Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2016 June 28

= June 28 =

Unlocking A Protected Page
Our company's page is locked and all the information is outdated. The user who locked the page is no longer with the company and has been for years. How do we unlocked the page or delete it so we can create a new fresh page?

I am the promotions director for WZBH 93.5 the beach (radio station)and attempting to update the page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:153:703:2A60:4972:E648:D62A:4162 (talk) 00:05, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * The page was locked by an admin, not by whoever worked for you, because of biographies on living people issues. It will not be unlocked and that is not the correct forum to request that anyways. You can request edits to the page by clicking on "view source" at the top and then the "submit an edit request button." Please note that all requests must be specific, in a "change x to y" format, and must be accompanied by a reliable source. --Majora (talk) 00:18, 28 June 2016 (UTC)


 * It is not your company's page: it is Wikipedia's article about your company. Wikipedia is concerned that it be accurate and up to date according to independent reliably-published information, but has very little interest in what the company says or wishes to say. You are welcome to suggest edits on the talk page (preferably backed up by reliable published sources), but you are strongly discouraged from editing the article directly. --ColinFine (talk) 10:01, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

Jodie Dry
Ref number 1 is all wrong. Please fix 144.139.149.95 (talk) 02:37, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

Help:Cite errors/Cite error ref too many keys
Hi -- In my proposed article for Wikipedia : Draft:Penny Thompson, I have cited the same article from the Miami Herald 3x and was trying to consolidate. This article is the obit for Penny Thompson and supports a number of different facts about her in my article.....have read Wikipedia several times about doing multiple citations from same source, but obviously, I am not doing it right.....My apologies....I am waving the white flag for help! The article is from Pg. B-1, September 23, 1975, Miami Herald, with headline: "Columnist's 'Good Wife,' Penny Thompson, Is Dead" 02:52, 28 June 2016 (UTC)Fleejoseph (talk) 03:08, 28 June 2016 (UTC)


 * , I've fixed it here.  Dismas |(talk) 03:15, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

Jodie Dry
Please see above concerns re the ONLY citation on this page. Thank you101.182.117.21 (talk) 04:45, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

Eagleash (talk) 07:01, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

How to run something like-
How to run something like- -- Aryan  ( है?) 12:02, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * See How to run an edit-a-thon. PrimeHunter (talk) 12:04, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

ISIN - International Securities Identification Number
Hello,

I've been in a rather frustrating editing "war" on this page over the "Controversy" section: I work for an organization that issues ISIN's and has direct knowledge of the case cited in that section. I have added notes explain why the Controversy section was misleading or incorrect, yet two IP addresses keep undoing my edits (although, it's worth noting, without any justification or citation for WHY the original text should stand). Not sure what the protocol is, but the parties behind the IP addresses continue to reinsert opinion over fact in what was a legal matter.

Hope you can help stop the back and forth.

Thanks — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mbastian19 (talk • contribs) 12:18, 28 June 2016 (UTC)


 * , what we call original research is not to be used for articles. Information should come from reliable sources which can be cited. So, unless you have sources which can be cited, then what is cited (however wrong it may be) must remain. Dismas |(talk) 15:00, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

Cat-a-lot
Over at Commons, there's a useful gadget that allows lots of pages to be moved, copied, or removed from a category with just a few quick clicks: "Cat-A-Lot". I've seen it in occasional use here, but much less than at Commons. How does one implement it? It's not in Gadgets or anywhere else in Preferences, as far as I can tell (in my Commons preferences, it's in a section of Gadgets that doesn't exist here), and while Commons:Help:Gadget-Cat-a-lot gives a link for users of the English Wikipedia to get instructions, it goes to a page that doesn't provide any instructions. Nyttend (talk) 12:45, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * I've not tried it, but a number of editors have added User:קיפודנחש/cat-a-lot.js to their common.js configurations. -- John of Reading (talk) 13:03, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * See User:קיפודנחש. Add  to your Special:Mypage/common.js —  crh 23   &thinsp;(Talk) 13:05, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * For future reference, I found this by going to User scripts as you did, hitting source and then going to the parent page, where there are instructions. — crh 23   &thinsp;(Talk) 13:07, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

I am editing
List of Holocaust memorials and museums in the United States and just subdivided the article into individual states and the table of contents is taking up too much space. I know that there is a way to have the ToC run down the right side, or left side for that matter, of the page, thus saving space and looking better. But I don't know how to do it and figure that it is faster and safer to just ask here than go looking for and try to emulate some other article. Can you help? Einar aka Carptrash (talk) 15:57, 28 June 2016 (UTC)


 * See WP:TOC and learn to fish... metaphorically. Dismas |(talk) 17:01, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * The Lists of lighthouses and lightvessels was improved by changing the ToC, so I made a similar change. Hope it helps...Jokulhlaup (talk) 17:09, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * It helps and I'd rather starve than eat fish. Carptrash (talk) 18:42, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

Cat help requested
Although I use categories, I'm not conversant with the finer points of categorization, particularly in the case of parent and child categories. It appears that in some cases an article ought to be in both in other cases one or the other.

As background I'm trying to help a reader understand why some middle distance runners do not appear in the category Category:British middle-distance runners. There are various aspects to the answer but one aspect hinges on my understanding of the meaning of "non-diffusing parent category". In particular, I found one runner in the category Category:English middle-distance runners but not in Category:British middle-distance runners. If I read the explanation correctly, anyone in the English category should also be in the British category. Empirically that's not true so I'm trying to ascertain whether that's an error or if I am misunderstanding the concept.

If it is an error and the British category should be added to articles in the English category, I urge that no one make a change to Christina Boxer. I'm using that as an example for the reader and hope to encourage them to become an editor by fixing this if it needs fixing.-- S Philbrick (Talk)  17:47, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * You're right, but there are exceptions. British is a nationality. English is an ethnicity. I edit sports articles and have come across English immigrants who have been Australian citizens. Such sportsmen may consider themselves English but not British. At the same time, in general, the English people categories have generally been subsumed by the Brit people categories to such an extent that it was only recently I guess that the Brit census too included English as a separate category to tick off (I might be wrong here but)... So in general, if the English person is Brit too, I guess both categories should be placed on the article. Lourdes  18:19, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * I apologize for the following tangent: isn't a citizen of England "English", and isn't England a part of Britain? --A puzzled yank:2606:A000:4C0C:E200:8909:BFA1:BA09:8D73 (talk) 19:22, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * There is no such thing as a "citizen of England." One can be a citizen of the UK and be a resident of England, Wales, Scotland or Northern Ireland, and independently be of English, Welsh, Scottish or Northern Irish ethnicity (or any other ethnicity from anywhere in the world). If Northern Irish, one might have the option of being considered British for some purposes and Irish for others – see for example Rory McIlroy.
 * In some sporting contexts (per the OP) England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland are considered separate entities and have separate teams, such as the current UEFA Euro 2016 Football (soccer) Competition; in others there is a UK team encompassing all four, e.g. The Olympic Games (in which it is confusingly called "Team GB"), though again Northern Irish competitors can opt to compete for Eire instead, while in some sports an All-Ireland team can exist in parallel to Eire, NI and UK teams. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 185.74.232.130 (talk) 14:37, 29 June 2016 (UTC)
 * It's past time to get rid of this unhelpful "diffusing" and "non-diffusing" idea. Time to use common sense here and put it just in the child category, and in the process you'd follow the Commons policy instead, in which pages aren't permitted to remain in child and parent categories with basically only one exception (search for "Merkel" there), which is actually rather simple.  Permitting parent and child categories to appear together is confusing for everyone except wikispecialists: it goes against common sense and against basic principles of thesaurus organization, which is what our category tree is supposed to be; you won't see this in proper applications of similar professional-designed systems, e.g. the Library of Congress Classification.  Nyttend (talk) 20:07, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

Changing the photo in the infobox of my business's wiki page
Hi, I have an updated photograph of the Guelph Civic Museum, but I'm not sure how to upload it and swap it with the old photo. Is there a way someone can help me through this process? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aboughen (talk • contribs) 19:21, 28 June 2016 (UTC)


 * Hello, . The first question is, what is the copyright status of the photo? If you took it yourself, then you can upload it and release it under a suitable licence as you go; but if you are not the holder of the copyright, then you do not have that power: you would need the copyright holder to explicitly release it under a suitable licence: see donating copyright materials. (Note that permission to use the picture on Wikipedia is not enough: we require that materials be released under a licence that allows anybody to reuse them for any purpose). In either case, you can upload it to Wikimedia commons by using the Upload wizard. Once you have done that, you can edit Guelph Civic Museum to replace the filename of the existing picture with the new one (you have to get it exactly right, as to case, punctuation, and file extension).
 * Please also be aware that, as an employee of the Museum (judging from your title), you have a conflict of interest, and you are discouraged from editing the article. Having said that, replacing the picture is probably fine, but you still should declare your position, and if you are in any sense being paid to do this, you must make the declaration called for in WP:PAID. --ColinFine (talk) 19:46, 28 June 2016 (UTC)


 * Yes, as ColinFine stated, if you took the photograph yourself – then simple. Just upload it to Wikimedia Commons. If you did not however, then simple again, just ask the photographer to email a OTRS to Wikimedia Commmons -then upload it. This link  even provides a template for the email. It may seem complicated the first time around but becomes simple to follow  if one need to do it on future  occasions. As a museum they must have plenty  of opportunities to preserve cultural images on Wikimedia Commons. If you work for this org and have trouble with the management  agreeing with the licensing conditions, then remind them about the parable of the lamp under a bushel where no man see it. This is why so many orgs now support Creative Commons licences.  More people get to become aware of the 'lamp' through freely available images.--Aspro (talk) 22:31, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

The Author of the portrait of Jacques Jarrige: by Claire LE DOUARON and not by Wolfgang Hershey Laboratories nor Garett Linn.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_Jarrige — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.123.36.247 (talk) 20:21, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

Claire LE DOUARON. Paris. FRANCE. Working as photographer with Jacques Jarrige in France. This portrait of JACQUES JARRIGE is mine. I took them in Jacques Jarrige's studio, 4 rue des frères Lumières - 94150 La Queue en Brie - FRANCE, le 10/10/20214.

INFORMATIONS SUR LA PHOTO Image L: 2691 pixels H: 1733 pixels Date originale: 10/10/2014. 15:11:10 Date numérisée: 10/10/2014 15:11:10

Fichier Nom: P1030363 copy_2.jpg Taille: 1,6 Mo Modifié: 13/10/2014 11:10:50 Importé: 11/10/2014 11:19:49

Appareil photo Fabricant: Panasonic Modèle: DMC-GM1 Logiciel: Adobe Photoshop CS5

Garett Linn, in Wolfgang Hershey Laboratories, works for Valerie Goodman who represents Jacques Jarrige in her Gallery in NYC. NONE OF BOTH ASK ME TO USE IT. Perhaps, they pick up on the personnal web site of jacques Jarrige. Because Jacques Jarrige is my friend,  I ACCEPT  this use, but I WANT TO SEE MY NAME as the AUTHOR. If you want to verify what I say,  you can ask Jacques Jarrige himself. Thanking you in advance, Best regards. Claire LE DOUARON — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.123.36.247 (talk) 20:18, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * Since this file is hosted on commons (c:File:Jaques Jarrige at work.jpg, I recommend you email the support team at  and explain the issue. As a further note, for the file to continue to be used it needs to be under an open license compatible with CC-BY-SA, which means anyone can use it (with attribution) —  crh 23   &thinsp;(Talk) 20:55, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * Claire Le Douaron, I have deleted the image, since it's clearly taken from, its use here without proven permission is a violation of our policies, and use without permission in the first place is a copyright infringement. Thank you for your offer to permit its use; at the moment we can't use it, but as Crh23 says, we'd be happy to use it with proof of a "free license".  For "free license", please see À propos des licences; as Crh23 notes, we only accept images if anyone may use them for any purpose.  To prove permission, you can ask the http://www.jacquesjarrige.com webmaster to include a permission statement, or you can email a permission statement to ; the first would merely need to state the free license for the image, but the second would need to specify both the license and your identity, and you will need to use an email address related to Jarrige's website.  I'm sorry that we have all of these requirements, but it's necessary to protect copyright holders; anyone can claim to be the copyright holder, so we need to make sure that permission statements really come from the copyright holder.  Nyttend (talk) 21:23, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

Changing redirect
Heading added — crh 23   &thinsp;(Talk) 20:51, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

How can I sever the redirection of Royal Aero Club Records Racing and Rally Association to Royal Aero Club?

Petechilcott (talk) 20:32, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * See Help:Redirect. If you go to Royal Aero Club Records Racing and Rally Association, you'll end up at Royal Aero Club, but you'll see a little (Redirected from Royal Aero Club Records Racing and Rally Association) message at the top.  Click the link in that message to go to the redirect.  From there, click the "edit" button, just as you would on any other page.  You can then replace the redirect code ( #REDIRECT Royal Aero Club ) with something else; this will cause it to stop redirecting.  But why do you want to do this?  If you want to replace it with an article, that's fine.  If you want it to do nothing at all, you should take it to RFD with a deletion request.  I can help you with that, if you want to see it deleted.  Nyttend (talk) 22:21, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

Ah - thanks. The Royal Aero Club and the Royal Aero Club Records Rally and Racing Association are 2 distinct bodies with the latter being formed from the former. I have created a page Draft:Royal Aero Club Records Racing and Rally Association which was deleted for copyright reasons (another website had quoted our handbook and this was used as the reason to delete). I am hoping to get the page reinstated and for that reason would want to to see the redirection removed. Even if the Wiki page is not reinstated, the redirection should be removed for the reasons stated.

Petechilcott (talk) 21:16, 4 July 2016 (UTC)

How do I post or upload a PDF file to Wikipedia?
How do I post or upload a PDF file to Wikipedia? Thanks. Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 21:09, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * Special:Upload tolerates PDFs (or at least the one at Commons does; I've never tried here); just do everything just as you would any other type of file. Nyttend (talk) 22:22, 28 June 2016 (UTC)


 * Thanks. But, that's my question.  I have never posted or uploaded any type of file, PDF or otherwise.  Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 01:42, 29 June 2016 (UTC)


 * It's exactly the same as an image,, and the WP:Upload wizard will help you upload to Commons or Wikipedia as appropriate. (Copyright considerations are also the same as for an image.) Having said that, it is comparatively unusual for there to be reason to upload a PDF: why do you want to do so? --ColinFine (talk) 08:58, 29 June 2016 (UTC)


 * Thanks. I ripped a page out of a magazine.  The page has a good article on it.  I wanted to scan the page as a PDF.  And then post it as an "External link" in the Wikipedia article.  And, also, post it on the article Talk Page.  The article is: Amy Archer-Gilligan.  And possibly Arsenic and Old Lace.  Is this allowed or not?  I am not familiar with all this copyright mumbo-jumbo.  And I have never downloaded/uploaded/posted a file of any sort before, PDF or otherwise. So  I have no idea what I am doing.  And no idea if it's allowed.  Thanks. Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 16:14, 29 June 2016 (UTC)


 * Does the magazine not own the copyright to the page you have copied?   D b f i r s   16:58, 29 June 2016 (UTC)


 * I'd say that would almost certainly be a copyright violation. The only way it could be not is if the magazine has explicitly released the content under a permissive license, which is rather unlikely. — crh 23   &thinsp;(Talk) 17:04, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

I can think of no reason why you shouldn't simply cite the article without the .pdf, since that latter would of course be a copyright violation. There has never been, nor will there (probably ever) be, an requirement that citations contain an internet link. In this era of Photoshop, your "external link", for that matter, could be an altered or otherwise falsified faux-copy of the actual article. It's certainly been known to happen. -- Orange Mike &#124;  Talk  21:57, 29 June 2016 (UTC)


 * So, without internet links, how does anyone on Wikipedia verify what the original source says?   Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 04:21, 30 June 2016 (UTC)


 * The same way everyone checked references before there was an Internet. Go to a library and look at the cited book, check a newspaper's archives, find a copy of the cited journal...  Rwessel (talk) 23:36, 30 June 2016 (UTC)

Draft:Penny Thompson
Draft:Penny Thompson

Before I submit article "Penny Thompson" wondered if there are any glaring issues I need to correct/address first? Thanks very much. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Fleejoseph (talk • contribs) 22:11, 28 June 2016 (UTC)


 * I don't have any comments on the article itself (except "looks good!"); but I found the section on the "flying car" especially interesting. If you can find more info on that, our articles on Roadable aircraft and ERCO Ercoupe could use some updating. I found Bryan Autoplane which had one model based on Ercoupe, but the date doesn't match, and it only seats one person.  --Anyway, ... happy editing!  ;)  --2606:A000:4C0C:E200:8909:BFA1:BA09:8D73 (talk) 23:26, 28 June 2016 (UTC)


 * Yes, good work. Thanks.  However, I believe that there is a Wikipedia "rule" about capitalization within heading titles.  So, for example, you would not have a heading called "Early Years" (upper-case "Y").  Rather, it would be "Early years" (lower-case "y").  Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 01:45, 29 June 2016 (UTC)


 * Indeed. and, this is in WP:HEADING where it says that headings should be in sentence case and not title case.  Dismas |(talk) 13:21, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

Note: Penny Thompson is now in mainspace. --2606:A000:4C0C:E200:6D88:8CAA:4690:9602 (talk) 18:27, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

How do I make categories possible on my page?
Hello, I'm an entertainer building my page. My other friends with entertainment sites on wiki have categories like

Early Years

Career

Personal Life

etc. I don't know how to get these categories on my page. All I can do is fill out one long autobiographical page. Please advise. Thanks, CarlyCarly Ozard (talk) 23:47, 28 June 2016 (UTC)


 * , those are called headings, not categories. Categories are a different thing here on Wikipedia. And you can see an example of a heading at the top of this section here which gives you an example of the code.
 * That said... Wikipedia is not a web host for your personal autobiography. In fact, autobiographies are not allowed. If you are notable enough by Wikipedia standards, then an article can be written about you but the creator that article should not be you or anyone directly affiliated with you such as a friend, manager, or promoter. That is because you and those people have a conflict of interest and will find it hard to write about you in a neutral and encyclopedic way. Dismas |(talk) 01:08, 29 June 2016 (UTC)


 * I think she means her User Page, and not an article about her proper. See: User:Carly Ozard. Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 01:29, 29 June 2016 (UTC)


 * Yes, I've seen it. I was thinking more specifically about the first item at WP:NOTWEBHOST but pointed Carly to the more general WP:NOT at first. Dismas |(talk) 01:33, 29 June 2016 (UTC)


 * Back to the original question. If you want a heading (not a category) named "Early years", you simply type the phrase "Early years" with two equal signs before it and two equal signs after it.  So, you would type  == Early years == .  Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 01:35, 29 June 2016 (UTC)


 * I took the liberty of adding a template. --2606:A000:4C0C:E200:8909:BFA1:BA09:8D73 (talk) 01:39, 29 June 2016 (UTC)


 * , I'm afraid that that material is inappropriate for a user page: please see WP:USERPAGE. You may put limited biographical information on your user page, but it relates to you as a Wikipedia aditor. Put bluntly, there is nowhere on Wikipedia where you may "build a page" in the way you are attempting. We are an encyclopaedia, which consists of neutrally written articles about subjects, which summarise what independent reliable sources say about the subject. Wikipedia has almost no interest in anything that a person (or a company, or a band) says about themselves. Sorry. --ColinFine (talk) 09:05, 29 June 2016 (UTC)