Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2014 September 18

= September 18 =

Sum
When I look at the revision history of a page and I click on prev, I have the following choices: rollback (AGF), rollback, rollback (VANDAL), undo, and sum. If there are, say, three edits in a row by the same user, and I want to back them out without rollback, I click on sum and put in an edit summary. Unbeknownst to me, this causes my edit to be marked as minor. Is this a Twinkle issue or something else? Is there a way of treating three consecutive edits as an "undo" so it is not marked as minor? I didn't even know this happened until someone brought it to my attention.--Bbb23 (talk) 00:17, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * (Partial answer) This isn't a Twinkle issue, as Twinkle only adds the three buttons "rollback (AGF), rollback, rollback (VANDAL)". -- John of Reading (talk) 06:27, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks for part of the answer, . Actually, I think I may know the answer, even if I don't understand the implementation. If I hover my mouse over rollback, the balloon says it will rollback all of this user's edits. If I hover my cursor over sum, it says the exact same thing in the ballon. If I click on rollback, there's no opportunity to put in an edit summary. However, if I click on sum, there is and the dialog for the edit summary has the word rollback in it. I never noticed many of these details before. I assumed there was no "negative" implication, unlike rollback, in using sum, which is why I used it. So, apparently, the only difference is sum stands for summary, but, like rollbacks, the action is marked minor. Assuming all this to be right, then how do I undo several consecutive edits, with a summary, and with the edit not being marked minor? And where is any of this documented?--Bbb23 (talk) 14:32, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * The default behaviour of the Twinkle buttons is that only the "vandal rollback" is minor, but this is configurable via your Twinkle preferences in the "Revert and rollback" section. So the second Twinkle button is probably what you want.
 * Poking around a bit more, your "sum" option is added by User:Gracenotes/rollback.js which is called from User:Bbb23/vector.js. I don't see anything in that script that allows the rollback to marked non-minor, but you could ask the script author about it. -- John of Reading (talk) 15:03, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * John, your answer eliminates the need for the long post I was about to make (edit conflict). I figured out about the Twinkle buttons, but I didn't realize that sum was caused by a script. That helps enormously. Thanks a lot.--Bbb23 (talk) 15:09, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

CCNV improved
the Community for Creative Non-Violence sources has been improved. How does that heading get removed? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dghavens (talk • contribs) 03:18, 18 September 2014 (UTC)


 * ✅--ukexpat (talk) 13:16, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

Finding the version in history closest to a particular time
The only way I could find right now was to give the month in the section above. But, there could be hundreds of contributions in a particular month and it is tedious to go through them all. Kingsindian (talk) 08:48, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Is there a way to quickly find the version of a page in history closest to a given time?
 * Is it possible to quickly get the history of a page starting from a particular time?
 * A request was posted to make this easier 7 years ago and i recently reposted it (meta:tech). It was said to be easy but was never done, due to lack of vocal people to support the request. If you want this, please voice your support. -- Taketa (talk) 09:18, 18 September 2014 (UTC)


 * If you click "older 50" on a history page then you get a url like https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Help_desk&offset=20140917174859&action=history where you can manually change the offset (always in UTC time) in the url. PrimeHunter (talk) 10:25, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks. 's reply suits me perfectly. My impression is that it will solve Taketa's problem as well. Kingsindian (talk) 10:51, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * I know of this method. This is unnecessarily complex and people do not know about it, where a simple button would suffice. -- Taketa (talk) 11:41, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

Reformatting coordinates
I was wondering if it was possible to reformat coordinates, so they work in the same way a piped link would? I'm interested in doing this, so that I can keep the original incription text at Charlotte Medal but link to the actual coordinates. So where the text in the article reads arriv,d at Teneriff th4 of June in Lat 28 13 N Long 16 23 W the coordinates could be clicked to link to 28.21667°N, -16.38333°W. Template:Coord/doc is extensive, but doesn't seem to cover this. Thanks very much for your time and help in advance. -LookingYourBest (talk) 09:29, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * article text is text and links to text articles. the linked coordinates may be appropriate to an infobox, or maybe even within the text of the article as coordinates, but never piped over by text. -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom  11:57, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * I thought that might have been the case. No worries! Thank you very much for the speedy reply. -LookingYourBest (talk) 12:06, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

Jamie Soward
Hi, I am trying to change the photo on Jamie Soward's (Australian rugby league player) but it keeps saying I do not have permission to do this. I am registered. How do I change the photo? Do I need permission from someone?

Jamie Soward

Manda 2908 (talk) 10:01, 18 September 2014 (UTC) However, most photos should be uploaded to Wikimedia Commons, which you can do without being autoconfirmed - click "upload file" on the left hand side of the Commons page. Please ensure that you own the copyright of the picture - which almost always means that you must have taken the photo yourself - or it will just be deleted. Arjayay (talk) 10:19, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Your account needs to be WP:AUTOCONFIRMED before you can upload photos to Wikipedia.

My Use of Wikipedia
I'm retired. I was a controller at Edwards AFB, CA, 1955-1959. Edwards is a test base & the 1950 was the jet age. They tested the first commercial jets, including the B-707, while I was there.

After the service I worked for the FAA as an air traffic controller at 4 different control towers, HQ in DC, & the Regional Office in Fort Worth. I covered each decade from 100-2020, & then I talked about the future up to 2050.

I write a lot about my experiences, but I did a lot of research. I had a lot of respect for the test pilots, most were already hero's from WW II &/or the Korean war. Some were killed at Edwards & I was the last to talk to them & I sent emergency equipment, Helicopter, & Dr. to the crash site. I got information from Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.

This is my first & only book & I understand that I need your permission to use your material? Will you please allow for me to say where I got the information & give me permission, if I need it, to use your material.

Thanks, Please respond!

Cecil Miller — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.170.122.110 (talk) 14:02, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Hi Cecil. Sounds like a fascinating memoir. You don't need to get specific permission to resuse Wikipedia's material - as long as you say where the text comes from (ideally with a URL), you can use it for free. The only other proviso is that if you make changes to the text, you must allow other people to reuse it in the same way (this would only apply to text taken from Wikipedia, not to the entire book).
 * There is a more comprehensive explanation at Reusing Wikipedia content, which I'd encourage you to read, but in essence, if you say where you got it and let other people use it as well, it's all yours. Best of luck with your book. Yunshui 雲 水 14:40, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * I agree, sounds like an interesting book. As Yunshui noted, the use of the material is easy. However, I'll caution you to recall that anyone can edit, so don't treat the contents as 100% accurate. If you want to use something, I urge you to make sure it is referenced to a decent source. -- S Philbrick (Talk)  14:53, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

Russian Wikipedia Image files
Hi, I'm trying to edit some pages about Tajikistan and lots of great stuff is already out there on the Russian version of wikipedia but it for some reason it won't appear when I add these images to the english language version. I don't really know where to turn for help with this but if someone has any experience editing with this kind of stuff it would be great to get some help. The image I would like to add is called Файл:Madamin-bek.jpg. In English this should be File:Madamin-bek.jpg but if I type this I just get this: Monopoly31121993 (talk) 18:31, 18 September 2014 (UTC)


 * I suspect that the problem is due to the files in question being hosted locally on the Russian Wikipedia, rather than on Wikimedia Commons. Assuming there are no copyright issues (Commons does not allow non-free or fair use images), your best option would be to move the files to Commons - see Moving files to the Commons. AndyTheGrump (talk) 18:41, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * If the file has only been uploaded to the Russian Wikipedia itself, trying to use it on the English Wikipedia won't work. It should be uploaded to WikiMedia Commons instead to be able to be used in all Wikipedias. Note that Commons has slightly different image licensing rules than Wikipedia, although I don't remember the exact differences. J I P  &#124; Talk 18:45, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * hmmmm.. ok, thank you for the speedy replies. I will try to sort this out but if anyone could help me out a bit it would be very nice and it would probably help bring a few thousand new image files to the English language pages which are currently only visible on the Russian language pages. Thanks again!Monopoly31121993 (talk) 19:01, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

Tools for converting to LDR
Are there any tools that assist in converting an article to use list-defined references?

It wouldn't be that complicated a software task to move all refs from the body to a reflist, assigning arbitrary refnames where needed. In a few seconds, that would get you about halfway to a clean LDR implementation. &#8209;&#8209; Mandruss (talk) 20:07, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

I now see User:PleaseStand/References segregator mentioned in WP:LDRHOW, which at first glance appears to do something like the above. So my question becomes, are there any other tools that assist in LDR conversion? &#8209;&#8209; Mandruss (talk) 20:22, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * I believe betacommand-dev/fix_refs.html does that. &mdash; MPelletier (WMF) (talk) 21:01, 18 September 2014 (UTC)


 * No documentation or usage information at that link. Tested against Alaska Highway, it completely bolluxed the article, as well as putting quotes around refnames where quotes are not needed (improvement very debatable). Thanks for the feedback but I don't think I'll be using that one. &#8209;&#8209; Mandruss (talk) 21:10, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Try User:PleaseStand/References segregator. This is listed at Help:Citation tools. --  Gadget850talk 23:08, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

Libelous orphan recently added to living biography - McPhedran
It has just been brought to my attention that an 'orphan' has been posted over my name so that it is the first item read. There are several incorrect statements and a quote with a link to a student newspaper article which does not in fact contain the quote. Whoever made this addition indulged in personal commentary that is not supported by the links given. Please advise as to the most effective way to remove what is untrue and clarify in response. I have read the help information on this and that is why I am posting this request. Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Globalist2014 (talk • contribs) 21:31, 18 September 2014 (UTC)


 * You didn't say, but I'll assume the article in question is Marilou McPhedran, and that you are that person.
 * I'm not sure what you mean by "libelous orphan". The message doesn't say or imply that you're an orphan. It says no other articles link to that article, so it is an orphaned article. How is that libelous?
 * If you have concerns about the sourcing of article content, please post them on the article's talk page, Talk:Marilou McPhedran, using the "New section" link near the top of that page. &#8209;&#8209; Mandruss (talk) 21:40, 18 September 2014 (UTC)


 * There appear to be more serious problems with the article than an unnecessary 'orphan' tag - much of it seems to have been written with a clear intent to disparage the subject. I'll bring the article to the attention of the Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard. AndyTheGrump (talk) 22:00, 18 September 2014 (UTC)


 * For now I'll blanket-revert the changes. That kind of edits is not an improvement, though some of the claims about leadership issues reported in reliable sources may have a place in the article. Huon (talk) 22:04, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

The bot's action was clearly contrary to the orphan doc, so I have noted the discrepancy at the bot owner's talk page, here. &#8209;&#8209; Mandruss (talk) 22:15, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

Re this edit (reverted here) I've placed a notification about this discussion here on User talk:Dean of Peaches. Wtmitchell (talk) (earlier Boracay Bill) 23:16, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

Permanent link
Hi all,

I always lose track of this and can never find it again: there's a Wikipedia page that links to the Wiki's Main Page on different days; a permanent link to the main page as it looked on a particular day. Can anyone find that?

Thanks,-- ɱ    (talk)  23:05, 18 September 2014 (UTC)


 * You can view most dates at Main Page history. Altamel (talk) 23:17, 18 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Thank you, this is exactly what I was looking for. I almost started to think I was making it up, and that it never existed, because none of my searches brought up anything close to that. We should link it to more things, including the permalink information and Main Page alternatives.-- ɱ    (talk)  00:14, 19 September 2014 (UTC)