Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2016 April 22

= April 22 =

Referencing errors on Gummawala
Reference help requested.

how to solve this error?????

Thanks, Aksaini2201 (talk) 05:47, 22 April 2016 (UTC)


 * The info box you've just added contains this named reference .  You haven't however actually provided details about this citation.  See WP:Referencing for Beginners for help.  CaptRik (talk) 05:50, 22 April 2016 (UTC)

Biography
Hi

Thank you for you input on the edited page. It still has a message about biographies and verification. I had thought I'd improved this and done it correctly.

The page again is Geeta Nargund. I hope once I've got this test page sorted I can contribute some more.

Thanks

EdJim — Preceding unsigned comment added by EdJim (talk • contribs) 09:28, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * It was a five years old note at the top of the article, we fixed it. – Be..anyone &#x1F4A9;  11:12, 22 April 2016 (UTC)

Averil Leimon
Hello

I recently joined White Water Group and am in charge of editing Averil Leimon's wikipedia page. I edited couple of sections and when I previewed the changes made it successfully showed. However, after saving the page, I noticed the changes made did not appear when loading the page. Could you please let me know what has possibly went wrong.

Many thanks

Marisca — Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.147.136.99 (talk) 10:00, 22 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Hello, please sign your posts on talk-pages by typing four tildes ( ~ ) which will produce a signature and date stamp. It is not possible from the information available to tell what went wrong. Try making the edits again (or a very minor change to 'test'). However, your post suggests that you are employed by a company connected to Leimon and as such you possibly should not be editing the page. Please have a look at Wikipedia's page on 'conflict of interest' before editing further. Thank you. Eagleash (talk) 11:21, 22 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Do you mean article Whitewater Group? Nothing shows in the history.  Did you click the save page button?  Did you get an error message?  (You successfully posted to this page and it's the same procedure so you are editing correctly but I don't see your edits.) RJFJR (talk) 13:29, 22 April 2016 (UTC)


 * The OP probably means the Averil Leimon page, where nothing shows either. (Although it has been successfully edited by others since.) Eagleash (talk) 13:34, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * I notice that earlier today on that page, experienced editor Dismas reverted 2 sizeable additions on the grounds of lacking any References and being Promotional respectively. I suggest the OP needs to become more familiar with relevant basic Wikipedia policies such as WP:NOT. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 185.74.232.130 (talk) 13:39, 22 April 2016 (UTC)


 * The content removed by Dismas seems to pre-date the OP's involvement and as far as can be seen they haven't actually succeeded in adding any content to the article. As suggested in posts above though, reading up on policy is recommended. Eagleash (talk) 14:18, 22 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Leimon is director of a different White Water Group, for which we don't have an article. Rojomoke (talk) 14:42, 22 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Marisca: Please don't say, in Wikipedia, that you are in charge of updating a Wikipedia page.  Even if your job description says that is one of your duties, you are not in charge, in a Wikipedia sense, of updating the page.  We don't have article ownership, and we have a conflict of interest policy.  As noted above, you are probably required to make a conflict of interest disclosure, and possibly a paid editing disclosure.    Robert McClenon (talk) 01:06, 23 April 2016 (UTC)

One of my students broke Wikpedia
Hi my name is Bob Hazard (Bobwurst) and I am a professor of English at the College of DuPage. For the first time, I am having my classes do a major edit of a Wikipedia page and it appears that one of my students has crossed a line so egregiously that our school I.P. address has been temporarily blocked. I apologize for this, I haven't done enough scaffolding here for my students, obviously. I've emailed the student and asked him to stop doing whatever it is he's doing. Is there any way we can regain access to Wikipedia? Please let me know what I should do, both for this issue and going forward.Bobwurst (talk) 16:27, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Check out Guide_to_appealing_blocks, I don't know anything about the procedure, but found the manual. – Be..anyone &#x1F4A9;  16:46, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * As a more general resource, I think Education program would be worth reviewing. DonIago (talk) 16:48, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Was the student editing as an 'anonymous' account (an IP)? Having your students register for accounts would allow sanctions to be against an individual accounts rather than against a range of IPs. (I'm tempted to add the word probably after that comment.) RJFJR (talk) 21:05, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * There are other reasons why an instructor who is giving a Wikipedia assignment should require the students to create Wikipedia accounts. IP addresses shift unpredictably, especially in institutional blocks.  If students use IP addresses to edit, you not only don't know who to blame, but you don't know who to credit for good work.  Then again, maybe the student in question deliberately edited logged out in order to commit vandalism.  Does the range block permit account creation?  If not, it should be changed to permit account creation.  If you, Bobwurst, know what student engaged in the vandalism, you have a unique sanction that you can hand out that is not available to Wikipedia admins.  On your keyboard, your left index finger may rest on it.  Robert McClenon (talk) 01:02, 23 April 2016 (UTC)

dead dependent source links
What happens to accepted content when the dependent source is no longer available? For example, an edit is accepted based on the sources, but later the sources are no longer available online. Formulairis990 (talk) 17:02, 22 April 2016 (UTC)


 * We have a help page that describes just that situation here - Citing_sources. There's a 5 step process there that should be followed - apparently we should only consider truly removing the sourced content after 24 months if all the other steps haven't been able to find a suitable replacement.  CaptRik (talk) 17:51, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Thank you.Formulairis990 (talk) 18:22, 22 April 2016 (UTC)


 * But remember,, that sources are not required to be online. What is required is that they have been published, and enough bibliographic information is provided in the reference that a reader can in principle obtain it (eg through a major library). --ColinFine (talk) 18:34, 24 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Thank you, ColinFine. Formulairis990 (talk) 19:47, 24 April 2016 (UTC)

That monkey selfie
Is there an equivalent of a talk page documenting the decision making process behind pursuing the monkey selfie in court? Are the legal costs and other resources used in the process documented and available to the public? Formulairis990 (talk) 17:04, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Lots of search hits on commons, e.g., c:Commons:Deletion_requests/Files_in_Category:Monkey_selfie_at_Wikimania_2014. – Be..anyone &#x1F4A9;  17:09, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the quick response. Are the participants on that page the actual decision makers in pursuing the matter?
 * That page doesn't address the devoted resources, is there a general page for such things?Formulairis990 (talk) 17:16, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * The example link was one search hit about a specific deletion request discussion, the participants are commons users like you (if you upload an image there) and me, the specific request was closed as keep by Krd, another user like you and me, but presumably with admin rights on commons (non-admin close is tricky.)
 * I found no better search hit with a general discussion (village pump or similar) in less than one minute. Of course you can ask on c:COM:VPCOPY, or try the archives of this "copyright village pump". Some folks think that commons is about pictures, but mostly it is about copyrights with lots of contributors who are not lawyers.
 * Just in case, you did see the Signpost article here (enwiki) about the monkey selfie, or didn't you? IANAL –  Be..anyone &#x1F4A9;  19:30, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the explaining the page. No I hadn't seen the Signpost article. Your link isn't clickable. Could you try posting it again? Formulairis990 (talk) 19:53, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * This is the "help desk", not LMGTFY, therefore click the "search" button in the sidebar on any enwiki page to go to the wannabe-advanced search page aka Special:Search, on the special page disable "(Main)" (=articles), input "monkey selfie signpost", click the "search" button on this special page (or press Enter), and get several Signpost issues with articles about monkey selfies, e.g., Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2016-01-20 (2016) or Wikipedia_Signpost/Single/2015-09-23 (2015). Exercise: Find the oldest 2014 issue, holler if you don't find it. – Be..anyone &#x1F4A9;  20:14, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Well you do come off like a troll. I did search before posting, but while -- on quick perusal -- found articles on the subject, they did not address my query. Your previous comment made it sound like you had a specific article in mind. Formulairis990 (talk) 19:25, 23 April 2016 (UTC)

Notable Alumni
Hi,

I am a very new editor at Wikipedia and I'm in the process of editing the San Diego State University College of Business Administration in my talk page. I have added a list of notable alumni to the talk page, some of whom have their own Wiki pages, some of whom do not. I am told by user Bahooka and user Corkythehornetfan that I am not allowed to put the names of notable alumni don't have an existing Wikipedia article, but I cannot find a specific rule in any Wikipedia page I have read that addresses this.

Could you tell me if a rule like this exists and, if so, where I can find it?

I'll abide by the rules, but I need to know if they actually exist first.

Slfinch

Note: For more info, I've copied and pages talk page conversation below: ---

Don't even bother putting alumni who do not have a Wikipedia article already. See Wikipedia:Write the article first. Most of those above are not going to be notable enough to be listed in the article. Thanks, Bahooka (talk) 22:10, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

I did read Wikipedia:Write the article first and there are no guidelines that discuss rules pertaining to adding notable names or alumni that must have their own Wikipedia page. If these rules exist anywhere, please share them with me. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Slfinch (talk • contribs) 22:30, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

Also, as recommended a couple of times, read WP:UNIGUIDE, particularly the Noted people section in this case. You may also want to look at featured articles at that university project to see how other university articles are written in addition to just the university you work for. Bahooka (talk) 22:55, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

@Slfinch: WP:ALMAMATER, WP:LISTPEOPLE, WP:Notability (people), the list can go on. Wikipedia is not a directory and WP:WikiProject Universities has set a standard that unless they have a Wikipedia article, they don't get included because they are not notable. The only exception is a politician (both at the state and national levels). ☔️ Corkythehornetfan ☔️ 23:00, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

I have read ALL the links you've given me and I'm still not seeing where notable people MUST have their own Wikipedia page. Please provide me evidence of this "rule" by copying and pasting it into this talk page and provide the reference page from where it was found. I am happy to abide by the rules, but if you cannot provide me with a rule and a legitimate page reference, I can only assume you are making up your own set of standards. User:Slfinch —Preceding undated comment added 23:34, 21 April 2016 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Slfinch (talk • contribs)


 * WP:CSC is probably the criteria you're looking for, specifically  Red-linked entries are acceptable if the entry is verifiably a member of the listed group, and it is reasonable to expect an article could be forthcoming in the future.. In you're specific case therefore you should engage the other users in discussion about whether your alumni are likely to meet this criteria (see WP:ACADEMIC too).  CaptRik (talk) 19:25, 22 April 2016 (UTC)


 * WP:ALUMNI is also relevant. -- zzuuzz (talk) 19:38, 22 April 2016 (UTC)

Name change
I am trying to edit a page for a client who wants his name changed from Steve Israel to Steven Israel. I have been able to change that everywhere except for at the very top.

The URL is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Israel_(American_football) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Beckeyfarris (talk • contribs) 19:28, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * You can ask at WP:RM to have the page moved (renamed). Also read WP:COI for conflict-of-interest guidelines and advice.  RudolfRed (talk) 19:37, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * The process you are describing is moving a page. This requires the autoconfirmed user right, which you do not have (you will get it after 4 days and 10 edits automatically). Since there does not seem to be any issue with the move, I have done so. If you encounter this situation again, you can list your requested move here (instructions). -- The Voidwalker  Discuss 19:43, 22 April 2016 (UTC)

Can someone take a closer look at this article. It needs some tags; there is language like "a true entrepreneur at heart" and "has four beautiful children." MB (talk) 19:46, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Will do. -- The Voidwalker  Discuss 19:48, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * It's a lot worse than that, 90% of the article is unsourced. The only new source I can seem to find is this . I'm going to either trim it down or AFD it. -- The Voidwalker  Discuss 20:04, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Moreover, the two sources currently cited in the article, and the one provided above by The Voidwalker, all refer to him as "Steve Israel". Wikipedia uses the names that are usually used for people, their own preferences are immaterial. So his name as used for the title of the article and within it will need to be changed back. Maproom (talk) 20:24, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * The first source in the article does use Steven Douglas Israel in a formal sense, however, I did find another source which only refers to him as Steve Israel. I'll move it back after I finish trimming the content down. -- The Voidwalker  Discuss 20:31, 22 April 2016 (UTC)

The source for all of the information you just took out was from Steven himself so how can we get this corrected? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Beckeyfarris (talk • contribs) 20:53, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Can you provide us a link to a source in which Steven himself states that his name should only be Steven? This also applies for the rest of the information I removed, can you provide a reliable source proving that it is so? Otherwise, it must be removed. -- The Voidwalker  Discuss 20:56, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * I've reverted the move. If you want to move the page, you need to show that reliable sources refer to him as Steven, and use them in a requested move discussion. Joseph2302 (talk) 21:00, 22 April 2016 (UTC)

How is the person themselves not a reliable source? Here is a like to his bio http://www.endzoneluncheons.com/people/steven-israel/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Beckeyfarris (talk • contribs) 21:06, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Um that article refers to him twice as Steven, and then eight times as Steve. That in no way proves his common name is Steven, in fact quite the opposite. Joseph2302 (talk) 21:10, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * However, it does provide a source for the information that I removed. -- The Voidwalker  Discuss 21:12, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Are you going to be adding the information back in? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Beckeyfarris (talk • contribs) 21:15, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Yes, however, the information cannot be used exactly as it appears in the source (see this policy). -- The Voidwalker  Discuss 21:17, 22 April 2016 (UTC)
 * ✅; However I am aware that there is material that I was unable to include. -- The Voidwalker  Discuss 21:39, 22 April 2016 (UTC)

The endzoneluncheons website is useless, the very antithesis of a reliable source; it is a page controlled by the subject, calculated to publicize him and make him look as good as possible. -- Orange Mike &#124;  Talk  00:02, 23 April 2016 (UTC)
 * That's why I kept it's use to a minimum. If you believe some of what I included should be removed, I won't argue. -- The Voidwalker  Discuss 01:03, 23 April 2016 (UTC)