Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2018 May 6

= May 6 =

reflist and col div with the same colomn width
I often use reflist with a column width of 30em and get a four columns on my display. When I use div col with colwidth=30em I get three columns. Why is this happening? And can it be fixed?User-duck (talk) 01:06, 6 May 2018 (UTC)

Font size. Compare:

normal font size


 * item 1
 * item 2
 * item 3
 * item 4
 * item 5
 * item 6
 * item 7
 * item 8
 * item 9
 * item 10

font-size:90%:


 * item 1
 * item 2
 * item 3
 * item 4
 * item 5
 * item 6
 * item 7
 * item 8
 * item 9
 * item 10

sets font size to 90% of normal.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 02:03, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for such a concise explanation and demonstration! All I need to do is to use colwidth=27em for div col!

normal font size 27em


 * item 1
 * item 2
 * item 3
 * item 4
 * item 5
 * item 6
 * item 7
 * item 8
 * item 9
 * item 10

font-size:90%  30em:


 * item 1
 * item 2
 * item 3
 * item 4
 * item 5
 * item 6
 * item 7
 * item 8
 * item 9
 * item 10

User-duck (talk) 02:44, 6 May 2018 (UTC)

Inquiry on adding a new feline member to "List of oldest cats" page please
Hello! As long-time readers of Wikipedia (and having just become a registered user), we are hoping to have some info added to your page "List of oldest cats" (a semi-protected page) but are not sure how to go about doing this.

Our beloved tabby Meetsi is verifiably 24 years old, making her the third oldest cat in Canada (and 8th in the world currently alive), at least according to this Wiki list. She was born in 1994 and has a microchip in her ear with this birth year. We also have dated vet records (an "authoritative agency"), to substantiate our claim. She may not live for much longer, but we would be honored to have her join your esteemed feline list:).

Please advise how we could add Meetsi's info to your site. We appreciate your help in getting her longevity officially recognized!

Thanks! cjoypenner — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cjoypenner (talk • contribs) 01:50, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Please see these instructions. Thanks! Septrillion (talk) 01:58, 6 May 2018 (UTC)


 * Hello, . Congratulations on your champion cat. Unfortunately, Wikipedia insists that all information be confirmable from reliable published sources; otherwise a reader next week or next month or next year has no way of checking that it is correct. (Even if it is correct now, another editor may have changed it by mistake, or in vandalism). If a story about your cat appears in a newspaper, for example, it might be able to be mentioned in Wikipedia. Otherwise, no. --ColinFine (talk) 23:25, 7 May 2018 (UTC)

my article
I have been editing my article multiple times before submitting and I have clicked the submit button multiple times, but when my professor tries to read my article it shows that there have been no edits for a long period of time. Can you please help me understand how to submit my article correctly so that my professor can see that i have worked on it. Please understand that this is a time concerning manner as grades are due this coming week. Thank you for your help.Kelsmika (talk) 01:58, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * It looks like you haven't edited your draft since April 18. As the AfC reviewer said, the contents should probably be merged into the Dementia article. Who is your professor? Does he/she/ze have a Wikipedia account? Septrillion (talk) 02:07, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Or she.  General Ization  Talk  02:08, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * You have not made any edits to Draft:Dementia and nutrition between April 18th and May 6th (above), so I wonder what version you have been editing? Do you have another account and a version in a sandbox?  Perhaps you have a copy on your own computer that you have been updating?  The draft contains unencyclopaedic language in addressing the reader as "you", and reads more like an essay.  It is unlikely that your draft will be accepted as a separate article, so I hope your professor is realistic and expects only a "Wikipedia-style" attempt.  If you find an updated copy, you are welcome to copy it to your draft so that your professor can read it there, but you will need to explain that you made some edits off-line.   Dbfirs  06:58, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * You may wish to merge Draft:Nutrition and dementia into Draft:Dementia and nutrition or vice versa. Septrillion (talk) 00:33, 7 May 2018 (UTC)

Recent Draft
I submitted a draft for publishing and now can't find it. It stated that until it was accepted or declined that it could be edited. Can someone advise where to find it? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Megan at LaneaxisVSM (talk • contribs) 14:46, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * I think possibly your earlier version of Draft:LaneAxis Virtual Freight Management was deleted as promotional. You should have been notified of the reason but I can't see anything on your talk page.  Did it have any independent WP:Reliable sources?   D</i><i style="color: #0cf;">b</i><i style="color: #4fc;">f</i><i style="color: #6f6;">i</i><i style="color: #4e4;">r</i><i style="color: #4a4">s</i>  15:36, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * As an administrator I can see deleted pages. The only page your account has edited is Draft:LaneAxis Virtual Freight Management which was created after your question. PrimeHunter (talk) 15:40, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * ... so did you create a draft without logging in or using a different account?  <i style="color: blue;">D</i><i style="color: #0cf;">b</i><i style="color: #4fc;">f</i><i style="color: #6f6;">i</i><i style="color: #4e4;">r</i><i style="color: #4a4">s</i>  15:44, 6 May 2018 (UTC)

Why won't my edits stay
Why won't my edits stay ? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:100E:B026:CE54:EDA8:C9CF:AD42:77A1 (talk) 17:27, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Hello, please provide links to any pages where you are encountering difficulties. Your edits, from the IP used to post here, at Roger Troutman and Zapp have not been removed; although some tidying and possibly sourcing would be needed to bring them more into line with Wikipedia's manual of style. Eagleash (talk) 17:58, 6 May 2018 (UTC)


 * Hello, person contributing from Arizona and Colorado. You have been adding unreferenced stuff to the Zapp (band) and Roger Troutman articles, and related topics, for a couple of months now, using multiple IP addresses. Your disruptive contributions have resulted in the Troutman biography being protected from unregistered users such as yourself, a protection style called WP:Pending changes. The pending changes status means that your contributions don't show up to the reader until a registered user comes along and approves them.
 * Examples of your disruptive changes include:
 * Unreferenced list of family names
 * Crediting Roger and Larry instead of Zapp & Roger
 * Accusation of theft, a violation of the WP:BLP policy
 * removal of a band member
 * Asserting falsely that Zapp is just Roger Troutman and not his other brothers and other band members
 * Puffery including Troutman's "most prized creation six sons".
 * Lots of unreferenced puffery and promotion, including Troutman's "most prized creation six sons".
 * promotion of Roger Troutman
 * promotion of Roger Troutman
 * promotion of Roger Troutman
 * promotion of Roger Troutman
 * promotion of Roger Troutman
 * So the answer to your question is that you should register a username so you can edit through article protection, but more importantly, you should stop promoting Roger Troutman to the detriment of the other brothers, and you should always cite your sources for information. Binksternet (talk) 20:17, 6 May 2018 (UTC)

Correct/proper reference/cite
I have encountered the following in an article:


 * According to the sheet music for the song, is set in the time signature of common time, with a tempo of 100 beats per minute. It is set in the key of F major with Madonna's voice spanning from the notes of C5 to B♭5. "Spotlight" has a basic sequence of Am–C–Am–C–G–F as its chord progression.

Since I cannot verify the statement from the cited source. I think the source needs to be changed. When I ask for clarification, another editor removes the "clarification needed" and states all sources do not need to be online. True statement, but then a different source needs to be cited. Am I correct? User-duck (talk) 18:02, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * No. There is no requirement that sources  be easily accessible; only that sources must exist.  See WP:SOURCEACCESS part of WP:V.
 * As an aside, your example citation is a without url.   requires a url (there is a hidden error message – instructions for how to make those error messages visible is at Help:CS1 errors).
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 18:34, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 18:34, 6 May 2018 (UTC)


 * The sheet music may well contain the information, it is not possible to say from what we have. However, there is a requirement to assume good faith and trust that the original editor has verified it. However, the link is to an Amazon listing of the sheet music for sale and we probably should not be linking to 'commercial' pages like that. By the same token, if a book contained information used as a source in an article, the reference would be to the book itself, not an Amazon listng of it. Eagleash (talk) 19:12, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Correct and I neglected to mention that. Sometimes use of asin is acceptable when Amazon offers a 'look inside' – this is much the same as facsimile previews at Google books.  Where there is no 'look inside' option, all we are doing with asin is feeding the vendor; we should not be doing that.  The correct citation, in my opinion, provides detail from the source, from the sheet music: author, title, publisher and location, ismn, year of publication, etc.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 19:23, 6 May 2018 (UTC)


 * Thanks, and . I completely agree with the statement: "The sheet music may well contain the information, it is not possible to say from what we have." Isn't that the purpose of a cite, to direct the reader to the source of the information. I would not have a problem with a cite of the sheet music, (I am not sure the best way to do this, I would use a book citation.) I do not like citing a web site selling the source. I do not like the book cites that use a Google URL that points to the cover. I should of mentioned I also question the quality of the source. Since when does sheet music have a "Shipping Weight: 2.7 pounds" and "Package Dimensions: 5.5 x 4.7 x 0.3 inches". ("Most slim jewel cases sold for burned CDs use the measure 142 by 125 by 5 millimetres (5.59 in × 4.92 in × 0.20 in)") Amazon also states "Publisher: Wea2 (January 1, 1980)". The publisher is probably "WEA International". I cannot find ANY other seller of "You Can Dance Sheet music" (The actual title of the Amazon listing), including Ebay. This editing skirmish started with a straight forward "verification needed", I could not find the information on the original website cited, which touts, "World's Largest Sheet Music Selection", The editor simply replaced SheetMusicPlus.com with Amazon.
 * To summarize, a proper cite would be for the sheet music, not a listing selling the sheet music. At least I learned about ISMN. P.S. I originally was trying to fix "citation is a without url" (I have the hidden messages visible), I was going to replace  with  using the "author, title, publisher and location, ismn, year of publication, etc." furnished by the seller.User-duck (talk) 04:47, 7 May 2018 (UTC)

question
Ive got almost 60,000 edits/almost 6 years experience from 2012(not counting as an IP which would be 2009) do I qualify automatically for any further user right  at this point? (just curious)--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 18:22, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * There are no editing-related automatic rights beyond extendedconfirmed after 30 days and 500 edits. You are extendedconfirmed.[//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:ListUsers&limit=1&username=Ozzie10aaaa] Some elections require more to vote but you have passed all requirements long ago. Other rights have to be requested and reviewed. See Requests for permissions. It could be said you have the "right" to display Service awards on your user page but I don't think it's checked. PrimeHunter (talk) 19:30, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * thanks--Ozzie10aaaa (talk) 19:31, 6 May 2018 (UTC)

Add Lisa Janti / AKA Lisa Montell to list of Baha'i Artist; Actress and Author ; see page on Lisa Janti at
2600:1700:E350:5ED0:D51D:1E13:3995:82AD (talk) 20:56, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * List of Baha'i artists, actresses, and authors does not exist. You will have to create it. In order to do so, you must first create an account. Septrillion (talk) 00:39, 7 May 2018 (UTC)

Asking the same question again and again, hoping for a different result.
I am having trouble remembering which policy or guideline discourages someone from posting an RfC within a few weeks of a previous RfC asking the same question. --Guy Macon (talk) 21:16, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * WP:DEADHORSE?-- Jayron <b style="color:#090">32</b> 21:29, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * I keep seeing "wait six (or sometimes three) months before checking to see whether the consensus has changed", but I am beginning to think that there is no specific rule against asking every week until you get the answer you want. Not that we actually need specific rules for every possibility, of course. See WP:CREEP. --Guy Macon (talk) 22:42, 6 May 2018 (UTC)

Edits to Page Undone
The edits I've made to a page are consistently being undone. I've attempted to enable a talk but the person isn't responding. They note my edits are bias and vandalism and I do not see how that is so. The page (Shmuly Yanklowitz) is a biography of a living person. What can be done? — Preceding unsigned comment added by FactChecker18 (talk • contribs) 21:47, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * I see that you have been edit-warring at Shmuly Yanklowitz: you have made the same edit at least five times in the last 24 hours. Your adversary, or adversaries, all IP addresses, have falsely accused you of vandalism, and have removed the referenced content which you added. Neither (none) of you have tried to discuss the issue on the article's talk page, as you should have done. Please do so. Maproom (talk) 22:31, 6 May 2018 (UTC)

Is this subject notable enough?
Hi. I was thinking of writing an article about a series of one reel 1930s animated shorts entitled 'Snipshots'. A 9.5mm film copy of No. 2 is on YouTube, and a single page on the Internet is written about the series. However, I was wondering, is that enough notability for an article. Thanks! In Memoriam A.H.H. I am good at fighting windmills.. 22:05, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Probably not - per WP:GNG 3 good secondary sources is generally accepted as a minimum to establish notability - additional info specifically for films at WP:NF. LittlePuppers (talk) 23:28, 6 May 2018 (UTC)

Huge CPU consumption when trying to edit a user subpage
I've been getting some major problems with CPU consumption while trying to edit my page User:Exoplanetaryscience/neareststars. Reading it works just fine, but upon clicking the "edit" button it idly uses 25% of my CPU. Is it the large number of Template:val's? Some other reason? I don't get this issue at all when editing any other pages other than this one. exoplanetaryscience (talk) 22:09, 6 May 2018 (UTC)


 * I could see black patches in lengthy Wikipedia articles as I scroll using the scrollbar. Browser: Google Chrome. 86.27.148.109 (talk) 22:09, 6 May 2018 (UTC)


 * That's the thing though. Aside from loading, even exceptionally long pages like List of Gothic brick buildings (920 kb) don't consistently use huge amounts of processing power. It's like when editing, some extremely inefficient process is trying to run constantly. exoplanetaryscience (talk) 22:16, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * The edit window loads for me in two seconds with no problems. Maybe you have enabled an expensive or broken editing script in preferences. Does it happen in [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:Exoplanetaryscience/neareststars&action=edit&safemode=1 safemode] or when logged out? If it constantly uses 25% of your cpu power then I guess you have a quad-core cpu (multi-core processor with four cores) and a process running on one core is using all available time there. The black patches in Google Chrome sounds like the Chrome issue mentioned at Village pump (technical) PrimeHunter (talk) 22:41, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * So far, I've tried resetting my cookies, editing it in safemode, and while logged out (as you said) and the only situation that doesn't end up taking my CPU is opening it in chrome (I'm using firefox) where it works just fine. I do have a four-core, but the consumption is more 25-35% than exactly 25%. exoplanetaryscience (talk) 23:28, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * If 25-35% is your total cpu load then it sounds like one process using whatever it can on one core and other processes using some of the other cores. I have Firefox 59.0.3 on Windows 10 and no issues. It might be a problematic Firefox extension. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:46, 6 May 2018 (UTC)
 * I've disabled the only extension I have (adblock) and nothing changed. I'm also using Firefox 59.0.3 on windows 10. I'm starting to think my computer's possessed. exoplanetaryscience (talk) 00:06, 7 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Used to happen with me earlier. I updated Firefox and Chrome. Works fine now. Like PrimeHunter said, probably not your computer, but something to do with Firefox (given that you said it's working fine with Chrome).  I_  0  ur c lc  5    01:49, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

Macaulay Culkin
Is Macaulay Culkin that appear in the movie Matilda, in the scene when Bruce Pappalardo eat the chocolate cake? --151.49.70.92 (talk) 22:45, 6 May 2018 (UTC)

I don't think so. I don't see him credited anywhere, and back then, he would have been definitely credited, since Matilda came out around the Home Alone craze. <b style="color:#060">💵Money💵emoji💵</b> Talk 23:19, 6 May 2018 (UTC)