Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2016 January 16

= January 16 =

Clock in personal toolbar
What happened to the clock gadget? It's not appeared on any page in the last couple of days. Figuring that I might have changed something by accident that affected it, I just now checked my gadgets, and "Add a clock in the personal toolbar that displays the current time in UTC (which also provides a link to purge the current page)" was still checked. I've never had any .js or .css pages, except for User:Nyttend/monobook.js (which hasn't been edited since September), and I'm using the same skin as I have since August 2006. Nyttend (talk) 02:34, 16 January 2016 (UTC)


 * My clock is still there, on the far upper right, just right of "Log out". StuRat (talk) 02:43, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Working here, maybe a browser issue.  Mlpearc  ( open channel ) 03:00, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
 * I take it you use MonoBook? Which skin are you using? -- Red rose64 (talk) 09:42, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
 * I use Monobook and my clock is unaffected.--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 11:03, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
 * It works for me in all desktop skins. Try to disable the gadget, save, and enable it again. Do other gadgets work? Does it work in any of the below? (Minerva doesn't have gadgets) PrimeHunter (talk) 13:15, 16 January 2016 (UTC)


 * I use Vector, and as of this post, the clock is working.  Mlpearc  ( open channel ) 18:11, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
 * The clock started working again late yesterday, and it's there now. I've not knowingly changed anything with my settings or my browser.  Bizarre...Thanks for the help!  Nyttend (talk) 20:20, 16 January 2016 (UTC)

St. Louis Rams: admin attn needed
Why is the St. Louis Rams article still known as this? A press conference wasn't enough to warrant a name change? As a prominent user said on the Rams talk page, WP looks stupid not having the name changed by now with all the red tape it put up. Buffaboy talk 03:36, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
 * St. Louis Rams has been moved to Los Angeles Rams after discussion at Talk:Los Angeles Rams. PrimeHunter (talk) 12:58, 16 January 2016 (UTC)

Damian Aspinall
I have done ref. 2 but it is all wrong. Please leave in the quote but fix it up. The ref is from an obituary. I am sorry. Thanks 101.182.146.167 (talk) 04:20, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
 * ✅ You were not far off with your citation, it just needed a little fixing. You should be able to see what I changed if you look at the page history, to help you learn how to better use the citation templates.  You can find full documentation for the particular template I used there at Template:Cite news, giving detailed descriptions of the parameters, etc.   was not the correct choice for citing a newspaper article.  I only cleaned up the 2 references in the "Early life" section, I didn't review the remainder of the article.  --Murph9000 (talk) 05:01, 16 January 2016 (UTC)

How to create an account on wikipedia
a have tried a lot of times but it can't be a sucesss — Preceding unsigned comment added by 36.253.107.8 (talk) 08:08, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
 * You should be able to just create an account. If that is failing for you, or you are having difficulty with the process, please provide some specific details.  --Murph9000 (talk) 08:19, 16 January 2016 (UTC)

Page size
How can I check the article's page size in bytes along with its prose size? Thanks Ayub 407 talk 14:50, 16 January 2016 (UTC)


 * Page length (in bytes) in available through the "Page information" link under "Tools" in the left hand menu bar. --David Biddulph (talk) 14:58, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Thank :) Ayub 407 talk 15:12, 16 January 2016 (UTC)

Help:Cite errors/Cite error included ref
I am trying to edit a page and I cannot tell if it has worked or if I need to do something different. Thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dogsincars7 (talk • contribs) 16:07, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Yes, it looks like you were trying to remove sourced content (please don't do that) but what happened instead was that you removed part of the reference for the information, which broke the code. I've restored it. You can ask me on my page if you have further problems with editing the page. Bishonen &#124; talk 16:18, 16 January 2016 (UTC).


 * The content that Dogsincars7 tried to remove was sourced, and presumably true. But it was personal information about someone other than the subject of the article: I believe her privacy should be respected, as recommended at WP:NPF. I will remove the paragraph. Maproom (talk) 16:43, 16 January 2016 (UTC)

Including quotations (in this case from a primary source)
Where can I find the rules on the inclusion of (a) quoted text from a source and (b) quoted text from a primary source (if they are different). I seem to remember seeing style guide info that said avoid using too many quotes, etc., but can't find it now.ThoughtIdRetired (talk) 17:52, 16 January 2016 (UTC)

Unusual coordinate format
So, while expanding the Cerro Tuzgle article I've found this source which uses an unusual coordinate format like S 24° 14′ 802″	W 66° 21′ 755″ which Coord does not accept. Is there a way to read/translate that format so that it works?Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 17:57, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Is that a direct copy and paste of the coordinates from your source? Seconds of latitude and longitude (the 3rd parameter of each, as written above) should be >= 0 and < 60.  My best guess is that your source has been written or edited by someone who does not properly understand latitude and longitude, and what you have is actually thousandths of a minute.  I.e. the correct coordinates are probably S 24° 14.802′ W 66° 21.755′.  The first digit of each being > 6 is what makes me think it must be decimal fractions of a minute.  The article is behind a paywall, so I'm unable to view those numbers in context.  I've worked with a variety of consumer and professional GPS units, going back to some of the very first non-military units from Raytheon, and have seen a mixture of formats, some using seconds, some using decimal fractions of a minute, some configurable to both formats.  --Murph9000 (talk) 18:14, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
 * It is a direct copy and paste from the article. There is no explanation at all for the odd format.Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 18:58, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
 * I would ignore that article because Google Earth has those co-ordinates in a river valley. It's a very big mountain, and fractions of a minute are probably not necessary. Other references say 24 degrees 05 minutes and 66 degrees 48 minutes, but they also look wrong on the map (probably a viewpoint on the road).  The highest point looks to be very close to the 24 degrees 03 minutes and 66 degrees 29 minutes already given in the Wikipedia article.    D b f i r s   09:00, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Technically, these coordinates refer to hot springs associated with the volcano, but such hot springs are often at some distance to it.Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 09:09, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Beware of geodetic datum. A mismatch between the coordinate and map datum can introduce a significant plotting error.  --Murph9000 (talk) 09:27, 17 January 2016 (UTC)
 * I agree that there can be a mismatch, but the US military claims 02 minutes and 31 minutes . The exact height of 5500 metres (has it grown?) on Google Earth occurs at 3.357 minutes and 28.738 minutes.  I assume that this is WGS84 and is the same as that used by Wikipedia.    D b f i r s   09:41, 17 January 2016 (UTC)

Well, nevermind. I've just found out (based on other sources) that indeed the "thousandths of a minute" reading was the correct reading of the coordinates. I'll correct the coord indicators to use these readings. Thanks for the help, guys!Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 12:41, 17 January 2016 (UTC)