevkor ✉  20:46, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * If the original work is clear about it (and I agree with Jac that this is not a good example), I see no reason why the work itself would not suffice. Victor Frankenstein begins the book with "I am by birth a Genevese; and my family is one of the most distinguished of that republic"; that's good enough for me, unless you're going to argue he's an unreliable narrator. -- Orange Mike  &#x007C;   Talk  21:00, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * A decent example of where a fictional reference is appropriate in a real-world article might be re. Platform 9¾ at King's Cross. But that is sufficiently documented; has enough references to mean inclusion is appropriate.
 * For "Vauxhall Road", a) there is not such coverage, b) "Vauxhall Road" is not Vauxhall. So to me, it is obvious in this case that it doesn't belong.
 * In the book/film, there's a shop called "Winstanley's Bookstore & Stationers" at 422 Vauxhall Road, where Tom Riddle bought a diary. But to cover that minor detail in an unrelated article would be excessive. Consider just how many fictional books mention places in London? If we added them all (to the location articles), they'd overwhelm them. So unless the coverage is much more significant (e.g. 221B Baker Street), it shouldn't be included.  Chzz  ► 23:14, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

how to put reference
I have been told to correct my references but I still don't understand how to do that so can you tell me in more detail of how to put reference. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ali786151214 (talk • contribs) 21:04, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Read WP:CITE for guidance. -- Orange Mike  &#x007C;   Talk  21:15, 29 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Referencing for beginners may also help.-- SPhilbrick  T  21:26, 29 July 2011 (UTC)