Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2015 May 30

= May 30 =

Which came first
Parts of Otter are verbatim copies from this (PDF), or vice versa. How would one go about determining which came first? &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  06:10, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * See if those parts of the article were added all at once or gradually edited to the matching state, for one thing. DES (talk) 06:31, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Note that the PDF has a creation date of 2 Apr 2015 in its metadata for another. DES (talk) 06:33, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * And this is how the WikiP article stood at Mar 30th 2015. MarnetteD&#124;Talk 06:38, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * PDF copied en.wiki, not the other way around. Went back through the page history and the identical parts I've checked up on definitely grew "organically" rather than single-burst as would have been the case when copy-pasted. AddWittyNameHere (talk) 06:44, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * I confirm this. DES (talk) 06:45, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks to everyone for their work on this. The situation has piqued my curiosity so I have two questions. Aren't they supposed to acknowledge that they used the Wikipedia article on their website? Since they copied the otter article how many others have they used? MarnetteD&#124;Talk 06:51, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * They are supposed to, but many sites infringe Wikipedia's cpyright. i sent a coplaint about this instance. DES (talk) 07:00, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Here is another thanks to you for taking the time to fill me in. It will be interesting to see it they reply to your message. MarnetteD&#124;Talk 07:03, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * See Mirrors_and_forks for a very long list of sites thst copy Wikipedia contnet, with adn without proper attribution, and various actions people have taken over the years. DES (talk) 07:18, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

I sent the following in an email: "Your page at http://www.worldanimalfoundation.net/f/Otter.pdf contains extensive content copied from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otter without attribution or acknowledgement. This violates Wikipedia's copyright, and the copyrights of the indvidual Wikipedia contributors. As a regualr contributor myself, i object strongly." and I got the following response: Thank you for contacting the World Animal Foundation. Please note we have deleted the web page until the corrections can be made. We apologize for any inconvenience.

Best regards,

World Animal Foundation, Inc.

and the link seems to be down at this time. Sometimes complaints do work properly. DES (talk) 04:08, 31 May 2015 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the followup and your efforts in this. To my eye they seemed like a website that wants to be informational for their readers. Hopefully they can figure out how to acknowledge WikiP if they use any of our articles in the future. MarnetteD&#124;Talk 04:14, 31 May 2015 (UTC)
 * I have to echo MarnetteD here--thanks for the follow-up and the efforts! AddWittyNameHere (talk) 04:19, 31 May 2015 (UTC)


 * Amazing. But same problem with this page and our article Porcupine, chosen randomly. In this case, they actually have their own copyright notice at the bottom of the page, so they apparently feel copyright is important when it comes to "their" content. Perhaps they would care to take down the whole site "until the corrections can be made"? &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  04:19, 31 May 2015 (UTC)
 * I had mentioned that possibility yesterday so thanks for checking on it there might be others as well.  would it be possible for you or someone from the WMF to contact them and help them to understand how to acknowledge WikiP's copyright status so they could still use the information? Just a suggestion and if things don't work that way then disregard it. MarnetteD&#124;Talk 04:25, 31 May 2015 (UTC)


 * Ugh. At a very quick check just through the short per-animal blurbs at [http://www.worldanimalfoundation.org/mammals.html Mammal Facts (starting some bit down the page), I suspect that you're right and they may as well take down the whole site. Even without checking the most of them against our articles, I recognize some very distinct wikipedian-style leads.
 * "Common name" ("binomial name"), is a [member/species/etc.] of the (sub)family "scientific name of (sub)family" native to [area].
 * "Common name", also referred to as "various common names", is [a/the sole/largest/most common/etc.] species of the (sub)family "scientific name" ("common name for family").
 * The "common name" is a species of "common name" ranging from [area], throughout [area], to [area].
 * "Common name" is the common name for (the) x number of species of the suborder "suborder" (common name/meaning).
 * My guess is that 90%+ of their articles on animals are partially or mostly copied from Wikipedia. AddWittyNameHere (talk) 04:38, 31 May 2015 (UTC)
 * , my understanding is that the foundation (WMF) does not, as a matter of policy, send out complaints about noncompliant reusers of Wikipedia content. Their position is that the copyrights being infringed are those of the individual contributors to the various articles copied from. Look at the Forks and Mirrors page I linked to above, and you will see records of litterally hundreds of sites that reuse our contnet, many of them withoyt complying (or not complying fully) with our license. You will also find records of emails, telephone calls, and leters complaining about this, all from volunteers, not WMF staffers as far as i know. A few of the emails and letters were from me, mostly quite a few yars ago.
 * All I did in this case was use the "contact us" link on the home page of that site -- anyone could do the same. DES (talk) 10:59, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

Referencing errors on Sacraments of the Catholic Church
Reference help requested.

How can I have my article viewed and edited for publishing?

Thanks, Jackgarcia49 (talk) 06:58, 30 May 2015 (UTC)jackgarcia49
 * When using cite book the value of isbn= should be jsut the actual ISBN, do not use 10: or 13: in front of the idbn, the tempalte can detect and validate the length. DES (talk) 07:06, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * (Can't reconcile the heading and the question. How are they related, if at all?) &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  07:10, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Someone made an error back in March fomatting a refernce citation in the article Sacraments of the Catholic Church. It seems to have been fixed or removed, i dodn't bother chasing down exactly when. I suppsoe the question was a rather akward way of asking for help with that. If not, the OP may repond and clarify things. DES (talk) 07:21, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Diversifying editor contributions
Just heard a discussion on the BBC in the uk on how to diversify editor profiles. I have some comments - how can I contribute these? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.159.79.206 (talk) 08:56, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I don't understand the question. What are editor profiles, and what does it mean to diversify or contribute them? &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  09:06, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * I assume by "editor profiles" they either been Wikipedia users, or Wikipedia articles- probably the latter, since lots of companies ask how they can create their company profile on here. Joseph2302 (talk) 10:57, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * 86.159.79.206, you can make comments here. Just click [edit] beside the section heading above, add your comments at the end, and click "Save page". &#8213; Mandruss  &#9742;  11:11, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * It is known that Wikipedia has a systemic bias and there is a group working on that issue Systemic bias =>WikiProject Countering systemic bias where you can join the discussion. -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom  13:16, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Name of King
Hi, we see many kings who when acceded the throne ruled with a different name. For example his real name was Mu'azzam but when he aceeded the throne, he ruled with the name Bahadur Shah I. Now how we will call the person in the article? Should we refer to him as Shah or Mu'azzam? RRD13 দেবজ্যোতি (talk) 09:58, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * That would be better discussed at Talk:Bahadur Shah I, . But I suppose that "Shah" is a title, and not a surname, so that wouldn't be what should be used. Naming practices vary by culture, so I don't know the correct answer. DES (talk) 13:45, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * There is a summary for naming conventions of royalty at WP:NCNOB uhhlive (talk) 20:16, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

Help:Cite errors/Cite error included ref
Article - RAF Kinloss history, Cold War. What cite error A is apparent and what hashtag is required? Geordie582 (talk) 11:36, 30 May 2015 (UTC)Geordie582 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Geordie582 (talk • contribs) 10:44, 30 May 2015 (UTC)


 * If you mean the error in RAF Kinloss,, that was caused by this edit. the technical problem was how the ref tags were used. The edit contained the text

"

while in general a citation should look like:

"


 * that is a ref tag before the citation and a /ref tag after it. But the bigger problem is that "Crew member for 5 years" isn't a useful citation. Is that the title of a book? If so who wrote it and when was it published, and what pages support the facts in the article? Or is it saying that the poster or someone the poster knows had been a crew member in the squadron? If so, I am sorry to tell you that unpublished personal memories can't be consulted by anyne else, and so are not reliable sources. In any case the edit linked above has been undone and so the cite error is no longer on the page. DES (talk) 13:41, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Could I purchase a copy of the Methodist Recorder published last Thursday?. Thank you.
Could I purchase a copy of the Methodist Recorder published last Thursday please ? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.103.29.196 (talk) 13:23, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * I suspect, based on your question, that you found one of our over 6 million articles and thought we were affiliated in some way with that subject. Please note that you are at Wikipedia, the free online encyclopedia that anyone can edit, and this page is for asking questions related to using or contributing to Wikipedia itself. Thus, we have no special knowledge about the subject of your question. You can, however, search our vast catalogue of articles by typing a subject into the search field on the upper right side of your screen. If you cannot find what you are looking for, we have a reference desk, divided into various subject areas, where asking knowledge questions is welcome. Best of luck. DES (talk) 13:27, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

A page with no talk page!
This page has no talk page. What's the problem? Mhhossein (talk) 14:10, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

For some reason, the talkpage Talk:Jamiah kabirah Ziyarat had been redirected to Jamiah kabirah Ziyarat- I've undone the redirect, so the talkpage now exists. Joseph2302 (talk) 14:14, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks a lot. I was mixed up! Mhhossein (talk) 14:18, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Michigan State football coaches
In the listing Of Michigan State football coaches you do not have Vince Carillot listed, who coached from 1960-68.

From, Vince Carillot  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:5:9780:A8:E839:75DE:C74D:76F2 (talk) 15:07, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * The article, Michigan State Spartans football only looks like it covers head coaches. From my quick research, it looks like Vince Carillot was the backfield coach? If so, is there another page you were looking at that covered more than just head coaches, where you think they should be included? Monty  845  15:23, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Blacklist for websites
How can I report spammers or problematic websites? And where can I request to add them to blacklist? --Zyma (talk) 15:31, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * If they are being added to Wikipedia: general information Spam blacklist or specifically proposed additions. Monty  845  15:36, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks. --Zyma (talk) 15:38, 30 May 2015 (UTC)


 * , the usual reporting place is here: Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Spam. — Jeraphine (talk) 16:47, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Ali ibn Husayn Zayn al-Abidin
Please help to remove the tag at the end of the article, I could not.--Salman mahdi (talk) 19:32, 30 May 2015 (UTC)


 * The problem is that a few efn templates are put inside other efn templates. Ruslik_ Zero 20:43, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Fixed, by following the advice given in the error message. Maproom (talk) 21:14, 30 May 2015 (UTC)