Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2017 February 10

= February 10 =

Is Amazon.com a good website for book citations?
Hello, I am writing a page and I am wondering if the Wikipedia community generally considers Amazon a good place for citations. Also, is it also important to cite a book and if so are there any other suggestions as websites for a reliable citing source. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cassini127 (talk • contribs) 00:47, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * No. Wikipedia should not be providing free advertising for, and feeding prospective customers to amazon.com.  Use the book's isbn either as isbn in a citation template or by using  in a handcrafted citation.  Doing that gives readers a link to Special:BookSources where, if the readers choose, they can link to amazon, google, world cat, and a variety of other resources.  For example, from the  documentation:   → ISBN 0-7475-3269-9


 * Remember that you need to WP:SAYWHEREYOUGOTIT. If whatever you wrote is supported by a book, cite that book.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 01:01, 10 February 2017 (UTC)


 * , the important bit of a citation is the information which will let a reader locate the source - so, for a book, things like title, author, publisher, date, page number, editor. Including a URL is a courtesy to make things easier for a reader, but it is not essential, unlike some of the other items. Having said that, if the text of the book is available on Google books, you can provide a link to that. But see WP:GBT. --ColinFine (talk) 11:02, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Referencing errors on Aanandan
Reference help requested.

In the article Aanandan I have defined the ref name on the very first instance. Still I get the error message "Cite error: The named reference hindu was invoked but never defined .." Please help to clear this.

Thanks, UK Sharma3 01:18, 10 February 2017 (UTC)


 * Hello, the error occurred because the section 'reception' was placed after the reference section. Moving it solved the problem. Eagleash (talk) 01:25, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Is there a way to attribute edits logged under an IP address to the owner's username?
I just created a Wikipedia account today, and would like to have my prior edits logged under my IP address now show as made by my username. Is there a way to have those 'IP address' attributed edits now linked to my username? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Retronimble (talk • contribs) 01:35, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * No. If it is a static IP that no-one else has used you can always leave a note on your page on and on the IP's page that the edits are yours. That's it. Meters (talk) 01:54, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

How can I find the hidden book creator toolbar
I hid the book creator however I can not find it. What should I do to fix it? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ljylxl (talk • contribs) 02:24, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Hi Ljylxl, just look at the left side vertical menu bar on your screen. You'll see a section titled Print/export. Under this section, you'll see a link titled "Create a book". Click on that and you'll be on your way. For further future reference, you can also visit Help:Books. Thanks. Lourdes  04:33, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Pinging . Lourdes  04:34, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Fix The Pac-12 Championship Category
Can You Fix The Pac-12 Championship from finals to The Category. 2600:8803:7A00:19:B1D6:A74D:9E61:CFB3 (talk) 02:47, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Pac-12 Football? Pac-12 Basketball? What needs fixing? Please explain the problem in full and provide links if possible. - X201 (talk) 08:55, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

A draft
My username is SpencerConnect. How do I get to my draft? — Preceding unsigned comment added by SpencerConnect (talk • contribs) 14:29, 10 February 2017 (UTC)


 * See WP:Your first article. Personal opinion: You may have wanted to know basic things like this before agreeing to take payment for writing an article. † dismas †|(talk) 15:25, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Pinging:  † dismas †|(talk) 15:26, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

No argument. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.249.251.221 (talk • contribs)

Responding to RfC Surveys - how to !vote
When an article is up for Merge, Deletion, etc. what is the accepted way of formatting my  for that discussion? I skimmed over most of WP Voting, but I didn't see anything linking specifically to how to participate.

I keep seeing references to a,, but when I hit edit to respond to an RfC, I don't see anyone using the syntax,  ,  ,  , etc. Instead, I typically see something like. Is there a plugin or third party solution that people use to  with, similar to Twinkle? I'm currently under the impression that I should literally just reply with, but I want to make sure that I'm not "doing it wrong", or that there isn't a wiki-noob friendly point and click method of doing things.

I understand that ultimately, it's not the amount of 's that matter, and more comes to how well the arguments and such are constructed and of course what the consensus is. My question is more a question of formatting and not so much of policy.

Assistance would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. Sawta (talk) 14:56, 10 February 2017 (UTC)


 * Hey Sawta. A WP:!VOTE is actually kindof a tongue-in-cheek reference to the fact that these are not actually votes, but are rather a discussion where only well reasoned arguments based on policy are considered and weighed. Formatting is usually something along the lines of:


 * Oppose - Here is my reasoning based on policy. Timothy Joseph Wood  16:05, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Merge - Here is my reasoning based on policy. Timothy Joseph Wood  16:05, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Support Option 2 - Here is my reasoning based on policy. Timothy Joseph Wood  16:05, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * This singer is not notable. Delete or Redirect to the article on the band. Timothy Joseph Wood  16:05, 10 February 2017 (UTC)


 * And what the actual text of that !vote is, will depend on what type of discussion is being had. Even this is mostly convention and not strictly required. There is no obligation to format perfectly, because although there are some tools like http://tools.wmflabs.org/afdstats/ which attempt to automate !vote counting for statistical purposes, the actual determination of consensus isn't made by a bot, but a person who can read and evaluate the arguments given.  Timothy Joseph Wood  16:05, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Help to change an image please
I need to change an image on a wikipedia page: the page is titled "George Giffard". The image (which was previously, correctly, a photograph of him) has been changed very recently, on 5 February 2017, and the photo now shown is not of George Giffard. I have never edited wikipedia before, am completely new to this, and have spent a couple of hours trying to understand how to do this, and am having trouble; I feel this is too complicated for me. Can anyone help with this please? The image previously used was from his regimental page http://www.queensroyalsurreys.org.uk/colonels/039.html and I want to change the image back to this. Arabella Birdperson (talk) 15:39, 10 February 2017 (UTC)


 * The image was indeed added on 5 February but AFAICT, there was not an image on the page prior to this. However, if you 'google' George Giffard you do see in their basic information the regimental image referred to. Wiki has little if any control over that. The preferred image is likely to have copyright issues. Eagleash (talk) 16:09, 10 February 2017 (UTC)


 * I've removed the image of General Sir Thomas Blamey since it obviously doesn't belong there. If anyone uploads the correct image to Commons (copyright free) then it can be added to the article.    D b f i r s   16:24, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Thank you Eagleash for your reply, and thank you Ddfirs for removing the incorrect picture. I'm out of my depth here; a further query: in order to use the image on the regimental page, can I simply contact the regiment and ask permission for their image to be used on Wikipedia? Arabella Birdperson (talk) 16:43, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure that the man with the eye-patch is General W.J. Slim.


 * It's not pertinent to the discussion but the image does not appear to be of Blamey either. Google searches show him to be a man of different build without an eye patch. Hopefully an editor expert in copyright will be able to provide relevant information shortly. Good luck. Eagleash (talk) 16:55, 10 February 2017 (UTC)


 * yes, kind of. Whoever holds the copyright will need to donate it following the instructions at WP:DCM. You can request it using the templates shown at Example_requests_for_permission. Potential issues:
 * 1) The QRSRA may not hold the copyright to that particular photo. It may have been granted authorization by the photographer to use it for their own website, but it does not make that copyright transferable.
 * 2) If the QRSRA holds the copyright, and they are OK with the photograph being used on Wikipedia, they must still agree to release it under a free license, meaning anyone could use it; for instance BigDevilCorp could use it as an illustration of "BigDevilCorp's book of stupid soldiers". Tigraan Click here to contact me 18:49, 10 February 2017 (UTC)


 * It looks as if I was misled by the original caption from Australian War Memorial which had the names reversed, and that picture (now reinstated) really was of George Giffard in 1940. I'll leave it to you and  to agree on a better picture.    D b f i r s   21:21, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Hi @Dbfirs and @Applodion, that picture is definitely 100% not him! I'm a relative of his! If you compare this picture to the picture on the regimental website http://www.queensroyalsurreys.org.uk/colonels/039.html I hope you can see that this is not the same person. The Australian War Memorial link mentioned above doesn't seem to work; but if that is a picture captioned George Giffard on their site, then it is a mistake. I have emailed the team who manage the regimental website to ask if they can help with regard to the copyright of the photo on their website. I do also have photos of him, but think the regimental website photo is most appropriate for his wikipedia page. Would it be possible please to take down that picture as it is definitely not of him? Arabella Birdperson (talk) 22:12, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * 1. Several images on the Australian War Memorial show the same man, listed as "General George Giffard", all of them taken at a time when Giffard was really in Palestine - I think it would be a very strange coincidence if they really mistook him (though that is possible); 2. as far as I understood, this eyepatch does appear to be the result of temporary injuries; 3. for me these two images appear to be the same person, though the image in question here seems to be from a time when he was younger. Though it is of course possible that I am mistaken in regard to these points. Applodion (talk) 22:19, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Btw, the reason I uploaded this image, was because it was the only image of Giffard I could find that was not copyright-protected. Arabella, if you can obtain another (better) image, that is also not copyright-protected, we could use that one instead. Applodion (talk) 22:25, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * I again checked the image on the AWM ( link here ), and its description is "1940-06-09. PALESTINE. GENERAL SIR THOMAS BLAMEY AND GENERAL GIFFARD - G.O.C. PALESTINE, HAVE 1ST MEAL IN PALESTINE. (NEGATIVE BY G. SILK)." The part "G.O.C. PALESTINE" is significant here, as Giffard really was the General Officer Commanding British Forces in Palestine and Trans-Jordan at the time, so the at least the photograph believed the left man on the image to really be George Giffard. Applodion (talk) 22:30, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Hi @Applodion, thanks for your reply. That link is working now (problem at my end I think) and yes there are 2 images on the Australian War Memorial site which look like they were taken at the same time, of the same 2 men, and are both incorrectly captioned. I understand your comment about the photographer, so I'm not sure how this incorrect captioning could have occurred, but I'm 100% certain that the man with the eye-patch is not Sir George. I have just emailed the AWM to ask that they re-caption the picture. I have many photographs of General Sir George, but I'm taking on board the comment left earlier in this thread by Tigraan, that if I allow one of my photos to be released under a free licence, then it could end up being put to a use which I wouldn't be happy with. I'd really be happier for the Wikipedia page to not have a photograph though, rather than the one from the Australian War Memorial site. I assure you that this is definitely not him. The man in the photograph with the eyepatch has a long face with a long prominent chin with no cleft whereas Sir George had a shorter chin with a cleft. Would you be able to take the picture down please? I'll let you know when I hear back from the regimental website re: the copyright on the photograph on their site. Thanks again for getting back to me about this. Arabella Birdperson (talk) 23:07, 10 February 2017 (UTC)


 * No problem Arabella. My proposal would be that for the time being I remove the image from the article, while you scan one of your images and upload them as new version of the image: On the image's page on wikimedia (link) you can see the "Upload a new version of this file" button at the page's bottom. There you can upload your version of the image, whereupon we change the copyright and can avoid the hassle of having to delete and then re-upload these images. Applodion (talk) 23:18, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Hi @Applodion, I really appreciate your help in this, thank you. I've had a quick look through some photos and I have a formal uniform portrait photo which I think would be suitable. I don't have scanning facilities here, but will scan it tomorrow and attempt to upload it through the link you've helpfully provided. By using my photo will I have to agree that the photo is being released under a free licence? Thanks for your assistance. Arabella Birdperson (talk) 23:51, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

I pretty sure that the man with the eye-patch is General W.J. Slim. Arabella Birdperson (talk) 00:09, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * I am quite sure if the image was taken by your family or someone on behalf of your family, you can release it into "free use" by 1. uploading it and then 2. providing the correct licensing (the latter of which I can do for you). Since I am currently writing on an article about a WW1 battle in East Africa (the Battle of Lioma), where George Giffard was the British commander, I also wanted to ask if you have images of him as officer of the King's African Rifles during or shortly after WW1. If so, I would be tremendously thankful if you agree to also provide such an image, as it would enhance the visual quality of the article in question. If you don't have any images or don't want to upload one of them, that would also be absolutely okay! After all, these are your images, and you can decide how to use them. :-) Applodion (talk) 00:35, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Hi @Applodion, I will have a look and see. I don't have all the photos, albums were distributed among different family members. I'd be interested to read the article when it's ready. Will scan photo and upload shortly. Arabella Birdperson (talk) 09:22, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Hi @Applodion, I have an image ready to upload. I have clicked on your link above, but I can't see any "Upload a new version of this file" button anywhere on that page, can you help please? Arabella Birdperson (talk) 11:34, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Yesterday the upload button was still there, so I assumed it was blocked due to the deletion request. Applodion (talk) 14:11, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * No wait, there it is: try again and look if you are logged in at wikimedia; at the bottom the button must appear Applodion (talk) 14:11, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * It is under the image at "File history" - "Upload a new version of this file". If you don't find it, here is a direct link, though I don't know if this works. Applodion (talk) 14:14, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Hi @Applodion, when I click on the link it's still showing that I'm logged in at the top right of the screen, but I can't see the button. Do I need to somehow log in separately to the link? If so, I can't see where to do this. Thanks again for all your help! Arabella Birdperson (talk) 14:16, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Have you tried this link yet? Applodion (talk) 14:20, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Hi @Applodion, that last direct link worked, in that it took me to where I could upload my image, however it rejects my image with the warning, "File extension ".png" does not match the detected MIME type of the file (image/jpeg)" even though my image is a jpeg! Arabella Birdperson (talk) 14:23, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * That problem comes from the fact that the already uploaded image is a png file, while your image is jpeg. Try the following: Open your image with paint or another program to work on image files, and simply save it as .png file. The newly saved png-version of your image should be uploadable. Applodion (talk) 14:26, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Thank you @Applodion; I saved it as a .png file, and tried to upload that. Unfortunately now I get the following message: "A file with this name exists already. You can't upload a new version because your account is too new. Please go back and upload the file under a new name. Once you've done that, you can ask someone at the Help desk to move your file to the name you want." Arabella Birdperson (talk) 14:35, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Ah... damn. Okay, that is a problem. Then lets do the following: upload your image here link; all steps are generally well explained. At "Release rights" chose "Own work" (we later change that to "inherited family photo") and upload your image under another name, like for example simply "George Giffard" or "General George Giffard". We will later delete or replace the old image seperately. Applodion (talk) 14:41, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

It's going smoothly so far @Applodion! Got to 'add a category' will I just leave that blank? Arabella Birdperson (talk) 14:56, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * We can add categories later, so to make it easier, just leave it blank for now. Applodion (talk) 15:01, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Ok thanks @Applodion, I think that has worked! Arabella Birdperson (talk) 15:04, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Incidentally this is not the photo I was originally going to use. In this one I have uploaded he is a General, but the other one he is younger, so maybe it would be more suitable for your article? The photo doesn't have a date on it, but I'd guess he's about 30-35ish. It's a formal uniform portrait photo. Arabella Birdperson (talk) 15:12, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Good job! It would be great if you also upload the photo of him when he was younger. But first of all I am now going to fix some things about the photo (like adding categories) that shall serve as infobox image. Can you tell me these things: When and where was the photo originally taken? Perhaps also who was the photographer? Applodion (talk) 15:29, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Yes, I will upload the other image when ready; judging by the epaulettes (referring to the Wikipedia page!) he's a Lieutenant-Colonel in the other photo. Anyway with regard to this uploaded image, I'm afraid I don't have much further information. I have cropped it down from a photo where there is another officer. Sir George has written 'Foulkes and self' on the back, India. Foulkes is Major-General Charles Foulkes I think. I would imagine that it's 1943 (or 1944)? I have no idea who took the photo I'm afraid. I've inherited it among a pile of loose photos with no further information other than what Sir George has written on the back of some of them. Arabella Birdperson (talk) 15:41, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * No problem, that is already more than enough information. Just in case you want to change the information of the image in the future, you can generally do so on the image's page on wikimedia by clicking "edit" If you want to add categories, for example, simply place them at the article's bottom. Applodion (talk) 15:48, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Oh, and i have already added the image to the wikipedia page: George Giffard. Applodion (talk) 15:52, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Furthermore, George Giffard was indeed Lt-Col during WW1 in East Africa, so that image would be perfect! I think I should also add that I think you can be proud to be related to General Giffard; he appears to have been a very capable commander, and notably was even praised by Paul von Lettow-Vorbeck as his thoughest opponent - Giffard was, as far as I know, also the only Allied commander during WW1 to actually come to close to actually destroying Lettow-Vorbeck's last guerilla forces. Applodion (talk) 15:58, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

That's great, I can see it now! Thank you so much @Applodion! With regard to the other image, I kept open the upload wizard page, and there is a button for 'upload more files'. Should I upload the other image there? Arabella Birdperson (talk) 15:56, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Yepp, that is the easiest way. You can also always upload more files on wikimedia by clicking "Upload file" in the left corner (under "Tools"). Applodion (talk) 16:00, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Ok, I think I have managed to upload that one too @Applodion! Yes, I am pleased to be related to him, I didn't know that von Lettow-Vorbeck said that about him, that is interesting to hear, thank you. The feeling within the family is that he wasn't given the credit that his role in the Burma campaign in WW2 deserved, although Slim spoke and wrote to acknowledge this, Mountbatten etc were not so generous. Maybe some day things will be set straight. Anyway, I look forward to reading your article and hope the photo will be of some use. Many thanks for your help and patience in guiding me through all this! Arabella Birdperson (talk) 16:16, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

I'm afraid I have no information about when or where the photo was taken, or by whom. Arabella Birdperson (talk) 16:18, 11 February 2017 (UTC)


 * No problem, and yes, that image is quite great! I think we should also add it to his main article as well, to show him when he was younger. Furthermore, I should be the one thanking you! Without your help, patience and tolerance for my sometimes quite horrible English (not my native language ^^), we would never have got such great images of General Giffard here on Wikipedia! Applodion (talk) 16:33, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

You're very welcome @Applodion! Yes, if you think it would be appropriate to add this to the main article then that would be great. Incidentally I would never have guessed that English is not your first language :) Arabella Birdperson (talk) 16:38, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Done, and thank you. ^^ I want to say that whenever you need help again here on Wikipedia/Wikimedia, feel free to contact me on my talk page. After all, Wikipedia grows and improves with every contribution, and it becomes much easier to contribute when we all help each other. Thats the spirit of Wikipedia, after all. :-) Applodion (talk) 16:57, 11 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Just one more question: Of the images of the AMW that claim to include Giffard ( link here ), which ones actually show him? I just want to ask, in case I want to add one of these images in the future - after all, I don't want to make the same mistake twice! Applodion (talk) 17:03, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Hi @Applodion, thanks, I will contact you again on your talk page when I next need help! It's been great to learn more about how Wikipedia works, and I'm amazed and very grateful that you and others have been so helpful. With regard to the images of the AMW, the ones that show him are as follows: https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/001157/ he is seated on the right https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/001154/ I think he is the tall figure in the middle (it's hard to be 100% sure, the face isn't clear)  Sir George was an exceptionally tall man. https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/001175/ he is the tall man on the right https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/001572/ he is seated on the right, wearing glasses https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/001569/ he is seated, furthest right, wearing glasses I don't see him in any of the other photographs. I hope this helps you! Best wishes, Arabella Birdperson (talk) 21:18, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

Trying to change heading title
Hi,

I have read how and where to go to move and then change the title, Alfred E. Mann Institute for Biomedical Engineering, I would like to add at the University of Southern California, but I do not see any choices as such to do that on the page.

Where do I find this and how can I change the title?

Thank you for all your help.

Best,

Kathy — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kathy Bonagofsky (talk • contribs) 17:23, 10 February 2017 (UTC)


 * Hello and welcome to Wikipedia the addition would seem to make the title unnecessarily lengthy. The location is mentioned very early in the text. BTW, page moves will not be available to you until your account is at least four days old and you have made at least 10 valid edits. Eagleash (talk) 17:35, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Image for Gwendolyn Brooks
− Hi, can someone help me find a good encyclopedic image for Gwendolyn Brooks, died 2000, so we probably can use non-free but anyway, if you can upload one to the article, I would be much obliged. Thanks. Alanscottwalker (talk) 17:29, 10 February 2017 (UTC)


 * Alanscottwalker: ✅ Timothy Joseph Wood  18:18, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Alanscottwalker (talk) 20:04, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * There are definitely better ones out there, but if someone dug, I'd say it would be hard to justify using one of them rather than the Library of Congress one. I just wish LOC had all the copyright information themselves. Timothy Joseph Wood  20:07, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Great. I found the Loc file that gives more info and added it, it's a good photo in substance (if not in technique - there seems some washing-out), as it was probably taken when she won the Pulitzer but personally I might prefer later in life - at any rate Thanks, again. Alanscottwalker (talk) 20:16, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Vandalism on the main page?
What on Earth happened here ? RedPanda25 20:09, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Mostly, various unconstructive edits by compromised admin accounts. -- zzuuzz (talk) 20:22, 10 February 2017 (UTC)
 * This definitely shows why admins need strong passwords and security accounts. RedPanda25 16:05, 11 February 2017 (UTC)

My Wikipedia Page
I am trying to make a Wikipedia page and I need help with the overall advanced creating process. Please help me make the Wikipedia page. Thank you--John Doe Gaming (talk) 23:06, 10 February 2017 (UTC)


 * Read: Your first article. Is this article you are proposing to add is about yourself?--Aspro (talk) 23:27, 10 February 2017 (UTC)


 * You might like to get some practice at editing other articles first, then read WP:Your first article for guidance, but please note that articles about yourself are strongly discouraged.   D b f i r s   23:32, 10 February 2017 (UTC)