Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2015 January 14

= January 14 =

creating a page for a not for profit (charity)
Hit here,

I recently submitted a page for Assistance Dogs Australia (ADA).

ADA is a registered charity which does not receive government funding and relies on the generosity of the public to provide its valuable services to the community. Founded in 1996, Assistance Dogs Australia trains Labradors and Golden Retrievers to help people with disabilities, providing them with greater freedom and independence.

I was told that i could not have the page as it was sales and had info from our website included.

I am confused as to why we can't have a page whn a number of other charities have their own wiki page so am unsure why ADA can't have a page??>


 * Cancer Council Australia
 * Starlight Children's Foundation

thanks for your help Hayley — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hayleynissim (talk • contribs) 02:44, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Archived Help desk thread: Help_desk/Archives/2014_December_16 &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  02:50, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a directory of charities. Wikipedia has articles on charitable organizations that are considered notable under Wikipedia's guidelines, meaning that they have been mentioned in reliable secondary sources.  If you are affiliated with the charity, either as an employee or an officer, you have a conflict of interest, and are discouraged from creating or editing an article, in order to maintain neutral point of view.  You may request that an uninvolved editor create an article by making an entry at Requested Articles.  The rules about creating articles on non-profit organizations are essentially the same as for profit-making businesses; the articles must be neutral, must reflect reliable secondary coverage, and should not be overly promotional.  Robert McClenon (talk) 02:52, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * For additional guidance as to the notability of organisations see WP:ORG.--ukexpat (talk) 13:11, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Footnote numbers listed separately from their text
I have a draft article - Pjr 2005/sandbox/Creativism - with Notes at the end, followed by References. When I preview this article, the Notes show only as numbers (1-44), with the actual text for the Notes given separately after the References, instead of before them. Is this the result of an error or omission on my part? How can I get the text of the Notes joined to their respective numbers, the way they appear in Edit mode? Pjr 2005 (talk) 03:43, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * Hello, see WP:referencing for beginners. In short: you don't have to number the references manually, just put the tags after the sentence(s), they verify. To create a list of those references, you have to put a template in the article's "References" section. This template will generate a numbered list of all ref tags within the previous article text (note: only for refs, which appear before the template in the article). But please read the linked guideline as well, it explains this stuff a lot better than me :). GermanJoe (talk) 03:59, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * A word of warning, unrelated to your question above. I had a quick look at your draft article, and it appears to be about a word, rather than a subject. That is not how Wikipedia works, it is an encyclopedia not a dictionary, and has articles on topics. If several topics, each themselves worthy of inclusion, are commonly denoted by the same word, they should have separate articles. Maproom (talk) 10:46, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Uploading Vital Records?
What is Wikipedia's policy on uploading scans of a deceased person's vital records for biographical purposes? e.g. birth/death/marriage certificates and social security applications (SS-5's). Particularly in a case where there is contradictory information about the deceased's date of birth, legal name, etc. Muzilon (talk) 10:38, 14 January 2015 (UTC)
 * dont do it . as primary sources they are generally not acceptable anyway. and there is no chain of custody to validate that they actually are the records. -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom  13:23, 14 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Then why is WikiMedia Commons full of uploads of vital records for people like Michael Jackson and others? And how are we supposed to resolve disputes over names/birthdates, etc. if secondary sources are contradictory? Muzilon (talk) 14:29, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * I assume that they have been uploaded as documents of historical interest, and that's fine. They should not, however, be used as reliable sources in articles. If sources disagree, and it is a genuine disagreement rather than something as simple as a misprint in a single source, the article should note the disagreement and cite the sources.--ukexpat (talk) 19:00, 14 January 2015 (UTC)
 * I'm working on the article about the American actor John Dall (d. 1971). The secondary sources do disagree about his year of birth and legal name, as I have noted in the article. It seems to me that this could be resolved by referring to primary sources such as vital records or social security records. We then come to the question of whether scans of such U.S. records are subject to copyright, privacy, or other legal restrictions on Wikipedia, which was the main point of my initial query. Muzilon (talk) 00:01, 15 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Uploading them for that purpose is pointless - we don't accept uploaded scans of documents as sources, as their authenticity cannot be verified. AndyTheGrump (talk) 00:39, 15 January 2015 (UTC)
 * By those criteria President Obama's birth certificate can't be "verified" either. :) The article on the death of Michael Jackson blithely includes a scan of his (alleged) death certificate, with a claim that the certificate is Public Domain. Ditto for Marilyn Monroe's (alleged) birth certificate. Is there going to be a problem if I upload Mr Dall's death certificate or Social Security Application (SS-5) as "documents of historical interest"? Or do I have to write a hard-copy book about Mr Dall and publish my copies of those documents for it to be considered a "reliable source"? Muzilon (talk) 01:16, 15 January 2015 (UTC)


 * But, as far as I can tell, in none of those articles is the scanned document being used as a reference for anything - the documents are the subject of discussion only.--ukexpat (talk) 21:53, 15 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Whatever. Let's say I want to upload a California death certificate and an SS-5 for "discussion only" purposes. Are these documents indeed "Public Domain"? Does Wikipedia, the State of California, and the U.S. government place any legal/copyright/privacy restrictions on publishing such documents? Muzilon (talk) 22:25, 15 January 2015 (UTC)


 * I don't know about California. I happen to possess a Pennsylvania death certificate. It claims on the face of it that it is a violation of Pennsylvania law to copy it. Jc3s5h (talk) 23:16, 15 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Is an online photograph a copy, or does that only happen when one prints it on certificate paper? InedibleHulk (talk) 23:21, 15 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Muzilon, see PD-CAGov. Documents produced by the government of California, whether by statewide officials or officials on some other level, are in the public domain as far as copyright is concerned.  I have no idea how this affects a filled-out certificate (who knows, perhaps it's copyrighted if the filler-outer person weren't a government official), let alone whether there are non-copyright restrictions such as state laws forbidding the copying of vital records.  Jc3s5h, Pennsylvania's different in the copyright aspect at least, since its government works are copyrighted, although I don't know anything about non-copyright restrictions for PA documents.  Nyttend (talk) 00:10, 16 January 2015 (UTC)
 * I've emailed the California Department of Public Health and the US Social Security office to see what they say. Are there any Wikipedia researchers who have library access to the indexes of New York births in the early 20th century? (These indexes are not available online.) Muzilon (talk) 07:23, 17 January 2015 (UTC)
 * If anyone is still curious, here is a reply I received from U.S. Social Security Administration (SSA) about uploading a deceased individual's Social Security application (SS-5) obtained under the U.S. Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) PD-USGov-SSA:
 * {| class="wikitable"


 * When a requester receives a copy of a deceased individual’s SS-5 from SSA—the request has been reviewed under the Privacy Act and the FOIA. This means that the subject individual is shown deceased in our records or the requester provided acceptable proof of death and we have made any redactions in accordance with the PA and the FOIA.  Therefore, when a requester receives the SS-5, they may do what they want with it.
 * When a requester receives a copy of a deceased individual’s SS-5 from SSA—the request has been reviewed under the Privacy Act and the FOIA. This means that the subject individual is shown deceased in our records or the requester provided acceptable proof of death and we have made any redactions in accordance with the PA and the FOIA.  Therefore, when a requester receives the SS-5, they may do what they want with it.


 * FOIA PA Officers
 * Office of Privacy and Disclosure
 * 6401 Security Boulevard
 * 617 Altmeyer Building
 * Baltimore, MD 21235


 * }


 * And from the California Department of Public Health PD-CAGov:
 * {| class="wikitable"

Are informational copies of death certificates considered public domain? CDPH response: They are considered a public record.
 * QUESTIONS:
 * QUESTIONS:

Are there any restrictions on their use/reproduction, such as in a book or a website (like Wikipedia)?

'''CDPH response: CDPH is not aware of any prohibitions on their use/reproduction. There are laws prohibiting their use for illegal activities, such as identity theft.'''
 * }
 * Muzilon (talk) 08:10, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

Chronotron disambiguation request
Regarding the page Chronotron, I would like the Chronotron definition to be disambiguated. Chronotron is also the name of a popular time-stretching and pitch-shifting software product (www.chronotron.com). Chronotron 1.0 was released in 1999 as a DSP plug-in for Winamp. The brand Chronotron and its logo are registered trademarks in France since 2003 (see http://bases-marques.inpi.fr/ for the actual registration information). 178.254.68.246 (talk) 11:01, 14 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Disambiguation is generally only done as between existing Wikipedia articles, to avoid navigation confusion between titles here so that users can reach the one they seek, when the choice is possible between more than one. We do sometimes include red links in disambiguation pages, where the topic is clearly notable, but only where the disambiguation page is needed in the first place as to existing titles. In short, since there does not appear to be an article on this software, there is nothing to disambiguate.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk)

I want to insert a counter (number of days past since an incident)
Like I said, I am trying to add a counter that will count the number of days since something have occurred. I need it for setting a world record in something. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rabia 14 (talk • contribs) 11:46, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * This  gives this  as its output. See Template:Time ago for full instructions. - X201 (talk) 12:02, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * Make sure the text remains valid if events change without the article being updated. I suspect that may be a problem with what you have in mind. We don't want Wikipedia, or a mirror keeping an old copy of an article, to claim in many years that someone has been on a hunger strike for thousands of days if it stopped long ago. PrimeHunter (talk) 12:13, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * Yes, the article needs to reflect something that has been documented as actually happening not just that a day has passed. -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom  12:29, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * Furthermore, as noted at Template:Time ago "due to Wikipedia's caching mechanisms, you may need to purge a page using this template to update the dynamic value." This is a common problem - often leading to complaints (especially about the age parameter on, or just after, an article subject's birthday) as unless the article is edited or purged daily, it will be out of date. - Arjayay (talk) 19:11, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * Indeed. If you cannot find an independent reliable source that says "X holds the world record for Y" then no Wikipedia article may claim that X holds that record. Deducing it by counting days would be original research, and that is forbidden in Wikipedia. --ColinFine (talk) 17:10, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

Copying and pasting articles
I have copied and pasted Wikipedia articles into my email for many years. This is for my own use only. I use the info. as foundations for further study, or more mundanely, to find out about a new movie. This morning, I could no longer copy Any article. I tried two entirely different email accounts, even though I only use one of them for this purpose. I haven't tried to print an article directly from your website, but, that's all I need, more paper. Or, if I were to do this, it would be part of an email containing further research to be printed. What happened? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Taksasha (talk • contribs) 15:46, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * I don't know. It's perfectly fine to copy and paste articles (for yourself or, under some conditions, any other purpose). It seems to be a problem local to your computer - but without more information it's pretty difficult to tell what it is. It definitely nothing wikipedia changed. Martijn Hoekstra (talk) 15:53, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * I second Martijn in this. The problem is local in nature, maybe a JavaScript lock. Make sure you haven't installed any scripts- or for that matter trash extensions that are available all over. If not, it should resolve itself in a day or two. By the way, you don't really need to create couple more of email accounts :) Technically, there's no update and at this point, I can still copy text.  Ethically  Yours! 17:19, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * @Taksasha:  As with all such weirdness, the lowest hanging fruit is to try restarting.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 23:00, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * The next simplest test is using the menu option if you've only tried the keyboard shortcut, or vice versa. Maybe your command/control button is dead. InedibleHulk (talk) 23:26, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

Accessdate=
There is an accessdate= error on a reflist. What is the procedure to correct it?

Thank You, Jet — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jet1950 (talk • contribs) 17:08, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

(edit conflict
 * The ASIN and page fields weren't in their own sections. Reflist just carried on reading them as part of the access date. - X201 (talk) 17:15, 14 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Put the accessdate in this format: . Say, if you want to keep accessdate as today, then write   Thanks. If you need further help, contact me.  Ethically  Yours!  17:13, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * That is only one of the access date formats. Use the style established by the article. See MOS:DATEUNIFY. --  Gadget850talk 17:25, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * And in any case the accessdates in 1971 and 1982 look unlikely, given that Wikipedia was launched in 2001. Perhaps someone doesn't know what accessdate means? --David Biddulph (talk) 17:33, 14 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Do access dates prior to the founding of Wikipedia represent an error that will be reported? So if 2005-13-01 is bad (as a bad month) will 1982-01-01 also represent an error?Naraht (talk) 17:55, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * Looking at Richard Earl Thompson, it is a moot issue as none of the accessdates show since none of the references have url. This gives an error that is normally hidden; see Help:CS1 errors. --  Gadget850talk 18:01, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * Such an error isn't mentioned at Help:CS1 errors, and a quick check in my sandbox seems to show that there is no such check. It looks as if the same test is done for all dates, without anything extra for accessdate. --David Biddulph (talk) 18:08, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * Module talk:Citation/CS1/Feature requests.


 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 18:14, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Need HELP in moving article
In a desire to try something new, I created an article in my user space. When I moved it out (or tried) I ended up with an article User:Edith Barry instsd of Edith Barry. The second link, although blue, leads to the USER page. When I tried to move it again, all hell broke out. Please help/fix or advise. Einar Carptrash (talk) 18:20, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * The article is at Edith Barry, the "Edith Barry" user page redirects there because the page move that OrangeMike did left behind a redirect. I have tagged that page for deletion.--ukexpat (talk) 18:54, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * A move between spaces has to be done carefully. An intended move from user space into article space can, by omission by the mover, create a user page rather than an article page.  Be careful doing the move.  It is an easy accident.  Robert McClenon (talk) 19:29, 14 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks Orange Mike, ukexpat and Robert. I have written articles before but always on my desktop and then moved them.  This was a new and bold experiment and likely will not be repeated. It is comforting to knw that no matter how much of a hash I make of things, a simple request will usually produce fine results. Carptrash (talk) 04:59, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

Tim Drummond
On January 12th, Tim Drummond died. You had him in your list for that day. Why was he dropped? As a co-writer with Bob Dylan and as a bassist for many rock n roll legends, he deserves mention as much as any prelate from Rangoon or other minor figures. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.74.38.174 (talk) 18:20, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * What list are you referring to? The Tim Drummond is in the list at Category:2015 deaths RudolfRed (talk) 18:31, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * He wasn't "dropped" he was moved to the 10th - the day he died - according to this source although this was not announced until 12th. - Arjayay (talk) 18:33, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Referencing errors on Shabab sabri
Reference help requested.

Help me in correcting the reference links on the article.

Thanks, Yogeji (talk) 19:33, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * The link in the section heading points you at exactly where the problem is. The error message is also very clear; it says "Cite error: There are tags on this page without content in them (see the help page)", and in that message the words "help page" are in blue, indicating that they are a wikilink to a page which gives specific help, in this case Help:Cite errors/Cite error ref no input. --David Biddulph (talk) 20:18, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Wiki Page needed
To whom it may concern,

Political activist and actress, Ameena Matthews, needs a Wiki page please. She’s all over the news

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Interrupters

she has a link for Wiki but it takes you nowhere.

Thanks for considering my request.

Best Regards,

Geoff Atkinson — Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.39.7.42 (talk) 21:35, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * Hi. If she meets our notability requirements (Google News indicates she is not "all over the news" as you say, but if she was, reliable major newspapers would be good sources to cite to demonstrate her notability and verify the text) and if you are unconnected to her, then you, as a person interested, can volunteer to write the page. That's the way all our content is added – by volunteers donating their time and ability, rolling up their sleeves and starting. There is no central authority that writes articles. You are another potential volunteer just like everyone who answers questions on this page. She doesn't need a page. If you want her to have one as you evidently do, if she meets our standards for one, and you don't have a conflict of interest in doing so, by all means go for it. By the way, this site is called Wikipedia, not wiki. A wiki is any website using wiki software; there are thousands of them.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 23:11, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * (e/c) :The criteria for a Wikipedia article are outlined here. If Matthews meets the criteria, you can suggest an article at this page, or you can create an account and be guided to help create an article yourself! -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom  23:13, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Help on Michiel Huisman's account
I have tried to add a profile picture to Michiel Huisman's wiki page, but I was not able to do it due to all the copy rights stuff. I feel he should be given a profile picture due to all the prominent roles he has had on TV and in movies lately. For example Game of Thrones. If anyone could add one I would appreciate it because I think he deserves it. I know it's not really a question, more of a request. I am just so new to Wikipedia that's all. Sebahed (talk) 23:00, 14 January 2015 (UTC)Sebahed
 * "Deserve" does not play a role in what happens on Wikipedia, except that content about living persons "deserve" to be treated with respect, in that we don't allow harmful stuff without appropriate sourcing and encyclopedic value. Wikipedia is created by volunteers who work on what they want, based on what is available to create a free encyclopedia. In this case it means that Huisman "deserves to get" a picture when a volunteer takes a picture they are willing to donate or Huisman/Huisman's agents release a free use image. see Donating copyrighted materials --  TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom  23:07, 14 January 2015 (UTC)


 * Note Wikipedia does not contain 'profiles'. --CiaPan (talk) 12:06, 15 January 2015 (UTC)