Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2017 December 9

= December 9 =

I would like helping creating articles for 2 actresses who play roles on the tv series Star_(TV_series)
The 2 actress who play roles on Star named Brittany O'Grady and Amiyah Scott don't cureently have articles. Would these articles make good reliable sources:http://www.kingamiyahscott.com/about/ https://heightline.com/amiyah-scott-married-husband-boyfriend-wiki-bio/ http://wikinetworth.com/celebrities/brittany-o-grady-age-birthday-parents-ethnicity-boyfriend-dating.html Callistoxena (talk) 05:01, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * None of those looks like anything near a reliable source, especially when we're talking about biographies of living persons. If these women are notable enough to call for an article here, there should be more substantial coverage of them, in more substantial publications. -- Orange Mike &#124;  Talk  21:52, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * I agree.-- S Philbrick (Talk)  00:28, 10 December 2017 (UTC)

How do I upload an article onto Main Space
I have recently created an article in my sandbox that I want to upload onto main space however whenever I go to search for it, my article does not show up. I have tried so many things but can't get it to where there is accessible to the public. I hope you can help me figure out how to do this! Hope to hear from you soon! Thank you — Preceding unsigned comment added by Amitchell3 (talk • contribs) 05:26, 9 December 2017 (UTC)


 * You seem to have solved the problem by editing an existing article, but ask again if there is still a problem. Draft articles in draft space or in sandboxes are not indexed by Google, but can be read and edited by any editor who knows about them.    D b f i r s   08:12, 9 December 2017 (UTC)

Seems to have lost my original Account??????????
I have been a member for quite a couple of years, and tonight apparently I do not exist!!!!!!!

Doesn't seem to have record on my account, which is odd, Why:  Because I just gave them a donation a couple of weeks ago, so tell me where did my money go if not in the pockets of Wikipédia, which is scary and not very reassuring for my safety and ease of mind

I have tried high and low to get to a specific place to write all this down, nothing except here?????????

Thats not right cause I am sure not to give my e-mail here and how can someone who is NOT in the Administration correct the bug in your files?????????????? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Myself33 (talk • contribs) 05:36, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * What was your other account? Without that we can't even look it up. Meters (talk) 05:55, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * This is a good place to ask for help but it's impossible to help without the account name. It seems unlikely to be a bug in our files. Don't give your email address. We don't need it and this is a public page. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:01, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * When was your account from? If from before the unified login for Wikimedia projects then it might have had ~enwiki or something similar added onto it. I also don't think that a Wikipedia account is needed to donate, so that might be some other account you are thinking of. Emir of Wikipedia (talk) 13:15, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Apart from the user account name, we could also start if you can tell us the names of some articles you edited. Every change is logged, so we can look at the history of those articles.--Gronk Oz (talk) 14:17, 9 December 2017 (UTC)

Citing a PDF source
Usually in a pdf file with multiple pages there are two series of page numbers: In several cases, these two numbers don't match: the same "physical" page could have two different numbers - because the "file numbering" counts also the cover, and maybe also an introductory section (e.g. an index), hence the first one is hgher than the latter; or becuse the file contains only a part of the original document (e.g a chapter), hence the first one is lower than the latter. In such cases, which number should we put in the page= parameter when we cite the document as a reference using a cite template? 93.57.255.93 (talk) 14:28, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * actual "page number" in the file, as shown by the pdf-reader;
 * "page number" in the document itself, as written on the top/bottom of the page.
 * Document page number(s) if it's a book-type ref, Document article page range if it's a journal article Jimfbleak - talk to me?  14:46, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Examples
 * Jimfbleak - talk to me?  14:56, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Hi Jimfbleak, I'm not sure I correctly understood your explaination: in the second example (book-type sources), your reference is referred to this page (the one marked as number four) or to this page (the fourth one)? 93.57.255.93 (talk) 15:19, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * It's the page with "4" printed on it, the one with a map Jimfbleak - talk to me?  15:42, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * I would dispute the general notion that journal cites must use the article's entire page range.  In Editor Jimfbleak's journal example the page range is 305–315.  That usage is fine for a bibliographic listing and where short citations are used ( and the -family templates, for example – because individual page numbering is part of that style) but for inline use, cite the page that supports the Wikipedia article text.  Don't make extra work for the reader by requiring them to search through an entire journal article to find the supporting text.  If the supporting text is on journal article page 310, use that in the citation.
 * Use the document's own pagination, not the pagination of the pdf file.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 15:21, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * I would dispute the general notion that journal cites must use the article's entire page range.  In Editor Jimfbleak's journal example the page range is 305–315.  That usage is fine for a bibliographic listing and where short citations are used ( and the -family templates, for example – because individual page numbering is part of that style) but for inline use, cite the page that supports the Wikipedia article text.  Don't make extra work for the reader by requiring them to search through an entire journal article to find the supporting text.  If the supporting text is on journal article page 310, use that in the citation.
 * Use the document's own pagination, not the pagination of the pdf file.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 15:21, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 15:21, 9 December 2017 (UTC)


 * (ec) Does that (Bleak) entirely answer his question? Normally, always prefer the numbering visible on the pages. It may be easier if you don't use the cite templates. Then you can explain if you think it necessary. Johnbod (talk) 15:21, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Johnbod, it's up to you whether you use templates, I nearly always do because it makes it less likely that I'll make formatting errors. With regard to journal page ranges, it's what is universally done outside Wikipedia, and I don't think we should make up our own personal styles on this. I suppose that additionally adding a specific page number in parentheses might be OK if it's a very long article, but I don't do that  Jimfbleak -  talk to me?  15:42, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Not "universally" - actually that's more of a convention in scientific subjects, and in my experience especially medicine, where references are generally expected to pick up only what is in the abstract, and picking up points from the middle of articles is not considered quite the thing. In arts subjects the convention is entirely different, and while page ranges may be quoted in the main biblio entry, references to specific pages within are expected where appropriate. Quite where railway studies (which seem to be the topic here) come, I wouldn't know. Johnbod (talk) 15:52, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Our own rules have this to say: "Cite the source clearly and precisely (specifying page, section, or such divisions as may be appropriate)" (WP:V), and "[ specifies] A range of pages in the source that supports the content ... do not use to indicate the total number of pages in the source." (Template:Cite journal) – Finnusertop (talk ⋅ contribs) 16:13, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * The cs1|2 citation templates are our own 'made up' styles so using that to argue against identifying specific pages in the source doesn't hold much water. We should not be making the task of verification more difficult for readers but rather, we should make it as easy as is possible.  Editors know (or damn-well should know) exactly where in the source the supporting text is when they write a cs1|2 template.  It is a trivial matter for them to use that knowledge for the in-source location parameters.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 16:26, 9 December 2017 (UTC)

Same-sex marriage poll
Hello,

I left a message on User:Ron 1987's talk page to underline the fact that on the Template:Same-sex marriage opinion polls worldwide and Template:Same-sex marriage opinion polls Europe, there is a reference to a poll indicating that 64 % of the Dutch people agree with same-sex marriage. However, there is another poll (done by Eurobarometer, an official instrument of the European Commission), saying that 91 % of the Dutch agree. Since he has been reverting my edits on the excuse that the first poll is a few points more recent, I would like someone else to step in. The Eurobarometer relies on thousands of face-to-face interviews and since there is that significant difference between the two polls, I conclude that the first one must be wrong. Can someone else (other than me) tell him to stop reverting my edits on both pages to install the Eurobarometer poll (that is used on the same list for countries like Sweden or Denmark)? Thanks.

WhatsUpWorld (talk) 14:29, 9 December 2017 (UTC)


 * Both and  need to stop Edit warring, and follow the Dispute resolution procedure, which starts by discussing the issue on the (Template's) talk page, and at no point includes an appeal to the Help Desk. I see that you have at least opened a discussion on Ron 1987's talk page, WhatsUpWorld, but a demand to bow to your view is not a good way of starting a discussion. (I am not saying anything about the relative merits of the two views: I haven't even looked at them). --ColinFine (talk) 23:15, 9 December 2017 (UTC)

New tags
Hello to the editors at the Help Desk!

I have noticed a bunch of new tags have been added to Wikipedia within the past week, most notably the "rollback" tag that is added to every edit made using the rollback tool. Similar tags have been added to all the different language editions of Wikimedia sites (not just Wikipedia), and so I would like to know more about how this came about.

Thank you in advance! « « «  SOME GADGET GEEK  » » » (talk) 16:25, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Implemented in https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/390224/ referring to T73236 and T167656. See also mw:Manual:$wgSoftwareTags. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:26, 9 December 2017 (UTC)

How come no one answered my question about the 2 actresses from tv series Star
I've been waiting for an answer. Callistoxena (talk) 19:08, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * We're all volunteers here, so please be patient. RudolfRed (talk) 19:25, 9 December 2017 (UTC)
 * You only asked this today. That is hardly a long wait. Please be patient. Emir of Wikipedia (talk) 19:49, 9 December 2017 (UTC)

2018 MAC Football season — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.102.39.189 (talk) 23:58, 9 December 2017 (UTC)