Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2013 September 24

= September 24 =

VE's turn off
Anyone have a line on exactly what discussion/process etc. led to the Visual Editor being turned off and/or opt-in being made the default (not that I mind)? I've checked WP:VE, WT:VE, WP:VPT, WP:VPP, WP:VisualEditor/RFC and WP:VisualEditor/Default State RFC and haven't found it, but I know that the recent discussions I saw were that the foundation was absolutely not going to abide by the results of the RFC.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 00:56, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * WP:AN has it :) The foundation, fyi, didn't abide by the results until the community actually did implement it's fix. ~ Charmlet -talk- 01:02, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks Charmlet! Going to go read now.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 01:06, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * It's also at WP:VPT, but that was posted just shortly before your question here. RudolfRed (talk) 02:49, 24 September 2013 (UTC)


 * WP admins planned to hide VE in JavaScript menu: The admins had power to hide VE in the menu because VE had been forced on JavaScript browsers (and some users were shocked when "[ [this]]" failed to work any longer in July edits). By 22 September 2013, there was a clever plan to hide VE yet allow opt-in for registered users who had at least 1 edit, but the Foundation stated concerns about JavaScript server-speed and removed VE from the server-side menu instead (as opt-in). I wish they had worried about user edit speed whenever a very large VE edit failed to save any changes. -Wikid77 (talk) 06:34, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

Deeply biased moderator.
A collection of articles pertaining to anti-feminism/feminism (antifeminism, misandry, men's rights, feminism, etc) appears to have a moderator that is deeply biased against these things and is also very influential. While insisting that things such as anti-feminism is portrayed in the most negative light possible, they further ensure that no actual criticism of Feminism is allowed on the page. At one point they went so far as to cite a single scholarly work as the definition of the word "Misandry" despite that work not containing the definition as read and in fact there being numerous definitions contrary... the only justification for choosing that definition was that it was the most negative one. How do you deal with such an influential and biased moderator? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mr.Cappadocia (talk • contribs) 01:42, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * You can try the guidance at WP:DR to resolve your dispute. I would suggest that you stay away from these topics, as you seem to be engaging in edit wars and personal attacks, which are not the way to solve the problem.   Consider finding other topics here at Wikipedia to contribute contstructively to.  RudolfRed (talk) 02:32, 24 September 2013 (UTC)


 * It also might help to use the normal Wikipedia terminology. There is no such thing as a "moderator" here at Wikipedia. Those involved in discussing or making changes to articles (or other pages) are called editors. -- John Broughton (♫♫) 18:56, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

Wrong use of the America term
There are NOT such thing as "Americas" when talking about continents, because it is a single continent the denominations "North American" and "South American" portals are strictly incorrect and both portals MUST be mixed into single one; America has got 35 countries by the way — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.130.104.60 (talk) 05:34, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * North and South America are geographically separate continents, riding on separate plates. I don't know why you would think otherwise. Placas tectonicas es.svg.&mdash;Kww(talk) 06:14, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

? are we talking the same language? did you finish high school? you must be US-American right? --We are discussing in Geopolitically/administrative terms; tectonic plaques are not a criteria to make such a classification, Continents are : Asia; Europe; Africa; Oceania; America [just one] and according to some geographers also Antarctic(-a) -How dare you to say such a thing that there are 2 separate continents? did not they teach you that at your kosher high school — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.130.104.60 (talk • contribs)


 * If you really want to discuss this further, then the talk pages of North America and South America are the places to do it. I don't expect that you will find any support, though: a continent is a geological feature, defined by a grouping of tectonic plates. North America and South America are geologically distinct continents.&mdash;Kww(talk) 07:20, 24 September 2013 (UTC)


 * It also seems to have been discussed many times at Talk:Americas. -- John of Reading (talk) 07:26, 24 September 2013 (UTC)


 * I agree with Kww. The consensus, as expressed in the article continent, is that North America and South America are distinct continents. However I believe that plate tectonics is irrelevant, as the definitions of the continents were generally agreed before continental drift was understood. Maproom (talk) 07:35, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * The tectonic plates are irrelevant also because some continents are on multiple plates. India is on a separate plate from central Asia that is sliding under Asia, uplifting the Himalayas.  The distinction between Europe and Asia is a more artificial distinction than between North America and South America.  North America and South America are joined only by an isthmus, while the nominal boundary between Europe and Asia is a thousand miles long.  Geographers usually identify seven continents: Europe; Asia; Africa; North America; South America; Oceania; and Antarctica.  Geologically Eurasia is a single continent, and Oceania is not a continent but Australia is.  Take this discussion to the talk pages.  Robert McClenon (talk) 00:05, 27 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Gotta say, RMcC, that was an interesting read. (Not sarcasm) Well written! Cyphoidbomb (talk) 04:29, 27 September 2013 (UTC)


 * There ARE such a thing as "Americas" when talking about continents, it´s a matter of choice/habit. Listen to CGPGrey: . Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 11:22, 24 September 2013 (UTC)


 * I hope we're all agreed that the best place for this discussion (if anyone wants to continue it) is at one of the three article talk pages mentioned above, and not on this page. -- John Broughton  (♫♫) 18:53, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * I actually think this is worth discussing no where on Wikipedia. Never gonna happen, been discussed to death. See the talk page John pointed you to, its archives and other discussions such as at Talk:South America/Archive 1 and Talk:North America/Archive 2. Note, 190.130.104.60, that any further apparently antisemitic remarks will result in an immediate block.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 22:27, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

Page Doesn't Update
Page about author Yael Neeman I added several links to this page, but my changes only appear when I'm logged in, as soon as I log out - they don't appear. I'd appreciate any help on the subject. Thank You, Carolynsknight (talk) 07:32, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * We don't control Hebrew Wikipedia. It looks to me like a purging problem that will fix itself in an few hours. I can't purge it manually because my browser goes wacko with the right-to-left URL.&mdash;Kww(talk) 07:37, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * I think I just did a null edit on the page. Maybe that will help?  I can't read Hebrew, so I don't know for sure.  Dismas |(talk) 07:42, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

Thanks Kww, I checked but it still doesn't show up. (it's the last four links in the external links section). If I press on Edit, then I see them, but after the save they don't show up. I'll wait a few hours as you suggested to see if it will fix itself. Thanks very much for your help! Carolynsknight (talk) 07:53, 24 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Also, the Help desk for the Hebrew Wikipedia is here. -- John Broughton (♫♫) 17:10, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

The exact same thing is happening to me in this English language wikipedia for the Irish town of Kinsale. I've added a section "People from or associated with Kinsale" and it appears in the edits and even in the source code, but I can only see it if I view the page while logged in. Any recommendations? Blippityblop (talk) 16:34, 26 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Looks like a caching problem, see the answer to below. - David Biddulph (talk) 16:56, 26 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Thanks David, will address my further comments to that section. Blippityblop (talk) 18:50, 26 September 2013 (UTC)

Satpal Maharaj - Content
Dear ,

The content details mentioned in the mail is not correct & written with malafied intension.

Name mentioned "Bal Bhagwan Ji" is also correct. In Childhood we call kid by some name, it does not mean that the same name would be used throughout live.

Requested you to remove the word "BAL BHAGWAN JI"

Also the descriptopm of program organized by manav utthan sewa samit is wrong and it is meliciously explaind.

Currently Satpal Maharaj has no relation with Prem Rawat & Other brothers, why there name is assciate by them is wrong

Also the work done by Satpal Maharaj is not explained,

There is no mentioning of award "Men of the year" and "Man of the millenium" by international biographical society, Cambridge in the year 1999 & 2000.

Many work done by him for employment in uttrakhand ald also for sanction of railway line in uttrakhand the Himalaan State not mentioned in the details.

The sole intersion to write this article is malafied.

Please do the needful in providing correct information to the people.

Regards,

Gyan Vashishtha


 * The place to discuss this is on the talk page Talk:Satpal Maharaj. But please remember that it is a fundamental principle of Wikipedia to assume good faith. Describing other people's edits as "malafied intension" is assuming bad faith, and will not win you much support in any consensus. --ColinFine (talk) 08:40, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

Copyright status of works by students
Are there any guidelines available anywhere regarding the copyright status of works done by students? AIUI the copyright of theses and dissertations created as part of qualification for masters or doctoral degrees usually belongs to the student but may be ceded to the university. What is the status of "minor works" such as term papers, essays and assignments by undergraduates and even high school students? Is there international consistency like there is for "commercial" works such as books, films, photos, music etc, or does it vary a lot by country or even subnational jurisdiction? Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 13:45, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * In virtually all copyright regimes, the student would initially hold copyright -- there is rarely a difference between an essay, say, and a book -- but feasibly the institution could impose whatever rules it wanted regarding the transfer of copyright upon submission. I have to say I doubt that many do. - Jarry1250 [Vacation needed] 15:30, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

New article
Hi, can anyone remove my text on NEURONUS IBRO & IRUN Neuroscience Forum (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:WiolaW/sandbox ) from my sandbox to the sites of Wikipedia? Thanks! — Preceding unsigned comment added by WiolaW (talk • contribs) 15:42, 24 September 2013 (UTC)


 * - Your sandbox page is not ready to be changed into an article. If the page were moved, it probably would be immediately deleted (more than 1000 articles per day are deleted here at Wikipedia). The article doesn't have any information to indicate that the subject is notable. It doesn't have any footnotes. I strongly suggest you read WP:Your first article. Also, please note that Wikipedia, as an encyclopedia, aims to provide an overview of subjects, not detailed information. (There is far, far too much detailed information, such as the names of keynote speakers and those who won awards. (A Wikipedia article should have links to sources that can provide details for the interested reader.) -- John Broughton (♫♫) 17:07, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

How do you remove the extra space in the bottom of an article?
Hi. I am one of the major editors of The Voice of the Philippines and The Voice of the Philippines (season 1). These articles have these extra spaces found in the bottom of the article. How do I remove them? I haven't done anything for these extra spaces to appear in the said articles. -- A R E N Z O Y 1 6 A • t a l k • 15:52, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * I don't see any space, using Firefox. Are you using Chrome, by any chance? There's a discussion about this at Village pump (technical) The developers have fixed a problem, but I can't tell from that thread whether the fix has been deployed yet. Be patient, and you may find that the space disappears in a few days. -- John of Reading (talk) 16:09, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes, I am using Chrome. I haven't found any issues while using Firefox too. Thanks anyway for the clarification. :) -- A R E N Z O Y 1 6 A • t a l k • 16:21, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * FYI there is no problem on IE 10 either. Arjayay (talk) 18:43, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

CC licenses and POD publishers
Just found an interesting abuse of the Creative Commons license...is it legal for a print-on-demand publisher to "curate" (i.e. take a Wikipedia article or two or several) arrange them in a book format and offer it for sale? Because Hephaestus Books did with Slab hut and other articles into a book called Wooden Buildings and Structures, Including: Slab Hut, Bush Carpentry, Buswartehobel ISBN 9781242493300

Apparently, a 36-pages of Wikipedia articles gets offered at $20.69.--ColonelHenry (talk) 17:13, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * It's perfectly legal; see Buying Wikipedia articles in print or another form. -- Orange Mike &#x007C;  Talk  17:25, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Hey, if people want to pay for text that they can read for free, it's their choice. The company is providing some advantages:  The articles are all collected and arranged in a sensible order; you can use your highlighter or make notes next to the interesting bits; you can read them in a hammock far, far from your Wifi; and if you wrote or contributed to some of the articles you can keep an archive of the way they were at the time. &mdash;Anne Delong (talk) 17:36, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

Searches prefixed with "wiki:" redirect to c2.com
When I enter anything into the search box at the top of wikipedia of the form "wiki:test" and press enter, I get sent to "http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?test". Prefixes other than wiki don't trigger it, but the second half can be anything. Any idea what is going on? I do not know if this only affects this computer, but it seems like a strange thing for malware to do. K ati e R (talk) 18:14, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * I see that it is going to "the original wiki", so I take it that this is just interwiki support showing up? I originally tried it as a shortcut to "wikipedia:", hoping that the system would figure it out. K ati e R  (talk) 18:22, 24 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Yes, it's an interwiki prefix listed at meta:Interwiki map. meta:Talk:Interwiki map shows many people have been confused by it. PrimeHunter (talk) 19:02, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

Red Mountain High School in Mesa AZ mascot
Red Mountain High School in Mesa, AZ is listed on Wikipedia. However, the mascot listed is incorrect. The mascot is actually a mountain lion. Thank you for making this correction. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 159.36.0.199 (talk) 20:22, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Where did you see it listed incorrectly? The article on the school had not been edited since August and already listed "Mountain lions" as the mascot. I have changed this to singular (mountain lion) but I don't think that is what you meant when you said the mascot listed is incorrect, and I have searched Wikipedia for other articles that might list it and its mascot without result.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 22:40, 24 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Symbol move vote.svg Are you by any chance referring to a photo or text shown to the right of a Google search? Google's Knowledge Graph uses a wide variety of sources. There may be a text paragraph ending with "Wikipedia" to indicate that particular text was copied from Wikipedia. An image and other text before or after the Wikipedia excerpt may be from sources completely unrelated to Wikipedia. We have no control over how Google presents our information. You can however click the "Feedback" link on Google's search page and mark the mascot as wrong. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:02, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

Elgin Illinois wiki page
A few more movies were filmed here..and a few more famous people are from Elgin..the night mare on elm street movie filmed a few years ago  filmed its funeral scene at bluff city cemetery...the movie munger road was filmed in nearby st Charles Illinois...the film road to perdition was filmed in near by west Dundee for most of the older town scenes..also wwe superstar and Jennifer Hudson's husband David otunga is from Elgin and attended Larkin high school ..he did a graduating speech for the 2008 class...please update when you can..thanks  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.12.230.104 (talk) 20:23, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * If you have reliable sources for these assertions, then you can do it yourself. -- Orange Mike &#x007C;  Talk  20:33, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

Edit disappeared. Foulplay?
Earlier today I was editing the article German Green Party (Removing two images that didn't seem appropriate - self promotion). I left a note on the articles talk page to explain my reasons. Now the edit has disappeared. Not reverted (I half expected that), but it does not even appear on the revision history. The note I left on the talk page similarly disappeared, although there the revision history still shows my edit as the most recent edit (at 9.44), although the section that I have added does not appear on the talk page. So, what is going on? Has somebody hacked the database? My edits were done about 9.40am this morning, from IP address 86.171.30.141. 86.171.30.141 (talk) 21:14, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Heck, now everything seems to be in order again. Puzzled. I assume a browser cache problem on my side, although I thought I had checked that. Sorry for the hassle. 86.171.30.141 (talk) 21:17, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * :Note that German Green Party is a redirect, your edits are actually in the history of Alliance '90/The Greens. Your edits do appear in the history for me, and it appears they have not been reverted. If you looked in the history of the correct page and still didn't see them, perhaps your running into a caching issue? Maybe Bypass your cache would help. Monty  845  21:19, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

Jebulon
Hello, I'm Jebulon.

I'm French, sorry for bad english. My main page is on "Commons", Here.

My goal is to upload good quality images (I'm the proud owner of FP stars in THIS wikipedia !!!), and improve articles with better illustrations.

I'm Jebulon everywhere in all wikimedia projects around the world, EXCEPT here, in the english wikipedia.

I've a loggin problem, I don't know why, but I find this a bit ridiculous. Could somebody help and solve this issue for me ?

Thanks in advance.--82.123.108.224 (talk) 23:02, 24 September 2013 (UTC) (Jebulon)


 * https://toolserver.org/~quentinv57/sulinfo/Jebulon shows the English account User:Jebulon was created in 2007, years before your accounts at other wikis. The account has no edits so you can request the name at Changing username/Usurpations. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:08, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * I see I said exactly the same when you asked at Help desk/Archives/2011 December 29 I had forgotten that but at least I'm consistent! PrimeHunter (talk) 23:12, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

Added company history
Hello, I added company history to Un-Cruise Adventures. The company was already listed on wikipedia but without any information. I used information from my press kit which is also online on our website. We own the copyright. Isn't it ok to use it on wikipedia to give brief company background? thanks.SeattleSailor (talk) 23:48, 24 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Probably not. Wikipedia articles need to be written in a non-promotional manner, and it is likely your press kit isn't neutral in that regard.  23:55, 24 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Also, you have a conflict of interest (judging by your use of the words "our website") and should be very cautious about editing the article at all. Please read the link I just gave before you do anything else. --ColinFine (talk) 07:33, 25 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Note that Un-Cruise Adventures has been deleted as too promotional.--ukexpat (talk) 18:16, 25 September 2013 (UTC)